Jump to content

  • Curse Sites
Help
- - - - -

Mesmer Assumption


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
477 replies to this topic

#1 Tzu Qui Jinn

Tzu Qui Jinn

    Golem Rider

  • Members
  • 2736 posts
  • Location:Eternal Battlegrounds Jumping Puzzle
  • Guild Tag:[CAMP]
  • Server:Sanctum of Rall

Posted 16 July 2010 - 11:09 PM

OK most of us are now convinced that mesmers will make a return in Guild Wars 2.

The question I have is

1) What weapons do you think the Mesmer have access too?

2) What Mesmer or other spells do you think will make a return by use of the Mesmer?

I think the Mesmer will have the following weapons available to them.
Main Hand: Pistol, scepter, sword
Two Hand: Staff
Off Hand: Focus, Pistol

I think the main area's of magic for the Mesmer will be
Dominance
Illusion
Inspiration
Curses - I really believe the curse line of skills will transfer to the Mesmer, separating Hex power balance from the Necromancer.

Popular skills we might see returned are.
From Domination
Wastrel's Worry, Empathy, Cry of Frustration, Backfire, and Energy Surge as an ELITE

From Illusion
Conjure Phantasm, Illusion of Haste, Wandering Eye, Imagined Burden, and Illusionary Weapon as an ELITE

From Inspiration or Other
Energy Tap, Spirit Shackles, Ether Feast, Spirit of Failure and Extend Conditions or Echo as ELITE's.

Curses
Soul Barbs, Barbs, Mark of Pain, Shadow of Fear, and Spiteful Spirit as an ELITE.
NOTE: I chose these spells because they are Hex spells that arguably should have been Mesmer skills to begin with. I don't want to rehash old ground on a discussion that has been on going for 5 years now. I also do not want to turn this into a necromancer vs. Mesmer thread. If you don't think Curses will be on the new Mesmer, I'm cool with that.

What I want to know is what is your opinion on what the new Mesmer will be at the basics.

#2 Vorsakan

Vorsakan

    Storm Chaser

  • Site Contributors
  • 3027 posts

Posted 16 July 2010 - 11:53 PM

My own wild speculation...

Weapons

Main hand: Scepter, sword
Two hands: Staff
Off hand: Focus, dagger

Magic

I think, with the stream-lining emphasis of GW2, hexes won't play nearly so big a role; they're unintuitive & hard to distinguish, and unless they stack (which would be dreadful!) then multiple mesmers + gear skills + open world events = disastrously inefficient.

Instead, I'm guessing mesmers will in fact be 'pure' magicians somewhat akin to necromancers in GW1; point & click non-projectile conditions & crowd control, without making the scope/duration/recharge sacrifices elementalists invariably do appending X elemental damage to everything.

I'll also go out on a limb and predict that mesmers are the scholar class who summon minions out of thin air; Conjure Phantasm, Conjure Nightmare and so forth will actually summon short duration pets - more for use dynamically mid-combat, as opposed to GW1 style pre-combat set-ups.

For the business of killing, I'll go for:
> Counter spells (as in "if casting a spell...", "if attacking...")
> Direct chaos damage with a side of energy loss.
> Channeled spells comparable to GW1 hexes.
E.g. Empathy as a physical-attack Pain Inverter, with translucent sorrowful eyes over the foe that weep each time damage is incurred.
E.g. If mesmers adopt Spiteful Spirit, while channeling it the foe will actually be shrouded in a spiteful spirit that strikes/flares/whatever each time the target performs an action.

#3 Corpsesarefun

Corpsesarefun

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1436 posts

Posted 16 July 2010 - 11:54 PM

I hope and dream that mesmers get REAL illusions such as copies of allies and enemies to sow real confusion as well as hexes and interupts.

#4 Shadow Ritualist

Shadow Ritualist

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 701 posts

Posted 16 July 2010 - 11:59 PM

Corpsesarefun said:

I hope and dream that mesmers get REAL illusions such as copies of allies and enemies to sow real confusion as well as hexes and interupts.
YES. That's one thing I'd definatly want to see on a mesmer. And based on the professions page wouldn't they also have to have warhorns as an offhand?

#5 Craywulf

Craywulf

    Legion Commander

  • Members
  • 5273 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:05 AM

I think the Mesmer is going to be a very visual character to play. As we seen so far the skills and spells are now literal interpretations. I think the Mesmer will focus on Illusion and Domination. I think fast casting and Inspiration are going to be less of a focus.

#6 Eragon Zarroc

Eragon Zarroc

    Vigil Crusader

  • Members
  • 4198 posts
  • Location:Madness Incarnate
  • Profession:Warrior
  • Guild Tag:[WoD]
  • Server:Blackgate

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:12 AM

i think that the mesmer skills will have some pretty awesome skill animations :D  that's for sure ;)

#7 Crook

Crook

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1341 posts
  • Location:Canada
  • Guild Tag:[Gem]
  • Server:Blackgate

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:25 AM

Okay when I first started playing GW in 06,when I saw Illusion Magic from Mesmers ; I though actual Illusion:(

Or maybe push it even more, appear a optical illusion on your ennemy's screen:p

#8 Corpsesarefun

Corpsesarefun

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1436 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:28 AM

in game illusions would be better than opticals as they are tactics and strategy rather than a vision test :P

#9 Tall

Tall

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 563 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:30 AM

Tzu Qui Jinn said:

Main Hand: Pistol, scepter, sword
Two Hand: Staff
Off Hand: Focus, Pistol

Oh please. pleasepleaseplease let this be true. I would be ever so happy if mesmers could dualwield pistols and use swords.

But I don't agree with the merging of necromancer hexes. Most necromancer curses are more about weakening the opponent rather than countering, which is what a mesmer does.

#10 Breathe Hope

Breathe Hope

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 91 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:31 AM

I'd be all for actual illusions implemented in GW2 if there is a Mesmer. :p
Distortion would be a really cool effect. :D

Though, I doubt Mesmers will be able to use guns, swords would be more appropriate.

#11 Phoenix Tears

Phoenix Tears

    Banned

  • Banned
  • 2115 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:43 AM

And i'm exactly with that opinion... Curses belong to Necros. - Period - More has not to be said. End of Discussion.

However, to your thread I've to say otherwise only:

When there are mesmers again, regardles how being name, if Mesmer, Psionist, Mentalist or however, I think they will wield those weapons:

Scepters: VX
Staffs: V
Swords: VX
Daggers: XV
Pistols: VV
Focus: XV

I hope they improve them and don't simple reuse only what they had in GW1.
They should not use Illusions again, thats somethign for Assassins/Rogues.

Their Magic should be based on

Sleep Magic (Dominance/ Hypnosis)
Manticism (Inspiration/ Mantras/ Tarot Cards, Astral Magic > 4 in 1 mix)
and
Arcane Magic (Chaos/Fast Casting/Mind Power > 3 in 1 mix)

Their Main Gameplay Mechanic should be based on their Mind Powers.

Mesmers, to keep now for the moment and the sake of this thread at this Class name, staying at it, can have alot of new possible skill types to improve them and to make them more fun to play.

- Tarot Cards: used to make various predictions for either urself, ur allies or ur enemies.
Tarot Cards are two bladed swords, they can have either positive effects, or negative side effects for their effects they deal over time. Due to Tarot Cards being limited, are all Tarot Cards Skills Elites

- Mantras: Could be easily redesigned for GW2 so that they become better and more useful as self buff skills, maybe working as some kind of magical preparation skill like preparations worked for rangers in GW1. We know, Rangers wont have preparatinos in GW2 anymore, so why not let mantras take over this effect function as preparations as features like they worked were absolutely more useful, than mantras.

Psychokinetics Are attack skills that you perform with your Mind Powers

Telepathies Support Skills that you perform over your Mind Powers

Visions Self Buff Skills that you have through your Mind Powers

Astral Magic comes together with using Tarot Cards, allowing u to use the powers of the Sun, Moon and Stars to your help. lettign for example fall down a rain of shooting stars on your foes as example.

Arcanums AoE field skills that buff allies and allow you to use ur spells faster, while you stand in ur own Arcanums.

-------------

However, next step, which mesmer Skills do I guess, would make a return:


Scepter:
Visions of Regret (Elite)
Empathy
Backfire

Staff:
Energy Wave (Elite)
Phantom Pain (with changed effect)
Ether Lord (with changed effect)
Arcane Echo (renamed to Arcanum of Dual Speech)
Chaos Storm

Daggers:
Illusionary Weaponry (renamed to  Phantom Blade) (Elite)
Physical Resitance (renamed to Mantra of Repell)

Swords:
Repelling Parry > Elegant Whirlwind Slash > Stinger of the Scorpion (Elite)
Elite-3 Part Combo that blocks with high chance the next incoming attack with a counter, followed by a quick elegant double hit turning around the foe and thrusting the weapon from behind into the back of the foe poisoning them.

Elemental Resistance (renamed to Mantra of Reflection)
Quick Thrust > Staccatto > Heart Driller
3-part Combo which interrupts a foe quickly, initiates after that then a high speed flurry of seral thrusts which finalizes with one very heavy thrust that ignores the armor and leads to bleeding and knocks the foe down.


Pistols single
Disruptor Shot  (interrupts foe and deactivates skill usage for foe for the next x seconds)
Piercing Shot deals higher damage than normal due to ignoring the armor.
Charged Shot so logner u hold down the button, so more power gains the shot and so more range has it has bonus (+50% more power/range max)(Elite)

Pistols dual
Desperado  (fires quickly multiple times at the foes in ur near) (Elite)
Twin Shot - use both pistols simultanously to hit a foe twice
Mantra of Bulletproof > protects u for short time against projectiles from firearms
Cross Fire - additional damage agaisnt foes that stand adjacent to allies with high critical chance
Shot of the Gunslinger - A shot that gets downed allies back up, when you kill with it enemies.

Focus:
Hypnotic Gaze - stuns foes and lets them sleep for short time
Conjure Nightmare (renamed tp Nightmare Terror) - deals high damage against through hypnotic gaze stunned foes


Universal Skills:

Ether Fest
Ignorance (renamed to Mantra of Ignorance)
Tarot Card of Death (Elite)
When you draw this card for your enemy, can't the enemy be safed from being downed for the next 60 seconds, if you draw this card for yourself or an ally, the same effect counts for them, but when you die cause of this skills effect, then you will be next time protected against beign downed once.

Force of the Sun
When you gain through this skill the Force of the Sun will get enemies, which come into your adjacent near be blinded and start to burn as long they sta in your adjacent near. if the foe is out of your adjacent near will stop the negative ailments after x seconds


so, that was it, enough of concepting for first XD

#12 Corpsesarefun

Corpsesarefun

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1436 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:44 AM

Sorry phoenix but you dont seem to capture what a mesmer is :/ that concept is just a psychic not a MESMER if you see what i mean.

#13 Lyssa

Lyssa

    Wooden Potatoes

  • Community Contributors
  • 4840 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:52 AM

All I'm going to say this late at night is that I think:

Necromancer will lose curses to the Mesmer. (It will gain Wanderlust etc from rits in exchange)

Ranger will lose interupts to the mesmer. (It will gain Preservation etc as nature rituals from rits in exchange)

These two changes help to make each proffesion feel truly unique. Roles are no longer diffused between different proffesions!

Inspiration will become more focused on ally support.
Domination will stay mostly the same but borrow from great curses skills.
Illusion will stay mostly the same but animations will be swiiiiiiiish. I'd love for it to mess with players UI in PvP.
Fast casting will be dropped for another, fresh mechanic for the Mesmer.

#14 Phoenix Tears

Phoenix Tears

    Banned

  • Banned
  • 2115 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:54 AM

Corpsesarefun said:

Sorry phoenix but you dont seem to capture what a mesmer is :/ that concept is just a psychic not a MESMER if you see what i mean.


lol.. have u even thrown for a single second a gaze onto the skills I've taken for example for scepter and staff >.>

I bet you've just read only the word Psionist I mentioned 1 time above at the begin and you thought directly, the whole thing is about a psychic class only.
That mesmers evolve more into the psychics is imo just only common sense, its the only way how the mesmer Class can be improved, without changing too much from its origin making it look like something totally different.

#15 Craywulf

Craywulf

    Legion Commander

  • Members
  • 5273 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:55 AM

Phoenix Tears,

Miss Cleo called she says she Mesmers are not part of the Psychic Readers Network.

#16 Corpsesarefun

Corpsesarefun

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1436 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 12:56 AM

Dude you JUST said that mesmers should become psychics which is wrong, mesmers are mesmers and thats all they are :D

#17 Grunntar

Grunntar

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 448 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:09 AM

Corpsesarefun said:

I hope and dream that mesmers get ... hexes and interupts.

Hexes are so... Guild Wars 1!  I predict no hexes in GW2.

I'd rather see Conjure Phantasm summon this little guy to fight for you:

Posted Image

(Note, this is from the movie Forbidden Planet.  It's called the Id Monster, as was created by the imagination of Dr. Edward Morbius while he dreamed.)

Edited by Grunntar, 17 July 2010 - 01:12 AM.


#18 Gigashadow

Gigashadow

    Golem Rider

  • Members
  • 2363 posts
  • Location:Bellevue, WA
  • Guild Tag:[CYBG]
  • Server:Stormbluff Isle

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:12 AM

I think Conjure Phantasm will be back, except that this time it will summon a real illusion that attacks the target.  However, it will probably do something more interesting this time than just being an unattackable DoT.  Maybe you can kill it, or maybe it steals energy and gives it to the mesmer, or slows down casting or something.

#19 Charocles

Charocles

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 232 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:19 AM

Mesmer should create acual islusions. If not, no need for them in gw2 :P

#20 Saul Spotter

Saul Spotter

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1105 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:22 AM

I bet the Mesmer will be able to use any weapons, having mastered the ancient illusionary weapon skill over the centuries.

#21 Chronologix

Chronologix

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 359 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:28 AM

I watched a trailer for R.U.S.E the other day, and thought about illusions and "tricking" your foes.

And as a Mesmer, this can have some wildly tactical and strategic implications. Such as creating false allies or making your allies APPEAR as something they are not.

Example: (in GW1 terms: mesmer casts a spell that makes your warrior appear as a monk, enemies target the warrior, dealing less damage to the higher armor, saving your monk from harm, and slowly realize the monk is now beating them with a hammer)

#22 Validus

Validus

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 164 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:39 AM

I see the Mesmer definitely having domination and illusion magic. I think skills like Conjure Phantasm and other illusion skills would have effects similar to the Phoenix skill, where a creature is created to attack the enemy.
I am also really hoping they give Mesmers pistols at least as a second hand weapon. Since Elementalist can use daggers (for reasons I can't quite figure out), I don't see why mesmers wouldn't be able to use pistols. Not to mention they would be awesome with pistols!

#23 Reyno

Reyno

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 302 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:01 AM

I'm hoping that mesmers will be a lot more visual with their magic.  I thought the mesmer in GW1 was cool, especially as a concept, but I felt that it just went by a little unnoticed.  That didn't make it any less of a profession, its presence was just a little small.

So hopefully the mesmer's visuals are bolstered in GW2.  And from what we've seen so far (skills actually prompting the described motions and what not - whirling defense is an active, visual defense.  stances put your character into an actual stance) I think we can bet on seeing some seriously impressive shit from the Mes.  

My speculation as far as weapons go:

Main Hand: Scepter, Sword
Off Hand: Focus, Dagger
Two-Handed: Staff

And PT, I really have to disagree with that interpretation of the mesmer.  That's really just changing the entire concept from an illusionist to a diviner.  Illusions are mind magic, and belong to the mesmer.  Assassins get their shadow/sneaky arts.  No more on that, though, since this is about the mesmer.  The psychokinetics could be a possibility, though.  Psychokinetic barriers?  Force fields?  I think I'd dig it.

Maybe they could have some type of active glyph mechanic - placing a glyph (resembling an alchemic symbol or some such thing) on the ground that can buff friendlies nearby or standing on it.  Similarly, the same could be done to debuff enemies.  Like a redirection glyph that sends the enemy running off in another direction when they run over it.  Or a skill-down glyph that removes use of any skill used while over the glyph for a set period of time.  Or a misdirection that redirects the target of the next used attack skill to an opponent's own ally.  Or if they wanted to go extreme, a petrification glyph that freezes any opponent that steps on it for a set duration.

I'm imagining things, and maybe that's a little un-mesmer-ish, but I'm hoping to see some dynamically visual magic like this.

#24 The Candidate

The Candidate

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 191 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 05:27 AM

a lot of what i was going to say was covered, so ill just support them.

Vorsakan said:

I'll also go out on a limb and predict that mesmers are the scholar class who summon minions out of thin air; Conjure Phantasm, Conjure Nightmare and so forth will actually summon short duration pets - more for use dynamically mid-combat, as opposed to GW1 style pre-combat set-ups.

Corpsesarefun said:

I hope and dream that mesmers get REAL illusions such as copies of allies and enemies to sow real confusion as well as hexes and interupts.
DEFINATELY this ^

Lyssa said:

Ranger will lose interupts to the mesmer. (It will gain Preservation etc as nature rituals from rits in exchange)

These two changes help to make each proffesion feel truly unique. Roles are no longer diffused between different proffesions!

Illusion will stay mostly the same but animations will be swiiiiiiiish. I'd love for it to mess with players UI in PvP.

Craywulf said:

Phoenix Tears,

Miss Cleo called she says she Mesmers are not part of the Psychic Readers Network.

ahahahah :p

for weps, id like to see pistols and swords (rapiers). and of course, scepters and staffs. (plz  duel weild pistols) :D

just wanted to emphasize, REAL illusions (Think turn invisible, turn appearance into enemy npc to sneak by, make copies of self, make scary demon to send foes running, conjure pets for a short time, tricking foe into attacking his ally.. you get the picture :p),
inspiration more team support based and more interupts.

#25 Whisper

Whisper

    Golem Rider

  • Members
  • 2052 posts
  • Location:Denmark
  • Guild Tag:[KSL]
  • Server:Whiteside Ridge

Posted 17 July 2010 - 01:55 PM

Visual illusions would be nice... I also hope skills such as panic return...That skill is the very embodiment of the mesmer....Chaos

#26 Chalky

Chalky

    chalktastic

  • Super Moderators
  • 4786 posts
  • Guild Tag:[GOON]
  • Server:Maguuma

Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:00 PM

Pistols certainly would be a very nice touch for the class.  They're subtle enough to fit with a caster - not like a longbow or something - and you could probably have some pretty cool pistol skills for the class.

I don't believe we have any classes that can use pistols yet.

#27 Greyhart

Greyhart

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 185 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:08 PM

I wonder what the special mechanic of the Mesmer could be?

Elementalist gets attunements
Warrior adrenialine
Ranger pet

So what would make the Mesmer special?  Surely not simply the type of spells

#28 Corpsesarefun

Corpsesarefun

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1436 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:27 PM

Elementalists get attunement, adaptability.
Warriors get adrenaline, power.
Rangers get a pet, multiple targets.
Assassins get stealth.
Mesmers get physical illusions.
Necromancers get sacrifise.
Engineers get materials.
Macelady get something :L

#29 Lyssa

Lyssa

    Wooden Potatoes

  • Community Contributors
  • 4840 posts

Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:37 PM

''Physical illusions'' Cant really be their own unique mechanic...

I'm struggling to think of what it could be, too.

Maybe some kind of 'spell chaining' system or 'multi cast' where they can cast two spells at once. You know, an improvement on Fast casting as it was before.

EDIT:
A lot of people like the idea of being able to use a sword with Riposte and stuff. Would be nice if the Mesmers unique ability allows them to function as a caster while in that environment.

Edited by Lyssa, 17 July 2010 - 02:41 PM.


#30 Chalky

Chalky

    chalktastic

  • Super Moderators
  • 4786 posts
  • Guild Tag:[GOON]
  • Server:Maguuma

Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:59 PM

Lyssa said:

''Physical illusions'' Cant really be their own unique mechanic...

I'd say their unique mechanic would be energy theft.