55 replies to this topic

[Tjuba]

I have toyed with the idea of a main hand pistol as well as 2 other weapons. I focused more on a duelist mesmer (who cheats with illusions ) then the "mesmer magic" which I think can be added just by animation, graphics and sounds. Stats are just rough estimates to give you an idea. I don't think anything here is balanced, they may be totally overpowered or not good at all.

First for on topic purposes, Main hand pistol:
Short range, power, aoe.

1. Guided Bullet. Shoot a bullet which track its foe.
Can't miss or be evaded.
Damage: 170
Range: 900
Combo Finisher: Projectile (20% chance)
Nothing super interesting, mostly done with cheating duelist flavor in mind. Seeing a bunch of crazy purple projectiles zigzag tracking their target would be cool.

2. Power Rail. Charge up your gun for a massive shot. Hitting targets in a short, narrow line.
Charge duration: 2 s
Damage: 900
Combo Finisher: Blast
Range: 600
A short range, high damage aoe. the charge up makes it tricky for the perfect shot and blast finishing.

3. Bullet Field. Rapidly teleport to and shoot foes in target area. With a chance to create clones.
Damage 500
Range: 1,200
Combo Field: Ethereal
cooldown: 12s
Can create lots of clones fast vs multiple enemies. A nice team fight skill.

Rapier:
Melee, condition/control.

1. Dash and Lunge at your target, hit teleports you to the back of your target.
Dash range: 200
Range: 130
Bleed: 4s
Combo Finisher: Leap
     - Thrust at your foe
    Bleed: 8s
    Range: 130
        - Cut and cripple your foe while disengaging.
        Disengage range: 200
        Range: 130
        Crippled: 5 s        
Designed to confuse your opponent by jumping in and out of melee range, with clones from riposte skill it will be even more annoying as they dash and teleports around as well. 1st skill can be used as a gap closer but can't be spammed carelessly as  the 3rd ability jumps you back.

2. Riposte. block an attack, counter attack inflicting confusion and create a clone which uses lunge. If nothing is parried, gain swiftness.
Block duration: 2 s
Damage: 30
Range: 130
3 Confusion: 5 s
Swiftness: 8 s
Cooldown 10 s
A source of swiftness to aid in mobility out of combat. otherwise a normal block and clone production.

3. Thousand needles. summon 6 ethereal rapiers around you, giving you Retaliation.
Retaliation 6s
        -Spend your retaliation to daze your target and shoot a rapier per second
        spent, to a maximum of 6 hits.
        Daze: 1s        
        Damage: (6x) (1200)
        Range: 900
        Instant.
This can be used early for burst or as a daze, the longer you wait for perfect daze timing you deal less damage. I think it's a fun versatile skill based ability. Having a daze on mainhand with all our other dazes might be too strong though.

Dueling glove (offhand)
With one glove thrown at the ground, you only have one left! I want to have a option to only use one one-handed weapon, to get the duelist hand on back style. As it is not a weapon it is focused on boons. As a offhand it has a phantasm as well.

4. Dueling stance. Gain stability, might, raises precision and crit damage. Slows movement speed.
Stability: 5 s
Precision: 100 5 s
6 Might: 5 s
Crit damage: 10% 5 s
Movement speed: -33% 5 s
Cooldown: 35 s
A short duration buff to land a nice burst skill.

5. Servant Phantasm: Summon an Phantasm which cast a random buff on you every 5 seconds
Regeneration: 5 s (625 health)
Aegis: 10 s
Retaliation: 5 s
Protection: 3 s
Swiftness: 5 s
Might: 20 s
Fury: 5 s
Vigor: 5 s
Fun phantasm to use with signet of inspiration.

I also think offhand sword should be changed to offhand dagger. As a long sword in offhand just look dumb, or at least too much like a warrior.

[Maxtofunator]

I am sure this has been brought up before, and I only read the first post [sorry guys], but on top of every other good reason, such as giving us a OH weapon that is avaliable as a MH weapon, though they did this to other classes, such as the ranger dagger, or inversley to the thief and ranger swords.
However, this also makes sense to give it to us because we are the magical DUELIST, and part of dueling in the past has been pistols, not a sword and a pistol, but cowboys pulling out dual pistols during a duel.
I want to be able to go with a bamf that either uses dual pistols, or maybe a pistol with a torch to light my way

[FlyByKnight88]

I would love to see a skill that functioned as a distraction/dodge as well.  you hit the skill, and randomly jump/fire left or right, whilst you create a clone that rolls the opposite way.  Mainhand Pistol would be amazing!

[Delolith]

I was about to post a longer post....but I will say 2 things. Ranged weapon as one hand MH yes (like dagger or axe or cucumber or pumpkin or whatever). Pistol no....it is bad enough that we have such shit for an offhand.

Edited by Delolith, 20 August 2012 - 06:02 PM.

[Miku Flarestorm]

PlayerKX, on 20 August 2012 - 03:46 PM, said:

Already have sword as a power build weapon. We need viable condition weapons. Scepter doesn't cut it. Pistol should be a strong condition mh.

Miku Flarestorm, on 20 August 2012 - 11:18 AM, said:

Any MH as long as it's range and useful in power builds.

I'm asking for ranged power MH. We got Scepter as ranged condition.

[Midnight_Tea]

I'm okay with mesmers not having as much in the way of actual conditions. The necromancer is the go-to for that. What conditions we have just by the nature of our shatters can be game changing esp. if armed with illusionary persona.

My preference would be for a 900 range mostly-damage weapon with a cloning function on it. Sort of like the sword. but probably with a modest AoE attached rather than a dramatic skill like blurred frenzy. This could make the staff less of a mandatory equip since we wouldn't absolutely require chaos storm (as awesome as that spell is).

[PlayerKX]

Miku Flarestorm, on 20 August 2012 - 06:45 PM, said:

I'm asking for ranged power MH. We got Scepter as ranged condition.

I find your avatar picture oddly attractive. Nice work O.o

Anyway, I still think the scepter does great damage from afar. I believe it needs to be tweaked for better damage and a pistol for condition damage.

[Grimsy]

I didn't play Mesmer for long because the clone/phantasm thing just wasn't to my sort of playstyle (which is a shame because omg I wanted to like them so much so I could use Portal and Moa Morph) however I did find it strange that you couldn't have Pistol as a MH.

So yeah, I admit I have a lack of knowledge with Mesmers but MH Pistol seems like an obvious thing that should already be in!

/signed

[Midnight_Tea]

By the way, I wanted to thank everyone who posted because this is the first time I've brought the idea to the attention more than just the specifically-mesmer community. Meaning in some ways I've been doing nothing but preaching to the choir.

Nice to see that the idea works more generally as well.

In general, though, I think every profession needs some more tweaking here and there. Some are very brutally effective but have limited and very specific ways of being so, while others feel like you have a ton of options but they all don't amount to much. I think in the months past release, the professions will be examined and tweaked and they'll be listening to the community for what they really want to see. This is my contribution.

Long story short, I can't wait to play with you guys and thanks for helping me pass the time.  

Edited by Midnight_Tea, 23 August 2012 - 12:20 AM.

[Bad Idea Generator]

This could be a good weapon to do new things with.
Avoiding numbers for now.  Not avoiding puns.

1. Backfire
Normal range, average damage shot.
Combo: Physical Projectile (20%)
Combo finisher: Physical Projectile (20%) with non-allied combo field
(Or, if that enemy combo thing is too nonstandard, short duration confusion, making it a skill to maintain small amounts of confusion, like other professions with bleeding)

2. Dazzling Flare
Ground target, causes (confusion or blindness) on an area and some damage.
Combo finisher: Blast finisher
(Maybe another combo with non-allied field)

3. Shooting Star
Ground target, causes (blindness or confusion) on landing and some damage.
Combo finisher: Leap
(Maybe another combo with non-allied field)

Shooting Star becomes
3.1. Reentry
Summon a clone at your location and return to the location you activated Shooting Star from.

[Midnight_Tea]

I like Dazzling Flare and Reentry, though Shooting Star is kind of redundant.

All in all though I like this particular ability set. It's kind of plain but it allows the mesmer's other offhands to shine a bit more. I'd combine it with focus for a condition build or a second pistol and staff for a phantasm build.

[KeybladeMaster]

i want to be able to dual wield pistols on my mesmer so bad

[thenewzero]

I agree with this.  Mesmer was one of my favorite classes in GW1.  But in GW2, something feels lacking.  They just feel, as you said, like they aren't a finished class.  I agree that a lack of weapon choices is the biggest offender.  The other classes that have very few weapon choices (Elementalist and Engineer) have major class mechanics that kind of make up for it.  Elementalist has attunements, meaning each weapon actually has 4 times as many abilities as normal, and Engineers have the Toolbelt and Kit mechanics that grant them.

As others have said, it would be great if it had damaging conditions on it.  I feel like Mesmer damaging conditions are pretty weak.  Staff pretty much only has its autoattack, with a small possibility on Chaos Storm for Poison and on Chaos Armor for Confusion.  Scepter can do Confusion and that's it.

I, too, would love dual pistols mesmer!

[Midnight_Tea]

My vision for the mesmer is basically a scholar who imitates fighting like an adventurer without actually doing so. Remember how Norgu was an actor? Sort of like that. Think method acting in particular. A mesmer with two pistols would definitely NOT be unloading them like a thief, just presenting the image of a badass. That's what the whole thing with Illusionary Duelist is about, it's about summoning other selves to fight for you. But I'd still love the capacity for reliable mid-range DPS that can't really be asked for from the scepter. (though the scepter is definitely growing on me on its own merits)

If you want a sure sign the mesmer isn't finished, you only need to look a their "Drowning" skills. It's the same skills as their downed state, but they simply do not work . If you use the number 2 skill when drowning, you'll actually be immobilized until you die or rally. I'd be very surprised if the rogue phantasm worked too, haven't tested it. I'm not saying that to complain, but just remind people that the mesmer is still in a state where player suggestions for it can still be highly influential.


(Unless anyone gets the wrong idea, I'm still very grateful for the mesmer's inclusion in Guild Wars 2. ArenaNet could have very easily cut the profession from the final release and saved it for an expansion, given its current state. They didn't because they care and knew their fans were clamoring for it. Hopefully we're all here because we want to reciprocate. Hell, maybe that was the plan all along since rabid mesmer fans almost ensured its inclusion to begin with. )

Edited by Midnight_Tea, 01 September 2012 - 10:17 PM.

[Carighan]

The way I'd implement a MH pistol - because I think the layout of our weapon selection is 100% spot-on and actually much better than what many other classes have, sorry - would be to replace Scepters as a MH weapon.

Make Pistol the ranged MH weapon.

The thing is, given the setup of our weapons, I really don't see why - beyond style reasons - we would have room for a second ranged MH choice. I'd rather see development time invested into a general rework of the weapon loadouts for other classes, which seem to lack the tight cohesions ours have. Or into rebalancing our existent skills.

[Jamochet]

Just from a logic perspective it doesn't make sense that you can't use a pistol in your main hand. I am left handed and can't even really hold a pencil in my right hand. There are definitely some classes where I am confused by a weapon or two they can't use.

[Midnight_Tea]

The scepter could have a niche as a control-type weapon like the guardian has, or a condition based weapon due to its ability to create shatter-fodder. MH pistol I'd propose as a straighter DPS weapon with an emphasis on positioning, sort of between the sword and staff. The mesmer is itching for it in my opinion, since every other squishy in the game has a solid non-niche MH ranged option. It does lend a more adventurer feel than a scholar one, but the mesmer already feels like a bit of a hybrid between the two in the same sense a necromancer is like a soldier in some ways.

I disagree about the mesmer having tight weapon cohesion, though, not in general PvE at least. But I will agree that every profession needs work on this front, not just the mesmer. But I see nothing wrong with proposing suggestions, particularly if they're well-thought out. I won't worry about what the developers are using their time on because that's out of my hands.

(Honestly? My first pick? I'd like player housing even more than MH mesmer pistols, but I don't have a strong point to make about that)

[Lunacy Polish]

draxynnic, on 20 August 2012 - 02:28 PM, said:

Because it loses the mesmeric magic.

<snip>

Pistols don't have that, however - they're just point and shoot. Thieves are better at shooting accurately, engineers are better at adding exotic effects to a bullet. What mesmers are good at is illusions and messing with the target's mind - they use the offhand pistol as a focus and can fire off a single enhanced shot for effect, but they should be slinging spells rather than blazing away Wild West style.

I could not disagree with this statement more personally.

1)  Pistols are not just point and shoot, a lot of the skill to use them involves footwork, stances, retention techniques, situational awareness, point shooting vs. proper use of sights, there are many debates over proper technique (such as the arguments over the speed rock technique), etc. and its has changed over time.  Good grief people even debate the Weaver stance.  Go to a Cowboy Shooting event and you'll see the extended duelist style, go to an IDPA event and, well, you sure won't see that.   But that's irrelevant to the game in and of itself, the point is there's more than one approach to using a pistol as a weapon in the boring old real world.  Some of them are more showy, and some of them are more effective.  The more effective tend to be less visually striking.

2) "Wild West" shooting is PERFECT for a Mesmer MH.  I can easily see "fanning the hammer" or "twirling" as the abilities, things which are actually absolutely worthless in actual application but they look good and are visually distracting, which is right up the Mesmer's alley.

[Midnight_Tea]

... can I add a Metal Gear reference here? Yeah, I'm totally doing it.

Revolver Ocelot would sure as hell be a mesmer.



Mantis: I remember ten minutes ago, when logic and sanity governed the universe. Gosh, those were great times.

Ocelot: Look, if you ignore the little details, it's really quite simple. For several years, you have been working for a Patriot who is actually President Sears, who was put in office by The Patriots and is now trying to gain power to be rid of their control. The Patriots, in order to circumvent his efforts, had me trick you into getting him to hire me as an agent. Now I'm just waiting for the right moment to screw him over.

Mantis: But it's all about the little details! I mean, you must spend every day pretending to act like you're falsely letting on that you aren't not unbetraying someone you don't not purport to allegedly not work for, but you really do! How do you keep all this shit straight without having an aneurysm?!

Ocelot: Practice.

Edited by Midnight_Tea, 10 September 2012 - 07:38 PM.

[writethemwrong]

spelley, on 20 August 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

I still think the idea that we use Greatswords as freaking laser guns is enough for ranged DPS.

That bugs the hell out of me. Give us pistol mh and revamp greatswords to aoe heavy melee weapon. Why anyone would take a greatsword and make it a phaser, and not even set to kill if you look at our effiency in pve, is beyond me.

[Stellanina]

I would sign this petition so hard! Main Hand Pistol looks thematically good on a Mesmer. I mean, they gave Mesmer a Great Sword - and I still cannot get over seeing a female mesmer wield a GS with two hands, running around like that... And then immediately letting it float and shooting a laser out of it. It's a little strange to me.

Besides, I think the Mesmer could use the Pistol as an 'acting tool.' Illusion bullets, and the like. We also need something for the hardcore PvE-ers who need more help with AoEs, or at the very least, a tool to deal damage from afar. Mesmers have two MH's and 4 OH options, and it's a little befuddling to me.

Mainhand Pistol FTW!

[Chronos12360]

Finally able to post my thoughts on this topic. For a while I have been against another ranged weapon but after much thought I feel that any mh addition is a good one and if made more dps forward instead of niche like the scepter it could open up some more playstyle especially when utilizing precise and effective weapon switching. My main thought that led me to this feeling was that MH sword is lacking another melee weapon to use in the 2ndary weapon set and GS (and staff to and extent) don't have weapons that pair well if you build for straight damage (in the case of GS) or conditions (in the case of staff) For the purposes of this thread I'll leave my melee weapon addition idea off the table and focus on MH pistol.

Here goes: MH pistol will focus on direct damage with tacked on burning. Burning would make the weapon useful if building for condition damage and could allow for good fluidity between it and staff offset, while having good damage without heavily buffed burning will provide an offset ranged option along with gs (or even scepter tbh)

Skill Proposal:

1-)  Ember Shot, Burst Shot, Triple Flare - Fire bullets engulfed in Illusionary Flames (a 3-chain ability that has a chance of burning on all 3 attacks and Triple flare being a Combo Finisher that rapid fires 3 shots in quick succession.)

2-)  Blazing Trickery - Targetted AoE - Spawn a clone at your current position and blink to the targeted location. - Reactivation - Flare Switch - Swap places with one of your active illusions and fire a burning shot at your current target. (Think Illusionary Leap meets Infiltrator's Arrow)

3-)  Nova - Charge up a powerful illusionary shot that burns all targets in its path and leaves a line of Illusionary Flames in its wake. - Reactivation - Burst Flare - Interrupt and destroy your Nova before it hits its intended target to cause it to explode and leave a circle of lingering Illusionary Flame. (The idea is to have the normal version provide better single target damage but still provide a small combo field, that way the second version isn't always used but will have its place in AoE heavy fights)

Now I know it's not perfect but I feel like this fits the mesmer, it would fit with multiple builds with multiple offhands and secondary weapon sets. Just to back my claim I'll put down some places where the weapon would fit into some already popular builds.

GS power build = Provides a second option for more glass cannon builds and also gives another option over staff for a GS focused build.

Staff condition = Staff is a rather defensive weapon so a ranged MH with focus on burning could give more flexibility to a condition build, especially when on the offensive where staff isn't the greatest on it's own.

Bleed build - With MH pistol illusions firing frequently stacking bleeds would be quite effective AND having the option to burn could mean you could build condition damage and go full bleed but still have the burning damage so you aren't completely gimped in DEs where bleeds are stacked to 25 extremely quickly.

Just a couple of examples. No it's not 100% revolutionary, but I think that is a good thing. Going to ridiculous places with skills breaks the game so I've tried to stay in the realm of reality. Don't flame me too hard (see what I did there hehe). Please give feedback, especially on what would be good ranges or how you would change the skill(s). Thanks in advance.

[LavaSquid]

Definitely love it, signed.

[Chronos12360]

Thankies hehe. Now I know it wont happen exactly like my idea but anything even remotely similar will make me very happy. PS Anet if you like it steal it then give me a ring lol.

Edited by Chronos12360, 21 September 2012 - 04:55 PM.

[Ashelor]

I have a lv 80 Warrior(main) and a lv80 Thief, I've been looking to level a proper ranged class preferably a spellcaster since my main and 1st alt are primarily melee classes.

Tried Mesmer till lv20 and it just felt lacking ,i mean foundations were there but "something" is missing.
I love greatsword but it's just to clunky to use on more than 2 enemies.
And any other weapons that have AoE just don't feel rly good.

pistol 1 could be a bit like thief shortbow 1 (bouncing from target to target), 2 could be a combo field, and 3 could work in a similar way like thief's 3 works, changing depending on your offhand weapon.
Seeing as mesmers seem to have a thing for laz0rs, p/p n. 3 skill could be a beam like Basilisks have, it could inflict burning and confusion.

+1 for main hand pistol Mesmers.

[VanderBeltLegacy]

sorry but, as some1 who used GS+ Sceptre/Pistol for his 1st 67 level's(still do time to time), we have iDuelist+Magic Bullet(better then people give credit) as way as DBL pistol plays out...please no, we have Thief and Engineer for this, and i really dont wanna see another spammed weapon, like great sword(war/guard/ranger/mes) and kinda got a tad pissy at 3 classes having shield, i just hate over lapping.

not signed, because mentally im dificult.