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No real viable ranged weapon as Guardian


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#61 iVoyager

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:32 PM

they don't let us provide boons for allies (shouts range nerf), they don;'t let us have at least one decent damage dealing ranged weapon (orbs that you can move faster and run away) they don't let us stack up some critical chance (trait nerf)

so, why guardian is called guardian anet?

#62 Alberel

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:34 PM

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 06:54 PM, said:

Same

In an ideal world, I would have the BWE1 Smite, with a faster version of the current Orb of Wrath.

------------------

I've been thinking about this for a while. ArenaNet won't use this of course, but it's an interesting idea.

Maybe the '1' chain could be like this:

1.) Fire a slow moving orb at your foe

2.) Launch two more slow moving orbs at your foe.

3.) Instantly increase the speed of launched orbs by 3x

This makes the orb usage more skill based and allows for more interesting interactions with Smite and Chains of Light. Honestly, the Scepter is boring, even if it was effective.

I was actually thinking of something along the same lines as that myself. If anyone here has played LoL, the champion Jayce has a slow-moving projectile that when fired through the aoe of one of his other skills accelerates to several times the speed. It makes it quite interesting to use. I'd love to see something like that for the scepter, even if it was all collapsed onto the #1 skill.

Edited by Alberel, 16 August 2012 - 09:35 PM.


#63 Astalnar

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:38 PM

It is called guardian. It is not called ranger. So, it is just you. You have high survivablity so you don't waste your time at the outskirts of battlefield but in the middle of it instead. Now, go and guard the battlefield with all you got.

Joking, or better said half-joking. Guardian have high survivablity, tons of health, and armour so it isomehow natural to envision them at close range. High risk, high reward kind of play. Other, less durable clasess need to thread carefully and should prefer ranged combat (excluding warrior) for that reason. For the same reason, the game needs to be balanced, and you cannot excel at everything. If Guardian's only weakness is staff as long-range combat weapon I am more than content.

#64 roachsrealm

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:45 PM

if you are outside of a 5-foot step, you are at range.

anything longer than a melee weapon's reach, is by very definition, ranged.

you are a knight in heavy armor.  what makes you think you'd be any good or efficient at shooting a bow in the first place?

and yea, "fantasy world, cat people, magic, cannae change t'laws o physics, all that", but really?  scepter range is 900.  that's ranged.  it's not longbow, but rangers also aren't wearing steel pants.

#65 Alaroxr

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:54 PM

View PostAstalnar, on 16 August 2012 - 09:38 PM, said:

It is called guardian. It is not called ranger. So, it is just you. You have high survivablity so you don't waste your time at the outskirts of battlefield but in the middle of it instead. Now, go and guard the battlefield with all you got.

Joking, or better said half-joking. Guardian have high survivablity, tons of health, and armour so it isomehow natural to envision them at close range. High risk, high reward kind of play. Other, less durable clasess need to thread carefully and should prefer ranged combat (excluding warrior) for that reason. For the same reason, the game needs to be balanced, and you cannot excel at everything. If Guardian's only weakness is staff as long-range combat weapon I am more than content.

1.) Ranger =/= ranged combat, that is not the origin of the name "Ranger".

2.) "Guardian have high survivablity, tons of health, and armour so it isomehow natural to envision them at close range."

Guardians are in the lowest health pool with Thieves and Elementalists. Techincally, most Professions can have high survival, especially Necromancers (and Necromancers also are in the highest health pool yet are not envisioned as a melee profession).

Armor is the only thing left.

3.) "For the same reason, the game needs to be balanced, and you cannot excel at everything. If Guardian's only weakness is staff as long-range combat weapon I am more than content."

Warriors excel at pretty much everything, and they have some of the strongest ranged combat in the game. In fact, they have two 1200 range capable weapons.

The game is balanced so that every Profession can be proficient at survival/damage/control/support, but can't do all of them at the same time.

View Postroachsrealm, on 16 August 2012 - 09:45 PM, said:

and yea, "fantasy world, cat people, magic, cannae change t'laws o physics, all that", but really?  scepter range is 900.  that's ranged.  it's not longbow, but rangers also aren't wearing steel pants.

Tell that to the Warrior.

Edited by Alaroxr, 16 August 2012 - 09:55 PM.


#66 roachsrealm

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:56 PM

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 09:54 PM, said:

Tell that to the Warrior.

was hoping someone would catch that.

yeah, doesn't make a whole lot of sense, does it?

Guardian staff should be like Warrior Rifle.  Power / Crit.  Then we lose support.  Can't have it both ways, but which way would you rather have it?

#67 Cevilo

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:58 PM

View Postindure, on 16 August 2012 - 08:53 PM, said:

blah snip - WvW. - snip

you forgot your /rant tags.

in any case. look at every thing you typed and understand that is in the case of WvW, a game mode that isn't suppose to be balanced, just REALLY epic scale battling. if you want a viable ranged weapon get a siege weapon. they are putting there marbles in the whole "balanced PvP, E-Sport" thing, so they are going to balance there skills around SPvP/TPvP meta not PvE, not WvW. maybe you're screwed in a Epic scale WvW battle, but arena net will take those skills they gave the guardian to make his play style unique, over giving him a viable ranged weapon and then re-balancing every thing around that.

You're right I haven't playing (Much) WvW. and it really sucks if the guardian is as bad as you say in these situations. because I was really looking forward to playing. but in PvE their options are fine in SPvP their options are fine and as I said before adding a viable ranged weapon would make it unbalanced providing an issue for the E-Sports thing, in WvW yes you're generally going to be the first in a battle and first to die, but that's just a part of WvW, if your in a castle or what ever you seem to have access to turrets and Batistas that are more powerful than any sort of ranged weapon any class has.

#68 Alaroxr

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:58 PM

View Postroachsrealm, on 16 August 2012 - 09:56 PM, said:

was hoping someone would catch that.

yeah, doesn't make a whole lot of sense, does it?

Guardian staff should be like Warrior Rifle.  Power / Crit.  Then we lose support.  Can't have it both ways, but which way would you rather have it?

The Staff with a 1200 range auto attack, and the Scepter with a faster orb.

That's the way I'd have it anyway. It wouldn't lose focus of support, all it does is mean we can participate effectively at 1200 range. Nobody is asking to be a powerhouse of ranged damage like the Warrior or Ranger, just to be able to be effective rather than completely ineffective to mediocre as we are now.

Edited by Alaroxr, 16 August 2012 - 09:59 PM.


#69 indure

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:58 PM

View Postroachsrealm, on 16 August 2012 - 09:56 PM, said:

was hoping someone would catch that.

yeah, doesn't make a whole lot of sense, does it?

Guardian staff should be like Warrior Rifle.  Power / Crit.  Then we lose support.  Can't have it both ways, but which way would you rather have it?

Except for warriors have strong support if they spec for it.

#70 Alaroxr

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:03 PM

View PostCevilo, on 16 August 2012 - 09:58 PM, said:

you forgot your /rant tags.

in any case. look at every thing you typed and understand that is in the case of WvW, a game mode that isn't suppose to be balanced, just REALLY epic scale battling. if you want a viable ranged weapon get a siege weapon. they are putting there marbles in the whole "balanced PvP, E-Sport" thing, so they are going to balance there skills around SPvP/TPvP meta not PvE, not WvW. maybe you're screwed in a Epic scale WvW battle, but arena net will take those skills they gave the guardian to make his play style unique, over giving him a viable ranged weapon and then re-balancing every thing around that.

You're right I haven't playing (Much) WvW. and it really sucks if the guardian is as bad as you say in these situations. because I was really looking forward to playing. but in PvE their options are fine in SPvP their options are fine and as I said before adding a viable ranged weapon would make it unbalanced providing an issue for the E-Sports thing, in WvW yes you're generally going to be the first in a battle and first to die, but that's just a part of WvW, if your in a castle or what ever you seem to have access to turrets and Batistas that are more powerful than any sort of ranged weapon any class has.

So... it's fine for every other Profession to have good ranged combat while the Guardian has to PAY GOLD and potentially waste supply to participate effectively?

As for PvP and PvE, we are still worse than the other Professions.

----------

Plus, it's a pretty lame excuse to say that WvW profession balance isn't important when it's 1/3 or more of the game for many people. And how exactly does buffing the Scepter make it overpowered for sPvP or PvE?

When they talk about imbalance regarding WvW, they're not talking about Profession imbalance. They're talking about the fact that one side will always have more coordination, one side will always have more numbers, one side will always have more money and siege, and one side will always have more time to play.

Edited by Alaroxr, 16 August 2012 - 10:08 PM.


#71 Cevilo

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:15 PM

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 09:54 PM, said:

The game is balanced so that every Profession can be proficient at survival/damage/control/support, but can't do all of them at the same time.

yes it is (or is being geared towards that) but that doesn't mean every class will be viable at every range.

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 10:03 PM, said:

So... it's fine for every other Profession to have good ranged combat while the Guardian has to PAY GOLD and potentially waste supply to participate?

As for PvP and PvE, we are still worse than the other Professions.

----------

Plus, it's a pretty lame excuse to say that WvW profession balance isn't important when it's 1/3 or more of the game for many people.

When they talk about balance regarding WvW, they're not talking about Profession balance. They're talking about the fact that one side will always have more coordination, one side will always have more numbers, one side will always have more money and siege, and one side will always have more time to play.

yeah we all ready established guardians are garbage at range, they have a trade off, with those Domes and area denial, that no other class has access too. If that's not your cup of Tea, then you probably want to play a Warrior. really no other way to put it. all these "but the warrior has xxxxx" "but the ele does xxxxx" the Guardian casts bubbles, keeps people in check sends people flying with a hammer, and doesn't range well. you see these TPvP vids where they have guardians holding points, because that's what they are best at. no other class can hold a point or stop people the way a Guardian does. their trade off is they have no viable ranged options. you can't stand back and Pew Pew with a guardian. I really don't know what else to tell you.

#72 Myndrian

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:18 PM

let us wield our spirit bow eehhhh?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? i thought i something like that. and somebody has probably already suggested this. but a spirit range utility would be quite cool

#73 Alaroxr

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:29 PM

Guardians have a few area denial abilities or two that barely do a thing against ranged enemies, all of wards of which can be defeat by stability and all have long cooldowns, so it means they shouldn't get ranged capabilities?

Rangers have pets... and those pets are nice. They shouldn't have melee combat.

Also, those Necromancers have a whole other life bar! They shouldn't get healing skills for balance.

Thieves have Initiative, so they shouldn't have weapon swap.

Warriors already deal so much damage, why should they get an Elite Skill too?

Elementalists get 4 attunements, but not having weapon swap isn't enough. Their skills shouldn't cool down unless they're swapped to that attunement.

Engineer have so much utility, so to balance that they shouldn't be able to give support.

Mesmer already have clones, so toughness and vitality shouldn't scale as much for them since they already have that survival.

View PostCevilo, on 16 August 2012 - 10:15 PM, said:

yeah we all ready established guardians are garbage at range, they have a trade off, with those Domes and area denial, that no other class has access too. If that's not your cup of Tea, then you probably want to play a Warrior.

"You don't like one part of your Profession that depending on the situation, cripples you? Quit and play a Warrior."

Great advice.

Edited by Alaroxr, 16 August 2012 - 10:30 PM.


#74 indure

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:31 PM

View PostCevilo, on 16 August 2012 - 09:58 PM, said:

you forgot your /rant tags.

in any case. look at every thing you typed and understand that is in the case of WvW, a game mode that isn't suppose to be balanced, just REALLY epic scale battling. if you want a viable ranged weapon get a siege weapon. they are putting there marbles in the whole "balanced PvP, E-Sport" thing, so they are going to balance there skills around SPvP/TPvP meta not PvE, not WvW. maybe you're screwed in a Epic scale WvW battle, but arena net will take those skills they gave the guardian to make his play style unique, over giving him a viable ranged weapon and then re-balancing every thing around that.

You're right I haven't playing (Much) WvW. and it really sucks if the guardian is as bad as you say in these situations. because I was really looking forward to playing. but in PvE their options are fine in SPvP their options are fine and as I said before adding a viable ranged weapon would make it unbalanced providing an issue for the E-Sports thing, in WvW yes you're generally going to be the first in a battle and first to die, but that's just a part of WvW, if your in a castle or what ever you seem to have access to turrets and Batistas that are more powerful than any sort of ranged weapon any class has.

I'm not talking about balanced gameplay in WvW. I'm talking about class viability. As in, there is no reason what so ever to play a DPS guardian in WvW. If i want to man a siege weapon, I still would rather be a ranger, because when the fight moves I can move with it and not be limited by arbitrary class restrictions.

As for sPVP, I agree a strong, long-range weapon isn't needed, but that is only because sPVP doesn't emphasize long-range fighting. If you aren't contesting points, you aren't really helping and you can't contest points at 1,200 range. I disagree though that a Guardian should not have a long-range due to balancing reasons. Yes, a guardian can have a high defense, but so what? He has the exact same defense in melee and it is not OP. Why does range make a difference? Plus, like I previously stated long-range is not all that important for sPVP because of the small arena and focus on point capture. So there is little difference in allowing Guardians to have a strong long-range weapon, when they already have two mid-range weapons and most of the fighting will be happening mid-close range.

#75 Matsy

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:34 PM

Basically the only reason I don't want to play my Guardian as my main.

#76 indure

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:36 PM

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 10:29 PM, said:

Quit and play a Warrior."

Great advice.

Really feels like the mantra of this forum, when it comes to class balance. LOL

#77 Beowoolf

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:37 PM

Wow I was watching that warrior video that damages is ridiculous man I've seen a weakness in every class but what the hell can the warrior not do

#78 Drekor

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:42 PM

I'd just like to see smite be a single big AoE instead of the stupid fists. It could be a giant fist slamming into the ground but you lose so much DPS based on luck with smite. If it always did it's full damage we'd be pretty solid I think.

#79 Wufgar

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:42 PM

View PostCevilo, on 16 August 2012 - 10:15 PM, said:

yes it is (or is being geared towards that) but that doesn't mean every class will be viable at every range.



yeah we all ready established guardians are garbage at range, they have a trade off, with those Domes and area denial, that no other class has access too. If that's not your cup of Tea, then you probably want to play a Warrior. really no other way to put it. all these "but the warrior has xxxxx" "but the ele does xxxxx" the Guardian casts bubbles, keeps people in check sends people flying with a hammer, and doesn't range well. you see these TPvP vids where they have guardians holding points, because that's what they are best at. no other class can hold a point or stop people the way a Guardian does. their trade off is they have no viable ranged options. you can't stand back and Pew Pew with a guardian. I really don't know what else to tell you.

Hell Yeah.... I love garbage input!
Do you read your posts before posting it? Classes should do anything, but shouldn't be viable at it? What's the point in that?

Guardian has good defense abilities sure... but your post sounds like others don't have these abilities...
Ever played Mesmer? I can tell you, you stay much longer alive as a Mesmer than a Guardian...

Guardian can defend points so that's their only purpose since they are only viable at that? Hell yeah I hope we never play together...

#80 csalmo

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:05 PM

I love the Guardian, but absolutely cannot stand the ranged options. Not that they are not viable, but I feel like a bad ass warrior in melee throwing my swords and hammers around, but then when I switch to ranged I feel like I am wearing heavy plate mail and swinging a friggin magic wand around, which kind of kills it for me a little bit. The staff is not as bad but it does not appear it is meant for long range. And as said many times, the graphic for smite could use some love.

I love the Warrior rifle and longbow, and am still torn on which class I am going to main, because I really do love the feel of the Guardian. Someone posted before about taking a pistol or rifle and charging the rounds with blue flame or what not. There was a rifle skill in the hunger games event that looked similar to that and it was a pretty cool effect. I thought the Warrior's longbow skills would have been cool as a Guardian, using blue flame that burned enemies and cleansed allies. I also think the idea of summoning the spirit bow to use is also cool. Hopefully sometime in the future they take a look at it, in the mean time I will probably just play a melee guardian and a ranged warrior.

#81 Haithe

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:24 PM

This has just been reeeeeeeeally bothering me. I fell in love with scepter/shield combo during the 1st/2nd BWE events, it was mid-range kitey fun and I am sad that it has been changed so much from what I initially liked about it. However mmos are mercurial, its their thing so im not too surprised or let down.

It seems like after they made the range change on scepter and all the rest that went with it they push for you to use focus as an offhand and completly removed the effectiveness of smite by making it a short cooldown 'spammable' AOE that is just a pain in the but to use for little gain. The orbs hit less often, making them more 'homing' would help the speed thing. The swing animation your character does would start to look ridiculous if they sped the attack itself up.

I feel like they should have made staff the long ranger rather than scepter, either that or give us bows like our spirit weapon...

#82 Cevilo

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:44 PM

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 10:29 PM, said:

Guardians have a few area denial abilities or two that barely do a thing against ranged enemies, all of wards of which can be defeat by stability and all have long cooldowns, so it means they shouldn't get ranged capabilities?

Rangers have pets... and those pets are nice. They shouldn't have melee combat.

Also, those Necromancers have a whole other life bar! They shouldn't get healing skills for balance.

Thieves have Initiative, so they shouldn't have weapon swap.

Warriors already deal so much damage, why should they get an Elite Skill too?

Elementalists get 4 attunements, but not having weapon swap isn't enough. Their skills shouldn't cool down unless they're swapped to that attunement.

Engineer have so much utility, so to balance that they shouldn't be able to give support.

Mesmer already have clones, so toughness and vitality shouldn't scale as much for them since they already have that survival.



"You don't like one part of your Profession that depending on the situation, cripples you? Quit and play a Warrior."

Great advice.
now you're just being asinine. I would understand if Guardians were not viable, and needed this to be apart of the game, but the entire point to your argument boils down to "well if XXX class has this then so should mine"

if the warrior is "all around good", and you feel he can do every thing the guardian does but he ranges better, then why not play one? I like the guardian, I like in a SPvP,  he can pop a shield and push every one off of him, he can drop a shield in a choke point and stop people from following him or stop people from entering an area for a short while.

on the other hand I'm sure other classes hate it when they are trying to get on a point and a Guardian drops a shield that pushes them off, or uses banish to send them flying some where, or if a thief is about to unload and the guardian drops a Wall of reflection no other class has access to these options. I'm sure they would all love too. they have good ranged DPS the guardian has 2 ranged weapons that are essentially support skill weapons. because he does a lot of support. that's basically his flavor. just like not every one has access to stealth, only people who can cut off choke points close to what the guardian can do is thief/ranger with traps and even then after the initial effect, the biggest issue may be cripple. but usually people have a condi heal for that.

if we're going by your logic. Warriors should get a summonable pet, because rangers have perm pets, mesmers have illusions, engineers have Turrets, guardians have spirit weapons, thieves can summon other little ninja thieves, eles can summon elementals, and necros have summons. what do warriors get? banners...

engineers, thieves, rangers, and mesmers all have access to stealth why doesn't the rest of the classes? every one can do every thing right?

when it boils down to it. that's just some thing Guardians don't have. they are still viable, equally as useful as each other class, they have their own set of skills no one can really duplicate, and in the hands of a skilled player I'm positive these abilities more than make up for the fact that they can't pew pew at 1200 range. and no matter how much you would like to see it, the reason they are still viable, even considered by some as "op" is why more than likely we won't see a change in the ranged weapons section.

View Postindure, on 16 August 2012 - 10:31 PM, said:

I'm not talking about balanced gameplay in WvW. I'm talking about class viability. As in, there is no reason what so ever to play a DPS guardian in WvW. If i want to man a siege weapon, I still would rather be a ranger, because when the fight moves I can move with it and not be limited by arbitrary class restrictions.

As for sPVP, I agree a strong, long-range weapon isn't needed, but that is only because sPVP doesn't emphasize long-range fighting. If you aren't contesting points, you aren't really helping and you can't contest points at 1,200 range. I disagree though that a Guardian should not have a long-range due to balancing reasons. Yes, a guardian can have a high defense, but so what? He has the exact same defense in melee and it is not OP. Why does range make a difference? Plus, like I previously stated long-range is not all that important for sPVP because of the small arena and focus on point capture. So there is little difference in allowing Guardians to have a strong long-range weapon, when they already have two mid-range weapons and most of the fighting will be happening mid-close range.

I all ready made a post on in, but essentially, if a guardian has a viable Ranged weapon + use of his shields utilities they out range people, "So switch to melee" he can keep up wards to keep you out of melee range and keep hitting you. this is all theory craft, but I imagine, due to the range nerfs of the guardian recently, and the fact that they have done nothing to make his ranged weapons more useful my ideas of why they aren't buffing them probably aren't far from the truth.

as for the WvW things, I can't agree/disagree until I try it for my self, but I figure if there was a serious WvW problem with guardians the forums would have blown up about it. from what I've read in the WvW forums, melee is apparently viable. so I'm left to believe this is more of a you issue and not a viability issue.

View PostWufgar, on 16 August 2012 - 10:42 PM, said:

Hell Yeah.... I love garbage input!
.....
snip

yes it seems so since that was pretty much what you're entire post was.

I never said classes should do any thing, it's been stated many times by the devs that they should be able to do dmg/spt/ctrl
they don't say every class has to be viable in melee and ranged. as I stated in my other post, do you read these things? or do you just have bad reading/comprehension skills?

I never said that they should only defend or only survive. the forums are full of DPS glass tank builds, burn builds ect. no I've never played a mesmer, so I'm pretty sure I'd die quicker as a mesmer than a guardian ;) as for you? maybe you play mesmer better than you do guardian? now that we established both characters can survive, tell me what skills a mesmer can you to point blank stop you from entering a choke point if your chasing him or he's chasing you? I think the only other class I know of is the ele elite skill where you turn into a tornado and push people back.


at this point, the only real reason I've seen for having a ranged weapon is because xxx wants it.
it's probably not going to get changed because it's viable in all modes now with out it.

so it boils down to

"I want"
"You don't need"

I suppose you guys can keep going on about it. but it's apparent no one is going to give in their opinion. carry on.

#83 ZCKS

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:52 PM

View PostAstalnar, on 16 August 2012 - 09:38 PM, said:

It is called guardian. It is not called ranger. So, it is just you. You have high survivablity so you don't waste your time at the outskirts of battlefield but in the middle of it instead. Now, go and guard the battlefield with all you got.

Joking, or better said half-joking. Guardian have high survivablity, tons of health, and armour so it isomehow natural to envision them at close range. High risk, high reward kind of play. Other, less durable clasess need to thread carefully and should prefer ranged combat (excluding warrior) for that reason. For the same reason, the game needs to be balanced, and you cannot excel at everything. If Guardian's only weakness is staff as long-range combat weapon I am more than content.


This  ^ goes against arena.net's very ideals for the game.

They have said time & time again that every profession should be able to be viable at any role they choose to spec/trait/gear for.


That being said I can understand why they wanted to nerf the orbs damage, hopefully hower after they do some tweaking with the damage they will decide the increase the orb speed because as is it just plain sucks. You can literaly outrun the orbs easily completely negating their usefulness.

#84 Alaroxr

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:55 PM

View PostCevilo, on 16 August 2012 - 11:44 PM, said:

snip

Because I obviously think all of that...

It's called sarcasm and irony.

Edited by Alaroxr, 16 August 2012 - 11:56 PM.


#85 ZCKS

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:01 AM

View PostDrekor, on 16 August 2012 - 10:42 PM, said:

I'd just like to see smite be a single big AoE instead of the stupid fists. It could be a giant fist slamming into the ground but you lose so much DPS based on luck with smite. If it always did it's full damage we'd be pretty solid I think.

I would love this ^, make it One Instant AOE instead of a bunch of little glowing ping pong balls flying around.

One change I would do, instead of a fist make it an explosion of glowing spirit energy instead of a fist.

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 11:55 PM, said:

Because I obviously think all of that...

It's called sarcasm and irony.

The downside of the net my friend, sarcasm & irony don't cary across that well.

#86 Cevilo

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:05 AM

View PostAlaroxr, on 16 August 2012 - 11:55 PM, said:

Because I obviously think all of that...

It's called sarcasm and irony.

I'm well aware, but if you're going to make asinine posts, then expect one back.

#87 ZCKS

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:06 AM

View PostMyndrian, on 16 August 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

let us wield our spirit bow eehhhh?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? i thought i something like that. and somebody has probably already suggested this. but a spirit range utility would be quite cool

Personally I would love this or something like it as a possible ability in a furure expansion where the professions get new abilities/weapons/traits.

The guardian gets access to a bow but instead of "Regular Arrows" he/she shoots "Spirit Arrows" which can have offensive or defensive effects.


That or just change the spirit bow to where we can wield it like a temporary summoned weapon which replaces our skill bar for the duration & gives us 5 new abilities.

#88 Alaroxr

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:07 AM

View PostCevilo, on 17 August 2012 - 12:05 AM, said:

I'm well aware, but if you're going to make asinine posts, then expect one back.

So you acknowledge sarcasm is being used, then ignore that and respond as if it wasn't?

-----------

The bottom line is that just because Guardians have a unique form of area denial (that only involves 3 long-cooldown abilities), it by no means constitutes sub-par or non-existent ranged capabilities.

I've seen that claimed, but I have seen no evidence that even remotely proves that to be the case.

My previous post was doing the same thing, taking unique (or unusual) aspects of the different Professions and stating that because they have this strength, an arbitrary function should be removed or nerfed for "balance".

Edited by Alaroxr, 17 August 2012 - 12:17 AM.


#89 ZCKS

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:08 AM

View PostCevilo, on 17 August 2012 - 12:05 AM, said:

I'm well aware, but if you're going to make asinine posts, then expect one back.


I agree it was a bit assanine but it was kind of funny in how it made fun of the logic people were using when they said guardians should not have a viable ranged option when it would go against Arena.net's ideals for designing the professions.

#90 Cevilo

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:25 AM

View PostAlaroxr, on 17 August 2012 - 12:07 AM, said:

So you acknowledge sarcasm is being used, then ignore that and respond as if it wasn't?
no I reply with more sarcasm ofc.

you can be "sarcastic" and "ironic" all you'd like, it really doesn't help in a debate as to why the guardian "needs a viable ranged weapon" as opposed to "why he does not"

it's when you have to resort to asinine remarks with 0 value of the subject, out side of sounding like a jerk, you should realize you have nothing more to contribute to the topic.

Guardians aren't viable as ranged characters. and I doubt the situation would change unless some one can come up with a better argument than "because I want it"

they are viable in PvE with out it
they are viable in SPvP / TPvP (Even as far as required from what the TPvP meta set up looks like for now)
and are apparently Viable in WvW  (http://www.guildwars...-world-v-world/) first topic I saw when checking the WvW forums

and like I said before it could bring up balance issues with their skill sets. we'll never know if they don't change it of course. but it doesn't look like anet is ready to take that chance yet.

View PostZCKS, on 17 August 2012 - 12:08 AM, said:

I agree it was a bit assanine but it was kind of funny in how it made fun of the logic people were using when they said guardians should not have a viable ranged option when it would go against Arena.net's ideals for designing the professions.

idk I wouldn't say it's against their design for the profession, I was just watching a vid and reading a article and the dev made a brief mention of how he uses a stave for ranged combat. but from what I've seen the ranged options are more "monk" options. and they don't seem to be going away from that design




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