698 replies to this topic

[Chesire]

Rankith, on 04 May 2012 - 08:37 AM, said:

Heres a vid of a game I had.  No editing applied.  Sword/Pistol and GS:

Think you and I were on the same server. I remember fighting Brain Drain.

Added a few more videos to the list. I think I have enough to cover all the weapon sets now so I'll probably start giving them their own little section under spoiler tags so the list isn't so long.  Should make it easier on the eyes as well as easier to find videos for certain sets.

[jackazzm]

hello again! I recently added:


1v1 with thief on roof

1v1 with warlock(necro)

6min video showing excellent use of Svanir

1v1 + 1 downed transitioning smoothly into 2v2

9min vid, lots of fighting against warrior


With more to come

Edited by jackazzm, 05 May 2012 - 01:27 AM.

[Meva]

Great selection of videos, thank you for posting them, Chesire.

I have decided to test PvP in the next beta, and I have also decided to give it a chance to MH sword: evasion + cripple + boon removal looks like a good complement for my staff and pistol build, esp. if you try to keep your phantasms alive and get rid of the scepter clone-machine and lame confusion

[Babe]

Next weekend I'm definitely trying:

http://www.gw2tools....aYda;Ydba;YdceZ

Stability seems like such a must against warriors. If they can catch you in a stun, they can take out about 60-70% of your HP in 3-4 seconds. Maybe their burst will get nerfed and stability won't be so necessary, but whatever.

[noblue]

don't bother with stability--GET BLINK

[Babe]

noblue, on 05 May 2012 - 04:06 AM, said:

don't bother with stability--GET BLINK

Blink doesn't prevent further knockdowns, and warriors have more than one knockdown. Blink also doesn't synergize with Empowering mantras. I might even consider replacing signet of illusions for Mantra of Resolve/Pain and have a setup that pretty much gives me 3 slots worth of power-up from the trait due to Harmonious mantra, and for a good bit 4 slots worth of power up till I use a second Recovery.

Edited by Babe, 05 May 2012 - 04:15 AM.

[noblue]

Putting distance between you and the warrior is at least as valuable as 4 seconds of stability. The small amount of damage you will get from empowering mantras is not worth taking an inferior skill.

Every structured PvP build without blink could be improved by getting blink. It's good for offense, good for defense, good for movement. Unlike most other skills, you will find a use for blink in every single encounter.

There are also lots of cool tricks you can pull off with terrain. If you use blink correctly, you can teleport from the ground up to the scaffolding around the clock tower, and I'm sure there's a lot more stuff like that.

[Babe]

noblue, on 05 May 2012 - 04:34 AM, said:

Putting distance between you and the warrior is at least as valuable as 4 seconds of stability. The small amount of damage you will get from empowering mantras is not worth taking an inferior skill.

Every structured PvP build without blink could be improved by getting blink. It's good for offense, good for defense, good for movement. Unlike most other skills, you will find a use for blink in every single encounter.

There are also lots of cool tricks you can pull off with terrain. If you use blink correctly, you can teleport from the ground up to the scaffolding around the clock tower, and I'm sure there's a lot more stuff like that.

Blink does shit against Daze or Ranged attacks the warrior can switch to with a hardhitting rifle (getting hit for 5k by rifle warriors constantly was not uncommon), and warriors have gap closers just like Blink creates gaps. In the moment I use Blink I'm also doing jackshit since my build is concentrated on a sword/pistol; not every mesmer is a greatsword/scepter mesmer.

You call it a minor boost -- can you offer a source? Because all my mantras in addition to having a power up boost are instant, can be cast mid-spell/animations, and have a lower cooldown meaning less situations in which my utility won't be up. Stability also prevents the application of cripples, which is ridiculously important to not getting kited by snares. A blink would only close distance once but would continue to allow the application of snares on me for the opponent to hamper my movement again.

P.S. It's 5 seconds of stability. It's a stun breaker as well, meaning I can use it to break a stun and it will grant me immunity to any further CC whereas Blink does not, and warriors have a knockdown charge to counter Blink with.

Edited by Babe, 05 May 2012 - 04:45 AM.

[noblue]

Stability doesn't do anything against daze or ranged attacks either. You're worried about surviving the damage while you're stunned/knocked down, and blink is going to do that. Stability will as well (in conjunction with a dodge), but it's not as versatile as blink. It's ONLY good in situations where you're facing certain disables. Blink is good in those situations too, but it's also good in every other situation. Sure, the warrior might charge and get another knockdown after the blink, but if you timed it right, he wasted his burst/big damage move. You can survive a knockdown without that.

Blink isn't just good with ranged weapons. You can use it as a distance closer, and when they fix illusionary persona, it will guarantee that you get the 4th shatter hit.

As for a source about empowering mantras damage, I don't know the number, but I tried these builds out. Having a little passive damage might be worthwhile in PvE, but not in PvP.

[Babe]

noblue, on 05 May 2012 - 04:57 AM, said:

Stability doesn't do anything against daze or ranged attacks either. You're worried about surviving the damage while you're stunned/knocked down, and blink is going to do that. Stability will as well (in conjunction with a dodge), but it's not as versatile as blink. It's ONLY good in situations where you're facing certain disables. Blink is good in those situations too, but it's also good in every other situation. Sure, the warrior might charge and get another knockdown after the blink, but if you timed it right, he wasted his burst/big damage move. You can survive a knockdown without that.

Blink isn't just good with ranged weapons. You can use it as a distance closer, and when they fix illusionary persona, it will guarantee that you get the 4th shatter hit.

As for a source about empowering mantras damage, I don't know the number, but I tried these builds out. Having a little passive damage might be worthwhile in PvE, but not in PvP.

Again with the "little passive damage". You don't have the numbers, so don't make assumptions about it. You're not the only one who PvP'd during the BWE, and Blink disappointed me with the amount of gap closers and continuous spike classes can put out.

The warrior does heavy damage regardless of landing a single burst skill. I use stability so I can land some CC/pop out illusions for a Distortion while I DAMAGE him. It's a damage race, and kiting is only prolonging a bad situation since a rifle warrior outmuscles a mesmer from range far more than on melee when he's in range of getting blown up by my Blurred Frenzy or vulnerability stacks (not to mention being easy to hit with shatters).

My goal is to become immune to his CC while he's less immune to mine, so the battle becomes lopsided as I overpower him. Dragging out a fight with a class that has way more lasting power than you is a losing gamble. My build is all about shutdown and frontloaded melee damage with the staff as my defensive fallback for chaos storm+chaos armor>switch back to sword while the foe is pelted with conditions and I'm having protection and regen constantly.

Edited by Babe, 05 May 2012 - 05:37 AM.

[noblue]

I had a very easy time outlasting warriors. Ether feast (which is vastly superior to healing mantra) is a much better heal than anything warriors have, and it's usually not that hard to avoid their big damage. I can see the potential in using sword/pistol when you have the pistol stun up, but when it's not up, you're far better off using another weapon (staff would be best) and keeping distance. If they switch to rifle, you can stay close. A circle strafing mesmer with a staff is going to destroy a warrior with a rifle.

The lack of PvP videos with blink is disturbing to me, and I hope more people give it a shot. If you try it out and use it properly, you won't want to PvP without it.

Edited by noblue, 05 May 2012 - 05:49 AM.

[That Happy Cat]

Blink's range is far too short. When I used it the only use I got out of it was for escaping, I had no use for it in-combat: theoretically it could be useful as ranged dealing with melee or melee dealing with ranged but practically I have better tools for that. Other Utilities generally have a greater effect in combat.

If it always teleports you to maximum range if you click outside its range, instead of just telling you it's out of range; and if it's more reliable in teleporting up and down different elevations, then I might consider it.

Seriously though, I once Blinked right inside a wall and couldn't get out until it was available again. After that I switched Blink for Decoy and never looked back.

Edited by That Happy Cat, 05 May 2012 - 06:03 AM.

[noblue]

That Happy Cat, on 05 May 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

Seriously though, I once Blinked right inside a wall and couldn't get out until it was available again.

Sounds like the perfect defensive skill to me.

[That Happy Cat]

noblue, on 05 May 2012 - 06:04 AM, said:

Sounds like the perfect defensive skill to me.

Perhaps, if I weren't trying to chase an enemy with it.

[Meva]

I have seen good mesmers without mantra of concentration controlling warriors quite well: Feigned escape, Blurred Frenzy, iWave, The Prestige, Blink, dodge and some daze and stun tricks are more than enough to keep your melees at bay.

I think it is a matter of taste: MoC is for reaction, Blink is for a more pro-active gameplay. I am more about the latter, so I would take Blink as a no-brainer and never use MoC.

Edited by Meva, 05 May 2012 - 11:01 AM.

[That Happy Cat]

For me, Blurred Frenzy is pretty much all I need when a melee tries to tunnel me, it instantly reverses the situation and if they don't realise what's happening, it would be them running away from me rather than the other way around. Apart from the bug that made Blurred Frenzy while Immobilised a death trap, I didn't have much problems with melee at all.

Edited by That Happy Cat, 05 May 2012 - 10:29 AM.

[Delolith]

Babe, on 05 May 2012 - 04:38 AM, said:

Blink does shit against Daze or Ranged attacks the warrior can switch to with a hardhitting rifle (getting hit for 5k by rifle warriors constantly was not uncommon), and warriors have gap closers just like Blink creates gaps. In the moment I use Blink I'm also doing jackshit since my build is concentrated on a sword/pistol; not every mesmer is a greatsword/scepter mesmer.

You call it a minor boost -- can you offer a source? Because all my mantras in addition to having a power up boost are instant, can be cast mid-spell/animations, and have a lower cooldown meaning less situations in which my utility won't be up. Stability also prevents the application of cripples, which is ridiculously important to not getting kited by snares. A blink would only close distance once but would continue to allow the application of snares on me for the opponent to hamper my movement again.

P.S. It's 5 seconds of stability. It's a stun breaker as well, meaning I can use it to break a stun and it will grant me immunity to any further CC whereas Blink does not, and warriors have a knockdown charge to counter Blink with.

Stability has nothing to do with Daze. Blink is invaluable if used correctly. I played different setups that includes in a mix Mantra of Concentration, Mantra of Pain, Mantra of Distraction, Signet of Illusions, Signet of Inspiration, Mirror Images and Blink. Out of all these abilities the one that made it into my utility bars permanently it is certainly Blink.

Edited by Delolith, 05 May 2012 - 10:34 AM.

[Fanolian_]

jackazzm, on 04 May 2012 - 09:32 PM, said:

hello again! I recently added:

6min video showing excellent use of Svanir

With more to come

Smart move to generate 8 stacks of confusion by using Ethereal field + physical projectile combo.

[Thyar]

I far prefer the full Mantra setup (with supportive build) compared to Blink for MH-sword focused builds - because regardless of the meditation prep time, the cooldowns are great for what they do.

[Delolith]

Thyar, on 05 May 2012 - 10:48 AM, said:

I far prefer the full Mantra setup (with supportive build) compared to Blink for MH-sword focused builds - because regardless of the meditation prep time, the cooldowns are great for what they do.

Yes but at least you start your sentence with the phrase "I prefer" which shows your preference and not a stated fact. To say that you prefer something for this or that reason is far different than saying that this is superior although your claim is not backed up properly.

Edited by Delolith, 05 May 2012 - 10:55 AM.

[Meva]

Thyar, on 05 May 2012 - 10:48 AM, said:

I far prefer the full Mantra setup (with supportive build) compared to Blink for MH-sword focused builds - because regardless of the meditation prep time, the cooldowns are great for what they do.

It is a matter of reaction vs pro-active game, as I said before. Some player prefer to react when the hate is on them, others prefer to prepare themselves in advance to minimise the hate. In the old healer set-up, it is like choosing healing or protection: the former refills health bars and tries to counter the spike, the latter acts before the spike to reduce its effect.

For my personal taste, I prefer pro-active gameplay: it is closer to the mesmer in GW1 based on punishing skills, where you anticipate your foe's moves with Empathy, Backfire, Mistrust, Ineptitude or Clumsiness. Of course, inters are more reactive, but it is you who attacks, not the other way around. Therefore, I am more comfortable with sword+pistol and daze+stuns in utilities than mantras.

EDIT: Thyar, check the video jackazzm posted. You can see that each single hit of iDuellist through a mesmer field adds a stack of confusion, reaching 5 in a full volley and 9 after hitting twice. Neat.

Edited by Meva, 05 May 2012 - 11:05 AM.

[Delolith]

Meva, on 05 May 2012 - 11:01 AM, said:

It is a matter of reaction vs pro-active game, as I said before. Some player prefer to react when the hate is on them, others prefer to prepare themselves in advance to minimise the hate. In the old healer set-up, it is like choosing healing or protection: the former refills health bars and tries to counter the spike, the latter acts before the spike to reduce its effect.

For my personal taste, I prefer pro-active gameplay: it is closer to the mesmer in GW1 based on punishing skills, where you anticipate your foe's moves with Empathy, Backfire, Mistrust, Ineptitude or Clumsiness. Of course, inters are more reactive, but it is you who attacks, not the other way around. Therefore, I am more comfortable with sword+pistol and daze+stuns in utilities than mantras.

I prefer proactive playing as well. That is why I have 2 mantras in my build. However, that doesn't have to do anything with the fact I have a MH sword setup. MH setup has nothing to do with Mantras or proactive play as it can be mistakenly (???) assumed by Thyar's words. I do have blink in my setup as well though.

Edited by Delolith, 05 May 2012 - 11:05 AM.

[Meva]

Delolith, on 05 May 2012 - 11:04 AM, said:

I prefer proactive playing as well. That is why I have 2 mantras in my build. However, that doesn't have to do anything with the fact I have a MH sword setup. MH setup has nothing to do with Mantras or proactive play as it can be mistakenly (???) assumed by Thyar's words. I do have blink in my setup as well though.

I personally call Mantras "reactive" because once they are channelled you can cast them instantly and in the middle of another action. However, I do agree that channelling can qualify as "pro-active". My point was more about after-channelling: mantras are reactive because you can activate them instantly, but blink is more proactive because you have to time it properly when you see a gorilla charging on you.

In a certain way, I see mantras as GW1 ele's attunements: something you charge before you get into battle, and once you are there all your gameplay is about reacting properly. Blink and Mirrored feedback, on the other hand, are closer to punishment skills with the GW1 mesmer, where you have to wait for the right time to cast them, which in general is before the foe starts its rotation or right after it started.

Edited by Meva, 05 May 2012 - 11:31 AM.

[Chesire]

noblue, on 05 May 2012 - 04:34 AM, said:

Putting distance between you and the warrior is at least as valuable as 4 seconds of stability. The small amount of damage you will get from empowering mantras is not worth taking an inferior skill.

Every structured PvP build without blink could be improved by getting blink. It's good for offense, good for defense, good for movement. Unlike most other skills, you will find a use for blink in every single encounter.

There are also lots of cool tricks you can pull off with terrain. If you use blink correctly, you can teleport from the ground up to the scaffolding around the clock tower, and I'm sure there's a lot more stuff like that.

^ Pretty much sums it up.

The only thing I wasn't able to use Blink for was elevation climbing and that's because it would be slightly ridiculous. I prefer not being able to go up with it.

Babe, on 05 May 2012 - 05:34 AM, said:

Again with the "little passive damage". You don't have the numbers, so don't make assumptions about it.

I can also account to the minimal gain from Empowering Mantra's. It was in one of my first builds and I test it for maybe 45 minutes. I think my damage went from somewhere around 335 without mantra's charged to something like 347-350 with them charged; and that was with three active Mantra's. Highly disappointing honestly, I would have thought for sure it would be higher considering how annoying it is to recharge Mantra's during combat.

But I don't think it will change much because it is pretty balanced. On the other hand with such a minimal difference I don't even see the point in the trait unless you just love Mantra's.

Babe, on 05 May 2012 - 05:34 AM, said:

You're not the only one who PvP'd during the BWE, and Blink disappointed me with the amount of gap closers and continuous spike classes can put out.

I, personally, used Blink to Kite, LoS, Escape, Gap close, evade, hit and run, and move about the field. In my build Blink is far too superior to any other utility we have to simply replace it.

Just my two cents.

That Happy Cat, on 05 May 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

Blink's range is far too short. When I used it the only use I got out of it was for escaping, I had no use for it in-combat: theoretically it could be useful as ranged dealing with melee or melee dealing with ranged but practically I have better tools for that. Other Utilities generally have a greater effect in combat.

If it always teleports you to maximum range if you click outside its range, instead of just telling you it's out of range; and if it's more reliable in teleporting up and down different elevations, then I might consider it.

I think Blink is perfect as is except I agree that it would be nice if it teleported you to max range if you moved your mouse out too far--isn't entirely necessary mind you, but it would be nice.

That Happy Cat, on 05 May 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

Seriously though, I once Blinked right inside a wall and couldn't get out until it was available again. After that I switched Blink for Decoy and never looked back.

Lolz. Gotta love beta, eh?

Decoy just never did it for me honestly. I am just able to use Blink more effectively and the three second stealth just doesn't fill my cup o' tea. Some people love it though.

jackazzm, on 04 May 2012 - 09:32 PM, said:

hello again! I recently added:


1v1 with thief on roof

1v1 with warlock(necro)

6min video showing excellent use of Svanir

1v1 + 1 downed transitioning smoothly into 2v2

9min vid, lots of fighting against warrior


With more to come

Added, thanks

[That Happy Cat]

The main purpose of Decoy is to break targeting so I could temporarily hide amongst my Clones. It's a great skill to relieve pressure. AFAIK Blink does not break targeting so unless you Blink far out of reach (unlikely given its short range) it won't relieve pressure as well as Decoy can.

Edited by That Happy Cat, 05 May 2012 - 12:07 PM.

[Chesire]

Nah it doesn't break target. Is why I have the Scepter in my secondary for Prestige. My build gives such an amazing rate of clone generation anyway that Decoy is just a bit over the top. Shorter CD, Blind plus Burning if/when I need it (which does a ton of damage with my build anyway). But it's whatever fits your play style.

Blink is amazing for my style and build, even with it's drawbacks.

Edited by Chesire, 05 May 2012 - 12:28 PM.

[Delolith]

Chesire, on 05 May 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

Nah it doesn't break target. Is why I have the Scepter in my secondary for Prestige. My build gives such an amazing rate of clone generation anyway that Decoy is just a bit over the top. Shorter CD, Blind plus Burning if/when I need it (which does a ton of damage with my build anyway). But it's whatever fits your play style.

Blink is amazing for my style and build, even with it's drawbacks.

Once Far-Reaching Manipulations and the LoS issue with different z-axis gets fixed it won't have any drawbacks

[Chesire]

Tbh I think the z-axis isn't an issue but is working as intended.  I can already hear the outcry if people are able to teleport over keep walls and such--I'm fairly certain Anet already mentioned that this wouldn't be possible a while back; assuming that's what you were meaning.

[Delolith]

Chesire, on 05 May 2012 - 01:34 PM, said:

Tbh I think the z-axis isn't an issue but is working as intended.  I can already hear the outcry if people are able to teleport over keep walls and such--I'm fairly certain Anet already mentioned that this wouldn't be possible a while back; assuming that's what you were meaning.

I can guarantee you that I was able to do it very easily. I was porting from roofs to balconies, from the front wall up to the palisades, from the palisades down to the side where a bunch of enemies were hiding just to Temporal Curtain them and AoE the hell out of them with Blurred Frenzy and kill 3-4 low health people. It was not just 100% accurate since bad targeting sometimes let you with a bit of structure/floor in front of you blocking LoS and teleporting you to the point LoS was interfering. This skill allows for SO MUCH imagination and creative gameplay.

Edited by Delolith, 05 May 2012 - 01:41 PM.

[That Happy Cat]

I was more thinking along the lines of Blinking up the scaffolding of the Clocktower in sPvP.