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ArenaNet: Mike O’Brien on Microtransactions in Guild Wars 2


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Poll: Gold to Gem trading - how do you feel? (2438 member(s) have cast votes)

Gold to Gem trading - how do you feel?

  1. I love the idea of trading gems and gold (574 votes [23.54%])

    Percentage of vote: 23.54%

  2. It sounds like it may be good, but time will tell (1024 votes [42.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 42.00%

  3. Neutral/don't care/don't know/just want people to stop complaining (427 votes [17.51%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.51%

  4. It sounds like it will negatively affect my enjoyment of the game (230 votes [9.43%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.43%

  5. I hate the idea of trading gems and gold. (183 votes [7.51%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.51%

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#241 Meliai

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:12 PM

I think I'm going to wait to see what they're offering in the item shop.  :/  Also concerned about RMT sellers just selling cheaper gold than Anet.

#242 AndrewSX

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

Martin Kerstein said:

Everything that is in the store will basically be available for gold with this system - so it doesn't really matter what is in the store, as it is also available for players who play and don't want to spend additional money.

That's sweet.

As long as Anet keeps it controlled and balanced, it can be a very nice thing.

You want to buy a new appereance for your char? NOW you ave two options:

1-if you're a casual/not so time-waster player, shoot 10 bucks to Anet for a gem and do the change.

2-if you play more frequently/have time to invest on, you can get the change for free (no RealMoney) in "exchange" of time passed on the game.

Which means playing.
Having fun.

Seriously, i dont' see any issue. As long as is monitored and well done obviously, but i've already said that.

#243 athariel

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

Hmm, so the reverse works as well?

I can farm gold ingame, buy some gems and sell them on ebay for money?

If so, gold farming still exists, only you have to trade it for gems first before you sell

#244 The Eggman

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

I am still waiting for someone who is against this idea to tell me why I would buy gems if gold gives me all these amazing buffs to beat other players.

Also on the whole influence thing... that once again is a short term problem only. Guilds will all eventually be maxed out, just like the majority will eventually all be lv80s making xp boosters irrelevant balance wise. And the temporary buffs bought with influence do not give you a giant advantage, just a tiny one. Those buffs are also really cheap looking compared to guild levels, so no one should have issues getting them.

#245 AzureWatcher

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

ShadowABCXYZ said:

Influence affects WvW. It gives tangible advantage for spending Influence in Art of War.

You can buy Influence for Gold. Source.

You can get Gold from Gems.

You can pay Real Money for Gems.

What say you Martin?

This. I would love to have an answer to this question.

#246 slartibartfast

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

wyvern said:

No one has to have an abundance of gold when you have five hundred players all buying your gems.

You'd have to have at least 500 gems to sell in that case.  To make a ton of gold they'd either have to have an abundance or you wouldn't actually be making that much.

#247 Helion

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

Well this sounds good, we basicly are able to buy gems for gold and vice versa
and get everything even without buying stuff with real money.
So the only question would remain how much is the base value of 1 gem in gold.

You could say most ppl are going for profit when they sell gems, and only the stupid or the really rich ppl IRL would sell lower than the basic value Arenanet has determend for RL money -> gems

This could be a really, really good system if done right or turn out really bad if the gem/ gold conversion is to high.

But well afther this i think i can trust them, so i can pre-purchase with ease of mind

#248 CoffeeMug

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

Martin Kerstein said:

Let me reiterate two things I posted earlier in this thread (damn you folks post fast :P):

"Everything that is in the store will basically be available for gold with this system."

Anybody who is upset after reading this must not be paying attention.  This will keep the economy in check - any transactions of gems-to-gold will be balanced around these numbers.

#249 Wakers

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

ShadowABCXYZ said:

Influence affects WvW. It gives tangible advantage for spending Influence in Art of War.

You can buy Influence for Gold. Source.

You can get Gold from Gems.

You can pay Real Money for Gems.

What say you Martin?

You still have to trade those gems with another player for gold..

Or conversely, player can trade his gold for some gems and end up with the same boost.

Problem, where is it?

If someone buys masses of gems on day 1, they're gonna be a bit stupid because they will either a) not be able to trade them for gold for a while or b) trade them for a stupidly low price, meaning they've essentially just wasted a boat load of money.

You people are acting like everyone who plays the game is a millionaire and has unlimited funds to purchase gems from Anet :D Which is quite funny given some of the recent arguments about the cost of the game on launch.

#250 wyvern

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:13 PM

souldonkey said:

lolwat? This doesn't even make sense. Gold Farmers farm gold to sell people for real currency. So what you're saying is this will increase the amount of gold farmers? What? Why would I buy gold from a gold farmer so that I can use that gold to buy gems when I could just, I dunno, buy the ****ing gems?

What you're saying makes no God damn sense at all.

Gold farmers are able to sell gold cheaper than someone who buy gems with real money can sell their gems for in the auction house. People buy gold from gold farmers to get gems (or any cash shop currency) for cheaper than if they bought them directly from ArenaNet. It exists in every game with systems like this.

#251 Maconi

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:14 PM

Quote

Here’s our philosophy on microtransactions: We think players should have the opportunity to ... be able to spend money on ... time-saving convenience items.

I've always hated items like that. I have to spend a week to get what takes you a few hours? :eek:

On the flip side, why does anyone care about the Gold > Gem > Gold trading? At least it's not like D3's AH (where you can straight up sell items for $$$). There was a huge uproar over D3's AH at first but most people have accepted it and moved on now. I don't see how GW2 will be any different (in that people are overreacting and will eventually accept it).

#252 Asbrandr

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:14 PM

wyvern said:

What works in EVE will not work in Guild Wars 2. EVE has one of the harshest currency sinks in any game: the complete destruction of your ship. Think of it as the complete destruction of all your gear upon being defeated. This is what it would take to balance out the economy for this gem to gold RMT system.

This isn't adding gold to the economy though, and neither did PLEX. It's just transferring one player's gold to another player for an object that has no worth outside of the GW2 store.

#253 Razamis

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:14 PM

Quote

We have a new player-driven market that allows players to trade gold for gems and gems for gold.

Since you can buy gems with real money and then trade gems for in game gold, that essentially means that you can buy in game gold for real money, lets be real here.

In game gold can buy in game items. This essentially means that any trade-able in game items can now be purchased with real world money.

So now I can pay real money to negate the effects of respec costs, armor repair, buying gear for my character, buying supplies, etc..

I don't want to say the sky is falling here, because it is not necessarily, however this seems to completely ruin the value of in game currency. Will it matter if someone has a rare item they are selling? I can shell out $20 and buy myself to to the rarest item, the best stats, all without any effort.

I have a well paying job and I can afford to blow more real money then the average person. I suppose that now means I will never have to worry about gold in GW2 either as I will always have an abundance through real money transactions, in which I have no fear of my account being banned.

This is the first thing arenanet has done that I view as a mistake. Not only a mistake, but a huge and massive flaw. I am very disappointed, and very discouraged. If one of the best gaming companies is giving in to this RMT crap, then I am affraid for the future of gaming.

I always use to like collecting gold in MMOs, buying low and selling high on the markets and having a massive wealth, that will all be meaningless since I can easily drop $500 without a second thought and likely buy a fortune of in game gold (through gem trading).

They just ruined a big part of the game for me. Now I won't even try for items, or gold. I will just buy everything I want, which will likely shorten the life of the game in the long run for me.

#254 Melody

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:14 PM

I think this is a good thing. it's the most fair way to do it :)

Iris said:

Bots farm gold, gold buys gems, gems are sold on other venues than arenanet for a cheaper price... black market is born.

I honestly doubt many people will risk doing that. most realise by now HOW shady buying game currencies is from goldsellers and the like. why do that, when you can buy it directly from the most trusted source?

#255 Alexandriea

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:14 PM

Matsy said:

This puts what this system will do so good!
The only problem with the system is guild influence points, that's the ONLY thing that could go wrong.

That and the system may crush the egos of those who worked hard for say, their armor. (But that is a non-issue here)

I think some people are voicing concerns over say, Obsidian Armor suddenly becoming purchasable with $$$ which totally kills the perception of value of it. Its valuable because its extremely tedious to get.

But once again, non-issue as most of the sexy armor sets should be via karma and whatnot eh?

#256 Nemui

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:14 PM

Tr0n said:

Gold farmers will still exist of course. They will farm gold and sell gems for cheaper.

With this system ArenaNet just gets a piece of the pie from the gold farmers and makes the in-game economy a bit more interesting.

"of course" they will...

i wonder if the gems allow Anet to surveil illegal RMT more easily.

#257 Arngrim Einheri

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Gold converted to gems : Ok.
Gems converted to gold: Not ok.

Fix that and I will be happy.

#258 Martin Kerstein

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Catenaccio said:

It does matter what's in the store if it's something that raises your stats in any way, like armors, weapons, consumables and so on.

And i bet they will be in the shop.

As the post says, we haven't finalised what will be in the store, but for the sake of an argument:

Considering that you can also get it with ingame gold (via the trading system): It is as if you get it from an ingame vendor, so everybody has access to it. And when everybody has access to it - where does it matter?

#259 Datenshi92

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Redfeather said:

So wait, we can farm gold in-game and then convert it to gems and buy something like an extra character slot?

Apparently, yes :)

#260 ~PolarisNova~

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Meliai said:

I think I'm going to wait to see what they're offering in the item shop.  :/  Also concerned about RMT sellers just selling cheaper gold than Anet.

Lol Martin posted just before you: the gold is coming from other players so how are you coming to the conclusion about ANet selling gold?

#261 slartibartfast

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Well, that's enough of this topic for me.  I really don't feel like making the same arguments over from scratch in a new thread.

All I'm going to say is I told you so.

#262 cdkcp

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

You can use gold to win, both in PvE and WvW. You can buy your way through dungeon, by hiring more experienced players that will carry you (GW1...). You can pay other players to join your zerg in WvW, ensuring increased chances of victory. It does fulfill the definition of P2W.

Of course, it will also result in more money for development, which means more content for us.

#263 FoxBat

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

On RMT guys undercutting gem worth: keep in mind that in large enough numbers, this will also affect gem worth. If $1.00 worth of gems gets me 30 gold and .99 to an RMT gets me 30 gold, if enough people go to the RMT instead of gems, the supply of gems to those people trading gold for gems goes down, and demand on that side increases. This means in time .99 worth of gems will get me 30 gold. So the RMT guys then need to cut their price to .98 to compete again. There's room for RMT to co-exist but they are chasing a moving target, and there is always going to be a large % of people channeling their cash into anet's approved gold trading as a result. RMT not eliminated but made less common at least, which means less botting, hacking, etc.

You also need to take into account the convenience and safety factors with anet's sanction system vs. shady and sometimes hard to find RMTs who might get your account banned. The # of people willing to RMT for a .01 difference will be very small. So the RMT people will need a larger discount to entice a good portion of the population to take a risk, and yet they still have to make enough money after discounts for a living to sustain their workers. That gets harder to do and fewer groups can pull it off as the discount increases.

Edited by FoxBat, 20 March 2012 - 06:22 PM.


#264 Specialz

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Raveous said:

GW2 has the dumbest community I'VE EVER SEEN.  

God you morons will complain about ANYTHING!  I'm glad most of you fools didn't get beta keys.

Again, This is NOT PAY TO WIN.  You can purchase anything from the shop with IN GAME CURRENCY as well as GEMS.   FFS think before you whine.

Hey, that just mean.

it seems more like a efw cannot read or are reacting based on feelings while completely ignoring all forms of critical thinking skills, they should have learned in 7 grade science class.

#265 Vahkris

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Cryptex said:

1000+ hours of in-game playing..

Please stop exaggerating, you're showing how little you know of GW2.  Show me anything that affects your gameplay that will take even 100 hours of game time to get.  You won't be buying anything that anyone else can't easily get except looks.

You're thinking WoW and other grindy games where you spend hours getting a 1% increase.  It just isn't going to work like that in GW2.  Read up, it'll be okay.

#266 EagleDelta1

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:15 PM

Davinee said:

Wow, just really, WOW!

I could not be more happy. Again Anet have proven their intent to reinvent MMOs. I did not realize that such a system existed in another game, but it solves all known problems regarding transactions.

Basically people fear only 2 things:

- that GW2 will somehow be P2W

- that servers will be crowded with bots and goldspammers.

Both of these elements have been solved with this system. It cannot be P2W when you are able to farm ingame and achieve the same (plus, it says several times that the auction house will not have any items that will grant an in-game advantage). Neither is there a reason to buy gold from a spammer when you can turn gems bought via Anet into in-game gold.

I like your enthusiasm, but it's not new - EVE Online has been doing it for about 2-3 years and TERA has a similar system in the works

#267 Di-Dorval

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:16 PM

R3verse said:

WOW....all the armor and weapons of the same level have the same stats. We've know this for a long time now.

gw2 is more traditional in gear than yall think. there is whites blues greens etc. those are all different efficiency at the same level. dont think youll get everything maxed straight when u get to 80.

#268 ShadowABCXYZ

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:16 PM

Wakers said:

You still have to trade those gems with another player for gold..

Or conversely, player can trade his gold for some gems and end up with the same boost.

Problem, where is it?

A player who has payed gold for gems, has a readily available gold revenue available to him.

A player who never "feels he must use MT shop to play the game" has no readily available gold revenue, their rate of Influence generation will be lower.

Can't wait to see guilds that require members to purchase all that Influence for them.

#269 wyvern

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:16 PM

Asbrandr said:

This isn't adding gold to the economy though, and neither did PLEX. It's just transferring one player's gold to another player for an object that has no worth outside of the GW2 store.

Yes it will add currency to the economy because people will farm gold specifically for this and some will buy gold from gold farmers so they can get the gems cheaper.

#270 Angel Holyspear

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:16 PM

Dont see any problem here since: Gems only give u aesthetic goods and you can get max gear without much farming. So player who dont want to spend real money can now get it with their work in game and players who buy gems and trade them for gold can get that rare sword skin sooner.