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Visual Height Comparison -- Norn vs Human

height character models norn human tall short

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#1 Tibbel

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 12:14 AM

Hey everyone,

I am pretty sure that I'll be playing GW2 when the time comes, and after playing around in the beta this past weekend, I have pretty well convinced myself that I'll be playing a Norn. I really liked how their whole spirits of the wild/great hunt story works with ranger as my preferred profession.

Anyway, after not thinking about playing a Norn until this weekend (and not having played the original Guild Wars for any kind of reference), I've now been reading everything I can about Norn over the last couple of days -- and while I've seen lots of places that say, "OMG Norns is huuge!" (or in some cases, "OMG certain anatomical features of Norns is huuge!"), I haven't seen anyone actually compare the size of the Norn models to those of the Humans.

So, I spent some time this weekend in making this:

Posted Image

(Click to make the image Norn-sized.)

What I did was make one of each gender of each race (Norn, Human) of each height extreme (max height, min height). Where possible, I chose the bald hairstyle; human women can't be bald, so I chose the hairstyle which seemed have the lowest vertical "poof".

Also, each character is a ranger. I'm not sure if different professions have different height limits, but I think it's reasonable to assume there won't be any great discrepancy in relative heights between races across other professions. (i.e. Norn guardians may be taller, but we can reasonably assume that human guardians might also be taller.)

The screenshots were taken at max camera distance, with the camera rotated down to ground level. As is evident in the image, each character was positioned immediately in front of the same section of wall (one of the buildings near the portal area in Lion's Arch).

The horizontal lines on the image are color-coded by race/gender combination:
  • Blue = male Norn
  • Green = female Norn
  • Orange = male Human
  • Pink = female Human
If we assume 6'1" (6 feet 1 inch; 185 cm) is the average height for male Humans, then measuring the others to scale gives the range of available character heights:
  • Norn Male: 7'6"–9'1" (229–277 cm), avg = 8'4" (253 cm)
  • Norn Female: 6'10"–8'3" (208–251 cm), avg = 7'6" (229 cm)
  • Human Male: 5'6"–6'8" (168–203 cm), avg = 6'1" (185 cm)
  • Human Female: 5'3"–6'5" (160–196 cm), avg = 5'10" (178 cm)
Hopefully this helps others who may have had the same questions as I did.

Also, sorry for not doing this for the other races. I might have if I had time this weekend, but I do think that the other races have unique features so as to not rely on height to contribute as greatly to their racial differentiation. Should have done it yourself if you cared! :)

#2 Arquenya

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:00 AM

Very nice, funny to see that smallest Norn is about the same height as the tallest human.

Only .. average male human 185cm .. not sure where you live? ;-)

#3 iLag

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:09 AM

View PostArquenya, on 24 July 2012 - 08:00 AM, said:

Very nice, funny to see that smallest Norn is about the same height as the tallest human.

Only .. average male human 185cm .. not sure where you live? ;-)
Probably europe, I see that as normal too. But meh if you don't, specially since human characters are meant to be young generally therefore usually younger people are taller.

#4 Isarien

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:13 AM

Quite interesting how broad the difference is between Norn M/F sizes.

Instead of an inch or two between two characters at either end of the spectrum, like humans, it's a whole head.

Also, I am almost certain there is no profession based size influence, aside from the armor itself. I.E., a heavy armor profession. is going to not only look bigger, but his or her larger shoes may also give him or her a slight boost compared to a light armor profession

#5 Kang

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:26 AM

Really interesting to see! Thanks for making the effort to do this.

I wasn't aware just how big a difference the height slider makes on character creation, it's hard without any points of reference. I main a male Norn with the slider maxed out and I didn't feel out of place at all until I met up with my friends in LA who rolled human characters.

I'm not sure about the 'average' height of males being 6'1" (at least in Australia), but I'm not the best judge being 6'5", I just perceive everyone shorter than me 'short' and leave it at that.

#6 Cl1p

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:33 AM

View PostiLag, on 24 July 2012 - 08:09 AM, said:

Probably europe, I see that as normal too. But meh if you don't, specially since human characters are meant to be young generally therefore usually younger people are taller.
yea but where in Europe, it's definetly not a norm in belgium, france, italy or spain :P

#7 Isarien

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:43 AM

If we're going to nitpick about the OP's choice of "average human male height", let's bear in mind that the characters we're playing on aren't on earth, for one thing. As we know, humans on Tyria don't play by the same rules as we do. Hell, King Doric lived to be at least 130, if not more.

We have no gauge of what "average" is for humans on Tyria. Norn, on average (even the women), were described as being 9 feet tall in Ghosts of Ascalon, which cannot be reached by a player character according to the OP's measurements. By this logic, average human height would have to be much greater than 6'1", or else the Norn aren't as big as they were originally stated.

#8 Istaro

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:54 AM

I think the OP lives in the Dinaric Alps.

http://en.wikipedia....round_the_world

#9 Oduru

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:58 AM

View PostArquenya, on 24 July 2012 - 08:00 AM, said:

Very nice, funny to see that smallest Norn is about the same height as the tallest human.

Only .. average male human 185cm .. not sure where you live? ;-)

Quite probably not that far away from where you live. According to this source.

Quote

Statistically, the tallest people in the world, as measured by country are the Dutch. The average height for all adults for the Netherlands is 6 feet 1 inch (1.85 m).

Edited by Oduru, 24 July 2012 - 08:58 AM.


#10 Sleepyx732

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 09:01 AM

203 - 168 = 35.

Hrmm.. wow 35 cm really makes a difference huh?

#11 Isarien

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 09:19 AM

View PostSleepyx732, on 24 July 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

203 - 168 = 35.

Hrmm.. wow 35 cm really makes a difference huh?

The estimates are a bit off, as should be expected. If the difference between max Norn male and min Norn male is really 48 centimeters, precisely measured, the max Norn male in question would only be about 256 (7'9"ish) centimeters tall, as his entire body is about 5 and 1/3 times as tall as the gap between the two blue lines.

Norn are supposed to be around 9 feet tall though, which means humans are much bigger in Tyria than on Earth, or Norn got 'nerfed' at some point.

But, 35 cm is quite a vast difference, no matter how you slice it. That's about the difference between 5'2" and 6'4" for those who aren't acquainted with metric.

#12 Eqo

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 09:57 AM

Thanks for taking the time to make this visual comparison! I always feel nervous when picking a height for my characters since I don't know how that compares to average heights others will choose, or how it relates to other races. In GW1 a guild mate made her female character the max height, but it seemed most everyone else in the guild made short characters, so when we did group stuff she stood out like a giant. I wouldn't want to draw that much attention to myself! :D

#13 Count Viceroy

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:34 AM

If you're going with a big character, you might as well go all the way. If its worth doing, it's worth overdoing.

That being said, a tall norn clad in armor stands out like a skyscraper in a sea of tiny people. It looks hilarious in a zerg battle.

I'm going max sized charr, but with the whole hunch back thing, they don't look as bad as maxed out norn do.

#14 Arquenya

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:46 AM

View PostEqo, on 24 July 2012 - 09:57 AM, said:

Thanks for taking the time to make this visual comparison! I always feel nervous when picking a height for my characters since I don't know how that compares to average heights others will choose, or how it relates to other races. In GW1 a guild mate made her female character the max height, but it seemed most everyone else in the guild made short characters, so when we did group stuff she stood out like a giant. I wouldn't want to draw that much attention to myself! :D
Haha I also make tall girls, especially since they're already smaller than males by default.
I wonder if we're having any cutscenes in GW2 as about the best way to really see the differences and make nice screenies!! ;)
Especially with the norn and asura we should get some pretty funny group compositions.

Also nice that the smallest norn is about the same size as the tallest human.
That way small norns could blend in with humans very well.

#15 Donedusted

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 10:55 AM

Thanks a lot for doing this! I was really curious because I couldn't decide between Norn and Human and size was the deciding factor for me.

Thanks again!

#16 Zeffi

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 11:31 AM

I stood under a Norn in Divinity's Reach at the weekend, whether he was big or small I shall never know!  I came up to his knee..yes I can bite kneecaps...

#17 AlienMagi

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 12:11 PM

Would be nice to see charts like these for the rest of the races.

#18 XgreatArtist

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 12:14 PM

omg norn is massive!!!!!!!!!!

#19 Syncline

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 01:27 PM

In  NA, average male height is 5'9ish, while for women it's 5'4ish.

Note that in game norn are likely slightly shorter than the lore ones, because the devs had to pick a min/max size for every race that jived with the same-size hitbox for every player character.

#20 Illein

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 01:43 PM

I think I speak for everyone reading this thread if I ask one very obvious question:

How did you get Shaquille O'Neal to model for your norn measurement?!

#21 Tibbel

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 03:14 PM

Thanks everyone for the positive feedback while I was sleeping. (I live on the east coast of the US, not in Europe as some have postulated.) :)

Regarding the average human height, I have a few answers:
  • I have heard that Norn can get "over 9 feet tall". So if the tallest Norn is 1 inch over 9 feet, then these are the heights of the rest of the sizes.

Komlos believes the Dutch will remain the world's tallest people for some time yet, eventually achieving what might be seen as ideal heights -- averages of six foot two for men and five foot eight for women -- for what he calls the optimum "biological standard of living."

  • Lastly, who cares? :P The height measurements are really just for interest's sake, as what actually matters is the comparative sizes with other characters. As far as I have seen, there's not anything in-game that says, "You must be this high to ride," or any other height standards. (Although, maybe the Asura have some secret roller coaster somewhere that has a maximum allowable height. xD)

Edited by Tibbel, 24 July 2012 - 03:16 PM.


#22 Symbiont

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 03:17 PM

should there be such a big difference among the same race? the scale differences does look weird to me.

#23 Illein

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 03:36 PM

It's a freaking GIANT race, people. Get over it.

#24 Scry

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 03:42 PM

Good work, really interesting to see - I wish we could see the Sylvari in this too (but thats just me :) )

#25 Nedra

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 03:44 PM

View PostTibbel, on 24 July 2012 - 03:14 PM, said:

While the real average male human height is a bit shorter than 6'1", the characters we play are heroes. If we say that heroes' heights are most likely centered around a genetically advantageous level, then here's a source saying the numbers I picked may not be so far off of that value. The summary:

Here it says that the average height in the US for example is 5'7''
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Human_height

6'1'' seems pretty tall to me. It's certainly not an average. But yeah, as you said, probably heroes have to be tall.

#26 Mr_Finesse

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 03:56 PM

So basically, everyone who makes a norn should be maxing out their height to really get the "giant-race" feel.

#27 Raxzor

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 05:15 PM

Actually on Beta Norn forums there was a 3 page thread on how the Norn had been shrunk. So they where originally bigger than that.

#28 Brine

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 05:17 PM

I would like to know tallest Norn to shorest Asura.. Just to see the difference

#29 907gamer

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 05:19 PM

My tall Asura is going to look like an ant next to your tall Norn. Maybe you could give me a piggy back ride?

#30 Ravers

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 05:24 PM

View PostBrine, on 24 July 2012 - 05:17 PM, said:

I would like to know tallest Norn to shorest Asura.. Just to see the difference

Or Asura children. They were almost smaller than my Charr's foot!




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