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Misc Whip Weapons (In Future Expansions)


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#1 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 03 May 2010 - 12:05 AM

Edit: (My response to Biz's post)


Quote

Still, I would much rather see the bull whip...especially the more fantasy, metallic, style of such. There's just a sort of malicious feel about the weapon that gives a dark allure to anyone wielding it. There are several ways that this could be justified over the more practical chain whips of Asia. One would be to just cop out and add a blade fixed to the handle somehow. In the movie "The Rundown" the whip wielding enemies had switchblade-like daggers built into the handle of their weapons, though they didn't get to use this feature. I can see a more fixed blade mounted onto the handle somehow...but this feels a bit like a cop out just to make the weapon effective, so there is only one other option.

Who's to say that the whips must work in direct melee combat? The fact that this weapon can be utilized only within a mid-range may actually further the uniqueness of the mechanics behind it, further deviating its style other weapons. Lets imagine that, when wielding a whip, you are incapable of attacking any enemy that has gotten into direct proximity to you. Your whip wielding abilities have now deactivated and you are forced to do one of several things:

1: Fall back a little to regain the distance needed in order to continue attacking with your whip, or whips if you're duel wielding. Proximity in Guild Wars is difficult to gauge in a realistic manner. Direct Melee combat seems to be about three feet away from the opponent in game, and realistically speaking...anyone that's more than three feet away from you is within the distance required to make a bull whip effective. So it wouldn't take MUCH of a withdraw to regain your required distance.
2: Rely on your potential secondary non-whip weapon if you are duel wielding such secondary. A whip could be easily used in conjunction with a mace, sword, ax, or dagger.
3: Switch weapons, which I believe I read you will be able to do in Guild Wars 2. If the enemy gets close, simply swap out for different weapons that are effective at a direct range. For example, I would have a set of daggers...and when someone got two close, my duel whips would be swapped out for such.

Now, I see the whip as a fast, low damage, weapon that can be utilized mid-range. It is also a weapon that delivers agonizing pain above all else, and massive bleeding as well. So, most of it's abilities, in my eyes, would focus around bleeds and potentially short term stuns. This leads to another potential mechanic:

1: Wielding one whip grants you the bleeding attack abilities.
2: Wielding two whips grants you the bleeding and slight stun abilities.

This stun wouldn't be something drastic, more lick a quick hesitation upon attack that reduces the advancements of an enemy. This would allow one of two things, a chance to fall back a bit and regain distance from the prey...or simply delay the time before you have to switch out weapons.

All and all, this would make the whip incredibly different in style than the weapons we currently have...and since I have thought and written this on the fly, makes me desire the weapon's inclusion all the more!

Before I begin, I understand that they have currently solidified their current weapon choices with the statement that they will not be adding anymore. However, I don't believe this to apply to future expansions...and fully expect new weapons to be one of the various additions they add with each expansion, when they are capable of dedicating a decent amount of time and resources towards balancing the new additions of such. With that said, I also understand that there have been plenty of concept weapon threads which addressed the whip, but only vaguely...to my recollection. So, with that stated...

I would like to see Whip Weapons introduced into future expansions. I personally feel that they would be a unique in comparison to the current weapon types and provide something interesting...both visually and mechanic wise.

There are countless things you can do with a whip, disarm, trip, asphyxiate (Concept Devised by another Forum poster who's name eludes me.), or my personal favorite...cause massive bleeding. Despite some of these not being unique in mechanic...they're unique when you take into consideration that the whip is a mid-ranged melee weapon...some even reaching the length of eight feet. In combination to such, the whip fits very nicely into their duel wielding system...

Here's two good videos of what I mean:

Underword:


Iron Man 2:


Both of these are metal whips, but I couldn't find a video between the Rock and the three whip wielding villains in "The Rundown". If you have seen the movie, there's another good example of whip wielding. Regardless, I believe that there SHOULD be metallic whips  included seeing as how technology has advanced within Tyria, and the concept isn't too far fetched in a fantasy environment. Hell, elemental damage being infused with weaponry already plays a factor, so the possibility of seeing a "Whiplash" type metallic whip is perfectly feasible.

There's just something about duel wielding whips that makes your character look like a badass...be it male, or female...and I would greatly enjoy appearing the part. To be an Assassin with duel Metallic Whips (Possibly bladed) would be, quite simply, delicious...especially if they increased my DOT abilities...since that's my personal preference in attacking. :P

Edited by XxxTenebraexxX, 04 May 2010 - 03:42 PM.


#2 elixabeth

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Posted 03 May 2010 - 02:19 AM

/sign
I'd love to see more exotic weapons, especially since the scythe (closest we really had to 'exotic' previously) won't be making a comeback.

#3 Phoenix Tears

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Posted 03 May 2010 - 03:11 PM

After seeing this disappointing small weapon list, its imo a must, that it has to be expanded later, at least with this stuff:

- 2H Axes
- Whips
- Halberds/Spears (Polearm Weapons) ..scythe is a polearm weapon, can be just an halberd with other skin, the so called "war scythe" that existed really.

The skill system should make it easy to implement the weapons quick and easy.. absolutely can#t understand, why anet discarded them.


/sign simple

#4 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 03 May 2010 - 06:04 PM

@Phoenix Tears

I assume they'll add a few new weapons per expansion. They may have solidified the current list for the upcoming game, but when they delve into the expansions...it's quite likely that new weapons (and skill-sets for those weapons) will be one of their main new content additions. It makes a lot of sense with their new skill system. So, there's still hope for nearly all weapons currently excluded in my eyes...hopefully.

#5 Faer

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 01:41 AM

It would be much appreciated if posters would discuss the pros and cons of additions of a feature rather than their sexual fantasies in this forum.

#6 Sky Uppercut

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 07:22 AM

Tenebrae, your idea looks awsome.
Also the halbert looks cool.

How about morningstars or flails!! o.O ^^

Edited by Sky Uppercut, 04 May 2010 - 07:25 AM.


#7 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 07:48 AM

Sky Uppercut said:

Tenebrae, your idea looks awsome.
Also the halbert looks cool.

How about morningstars or flails!! o.O ^^

More like a compilation of ideas, my own and those of others I have seen in regards to the whip...simply brought into a single thread dedicated to such :P

#8 elixabeth

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 09:24 AM

@Faer,
It seems to me like no one's discussing any sort of fantasies - except for the idea of a broader range of weapons.  
This would increase the diversity of the auto-assigned first 5 slots in everyone's skillbar (more weapons = more combinations), as well as increasing the visual and fighting diversity.  Ways of doing damage, as well as damage types, were proposed; and Phoenix Tears added other ideas which would work well for increasing weapon diversity.

#9 Faer

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 09:54 AM

You can't see the posts I have deleted.

And for those who aren't taking this seriously - start. I won't tolerate any more childish nonsense.

#10 Naoroji

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 10:09 AM

/Yes for whips. /Yes for pretty much any additional weapons, really.

My own wishlist;
Fistweapons
Halberds/glaives
Melee spears

#11 pumpkin pie

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 10:11 AM

After watching Iron Man 2, I want whip for weapon too. Its very fitting for our elementalist class to infuse the whip with fire and air magic!

I will signed this.
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#12 Mhairi

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 11:16 AM

If anyone played Dark Age of Camelot, there was the Reaver profession which  used whips.  I miss my Reaver.

#13 AsianInvasion

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 12:02 PM

I don't see any one of the classes holding a weapon, at least in GW1. But in GW2, its a hold other story....

#14 Biz

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 12:24 PM

Whip is a nightmare to animate and implement properly, you could add 5-6 conventional weapons in the time it takes to get the whip done.

... on the off chance that it will be implemented it will most certainly not be the long whip we would associate with... but a short metal link martial arts "whip" that is more akin to a elongated flail rather then a whip you see in movies.

Also you failed to mention this clip - shows that "western" long whip is utterly and completely useless in melee range.

#15 Phoenix Tears

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 12:45 PM

Naoroji said:

/Yes for whips. /Yes for pretty much any additional weapons, really.

My own wishlist;
Fistweapons
Halberds/glaives
Melee spears

Melee Spears belong under Polearms and thus also to Halberds/Glaives/Lances/Naginatas ect. A Melee Spear is to say it exactly a GLAIVE.


To bring into the Game Great Swords but not Great Axes is ridiculous.
This is like creating a saltless soup.... with no taste.

Same with Polearm Weapons in general, they belong imo into the absolute weapon arsenal standard!!! If there is something like a knight class maybe, then are polearm weapons especially a must.

Whips would be a very nice option either for a complete redesigned new Dervish Comeback as that, what they should have been from begin on - nomadic "Dancers" with martial art like moves and the whip as their semi-ranged weapon.
Or the whip could be a nice addition for necros, assassins or rangers.
For necros for their sadistic sides... for rangers as beast masters (dompteurs) and for sins in form of Kusarigamas (Chain Sickles) or instead as weapon for Alchemists

---------

Fist/Feet Weapons like Claws/ Gauntlets would be a nice thing for Assassins to add to them the Martial Arts that look like Kung Fu ect. when there will be no Monks anymore I guess...
To this would be then also a good addition Nunckuks and/or Melee Staves (Bo-Staff .i.e.)


What I want to say with that all is, not all the additional weapons must be used for new classes, they can all greatly partwise also be used to simple improve the already then existing classes.

2H Axes > Warrior
Glaives ect. > Knight or whatever the class with the shield will be
Whips > Sins, Necros, Rangers
Claws ect. > Sins

Alone with these weapons would be GW2 greatly improved and as said, implementing them with the new skill system will be very easy.

Biz said:

Also you failed to mention this clip - shows that "western" long whip is utterly and completely useless in melee range.

lol, this is "only" a movie... in the game can be the long whip designed completely different, so that it can be very useful as semi-range weapon, more useful than scythes were in GW1 with AoE-Damager as the long whip has even longer range than scythes, but you can hit with it in one swing also multiple foes at once and keep your foes at range with fittign skills for that gameplay.

Edited by Phoenix Tears, 04 May 2010 - 12:49 PM.


#16 LordArticus

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 12:59 PM

pumpkin pie said:

After watching Iron Man 2, I want whip for weapon too. Its very fitting for our elementalist class to infuse the whip with fire and air magic!

I will signed this.
Posted Image

What skills would go along with it? and what classes? maybe kinda like the COV {city of villins} demonoligist class

#17 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 03:38 PM

Biz said:

Whip is a nightmare to animate and implement properly, you could add 5-6 conventional weapons in the time it takes to get the whip done.

... on the off chance that it will be implemented it will most certainly not be the long whip we would associate with... but a short metal link martial arts "whip" that is more akin to a elongated flail rather then a whip you see in movies.

Also you failed to mention this clip - shows that "western" long whip is utterly and completely useless in melee range.

Heh, looking at the current videos of Guild Wars 2,  I don't believe it would be an endeavor they mind delving into if they enjoyed the idea well enough. Considering it grants a style of fighting that neither of the current weapons grants, its difficulty is worth it in my eyes.

When it comes to the length, I'm not sure what type of whip you're talking about. Even the chain whips of Asian culture ranged anywhere from four feet on up...so they were hardly an elongated flail.



Anyway...in regards to the video, and the bull whip in particular, the effective range of a bull whip is about three feet on up. The effectiveness and style of utilizing one differs dependent upon how close the individual is, yes, but you can still use the weapon to trip an opponent, asphyxiate, or disarm when they're considerably close. Not to mention the fact that, with duel wielding, many would have another weapon within the opposite hand...such as a mace, dagger, sword, or ax.

However, I do expect that if they actually did utilize the idea, they would go with a weapon more akin to the Asian chain whip with stylized blades attached to the end instead of the traditional torpedo-like spike weight.  It's far more practical, and versatile, a weapon than the bull whip and can be easily utilized up close due to the ability to shorten.

Still, I would much rather see the bull whip...especially the more fantasy, metallic, style of such. There's just a sort of malicious feel about the weapon that gives a dark allure to anyone wielding it. There are several ways that this could be justified over the more practical chain whips of Asia. One would be to just cop out and add a blade fixed to the handle somehow. In the movie "The Rundown" the whip wielding enemies had switchblade-like daggers built into the handle of their weapons, though they didn't get to use this feature. I can see a more fixed blade mounted onto the handle somehow...but this feels a bit like a cop out just to make the weapon effective, so there is only one other option.

Who's to say that the whips must work in direct melee combat? The fact that this weapon can be utilized only within a mid-range may actually further the uniqueness of the mechanics behind it, further deviating its style other weapons. Lets imagine that, when wielding a whip, you are incapable of attacking any enemy that has gotten into direct proximity to you. Your whip wielding abilities have now deactivated and you are forced to do one of several things:

1: Fall back a little to regain the distance needed in order to continue attacking with your whip, or whips if you're duel wielding. Proximity in Guild Wars is difficult to gauge in a realistic manner. Direct Melee combat seems to be about three feet away from the opponent in game, and realistically speaking...anyone that's more than three feet away from you is within the distance required to make a bull whip effective. So it wouldn't take MUCH of a withdraw to regain your required distance.
2: Rely on your potential secondary non-whip weapon if you are duel wielding such secondary. A whip could be easily used in conjunction with a mace, sword, ax, or dagger.
3: Switch weapons, which I believe I read you will be able to do in Guild Wars 2. If the enemy gets close, simply swap out for different weapons that are effective at a direct range. For example, I would have a set of daggers...and when someone got two close, my duel whips would be swapped out for such.

Now, I see the whip as a fast, low damage, weapon that can be utilized mid-range. It is also a weapon that delivers agonizing pain above all else, and massive bleeding as well. So, most of it's abilities, in my eyes, would focus around bleeds and potentially short term stuns. This leads to another potential mechanic:

1: Wielding one whip grants you the bleeding attack abilities.
2: Wielding two whips grants you the bleeding and slight stun abilities.

This stun wouldn't be something drastic, more lick a quick hesitation upon attack that reduces the advancements of an enemy. This would allow one of two things, a chance to fall back a bit and regain distance from the prey...or simply delay the time before you have to switch out weapons.

All and all, this would make the whip incredibly different in style than the weapons we currently have...and since I have thought and written this on the fly, makes me desire the weapon's inclusion all the more!

LordArticus said:

What skills would go along with it? and what classes? maybe kinda like the COV {city of villins} demonoligist class

As stated previously within this post, I believe that the whips would cause massive bleeding and sheer agony, like they do in real life. So, when wielding one whip, you're granted bleed abilities...and when you wield two, you gain access to quick stun abilities too. Nothing too significant, just attacks that cause short stuns that delay the advance of the victim.

I should really add all this to the op.

Edited by XxxTenebraexxX, 04 May 2010 - 03:42 PM.


#18 pumpkin pie

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 01:13 AM

LordArticus said:

What skills would go along with it? and what classes? maybe kinda like the COV {city of villins} demonoligist class

Not really sure what class, but I'd like elementalist to be able to use whip, most probably the range class. But I don't suppose, my hopes are not very high that ArenaNet would come up with new skills for this weapon type.

#19 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 01:17 AM

pumpkin pie said:

Not really sure what class, but I'd like elementalist to be able to use whip, most probably the range class. But I don't suppose, my hopes are not very high that ArenaNet would come up with new skills for this weapon type.

Classes I see utilizing such a weapon:

Elementalist
Assassin (Or any Rogue Class, especially if deviating from Ninja)
Warrior
Ranger (Possibly)
Necromancer (Not impossible...)

Edited by XxxTenebraexxX, 05 May 2010 - 01:22 AM.


#20 ALLmasked

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Posted 06 May 2010 - 04:31 AM

Necro , yes

as offhand , if there will be undead minions involving

#21 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 06 May 2010 - 04:52 AM

ALLmasked said:

Necro , yes

as offhand , if there will be undead minions involving

That's what I was thinking as well...it's one of those iffy classes that you can see wielding a whip, know why, but just quirk a brow... I still, however, agree that they should be able to wield them as well...as an offhand like you said.

#22 pumpkin pie

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 01:33 AM

Watch Prince of Persia for the hassassin !O.o! nice whip animation and shurikens.



#23 Darklight

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 01:44 AM

whips are available btw... they are just one of the pick-up-able weps... its in one of the interviews or articles. anet does pay attention to all these threads =p

#24 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 02:02 AM

pumpkin pie said:

Watch Prince of Persia for the hassassin !O.o! nice whip animation and shurikens.


I...did not know someone in that movie had a pet snake.

Now, I DESPERATELY want to see that movie...I have always wanted a snake, Cottonmouth or King Cobra, that would coil about my arm and do as I wished...a living extension and pet all in one.

Darklight said:

whips are available btw... they are just one of the pick-up-able weps... its in one of the interviews or articles. anet does pay attention to all these threads =p

Baaaah!

Pick up weapon? I wonder how effective they will be, and if you can keep them throughout the game... Still, I would prefer them to be an official weapon with a true set of abilities, stats, mechanics...

#25 C410V1370

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 06:41 AM

I know something better than a whip for the assassins:


They are polishing this game a great deal so I bet there will be more options like this one in the future.

Edited by C410V1370, 29 May 2010 - 06:52 AM.


#26 XxxTenebraexxX

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 06:59 AM

C410V1370 said:

I know something better than a whip for the assassins:


They are polishing this game a great deal so I bet there will be more options like this one in the future.

Well now, that's something I'm quite interested in owning within reality...

Be that as it may, although I greatly adore the weapon, what would it's unique feature be to differentiate it from that of the other weapons? Granted...it's a Dagger with an extended reach...but I think they may need more than just that to justify it.

I don't know...I do adore the weapon though, oddly enough...it's the exact weapon I was going to give my concept profession. Except mine had a dagger on both ends of the chain.

#27 Naxle Smith

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 07:40 AM

C410V1370 said:

I know something better than a whip for the assassins:


They are polishing this game a great deal so I bet there will be more options like this one in the future.

Get OVER HERE!!!.
I would rather see a scimitar/falx/spear/scythe than a whip personally.

#28 Danzo Dattori

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Posted 30 May 2010 - 10:56 AM

For the Canthan expansion I actually wanna see a weapon like the Kusarigama

Posted Image

This weapon can have the functionality of a whip but with the close range attack with the scythe.
Since this weapon comes from Japanese culture, and Cantha is also Japanese culture I think it fits.

#29 Daelin Dwin

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Posted 30 May 2010 - 11:55 AM

Set GW3 in the 1800s and you can have all the whips you want, provided you use them on Elonians (mild racism D: )

#30 didis

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Posted 10 June 2010 - 06:45 PM

Early alpha/beta times of gw1
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