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Homosexuality in Tyria


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#181 ThiaTheMuse

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 04:08 PM

Of course homosexuality exists in Tyria. The question is: Do people care? I would say no, they don't. I doubt ANet programed their citizens with a bigotry sub-routine or anything. I also doubt that any Tyrian Holy Books have a mention of a sexual code of conduct. I, personally, can not see any of the Big 5 having a problem with it, they all seem smarter than that.

Now, how about the players? Well, who cares?! If your RP group has a problem with it, leave 'em. If they don't, great! Personally, my female noble Mesmer is the descendant of my female Ascalonian Warrior and Tahlkora. And that Mesmer is in a relationship with a female Norn Ranger. And I am very happy with that.

#182 Kable

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:23 PM

View PostOlaya, on 21 August 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

If you'd read Guild Wars second novel : Edge of Destiny, you would know that Caithe is in love with another female sylvari, Faeoleen or something (dont remember exactly how it's spelled). Though that sylvari is part of the Nightmare Court and we will have to stop her in the Twilight Arbor dungeon.

So, homosexuality exists in Tyria, at least for the Sylvari.

This interaction is THE most obvious one I have found within my personal story. Late in the Story around lvl 62 Caithe has some very specific dialogue that clearly points to the fact she and the head lady of Nightmare Court are in love. Problem is that it kind of shines a light on another issue in society. People falling for a bad person even though they know that the person is bad. Does this also say something about Anet's point of view on the complexity of homosexuality?? hmmmm

#183 Brynjar

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 05:49 PM

If I recall correctly, Caithe and Faolain fell in love before Faolain turned to the Dark Side, so to speak.

So, the question is, if you love someone and they love you back, even though they do terrible and evil things, what do you do? Do you stop them, even though you still love them and they still love you?

#184 Legion

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 07:18 AM

View Postdraxynnic, on 27 December 2012 - 12:59 AM, said:

In the case of noble families... it's possible that they're expected to produce heirs to continue the family, but are free to do what they please once an heir has been produced.

So cheating your wife is morally acceptable? I'm sure that most homosexual people desire to be treated with the same degree of respect and loyalty by their husband/wife as heterosexual people. I understand that the idea of a arranged marriages is anathema to most modern Westerners, but really that's how people work under nobility. The idea of sexual orientation is very new. Yes, some nobles had extramarital affairs, as BuddhaKeks have said, with both sexes but it was merely tolerated, never accepted and seen as more as an hedonistic vice.

Nobility is as much as a class as a bussines. Property, titles, wealth, status to hand down, alliances, traditions to uphold, all of them linked to your bloodlines. Nobles are not just rich people, they are a part of an hereditary institution centered around houses and run by family trees. Marriages between nobles is not just a marriage between a man and a women, it is a marriage between two families with the husband and wife being merely the representants of your house. Love is welcome and even desired but as a byproduct of marriage, not as the cause. All noble marriages are political in nature. This of course caused problems of inbreeding in the most closed aristocracies, such as schizophrenia becoming commonplace (or the infamous “Habsburg Chin”) in some families, in the long run, but that's another story. This state of affairs was not challanged until the rise of the bourgeois class.

Nobles are going to be the most "conservative" segment of society in their values because that's when their system was formed. Imagine a world in which ninety-nine one hundredths of all people were illiterate. They don't know how to read or write, they don't know any form of arithmetic or science, they don't even know what those two things are. Imagine that their understanding of politics is a third grade level. They see it more like how we see pro-wrestling, they don't understand how anything works, or why anything is right or wrong. They don't understand the law, they don't understand why wars happen, they don't understand the tenants of their own religions, they don't understand how to do anything except farm, dig ditches, or do other manual labor.

Now, of that one remaining percent, imagine that nine tenths of them know exactly enough to be able to do the taxes of the top .1%.

That .1%, who have to manage everything, conduct everything, and orchestrate the affairs of the entire rest of the species, is a Noble. Their entire existence is based around doing all of the political, intellectual and military legwork that the other 99.9% of the country should be doing.

Kryta might have move on to a less authocratic and more representative form than 250 years ago, the common man might be more educated than the illiterate masses of before and the nobles might have seen their importance reduced, but they will still work under the same principles because that's who they are and, more important, to who they belong.

#185 Marc1k1

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:40 PM

View PostEontos, on 20 August 2012 - 04:10 AM, said:

Alright, so in my little RP world, my main character, a male, human, is gay and has a human or sylvari boyfriend. (Deciding if it'll be a NPC in my personal story, or one of my alts--even though it is not possible to play both at the same time, one can make things up, as well as can;t decide if it'll be two humans or one human and a sylvari)

What do you think about gays in Tyria, do you think such a thing would be popustrous, horrifying and/or unheard of? Or do you think it would be accepted among the societies of the Humans, Charr, Norn, Asura and Sylvari?

Would some races accept it quicker than others? From what I understand, the Sylvari would be the first to adopt this lifestyle due to their accepting nature and ignorance to "customs" and lack of knowledge of deviance.

What do you guys think? This is not here to make people feel uncomfortable. Just act and post normal. Please don't go overboard and fling insults or praises everywhere either. :P

EDIT**** Oops, meant to post in Durmand Priory, my bad! Someone please move it.

Yes, the Sylvari wouldn't mind what-so-ever as one of the first things my friend came across on his first Sylvari character's story was a homosexual couple that was attacked.

I'd also like to think that, as Eternal Arcadia said, they've got bigger things on their minds.

So go for green, is what I think.

#186 draxynnic

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 12:12 AM

View PostLegion, on 29 December 2012 - 07:18 AM, said:

So cheating your wife is morally acceptable?
Shades of grey. Let's face it, if you boil things down to the unromantic basics (and if love isn't important, that's what it comes down to) marriage is basically a contract where the man promises to exclusively focus his resources on providing for the woman and her children, while the woman promises that all of her children would also be his. Either side pursuing a homosexual relationship outside of that doesn't threaten that, although STDs are another issue (we can't assume they'd just be magically cured now as we might have in GW1, although magical healing is still canon).

If both of them are heterosexual and know that they're each heterosexual, then that would be one thing. If the couple knows that one or both is not actually getting anything out of what they're doing to produce heirs, however, then if the culture in general doesn't have a prejudice against homosexuality like our own culture generally has historically, a loving (note: we could be talking philos or agape here) wife or husband might actually approve of their spouse meeting their needs where they can (in a manner that minimises the risk of infection if STDs are a significant concern). This goes doubly if the marriage (arranged by third parties or otherwise) is made between two homosexuals, effectively removing the sting altogether - the couple occasionally lies together and thinks of Kryta, while otherwise doing their own things on the side without judging the other.

And that's also not considering the possibility of a widow or widower that nevertheless has enough heirs for the succession to be regarded as being safe.
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#187 Brynjar

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 05:33 PM

This is yet another way the Norn way is superior. Want to get married? The only requirement is being equally awesome. What does marriage mean? That you will continue to be awesome together and make your children even more awesome than you were.

#188 Daenerys

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 07:18 PM

This thread has received at least two warnings since it was started, and the conversations have strayed too far off-topic and have occasionally even been flaming/etc. Topics such as this are tricky to navigate, but it's more than possible. Because this thread has gone past the point of no return (and I really did give it a chance!), I'm locking it.

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