613 replies to this topic

[Arquenya]

Soki, on 24 January 2013 - 07:27 PM, said:

All it takes is one look at what they have planned for ESO to know how much of a flop it's going to be.

Well.. what have they planned that will make the game fail?
I'm very sorry but I can't really seem to find very much on the game's intended design and mechanics at all.

[dawdler]

kalendraf, on 24 January 2013 - 04:11 PM, said:

One of the big draws for me in the Elder Scrolls series was the tremendous mod support they received from the modding community.  Bethesda actually encouraged this with their tools and game design implementation.  Has their been any word as to whether TES: Online will support modding, such as client-side-only graphical mods which would be purely cosmetic and not provide any player advantages?

Fat chance. Only reason TES allows for modding is because its singleplayer - you choose to cheat or not. An MMO is *never* going to allow modding. Even something as simple as creating quests (like the foundry in STO) open up a can of worms when it comes to XP and loot.

[Hirsty]

Like Elder said at the start.

Gonna be really good, or shit

[BuddhaKeks]

Soki, on 24 January 2013 - 07:27 PM, said:

All it takes is one look at what they have planned for ESO to know how much of a flop it's going to be.
I don't know why you're trying to make commentary on "people these days:(" being too cynical. On the topic of ESO, the only optimism I have is cautious optimism that the animation, combat mechanics, backstory for why the races are together, and proposed mechanics are reworked.
As you can see, that's a tall order - and probably won't occur.
Thus, I know it'll be a fail like TOR.

I -hope- it fails so companies stop jumping on the "we gotta have an MMO" bandwagon.

Animations are in pre-beta state, they can still change (and I don't even see what's so bad about them). Combat mechanics is something new to the MMO genre, or relative new, maybe it has been done before, though I can't think of an example right now. Point is, I would like to play it myself first, before bashing it.
Backstory isn't in anyway screwed up, Aldmeri Dominion as it is shown was present in TES lore for a long time, Daggerfall Covenant also makes sense, if you played Daggerfall you would know the king there holds influence over a lot of territory. I admit, the Ebonheart Pact is a bit of a stretch, since all 3 races in it, actually have a very strong disliking for each other, however Nord and Dunmer were known to make pacts before, to fight common enemies, like when they allied to stop the Snow Demons from Kamal. In conclusion, all factions are justified. Please name the mechanics that you don't like and need to be reworked, even though you have never seen them in action.

As you can see, you are just overly pessimistic for no reason at all. I see no reason for the game to fail (yet, could change in beta), just like GW2 hasn't failed.

While I agree, that we really don't need much more MMOs, I'm still curious to see how ESO will turn out.

[lazykoala]

The trailers look pretty awesome and when it goes f2p I'll give it a shot. GW2 didn't hit it out of the ballpark like I was hoping, so no reason not to give elder scrolls a shot at it. One thing about an elder scrolls game is they are ridiculously time consuming with tons of stuff to do and usually fairly complex all of which I like in a game. GW2 is solid overall, but feels very shallow to me even compared to gw1.

[Specialz]

Juanele, on 24 January 2013 - 04:01 PM, said:

I only got above average and I filled out everything as well. So I'm not sure what the magic touch was to get excellent.

As an aside, is it possible to like something without being called a fanboy?

Not really, that is why you should stop caring what random people say. People are going to call you whatever is up to the individual to decide whether it affect them or not.

People like what they like and if you are too afraid of liking something because of what others perceive as bad then you should not post on the forums, but that's just my opinion.

Edited by Specialz, 25 January 2013 - 02:06 AM.

[Keaghan]

I signed up for the beta, along with my friends, can't wait to start our small guild as always and try this game out! :] I'm really excited to see how this will be, especially lore. The graphics don't look that great, probably closer to oblvion the skyrim, meaning this has been in the works for sometime. Especially considering the quick time it took from officially telling us about this project and going to beta already.

Can't wait to see open world PvP, my girlfriend and I are dot.hack fans, and we still haven't found a game that has a really nice PK system.

Stuart444, on 03 May 2012 - 05:22 PM, said:

ZeniMax Online, which still links it to the parent company of Bethesda and therefore they can get whatever they need from Bethesda relatively easy.

Oh and it's (according to the Zenimax wiki) using the same engine SWTOR used. The HeroEngine.

^ That doesn't sound promising though, lol.

Edited by Keaghan, 25 January 2013 - 02:07 AM.

[Juanele]

Specialz, on 25 January 2013 - 02:01 AM, said:

Not really, that is why you should stop caring what random people say. People are going to call you whatever is up to the individual to decide whether it affect them or not.

People like what they like and if you are too afraid of liking something because of what others perceive as bad then you should not post on the forums, but that's just my opinion.

Well it doesn't stop me from posting but just irritates me that even in a reasonable conversation someone brings out the fanboy card. As soon as someone starts using that term I ignore them. You can have a debate without using labels such as that.

[dawdler]

Keaghan, on 25 January 2013 - 02:03 AM, said:

^ That doesn't sound promising though, lol.

What's not to like about using an engine where the developers brag about being able to create a generic MMO in months with little effort?!?!?!

Edited by dawdler, 25 January 2013 - 10:50 AM.

[Specialz]

Juanele, on 25 January 2013 - 02:31 AM, said:

Well it doesn't stop me from posting but just irritates me that even in a reasonable conversation someone brings out the fanboy card. As soon as someone starts using that term I ignore them. You can have a debate without using labels such as that.

You can do a lot of things without calling names, BUT what I saying is it WILL NOT HAPPEN, so why dwell on it. If what you are saying doesn't even happen with face to face discussions what makes you think it will happen on indirect anonymous conversation on some corner of the web?

Edited by Specialz, 25 January 2013 - 04:53 PM.

[Vexies]

There is a huge difference between the Hero engine and the one SWTOR used. I played SWTOR. You need to remember SWTOR's team bought a early version of that engine and heavily modified it to work for them. Obviously they should of worked with the developers of that engine and not went off on their own. From all that I can see there is no reason to believe the engine itself, as in what its been developed into will perform in the same fashion as what was seen in SWTOR.

Im not saying people are unreasonable for being aprehensive but its obvious Bioware bit off more than they could chew with trying to tackle that on their own.  We can only speculate but id hesitate to blame the hero engine on SWTOR's issues but rather what they did or didnt do to it in there ham fisted development of that game.

[kalendraf]

dawdler, on 24 January 2013 - 10:29 PM, said:

Fat chance. Only reason TES allows for modding is because its singleplayer - you choose to cheat or not. An MMO is *never* going to allow modding. Even something as simple as creating quests (like the foundry in STO) open up a can of worms when it comes to XP and loot.

I am only talking about graphical mods, such as armor or weapon skins which only apply on the client side.  Other MMOs do in fact allow this, even if they are not necessarily directly supported.  Even GW1 technically has these via texmod.  Given the strong mod support that Bethesda has shown in prior TES games, I would not be surprised if they offered players a method to add these in their MMO.  However, I've yet to see any confirmation one way or the other.

[Gilles VI]

BuddhaKeks, on 25 January 2013 - 01:04 AM, said:

Animations are in pre-beta state, they can still change (and I don't even see what's so bad about them). Combat mechanics is something new to the MMO genre, or relative new, maybe it has been done before, though I can't think of an example right now. Point is, I would like to play it myself first, before bashing it.
Backstory isn't in anyway screwed up, Aldmeri Dominion as it is shown was present in TES lore for a long time, Daggerfall Covenant also makes sense, if you played Daggerfall you would know the king there holds influence over a lot of territory. I admit, the Ebonheart Pact is a bit of a stretch, since all 3 races in it, actually have a very strong disliking for each other, however Nord and Dunmer were known to make pacts before, to fight common enemies, like when they allied to stop the Snow Demons from Kamal. In conclusion, all factions are justified. Please name the mechanics that you don't like and need to be reworked, even though you have never seen them in action.

As you can see, you are just overly pessimistic for no reason at all. I see no reason for the game to fail (yet, could change in beta), just like GW2 hasn't failed.

While I agree, that we really don't need much more MMOs, I'm still curious to see how ESO will turn out.

Did you see the trailer? Did you watch the combat parts?
As far as I can say from that trailer, it's back to standard WoW mechanics, everyone standing still casting stuff..

[Juanele]

I thought they changed the combat to a more elder scrolls style.

[Gilles VI]

Arquenya, on 24 January 2013 - 09:22 PM, said:

Well.. what have they planned that will make the game fail?
I'm very sorry but I can't really seem to find very much on the game's intended design and mechanics at all.

Standard quests (while alot of currently being developped MMO's try to deviate from that)
Confirming there will be lots of gear to get after lvl50 = gear threadmill.
Everyone can wear anything = amazingly hard to balance = no competitive PvP.

Other than that there are still the stuff like: exploring the whole world without restrictions, pretty realistic graphics, total freedom, fps combat, mods,... that alot of the TeS playerbase loves which won't be included simply because it is an MMO.
I'm sure this will attract some people, but I think everyone who really loves TeS is going to dislike it, it simply has nothing in common with TeS so far except for the lore.. :/

I wish they just made a multi-player option for skyrim or the next gen TeS..

[BuddhaKeks]

Gilles VI, on 25 January 2013 - 05:27 PM, said:

Did you see the trailer? Did you watch the combat parts?
As far as I can say from that trailer, it's back to standard WoW mechanics, everyone standing still casting stuff..

Yes I have seen this footage, but guess what, I wont judge combat mechanics until I have played it myself. It looks a little stiff right now, but I'm interested in the active attacking/blocking part, so I'm giving the game a fair chance.

[Gilles VI]

BuddhaKeks, on 25 January 2013 - 06:26 PM, said:

Yes I have seen this footage, but guess what, I wont judge combat mechanics until I have played it myself. It looks a little stiff right now, but I'm interested in the active attacking/blocking part, so I'm giving the game a fair chance.

Sure I'm giving it a chance too, I applied for the beta and I hope I get in, but honestly I'm already expecting it to be a disappointment.. :/

[Gerroh]

I won't be bothering with TESO.
-Everything that made the TES games good(at least to me) is impossible to implement in an MMO(Mods, a true sandbox environment)
-They're known for hefty bugs and huge balance issues; which aren't as much of an issue in a single-player, moddable game; but are huge issues for anything multiplayer.
-Argonians look awful in TESO
-TES games are always a disappointment.

It looks to me like Zenimax is just hopping aboard the MMO cash-cow bandwagon, hoping to suck in more money. Anyone with any sense could see a TES MMO is a terrible idea.

Edited by Gerroh, 25 January 2013 - 07:18 PM.

[Sponx]

Gilles VI, on 25 January 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

Standard quests (while alot of currently being developped MMO's try to deviate from that)
Confirming there will be lots of gear to get after lvl50 = gear threadmill.
Everyone can wear anything = amazingly hard to balance = no competitive PvP.

Other than that there are still the stuff like: exploring the whole world without restrictions, pretty realistic graphics, total freedom, fps combat, mods,... that alot of the TeS playerbase loves which won't be included simply because it is an MMO.
I'm sure this will attract some people, but I think everyone who really loves TeS is going to dislike it, it simply has nothing in common with TeS so far except for the lore.. :/

I wish they just made a multi-player option for skyrim or the next gen TeS..

Quests in TES:O will have more than your "standard" questing. It's been stated multiple times that they will follow both the known "Go to a hub, get quests, do stuff, get reward", but there will also be quests that appeal to the players of the single-player games, where you can go out and explore a random area and encounter random quests out in the open. You will also be able to play the game in FPS-mode, all though it's mostly designed around a third person view.

Combat will also be a lot like how it is in Guild Wars 2, no aggro/threat-system, "tanking" will mostly be done by crowd-control. No cooldown on abilites, instead they will use stamina/magicka as a resource. Also, the ultimate ability which relies on finesse, you gain finesse by actively dodging, blocking and counter-attacking.

Only thing that bums me out a lot is this whole faction-lockout stuff.

And also, remember that it's not Bethesda developing this game, they are most likely already working on TES:VI while Zenimax works on TES:O.

Edited by Sponx, 25 January 2013 - 07:34 PM.

[Var]

Sponx, on 25 January 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

Quests in TES:O will have more than your "standard" questing. It's been stated multiple times that they will follow both the known "Go to a hub, get quests, do stuff, get reward", but there will also be quests that appeal to the players of the single-player games, where you can go out and explore a random area and encounter random quests out in the open. You will also be able to play the game in FPS-mode, all though it's mostly designed around a third person view.

Thats pretty much the same as general MMO questing, just phrased differently. Hubs are not (and have never been) the only ways to find quests, even WoW has out-in-the-world-randomly-located quests. They could have *random quests* but all those can amount too (since they can never be scripted very richly due to their random nature) would be akin to the skyrim arbitrary dragon attacks or road-side events (unless they are zone specific quests... in which case they are exactly the same as the randomly thrown around WoW quests). But these's aren't really quests just happenings in the world that repeat on some arbitrary timer in some set of randomly chosen locations. I doubt they are going to go for the GW2 variety either in which you can't go five feet without tripping over an event given that they seem to be focusing more on hubs than anything. So it seems like we're either getting garden variety questing en masse, or garden variety questing with some GW2-like events thrown here and there over the maps.

As for the combat, as far as I've seen in videos (and if you want to compare them to GW2 previews), it seems far too rigid of a system to be really at all like the GW2 system. But we'll have to wait and see on that one.

[MyTabbycat]

Keaghan, on 25 January 2013 - 02:03 AM, said:

I signed up for the beta, along with my friends, can't wait to start our small guild as always and try this game out! :] I'm really excited to see how this will be, especially lore. The graphics don't look that great, probably closer to oblvion the skyrim, meaning this has been in the works for sometime. Especially considering the quick time it took from officially telling us about this project and going to beta already.

Can't wait to see open world PvP, my girlfriend and I are dot.hack fans, and we still haven't found a game that has a really nice PK system.


^ That doesn't sound promising though, lol.

They aren't using the hero engine. http://www.gameinfor...heroengine.aspx

[Specialz]

Don't expect guild wars 2 style quest mainly because they have been making it since before guild wars 2 revealed it's Dynamic event system. Personally, I applied for the beta and I am going in with no expectations, I mean there is no benefit being excited or having expectations for a game you haven't seen or played. Seeing a game is not teh same as playing a game.

Just to add, remember unreleased games are usually better than ALL the games out in the market, UNTIL...release.

[Gilles VI]

Sponx, on 25 January 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

Quests in TES:O will have more than your "standard" questing. It's been stated multiple times that they will follow both the known "Go to a hub, get quests, do stuff, get reward", but there will also be quests that appeal to the players of the single-player games, where you can go out and explore a random area and encounter random quests out in the open. You will also be able to play the game in FPS-mode, all though it's mostly designed around a third person view.

Combat will also be a lot like how it is in Guild Wars 2, no aggro/threat-system, "tanking" will mostly be done by crowd-control. No cooldown on abilites, instead they will use stamina/magicka as a resource. Also, the ultimate ability which relies on finesse, you gain finesse by actively dodging, blocking and counter-attacking.

Only thing that bums me out a lot is this whole faction-lockout stuff.

And also, remember that it's not Bethesda developing this game, they are most likely already working on TES:VI while Zenimax works on TES:O.

Euhm the only other-than-standard quest they gave was the black anchor system as far as I know..
Which is basically Rifts in a other skin.. (black anchor from molag bal lands randomly in world and people work together to destroy it)
fps or 3rd person view doesn't matter, fact is I'm used to having total battle freedom in TeS and now I will have to use skills and w/e..

And they can say all what they want about "action combat" the video shows very boring standing toe-to-toe WoW combat.
Just the same with Tera and its "action combat", it sounds awesome on paper, but in reality it's just standing there, "oh noes his eyes glow red" and press block, and that's it.
That said, I'm very glad they don't go fully the WoW way with tons of skills but instead go for fewer skills with bigger differences between them.

True, but fact that it isn't Bugthesda working on it doesn't prove anything, Zenimax didn't make anything before this, yes they have some big names on their team, but so did ToR..
And in the promotion videos (the one with the first ever game-play,...) the person who is talking looks very passive to me, and all his arguments came back to, "we assure you this isn't WoW, but I cannot give you an exact reason why, and w can't even show you..".

[Robsy128]

I'll give it a go when it goes F2P. I never touch P2P games.

[Gilles VI]

Robsy128, on 25 January 2013 - 08:30 PM, said:

I'll give it a go when it goes F2P. I never touch P2P games.

Same, but I will try to get in beta, applied with 3 emails lol.
And if there ever comes open beta I will try for sure.

But if it has a sub-fee I won't play it, not even if I'm having a blast.
Sub-fee is the biggest lie ever in this decade..

[Robsy128]

Gilles VI, on 25 January 2013 - 08:38 PM, said:

Same, but I will try to get in beta, applied with 3 emails lol.
And if there ever comes open beta I will try for sure.

But if it has a sub-fee I won't play it, not even if I'm having a blast.
Sub-fee is the biggest lie ever in this decade..

I'd say it's worth looking into but... eh. There just doesn't seem to be anything that makes this game stand out from the others, aside tom the title: The Elder Scrolls. I remember watching a video of the Elder Scrolls Online a while ago back before GW2 came out and the designer who was on the show and being interviewed really didn't sell the game all that well. He just fell flat on his face when they asked him what innovative features the Elder Scrolls Online was bringing to the industry. Then I compared his interview with the Arenanet videos, and without wishing to sound like a fanboy, they actually sounded like they cared and knew exactly how to be different in the industry of MMOs.

[Arquenya]

Gilles VI, on 25 January 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

Standard quests (while alot of currently being developped MMO's try to deviate from that)
Confirming there will be lots of gear to get after lvl50 = gear threadmill.
Everyone can wear anything = amazingly hard to balance = no competitive PvP.

Other than that there are still the stuff like: exploring the whole world without restrictions, pretty realistic graphics, total freedom, fps combat, mods,... that alot of the TeS playerbase loves which won't be included simply because it is an MMO.
I'm sure this will attract some people, but I think everyone who really loves TeS is going to dislike it, it simply has nothing in common with TeS so far except for the lore.. :/

I wish they just made a multi-player option for skyrim or the next gen TeS..

Well .. all that still doesn't make or break a game, at least not to me.
I guess it's just too early to have any well-founded opinion about the game yet.

[Gilles VI]

Arquenya, on 26 January 2013 - 09:41 AM, said:

Well .. all that still doesn't make or break a game, at least not to me.
I guess it's just too early to have any well-founded opinion about the game yet.

You're right it is to early, but well it is a gamebreaker for me.
After GW2 DE's, discuss how they aren't really dynamic all you want, there is no going back for me..
I tried SW:ToR, LotR:O and Aion again, was bored in all of em before reaching lvl5..
And with bored I mean totally wondering myself "why am I even playing this..?".

[Arquenya]

Gilles VI, on 26 January 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

"why am I even playing this..?".

I'm finding myself asking that same question quite regularly

But yes, we'll see. I'm not keeping my hopes up too high though. The MMORPG franchise is in quite a deplorable state compared to other genres in the gaming industry. Too bad I just don't really enjoy single player games as much.

Edited by Kamatsu, 26 January 2013 - 10:59 PM.
Removed off-topic GW2 comments

[omar316]

Gilles VI, on 26 January 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

You're right it is to early, but well it is a gamebreaker for me.
After GW2 DE's, discuss how they aren't really dynamic all you want, there is no going back for me..
I tried SW:ToR, LotR:O and Aion again, was bored in all of em before reaching lvl5..
And with bored I mean totally wondering myself "why am I even playing this..?".

I can't even stand the so called level 1 DE crap/story crap where you need to kill the Centaur joke at level 1. I quit Gw2 at level 2.

Back on ToR where scenarios actually are fun instead of waiting to stand in a circle for 10 seconds in different skinned maps.
And holy shit I get to play with spec trees and go all nuts with my spec/abilites/gear stats instead of being pressing 1 for 20 seconds and watching for CDs for 40 seconds.

And finally some hope for proper 3 faction based World PvP.