373 replies to this topic

[Chaosgyro]

Like I said: the sources of all everything. :)

[RedStar]

Quote

The names of the dragons don't appear to share any common links, but it is interesting to note that two of those that were buried beneath nations have names that seem to share linguistic roots (Zhaitan under Arabic Orr, Jormag within the Norse-based norn territories). The implication we've been given is that each of these names is older than the culture above them, which makes for an interesting coincidence - could the sleeping dragons have someone influenced the linguistic developments of the cultures around them?

I can recall that we had this discussion in another thread, but I think that I forgot the final answer so : are the dragons' names their real names ? Or names given by those surrounding them (or the Dwarves) ?

[Lyssa]

Another thing with pridormus:

For a long time I just assumed that he was named pridormus by the races because he was the first of the dragons to rise.

But if thats an actual name of his own that he's had for years and year, that may mean that he's always the first to wake up. Or even... the first to be seen on Tyria?

Edited by Lyssa, 01 February 2011 - 03:21 PM.

[Jonzzon]

draxynnic said:

Kralkatorrik is a four-syllable jawbreaker with short vowels and consonants apart from the long "rr". The language it makes me think of most is the Tolkein Dwarfish, although I suspect there are real-world languages it is reminiscent of that I don't know.

dont know if its conected but i keept thinkin Krakatoa everytime i read that name, giant volcano exploding, explosion heard around the world etc...

far fetch but still... ;)

[RedStar]

Quote

dont know if its conected but i keept thinkin Krakatoa everytime i read that name, giant volcano exploding, explosion heard around the world etc...

Hmmm at least I'm not the only one thinking that.

[draxynnic]

RedStar said:

I can recall that we had this discussion in another thread, but I think that I forgot the final answer so : are the dragons' names their real names ? Or names given by those surrounding them (or the Dwarves) ?

I don't think it's really clear, although the names certainly seem to predate the cultures that know them now.

Mind you, we don't know just how old the norn are - it'd possible that their ancestors were around the last time Jormag was active, especially if they really are devolved kodan.

[Konig Des Todes]

Kralkatorrik's name is definably named by itself. The fact that... (EoD spoiler)

Glint calls it that and she is his champion, and that when she said the name the air "cracked" as if it were crystallizing, showing that the name is linked to the ED's power.

Jormag's name is hinted to be by itself as well in two points: 1) The norn refer to it as "Dragon" most of the time (according to an old interview with Ree) so it isn't a norn-given name, and 2) (EoD spoilers again, less so though)

the Dragonspawn chants an ancient tongue and the end of it is "Joor-mag" - the chant was a spell calling upon Jormag's power.

[draxynnic]

Aye. I was thinking of the Dragonspawn myself - although there was some doubt in my mind as to whether that could have been the a remnant of the 'spawn's previous existence, and even if the names are used by the dragons doesn't mean they weren't given to them by others.

That said, as you point out the names do seem to have power to them, which suggests that regardless of where they came from, they're true enough for any purpose worth mentioning now.

[Nekketsu]

Since you're adding info about npc races too, I found some stuff about the Tengu at GWwiki

The naming conventions (at least for first names) seem to switch between tribes

Spoiler

Avicara
Syr Honorcrest
Ryk Arrowwing
Myd Springclaw
Nhy Darkclaw
Wyt Sharpfeather
Hyl Thunderwing

Angchu
Soar Honorclaw
Claw Tallfeather
Pust Emberclaw
Zen Swiftwing
Quill Songfeather

Caromi
Wyng Soothingclaw
Ryn Cursewing
Flyt Stormbeak
Nav Sharpquill
Squaw Nimblecrest
Swoop Needlegrip
Rawr Wildeye
Pello Agileclaw
Chuff Quickbeak
Myrd Brokenfeather
Phy Deftcrest
Zyd Pointedbeak
Gryp Wickedwing
Asynd Blindingclaw
Qik Sharpclaw

I couldn't find any named Tengu from the other 2 tribes.

EDIT: found a bunch from Caromi after some deeper searching

Edited by Nekketsu, 03 February 2011 - 03:49 AM.

[draxynnic]

There is one Sensali, but it appears only one: Gull Hookbeak.

Quetzal have Petrav the Evasive (who, interestingly, doesn't have the implied elite) in the Verdant Cascades and Kemil the Inept (who does) in Alcazia Tangle. These seem to distinctly vary from other Tengu, as they have titles instead of the adjective-bird anatomy names that other tribes have. They also both have two-syllable first names, which is rare among other tengu tribes, both sounding as if they might come from Eastern Europe (Petrav is very Slavic, while Kemil strikes me as Turkic.)

Another thing we can note is that Swift Honorclaw is Soar Honorclaw's father, thus the second name is passed from parent to child in similar manner to human surnames.

While I'm looking through the Tarnished Coast already, some Krait:
Flannuss Broadwing
Byndliss Flamecrown
Bredyss Longstride

All are flowing two-syllable names finishing with the sibilant double S common among serpentine races, followed by an English descriptive word. That said, ANet seems to have done a lot of revising on just where the krait fit into the world, so they may prove to be quite different come GW2's release.

[Lyssa]

So.... whats going on here? Not seen an OP update for a while.

Anyway it seems like a crime that we havent mentioned the Wardens yet when we flat out have information regarding their naming conventions:

Wardens do not take names as such, but take their monikers from their rank in the clan’s natural hierarchy. The lowest ranked, least powerful Wardens are associated with the smallest forms and shapes of nature—leaves, moss, seashells, and so on. Higher up are those Wardens who take their name from particular trees or larger forms of sea life, while those protectors that lead the clans take the names of the seasons. - Factions Manuscripts.

[Alice]

As recent posts suggest, I agree we should add the tengu information we have to the OP.  Tengu have always been one of my favorite species since I first stumbled across them outside Lion's Arch in 2005.  I really hope they are added as a playable species in a GW2 expansion. My fingers are crossed!

Qing Guang said:

Laph and Zhed ... have a single-syllable first name

Right. When reading the OP I was surprised by the amount of emphasis on all centaurs, every single one, without any exception...using two syllables in the first name. That really stuck out, and it seems it was worded as such with intent. I believe it should be rephrased so it isn't definitive, as clearly not every single centaur without exception follows this rule.  It is a good rule, but there are exceptions.  The OP should be modified to reflect this truth.

[Lyssa]

Yeah what err is going on here? Hasnt seen an update for a while!

[draxynnic]

Alice said:

As recent posts suggest, I agree we should add the tengu information we have to the OP.  Tengu have always been one of my favorite species since I first stumbled across them outside Lion's Arch in 2005.  I really hope they are added as a playable species in a GW2 expansion. My fingers are crossed!


Right. When reading the OP I was surprised by the amount of emphasis on all centaurs, every single one, without any exception...using two syllables in the first name. That really stuck out, and it seems it was worded as such with intent. I believe it should be rephrased so it isn't definitive, as clearly not every single centaur without exception follows this rule.  It is a good rule, but there are exceptions.  The OP should be modified to reflect this truth.

Yes, it should be. Made a quick alteration to the centaur section, and if BBQman doesn't do it himself soonish, I'll add the Tengu.

[Lady Minuit]

About the Sylvari, it is pretty clear their names are from Welsh, Gaelic and Irish influence, but as many of you pointed out, they don't really have last names since they all born from the same tree.

Known Sylvari names
Caithe, Faolain, Killeen, Trahearne.

So I was thinking maybe their "last name" could be based on either the season/weather/time of the day they are born (since we already know this play a role in their creation) or a nickname describing a feature they have or their personnality. This nickname could also be based on the meaning of the first name.

Examples of nicknames based on :

Seasons
Spring, Summer, Fall (Autumn), Winter

Mouvelian calendar
Zephyr, Phoenix, Scion, Colossus

Elements
Air, Fire, Water, Earth

Weather

Spoiler

Blizzard, Cloud, Cyclone, Dew, Downburst, Drizzle, Dust Storm, Firestorm, Freezing Rain, Frost, Frost Flower, Graupel, Hail, Hurricane, Ice Fog, Ice Pellets, Ice Storm, Lightning, Overcast, Rainbow, Rain, Rain Fall, Sandstorm, Showers, Sleet, Snow, Snow Fall, Snow Pellets, Soft Hail, Storm, Thunder, Thunderstorm, Tornado, Wind, Winter Storm, etc...

*Certain terms may be inappropriate depending of the weather around the pale tree.

Time of the day or related to

Spoiler

Blue Hour, Sunrise, Dawn, Morning, Midday, Noon, Day, Daylight, Daytime, Afternoon, Golden Hour, Sunset, Dusk, Twilight, Crepuscular, Evening, Midnight, Night, Nighttime, Twilight, Starlight, etc...

Other significant elements of nature

Spoiler

Bay, Blue Moon, Creek, Current, Dark Moon, Delta, Eclipse, Falling Star, Fjord, Flow, Freshwater, Full Moon, Geyser, Glacier, Ice, Magma, Meteor Shower, Moon, Moon Crescent, New Moon, Oasis, Ocean, Pond, Red Moon, Ria, River, Sea, Shooting Star, Star, Stream, Sun, Tide, Volcano, etc...

*Certain elements might be inappropriate, but can be useful as a reference.

Emotions or personality

Spoiler

Affectionate, Agitated, Angry, Annoyed, Anxious, Apathetic, Apprehensive, Bereaved, Bored, Brave, Calm, Charged, Cheerful, Cheery, Cold, Confused, Content, Contented, Curious, Delighted, Depressed, Disinterested, Ecstatic, Elated, Empathic, Energetic, Euphoric, Excited, Fearful, Fearless, Friendly, Frightened, Frustrated, Generous, Gentle, Glad, Gleeful, Grateful, Happy, Horrible, Hysterical, Indignant, Innocent, Inspired, Interested, Jealous, Joyful, Jubilant, Kind, Lazy, Lonely, Loving, Mad, Melancholy, Miserable, Motivated, Nice, Obstinate, Patient, Pessimist, Petulant, Pleased, Proud, Quiet, Restless, Sad, Savage, Scared, Shameful, Shameless, Shy, Silly, Sleepy, Soothing, Strong, Taciturn, Thankful, Unhappy, Uninspired, Vigilant, Warm, Weak, Wild, Wishful, Zealous, etc...

*Certain traits might be inappropriate for this race background.

Appearance or colors

Spoiler

Swift, Strong, Dark, Light, Beautiful, Pale, White hair, Green, Black, Brown, Petite, Graceful, Short, Tall, Long, Large, Young, Old, Ugly, Dirty, Square, Round, Symetric, Assymetric, Pointy, Chaotic, Ordered, Clean, Sharp, Dry, Wet, Lunar, Clean, etc...

Mythical creatures, plants or natural elements

Spoiler

Fawn, Nymph, Sylph, Sprite, Sidhe, Spirit, Oak, Fern, Grass, Moss, Vine, Leaf, Wheat, Troll, Fairy, Butterfly, Sorb, Maple, Willow, Rock, Dirt, Sand, Steam,  Mud, Antlers, Trunk, Bark, etc...

Combinaisons of nicknames

Spoiler

Vivid Willow, Dark Winter, Fiery Phoenix, White Snow, Pale Leafs, Beautiful Flower, Cold Zephyr, Calm Water, Earth Spirit, Young Fern, Pink Butterfly, Cool Rain, Fast Stream, Smart Coconut (:P), Lightning Seed, Golden Autumn, etc...

Examples of constructed names
Here are some examples I made from Welsh baby names where I added a last name based either on the meaning of the first name or any similar nicknames to those shown before.

Female names

Spoiler

Surname--------------------Meaning for the first name

Cain of Winter--------------Spear (works for both sexes)
Delwen the Pretty-----------Pretty
Elain the Fawn--------------Fawn
Eurliw of Fall----------------Gold colour (works for both sexes)
Gwawr of the Dawn---------Dawn
Gwenith of Summer----------Wheat
Lilwen the White Lily--------White Lily
Mari the Bitter--------------Bitter
Rianna the Nymph ----------Nymph
Reese the Enthusiasm-------Enthusiasm (works for both sexes)
Siriol the Cheerful-----------Cheerful
Tirion the Gentle------------Gentle
Valmai of Spring-------------Mayflower
Wynne the Friendly----------Friend (works for both sexes)

Male names

Spoiler

Surname--------------------Meaning for the first name

Arial the Venerated----------Venerated
Brychan the Speckled--------Speckled
Cenue the Seedling----------Offspring
Deryn the Blackbird----------Blackbird (works for both sexes)
Elinir the Respectful---------Respect
Firth of Autumn-------------Woodland
Gethin the Dusky------------Dusky
Glyndwr of Scion------------Valley of Water
Hywel the Eminent----------Eminent
Irwyn the Green-------------Green/Fresh
Lloyd the Grey Colossus------Grey
Meurig of Noon--------------Moor
Rhun the Grand Oak---------Grand
Vaughn the Small-----------Small

Of course it's just an idea, but would anyone be interrested in doing something like that or perhaps someone has another idea?

References
Welsh baby names, http://babynamesworl...gender6=2&page=
GW2 Wiki, Mouvelian Calendar, http://wiki.guildwar...velian_calendar
GW2 Wiki, Seasons, http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Season
GW2 Wiki, Category : Sylvari, http://wiki.guildwar...ategory:Sylvari

Edits

Spoiler

Edit 1 : added the examples for constructing nicknames.
Edit 2 : added male constructed names.
Edit 3 : added weather and natural elements.
Edit 4 : added some adjectives and examples and removed the animal references which works best with the norns.

Edited by Lady Minuit, 25 February 2011 - 06:17 PM.

[ShadowedSin]

One way how the Sylvari have been introducing themselves I believe is via the time of day they were born which is how their season is decided.

Also, names such as Cillian the Quick would be more than appropriate I think for them. I think we'll find out more when we get a Sylvari week in the future :)

[Lyssa]

draxynnic said:

Yes, it should be. Made a quick alteration to the centaur section, and if BBQman doesn't do it himself soonish, I'll add the Tengu.

Cool! But just the tengu? What about the other stuff?

[Greek Guardian]

I absolutely love this thread!Really helpful for coming up with new names for your characters,thumbs up! :D

[BrettM]

Lady Minuit said:

So I was thinking maybe their "last name" could be based on either the seasons/weather/time of the day they are born (since we already know this play a role in their creation) or a nickname describing a feature they have or their personnality. This nickname could also be based on the meaning of the first name.

Very nice! But, why not take it all the way and forget about English?

For "Cain of Winter", for example, use the Welsh/Irish/Scottish words for "of winter" to construct the name. ("Cain o Gwanwyn" for Welsh? Just a guess. Google is dangerous in untrained hands. Be afraid! :o)

For nickname versions, make Welsh/Irish/Scottish phrases that aren't just repeats of the first name. E.g. Elain Tirion = Gentle Fawn. (Better than Elain the Gentle, I think. Go for a noun and relevant adjective, rather than cluttering up the name with the definite article. I'm assuming Welsh, like Irish, is one of those languages where nouns precede their adjectives.) Throw on a title, too, if you like: Deryn Brychan yr Arial (Speckled Blackbird the Venerated).

It would be interesting to see similar lists for Irish and Scottish Gaelic.

[Lady Minuit]

BrettM said:

Very nice! But, why not take it all the way and forget about English?

Yea I thought about this as well, but for people that aren't so into google I thought it would be nice for them to know what it says at first glance (in english) while keeping the magic of the language (welsh/irish/gaelic first name).

But ur right that would work well too, it could be a good idea, just the words that changes.

[ShadowedSin]

One thing to note is that linguistically, Irish and Scottish do not have a word for 'of'. The O' is actually a anglicization of the old word, Ua meaning of the people of. The actual preposition though is non-existent.

You can express that though by simply basically taking the secondary part of the name and then making it possesive. I'll find examples of that later.

Also to note, the Celts didn't have surnames in Ireland until 1000 AD. Before that they just had person names, clan names, and secondary titles. The surname aspect didn't happen until Brian Borou (where the O'Briens come from) conquered the Island.

Slan ahbaile (Irish for good by to your home)

Edited by ShadowedSin, 23 February 2011 - 11:07 PM.

[Qehb]

^Mc or Mac, means son of,

For Charr first names I pick 1 or 2 words to describe the characters personality and roughly translate it to Mongolian.

[draxynnic]

Lyssa said:

Cool! But just the tengu? What about the other stuff?

Also on the list, naturally. Tengu are probably higher priority to to the higher likelihood of becoming playable, though. ;)

[ShadowedSin]

Qehb said:

^Mc or Mac, means son of,

For Charr first names I pick 1 or 2 words to describe the characters personality and roughly translate it to Mongolian.

Literally it means son, the of is inferred. I've actually bugged the crap out of my teachers and my irish grammar book basically says there is no direct word for of. You basically have to use case (way how nouns inflect) to create the meaning. I mean in Irish to literally say you are good, you say "Be I to good". That's because to say I am good is "Ta me go maith".

It's completely unlike English.

[draxynnic]

Hrrmn. Was just doing a bit of research on the charr names, and found a couple of things I wasn't expecting... namely, that there are places in India called Kalla and Almora. Sound familiar? It should... as two of the charr female names that aren't English words.

I'm going to look to see if I can find anything similar in male names - watch this space.

[Lyssa]

draxynnic said:

Also on the list, naturally. Tengu are probably higher priority to to the higher likelihood of becoming playable, though. ;)

Ah yes. Naturaly ^^.

[razor39999]

Btw since Irish and Scottish were mentioned, is Welsh part of the same family of languages?

[BrettM]

razor39999 said:

Btw since Irish and Scottish were mentioned, is Welsh part of the same family of languages?

They are all part of the group of Celtic languages, which has two main branches. Irish and Scottish Gaelic are closely related to each other on one branch, while Welsh is on a different branch that has diverged quite a bit. The sylvari NPC names we've seen are all Irish Gaelic in origin, I believe. But, since there are probably few linguists playing GW (I'm certainly not one), I don't think anyone will fuss too much if someone uses Welsh or Cornish names as an alternative.

[ShadowedSin]

Labharionn as na gaeilge. I speak the Irish.

Irish / Scottish / Manx are all from a branch of the Celtic languages that migrated out of Iberia thousands of years ago. Look up Galician it has a romance speaking Dialect, but it has severe Celtic cultural ties!

Welsh and Breton are what we in the linguistics business called Brythonic Celtic Languages where as Irish and the rest are called Goidelic :) Brythonic languages descend from a Gaulish (aka where France is now) ancestry.

[Shew]

This thread makes me sad that "Shew" doesn't really work as a norn's name. :(