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#61 Bridger

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 09:14 PM

Easyryder said:

I know you mentioned this in your 2nd podcast that you will discus about dungeons, but can you guys discuss the potential of having the same 5 man dungeon scale to 10 man or 25 man? Of-course keeping the rewards same. One feature to add will be to have leaderboards for each version so PVE guilds can compete against each other.

Dungeon Size controversy and Raids vs. DE controversy and End game Controversy are scheduled for week #4 show.  #3 is all about PVP :)

#62 ShadowABCXYZ

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 10:01 PM

Just to add, I loved the Battlefield 3 talk, its great to see how you percieve other games, while waiting for something even more phenomenal such as GW2. I do agree it should probably be at the end though, some people might not like it. (I loved the bit about the sticky grenades, It happened to me too :D)

Do you take suggestions for other games to talk about?
I was wondering if you would take a look at Vindictus, A free-to-play ActionRPG that was released in Europe only recently, and has been in USA for a year(?). It has all of that active combat, blocking, dodging, rolling etc. It is known for its challenging PvE, where bosses can "1-shot" players, Like that Oakheart you mentioned.

(just an idea)

#63 Milennin

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 10:03 PM

Bridger said:

I'm getting a few people saying this.  Maybe we'll put the "other game" talk at the end of the show instead from now on.  This week will not even have any if there's any news to talk about.

That would be better I think. That way I can just listen to what I came here for.=P And then the other game talk at the end is just optional. Anyways, I really like the rest of the broadcast.8)

#64 Freelancer

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 10:03 PM

I wonder what "background bird" has to say about our podcast. Lol.

Bridger is a very dedicated and professional guy, and when I heard the quality of his other podcasts, I was instantly drawn in. Team Legacy loves the cast, and I certainly love debating with Bridger and the crew in it. I can certainly see some heated awesome debates coming soon regarding pvp.

I hope your ready for my elitist wrath Bridger. Lol. <3
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#65 Bridger

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 10:09 PM

Freelancer said:

I hope your ready for my elitist wrath Bridger. Lol. <3
Alright then.  In preperation for my Devil's Advocate position, I will draw up an essay on why GW2 should include hat's with perks in it's micro-transaction store *twitch*.

#66 Wothan

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 10:40 PM

Awesome work bridger, keep on

#67 Massive Jawbone

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 12:12 AM

Bridger said:

I'm getting a few people saying this.  Maybe we'll put the "other game" talk at the end of the show instead from now on. [...]
Good idea. It's easier to stop listening at the end than jumping forward to the actual GW2 talk.

#68 Lance Darkrage

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 07:01 AM

Awesome podcast, seems very proffesional. You should try to get one of the developers to do a interview. Make up a list of questions, concerns, ideas, etc... The developers seem more than happy to accommodate from what I've seen. (might be a good idea specially if you find yourself running scarce in large topics). Like you mentioned Xollfury had a nice interview, I'd like to see what you can come up with and contribute to our pool of knowledge pulled from the Devs lol.

#69 ~PolarisNova~

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 07:22 AM

Oh yes, I also liked Bridger's rant......I had a 'twilight zone' moment listening it to, but it was pretty entertaining. :)

#70 Bridger

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 01:47 AM

Lance Darkrage said:

Awesome podcast, seems very proffesional. You should try to get one of the developers to do a interview. Make up a list of questions, concerns, ideas, etc... The developers seem more than happy to accommodate from what I've seen. (might be a good idea specially if you find yourself running scarce in large topics). Like you mentioned Xollfury had a nice interview, I'd like to see what you can come up with and contribute to our pool of knowledge pulled from the Devs lol.

I wouldn't want to do anything like that when they are not willing to give up any new info.  There are very few questions I can think of that haven't already been asked, and many of those questions are answered by "we're not talking about that yet."  

Maybe when they release the next big wave of info.  When's the next Con they might attend?  CES in January?

#71 obverkid00

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 12:01 AM

Bridger said:

#3 is all about PVP :)

I can't wait for that one then, I'll be sure to hop on the chat during the show.

Freelancer, I'll be listening really closely to what you guys will be saying ;)

Edited by obverkid00, 15 October 2011 - 01:37 AM.


#72 Nemui

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 03:07 PM

Bridger said:

Maybe when they release the next big wave of info.  When's the next Con they might attend?  CES in January?

Paris Games Week starts next week.

#73 Sarge

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 03:26 PM

Nemui said:

Paris Games Week starts next week.

Yeah but no new info will be released as its technically part of the con cycle for this round. :(

#74 Tidal

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 05:01 PM

Will the next episode be out later today?

#75 Bridger

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 07:51 PM

Sunday night we'll record the show, and it will be out by monday night.

#76 Devildoll

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Posted 15 October 2011 - 09:44 PM

sweet. i cant wait to hear the next one

#77 Abed092

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 07:16 PM

Really fun Podcast i enjoyed listening to it..You guys are just awesome (Cool voices,have Experience is Podcast(s) and really funny..i seriously laugh whenever u mention smth funny XD ) Thanks for making such an Enjoyable Podcast and i really can't wait to hear the next episode!!! :3

#78 Twisted Metal

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 11:33 PM

where do we go for the live show?

#79 Bridger

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 02:19 PM

Updated with the release of Episode 3.  Please post any feedback about the content of the episode in the Episode 3 thread, and any general feedback about the podcast in this thread.

Thanks!

Edit: Sorry Twisted Metal, we had a lot of problems getting it working at the start, so we didn't get a chance to promote it and we started late.  Now that we have all the kinks worked out though, we'll be live from http://www.twitch.tv/talesoftyria every Sunday night at 8pm EDT.

Edited by Bridger, 18 October 2011 - 02:36 PM.


#80 Twisted Metal

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 04:47 PM

Bridger, Here is a suggestion before you decide to make another Video next week.. Clean up your room :)

You got a Bra :surprised: (I'm assuming it's your wife / girl friends and not yours) hanging on your closet door, and every thing is just every where.

A good clean place helps to make the show look more professional... and not just a bunch of random guys being recorded on Skype talking about a game that isn't out yet :)

#81 obverkid00

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 05:54 PM

I'm just going to copy n' paste what I wrote in the comments @TalesOfTyria because I'm lazy :)
---
Great episode! I've really enjoyed the video feed, this time it seems you've covered everything :)
Recording live with people on chat seems to have done the job, everytime I've felt you've omitted something. it was brought up in the chat. Good job, it sounds and looks great so far :)

One thing about the Trebuchet, I think it's not you making that choice actually, it's a matter of whether the enemy forces you to use the trebuchet. If you're doing OK without it - why bother? Freelancer mentioned that you hardly hit anything, if you were to aim for a specific spot on the map, yes that seems to be the case, however it seems easy to aim straight for the 3 capture points.

#82 Zahrim

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 07:43 PM

One thing that needs to be adjusted is the verbal crutch of "um" that one of you are using every other word.  Other than that, this is my favorite podcast for GW2.  Keep up the great subject matter and discussion!

#83 Bridger

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 09:00 PM

obverkid00 said:

I'm just going to copy n' paste what I wrote in the comments @TalesOfTyria because I'm lazy :)
---
Great episode! I've really enjoyed the video feed, this time it seems you've covered everything :)
Recording live with people on chat seems to have done the job, everytime I've felt you've omitted something. it was brought up in the chat. Good job, it sounds and looks great so far :)

One thing about the Trebuchet, I think it's not you making that choice actually, it's a matter of whether the enemy forces you to use the trebuchet. If you're doing OK without it - why bother? Freelancer mentioned that you hardly hit anything, if you were to aim for a specific spot on the map, yes that seems to be the case, however it seems easy to aim straight for the 3 capture points.

Glad you liked the Show Obverkid!  Would you mind posting future feedback about specific episodes in their thread (linked on the first post)?  My hope is to keep discussion about the content of the episode in it's own thread each week.  We often had some really great discussions in the weekly threads for my Tales of Heroes podcast, so I'm hoping to repeat that.  We'll see if it works though :P

#84 Bridger

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 09:03 PM

Thanks man :P.  This was unfortunately pulled together a bit at the last minute.  Will certainly take that advice to heart though.  Lets just pretend it's cause I'm such a playa? :P

#85 Easyryder

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 09:15 PM

The dude with no video(sorry I don't recall his name) didn't get to talk much at all. Other than that, another good episode.

#86 obverkid00

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Posted 18 October 2011 - 09:29 PM

That was Andrew or how I tended to call him throughout this video the Avatarless S-man.
Indeed, he had only a few lines and I felt like he had more to contribute.

#87 Greibach

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Posted 19 October 2011 - 12:06 AM

Just gonna write some comments as I'm watching.
On the issue of WvW turning into two sides of Ranged DPS just slinging away at each other: I just don't see it that way at all. You say that tanks need healers to get up close; that is illogical in this system. Yes, in a Trinity game, you need healers to survive the DPS. Why? Because the DPS needs to do enough DPS to not be pointless and the healers need to heal enough to not be pointless (and the same thing works with tanks vs other roles). They are all circularly designed. Since there IS no trinity, that design paradigm doesn't apply. In fact, going along those lines, one might say that self heals are pointless because in 5v5, the enemy will spike you down too fast because with the trinity a 5 man spike with no healer resulted in instant death.

Having played the game and watched the videos, players are far more resilient to damage than the standard healer and DPS in trinity games. In fact they have to be in order to accommodate for self heals only. Again, it's a circular design. You need to have self heals that are strong enough to matter, and that means that spike damage must be low enough to not completely obsolete your only source of healing. What this all leads to is that melee characters and builds are much tougher or have strong evasive/closing maneuvers so that they won't be completely worthless when faced with ranged enemies. Sure, if you can get 20 guys to spike someone down in WvW, that works as a spike... but then what about the guy's other melee friends. Pretty soon you either have to spend a lot of time wiping them out and ignoring their ranged DPS, or you fight their ranged DPS and then have to deal with warriors and thieves in their primary combat arenas. I too used to be afraid of the power of a spike in GW2 with the lack of healers, but the simple fact of the matter is that the system has been designed around a certain threshold of damage and mitigation and by design spikes are not nearly as powerful as in many other games like GW1.

On the question of if you can make a fully ranged warrior or for example a fully melee (or close range)necromancer: I fully and completely believe that you can do that. The design of the system is such that it truly is meant to have every option be viable. That's why each class has different skills when equipping the same weapon, why there are no dual-classes, why each class has set weapon lists, and why your 5 skills are locked by weapon. If a warrior can use a bow, then they are going to make skills that are good for the warrior using the bow. If not, what's the point? Since a warrior can't use certain weapons, then he should be good at using the ones he can. In fact, back some time ago the devs actually commented that there was an in-office meta of a full ranged warrior party and that it was hard to deal with. Similarly, I have played the Necro and I actually preferred the melee weapons (axe and dagger) to the longer-ranged ones like the scepter and staff. They provided more damage and more durability in the form of damage mitigating conditions and life steal. The ranged options simply did different things like controlling conditions (vulnerability, chilled, etc) and area damage. The most damaging weapons were actually the melee ones. Similarly, last we saw traits were both general for the profession as well as sets based on equipment. With specific traits for bows, then those traits should empower options that don't exist on other weapons, thereby allowing you to make not only unique but also specialized builds.

On the trebuchet: I don't know if it will become a huge part of the meta, but I can say this: It isn't "just random" and you will be able to make a big difference if you practice with it. The AoE on it is really big and the ranges are extremely specific, i.e. something you can learn to near perfection. The damage, size, effect (knockdown and terrain destruction) and speed essentially can turn the tides in any battle at a point. Think about it this way: the treb can make a point virtually impossible to capture any given point. That's one person that essentially can counter 2+ players on whatever point they are shelling. The distinction I think is that you are saying it's "random". If you are a coordinated team with any kind of voice chat, you can tell the person where to shoot that treb. You don't need to "hit someone", you need to keep them off the cap point. You need to hit the point repeatedly; then your players can sit in a completely safe area. If they can't get on the point because the whole point gets blown up every few seconds, they will never take it; the entire point of a capture map is to capture points, thus the trebuchet can be crucial to winning by simply guaranteeing that one point never gets touched.

#88 Holy Theory

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Posted 19 October 2011 - 12:50 AM

WvWvW is gonna be a Zerg Fest because no Healers? I was under the impression that just because there is no dedicated healer that doesn't say you cant heal yourself and others.I think all Non personal Heals are AOE, im not quite sure. This AOE heal system alone will have Physical attackers running to points in which AOE has been layed down or Ranged Dealers running to the front line throwing them down. I dont think this will be mindless zerging I think players will have to make quick judgement in any bout of WvWvW.

#89 Bridger

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Posted 19 October 2011 - 03:52 AM

obverkid00 said:

That was Andrew or how I tended to call him throughout this video the Avatarless S-man.
Indeed, he had only a few lines and I felt like he had more to contribute.

It's really tough with 6 people on the show.  I'm going to set a hard cap on 5 max for the show from now on.

----------

Holy Theory said:

WvWvW is gonna be a Zerg Fest because no Healers? I was under the impression that just because there is no dedicated healer that doesn't say you cant heal yourself and others.I think all Non personal Heals are AOE, im not quite sure. This AOE heal system alone will have Physical attackers running to points in which AOE has been layed down or Ranged Dealers running to the front line throwing them down. I dont think this will be mindless zerging I think players will have to make quick judgement in any bout of WvWvW.

I don't think the lack of healers is going to cause zerg.  I think there's going to be zerg because concentrated firepower is completely overwhelming and uncountable (unless maybe massed AoE counters blobbing?).  Basically if you have a choice between four fights of 5v5 or two fights of 10 vs. 5, you'd go for the 10 vs. 5 option every time, because after you finish completely destroying the people you outnumber, you can go finish off their friends just as easily.

This is still speculation of course.  Not having played the game and gotten a feel for the mechanics this prediction could be off for a number of reasons.

Greibach said:

Just gonna write some comments as I'm watching.
On the issue of WvW turning into two sides of Ranged DPS just slinging away at each other: I just don't see it that way at all. You say that tanks need healers to get up close; that is illogical in this system. Yes, in a Trinity game, you need healers to survive the DPS. Why? Because the DPS needs to do enough DPS to not be pointless and the healers need to heal enough to not be pointless (and the same thing works with tanks vs other roles). They are all circularly designed. Since there IS no trinity, that design paradigm doesn't apply. In fact, going along those lines, one might say that self heals are pointless because in 5v5, the enemy will spike you down too fast because with the trinity a 5 man spike with no healer resulted in instant death.

This is an interesting point.  I still don't think it accounts for concentrated ranged spike firepower.  Perhaps, however, the movement abilities of the melee classes will allow them to close the distance fast enough and force the ranged classes to engage.  However, the prevalence of moving + casting abilities seems to indicate that it will be easy to kite?  Maybe cripple/chilled abilities will be the key here.  Warrior uses some kind of ranged cripple then switches to a melee setup and uses a charge skill to get in close.

Quote

On the question of if you can make a fully ranged warrior or for example a fully melee (or close range)necromancer: I fully and completely believe that you can do that. The design of the system is such that it truly is meant to have every option be viable. That's why each class has different skills when equipping the same weapon, why there are no dual-classes, why each class has set weapon lists, and why your 5 skills are locked by weapon. If a warrior can use a bow, then they are going to make skills that are good for the warrior using the bow. If not, what's the point?

Agreed.  The Warrior with a Bow should be and will be (IMHO) as effective as a ranger with a bow, but in his own way.  Looking at the skills on the GW2 wiki, the warrior seems to have quite a few AoE ranged shots, as well as an immobilize.  The Ranger, on the other hand, has only one AoE with his bow, but plenty of single target spike damage (specializing in long range) and one skill that knocks enemies away.  

So the Warrior with a longbow is going to be mostly dropping AoE down to support a larger engagement (his rifle is a more single target weapon) and has the capability to immobilize a target and charge to melee.  The Ranger with a longbow is going to try to nail a single target and keep the enemy at range.

Quote

...Think about it this way: the treb can make a point virtually impossible to capture any given point. That's one person that essentially can counter 2+ players on whatever point they are shelling. The distinction I think is that you are saying it's "random". If you are a coordinated team with any kind of voice chat, you can tell the person where to shoot that treb. You don't need to "hit someone", you need to keep them off the cap point. You need to hit the point repeatedly; then your players can sit in a completely safe area. If they can't get on the point because the whole point gets blown up every few seconds, they will never take it; the entire point of a capture map is to capture points, thus the trebuchet can be crucial to winning by simply guaranteeing that one point never gets touched.

That's a really good point actually.  I believe it can fire that fast as well.  You might be on to the real usefulness of the trebuchet.

#90 Bridger

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Posted 19 October 2011 - 03:53 AM

Greibach said:

Just gonna write some comments as I'm watching...

Holy Theory said:

WvWvW is gonna be a Zerg Fest because no Healers? I was under the impression...

Responding to both of these in the thread for episode 3...which has disappeared...

Edited by Bridger, 19 October 2011 - 09:46 PM.





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