Jump to content

  • Curse Sites
Help
* * * * * 3 votes

Trading, Inspecting, Dueling, and CoD Mail


  • Please log in to reply
39 replies to this topic

#1 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:05 AM

These 4 features may seem small, but their absence is certainly noticeable.

Person-to-person trade is important in any MMO - particularly in one where the Auction system is under maintanance.

Inspecting to see what that cool-looking armor set is, how an ally is built, or what stats they're geared to is a big feature in MMOs. For any reason there could be to exclude it, there are two reasons -to- have it.

Dueling is a less important feature of an MMO, but it is still a fun one - particularly when you want to test out certain abilities, or try some quick 1v1 fun.
Allowing people to challenge eachother to duels in Heart of the Mists only would be acceptable, IMHO.

CoD Mail is a less important feature, if you have P2P trading - but not having either is crippling and, honestly, awful design.



I know this was a simple post - but these are the most common basic-complaints I've heard, and agree with.
I hope GW2 develops some polish in the coming months - sooner, rather than later - as the economy is losing out on important early growth, in this first week - and a bad start for an MMO can cripple it, particularly in its economy.

#2 Maeverra

Maeverra

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 579 posts
  • Server:Maguuma

Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:11 AM

I'd love CoD, especially if you could include items. I've made mail trades with 5+ people so far and nobody's ripped me off, but the security would still be nice. lol

#3 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:41 AM

The "trust game" is not the way trade should go down.
It's more detrimental to the community to have to wonder if the person you're trading with will rip you off than if P2P trade/CoD Mail were available.

#4 BlueDragoness

BlueDragoness

    Fahrar Cub

  • Members
  • 46 posts
  • Location:Sock
  • Server:Dragonbrand

Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:45 AM

I don't understand why person-to-person trading hasn't been around since day one. It feels like I'm missing some reason that Anet would base this choice on. Is there some benefit to not having it? I can't think of any. :eek:

#5 Lycrus

Lycrus

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 304 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:48 AM

person to person trading eliminates goldseller completely..totally...the drawback is actually not as big as the good thing that comes out of it. trade with friend? simply send mail. trade while getting money? put of auction house. that its off atm is unfortantely..but thats the way to go. i didnt miss player trading at all till now. the only times when i wanted player tarding in other games were when i was too lazy to put it up on the auction house or when i wanted to not pee the auction fee :D

more so..its not bad design, its a simple choice, and a good one if you look at it froma nother perspective.

inspecting isnt needed either. simply ask the person maybe? you can only view stats anyway..most person will transmute theiur gear...so..what then? there is complete false information in the inspect window then. dont know for what you need to inspect..only times when i did it was to make sure the group member is equipped for this raud/dungeon or isntw earing pvpv gear<,<

dueling..well i dont care about it. as long as there is an option to auto refuse it, its a good idea to put it in. maybe only allow it in certain areas.

Edited by Lycrus, 29 August 2012 - 12:51 AM.


#6 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:52 AM

View PostLycrus, on 29 August 2012 - 12:48 AM, said:

person to person trading eliminates goldseller completely..totally...the drawback is actually not as big as the good thing that comes out of it. trade with friend? simply send mail. trade while getting money? put of auction house. that its off atm is unfortantely..but thats the way to go. i didnt miss player trading at all till now. the only times when i wanted player tarding in other games were when i was too lazy to put it up on the auction house or when i wanted to not pee the auction fee :D

How does not having a system to trade goods-for-goods eliminate gold-selling? Goldsellers give gold upfront after they receive $ payment anyway - they would just do it through the mail system.

An item you want may not be on the AH. If there were a P2P trade system, or a CoD Mail system, you could arrange a trade on the GW2Guru marketplace forums. ;)

I'm not positive you even thought it through...

Edited by Soki, 29 August 2012 - 12:54 AM.


#7 SpiralCee

SpiralCee

    Fahrar Cub

  • Members
  • 14 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted 29 August 2012 - 01:17 AM

COD mail is needed for sure!

Dueling, meh. Could take it or leave it.

Inspecting, if they add this, you should have an option to "allow inspect".

#8 Kraag_Deadsoul

Kraag_Deadsoul

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 233 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 01:20 AM

View PostSoki, on 29 August 2012 - 12:52 AM, said:

How does not having a system to trade goods-for-goods eliminate gold-selling? Goldsellers give gold upfront after they receive $ payment anyway - they would just do it through the mail system.

An item you want may not be on the AH. If there were a P2P trade system, or a CoD Mail system, you could arrange a trade on the GW2Guru marketplace forums. ;)

I'm not positive you even thought it through...

P2P trade is instantaneous and more difficult to track.  With the mail system, a delay can be put in without causing any consternation to the players involved; they simply shrug it off as:


Player A:  "Hey, dude, where's that stuff you said you were sending to me in the mail? "


Player B: "I sent it man, honest. "


Player A: "Oh, it's cool...must just be a bit of lag is all...*DING*...oh, cool, it arrived.  Thanks, man! "


Player B: "No, prob, bro."


What players don't realize is that "lag" they experienced is the programming on the back end tracking every transaction and looking for trade patterns which could be indicative of gold selling.  This permits the program/devs to pause the transaction until they've had an opportunity to review it in greater detail or even cancel the transaction altogether.  Obviously, this may not happen the very first time a gold seller sends coins through the mail system.  But it quickly identifies patterns of trade behavior that are easier to track - and stop - as compared to the P2P system.

The Trading Post/Auction House will come online eventually.  Their primary goal has been getting the server and login issues resolved, first.  That's a higher priority than the TP.  Doesn't do much good to fix the trade system if people can't log in to the game.  Now, they may have gotten things stabilized for the 3-day headstart crowd, but that doesn't mean they were then freed up to tackle the TP.  They then had the 1-day headstart and official launch crowds to worry about.  Once they were ready for those new waves of players joining the game, then they could start devoting time, personnel, and resources to other areas that need fixing.  Areas that are certainly important to the game, but less so than server stability and log in.

They will get the TP working.  It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.  One possible explanation for no ETA is they may not know the ETA themselves.  It may be proving more complex than they had initially predicted, given that the TP/AH is global rather than instanced to each server.  I'd rather know they're working on it (which they are) with no firm ETA than be given a false ETA just to placate people and then wind up disappointed if they don't actually come through on the ETA date.  They are keeping players updated on Facebook and Twitter.

Edited by Kraag_Deadsoul, 29 August 2012 - 01:22 AM.


#9 Quinci

Quinci

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1765 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 01:24 AM

There has been entire 30 page threads on why there is no p2p trading. This debate is old and nothing will or can be said in this thread that hasn't already been said on the subject.

#10 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 29 August 2012 - 01:56 AM

View PostQuinci, on 29 August 2012 - 01:24 AM, said:

There has been entire 30 page threads on why there is no p2p trading. This debate is old and nothing will or can be said in this thread that hasn't already been said on the subject.
The more the topic comes up, the more apparent it will be that there's a large interest in these systems - and overwhelming support for them.

Until the Official forums come up, I don't see any harm in lumping the obvious, most-expected systems together.

View PostKraag_Deadsoul, on 29 August 2012 - 01:20 AM, said:

P2P trade is instantaneous and more difficult to track.  With the mail system, a delay can be put in without causing any consternation to the players involved; they simply shrug it off as:


Player A:  "Hey, dude, where's that stuff you said you were sending to me in the mail? "


Player B: "I sent it man, honest. "


Player A: "Oh, it's cool...must just be a bit of lag is all...*DING*...oh, cool, it arrived.  Thanks, man! "


Player B: "No, prob, bro."


What players don't realize is that "lag" they experienced is the programming on the back end tracking every transaction and looking for trade patterns which could be indicative of gold selling.  This permits the program/devs to pause the transaction until they've had an opportunity to review it in greater detail or even cancel the transaction altogether.  Obviously, this may not happen the very first time a gold seller sends coins through the mail system.  But it quickly identifies patterns of trade behavior that are easier to track - and stop - as compared to the P2P system.

The Trading Post/Auction House will come online eventually.  Their primary goal has been getting the server and login issues resolved, first.  That's a higher priority than the TP.  Doesn't do much good to fix the trade system if people can't log in to the game.  Now, they may have gotten things stabilized for the 3-day headstart crowd, but that doesn't mean they were then freed up to tackle the TP.  They then had the 1-day headstart and official launch crowds to worry about.  Once they were ready for those new waves of players joining the game, then they could start devoting time, personnel, and resources to other areas that need fixing.  Areas that are certainly important to the game, but less so than server stability and log in.

They will get the TP working.  It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.  One possible explanation for no ETA is they may not know the ETA themselves.  It may be proving more complex than they had initially predicted, given that the TP/AH is global rather than instanced to each server.  I'd rather know they're working on it (which they are) with no firm ETA than be given a false ETA just to placate people and then wind up disappointed if they don't actually come through on the ETA date.  They are keeping players updated on Facebook and Twitter.
That's a nice theory. I'd like to ask how you feel like you know that the delay is tracking for trade patterns, rather than just giving the item code to the server to put it in the Mail slot of the receiving player? What's your source that that is, definitively, what happens?

I know for a fact that in WoW's case (Please stay focused on the subject) that tracking player trade is very easy. When a player receives a large portion of gold in a short amount of time, it's investigated - and if the sending player also sends a lot of gold to others, it's made into a 'case'.

Since it's very easy to track player trade in a similar game, I doubt ArenaNet would find it challenging to track player-trade.


Now that the "it stops goldselling" assumption-ridden argument is revoked...
Any other reasons?

Edited by Soki, 29 August 2012 - 01:58 AM.


#11 Marooned

Marooned

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 66 posts
  • Location:Somewhere over the rainbow

Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:30 AM

Im not into PVP, but I would love to fight some friends sometimes, just for fun. So, I actually cant create a closed pvp game with a password or something? I never even tried because I thought it was so... common to work this way.

#12 Red_Falcon

Red_Falcon

    Golem Rider

  • Members
  • 2417 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:34 AM

View PostSoki, on 29 August 2012 - 12:05 AM, said:

Person-to-person trade is important in any MMO - particularly in one where the Auction system is under maintanance.

View PostSoki, on 29 August 2012 - 12:05 AM, said:

CoD Mail is a less important feature, if you have P2P trading - but not having either is crippling and, honestly, awful design.

P2P trade no, but CoD is indeed needed.

Today I bought stuff and they sent first. If I was them I wouldn't have sent.
Next time they might deal with the wrong person and lose items.


View PostSoki, on 29 August 2012 - 12:05 AM, said:

Inspecting to see what that cool-looking armor set is, how an ally is built, or what stats they're geared to is a big feature in MMOs. For any reason there could be to exclude it, there are two reasons -to- have it.

No, this would ultimately lead to people trying to control how other need to gear, need to play, etc.
Everyone would be forced to meet a certain standard and to build into a certain setup, otherwise people who checked it would kick him.

No thanks, I want to setup my build and gear freely without anyone taking peeks and say "hey you're not following the current gimmick, you're weak".
Similarly no, I don't want people to steal my item setups, I want to keep my discoveries for myself.

View PostSoki, on 29 August 2012 - 12:05 AM, said:

Dueling is a less important feature of an MMO, but it is still a fun one - particularly when you want to test out certain abilities, or try some quick 1v1 fun.
Allowing people to challenge eachother to duels in Heart of the Mists only would be acceptable, IMHO.

Agreed completely.
Dueling is very fun and needed to take a break from PvE, plus you can test things on the go without having to enter proper PvP matches.
This one is a need.

#13 Rune100

Rune100

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 128 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:34 AM

I would love both the CoD mail and the Inspect feature. I don't think they're going to add Player 2 Player trade anytime soon, if ever, so CoD mail would be a nice option.

Duels would also be a good feature, but I still think it so be limited to certain Arena places inside the major cities.

#14 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:42 AM

So if you're vehemently opposed to P2P trade, then at least accept that Mail should be sendable to people who are offline? ;)

I feel like the arguement about Inspect making people push others to gear better is a pretty empty one, primarily because how you gear depends on your build - and it's very clear what you -should- gear for with the build in mind. If you're improving your condition durations and giving yourself new ways of applying conditions, you should gear toward Condition Damage.
If you're focusing on supporting and tossing down fields, you should build more defensively.

If you're not building Condition-damage when you're traiting for better conditions, you're limiting yourself such that you probably -should- be told "You should probably be doing this instead".


Aside from the empty arguement, there are benefits to the Inspect system being added: Seeing how your teammate's building quickly so you know how to work with them better, seeing what the cool armor they're wearing is, or viewing a player's completed achievements to see if they've done something really impressive.
Also, there could be a tickbox to "Allow inspects".
I have yet to see an arguement posed by a person who is against Inspection that makes sense that isn't an anecdotal "But they'll make from of me =(" reason.

#15 ZigKid3

ZigKid3

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 80 posts
  • Location:CA
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 30 August 2012 - 07:04 AM

Trading: Yes. Why? No stupid trust games with mail when finding a stranger with an item you have. or when trading items found in a dungeon run with a stranger. though. though, since mail (assuming its working at the time) is instantaneous and can be done from anywhere it can be pretty similar. However, with mail it's a trust thing, with CoD however it helps the not being able to trade problem a bit. but without trading, how are you going to trade item for item with someone? you can't, you'd have to sell an item to someone with CoD, and then buy their item with CoD in a roundabout way.

CoD: yes, needed, and see above.

Dueling: I don't see any reason why there shouldn't be a dueling feature at all, at the very least in the PvP area, though being able to duel someone out int he world is nice too. I have yet to see a legitimate complaint about how adding this feature is a bad thing. all I see is "i don't like dueling" well then obviously just don't duel yourself, don't make other people suffer. This game has PvP in it, it's not just PvE.

Inspecting: This would be a nice feature to browse your friends builds, compare with other people, etc... to the earlier comment about it making people being forced by others to build in a certain way: It is going to happen no matter what, the only guilds that will care enough to do this will be hardcore PvE guilds or hardcore sPvP teams, and they will do this regardless. so at least add inspecting to make this easier for you and your teammates. also if you don't like being told what to do, communicate, let them know you want to be your own build or find a more casual guild/team that wont make you build a certain way. btw inspecting is also a plus for RPers as well.

#16 Miteshu

Miteshu

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1987 posts

Posted 30 August 2012 - 11:31 PM

Trading: There is no player to player trading because It is easier to spot botters that way. A person that keeps regularly sending 100 gold to people is worth investigating. If you want to trade, use the Auction House when it is up.

If you don't want that green axe and you want that green hammer. You sell the green axe and use the money to buy the green hammer.

It also removes the stupid WTS spam on the chat log. It didn't remove for Guild Wars 2 while AH was down but the WTS spam was definitely removed when mailing was down. It will be removed when auction house is up. Then the people spamming WTS will be ridiculed for spamming the chat.

CoD: No for the same reason for trading.

Dueling: As long as there is no instant teleport to an arena. The only time I will duel will be in the dungeons while my party members are busy doing stuff. Then they'll go back and do stuff again. Dueling is a perfect activity for waiting.

Inspecting: If you want to know their items, you just ask them what they are wearing. They don't need to type everything, they just need to shift + click the items. If they don't want you to know, it is their privacy and they don't have to let you know.

#17 ZigKid3

ZigKid3

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 80 posts
  • Location:CA
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 30 August 2012 - 11:55 PM

View PostMiteshu, on 30 August 2012 - 11:31 PM, said:

Trading: There is no player to player trading because It is easier to spot botters that way. A person that keeps regularly sending 100 gold to people is worth investigating. If you want to trade, use the Auction House when it is up.

If you don't want that green axe and you want that green hammer. You sell the green axe and use the money to buy the green hammer.

It also removes the stupid WTS spam on the chat log. It didn't remove for Guild Wars 2 while AH was down but the WTS spam was definitely removed when mailing was down. It will be removed when auction house is up. Then the people spamming WTS will be ridiculed for spamming the chat.

CoD: No for the same reason for trading.

if there's no CoD system, then I hope you get scammed by someone who didn't hold up their part of the deal. Also, that's so roundabout.

View PostMiteshu, on 30 August 2012 - 11:31 PM, said:

Inspecting: If you want to know their items, you just ask them what they are wearing. They don't need to type everything, they just need to shift + click the items. If they don't want you to know, it is their privacy and they don't have to let you know.
Again, It's roundabout. inspecting, you'll just be able to click and view everything from equipment, to traits, to current utility skills. imagine having the person have to link each piece of armor one by one for several pieces, while you scroll over the tiny little text.

#18 Shamadamun

Shamadamun

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1353 posts
  • Guild Tag:[VV]
  • Server:Stormbluff Isle

Posted 30 August 2012 - 11:59 PM

I'm all up for CoD and Dueling, don't care for the others.

I prefer for people to stay anonymous in regards to specific builds and gear, so people won't just inspect people in the mists and copy their builds. C'mon guys, get some creativity, trial and error :D

I don't see the need for trading if we have CoD. Frankly, I kind of like the idea of not being able to hand a friend something, but instead throw it on a pigeon. Not sure why, just a personal preference of mine I suppose!

But seriously, add dueling. Seems like every MMO is not focused about 1v1 combat, and yet 1v1 always seems to be the most fun. Plus, it's something I did in WoW for years, so I got quite good at it :P

#19 Miteshu

Miteshu

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1987 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 01:18 AM

View PostZigKid3, on 30 August 2012 - 11:55 PM, said:

if there's no CoD system, then I hope you get scammed by someone who didn't hold up their part of the deal. Also, that's so roundabout.


Again, It's roundabout. inspecting, you'll just be able to click and view everything from equipment, to traits, to current utility skills. imagine having the person have to link each piece of armor one by one for several pieces, while you scroll over the tiny little text.
Why would I care about a CoD system when I can use the Auction House to trade when it is back up? I won't get scammed by someone who I idiotically trade to because I will never trade by mail. I don't want trade by mail nor do I want other to trade by mail, not now and not ever. I rather have meaningful conversation on the /map chat than having to deal with WTS spam. The time that ArenaNet disabled mail gifting severely cleaned out the map chat significantly.

Here is a better suggestion: Use the Auction House when it is back up. It removes WTS spam, and makes botting/gold farmers easy to spot. The auction house already serves the purpose of buying/selling items from players something that you intend to use CoD/P2P trading for. I don't see how CoD/P2P add anything good that AH doesn't have.


It is not hard to shift+click armor pieces on the hero panel. Hold shift, then click click click click click click and then enter. If it is that difficult, maybe Guild Wars 2 isn't the game for you.

#20 ZigKid3

ZigKid3

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 80 posts
  • Location:CA
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 31 August 2012 - 01:34 AM

View PostMiteshu, on 31 August 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

Why would I care about a CoD system when I can use the Auction House to trade when it is back up? I won't get scammed by someone who I idiotically trade to because I will never trade by mail. I don't want trade by mail nor do I want other to trade by mail, not now and not ever. I rather have meaningful conversation on the /map chat than having to deal with WTS spam. The time that ArenaNet disabled mail gifting severely cleaned out the map chat significantly.

Here is a better suggestion: Use the Auction House when it is back up. It removes WTS spam, and makes botting/gold farmers easy to spot. The auction house already serves the purpose of buying/selling items from players something that you intend to use CoD/P2P trading for. I don't see how CoD/P2P add anything good that AH doesn't have.


It is not hard to shift+click armor pieces on the hero panel. Hold shift, then click click click click click click and then enter. If it is that difficult, maybe Guild Wars 2 isn't the game for you.

So you hate mail and trading? Okay, how are you going to trade to a specific person then without risk of someone else buying off the auction house?

Of course clicking isn't hard, but having to click each and every individual one is pretty ineffecient.


View PostShamadamun, on 30 August 2012 - 11:59 PM, said:



I prefer for people to stay anonymous in regards to specific builds and gear, so people won't just inspect people in the mists and copy their builds. C'mon guys, get some creativity, trial and error :D

People will copy each other and use cookie cutter builds reguardless

Edited by ZigKid3, 31 August 2012 - 01:37 AM.


#21 Miteshu

Miteshu

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1987 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 02:11 AM

View PostZigKid3, on 31 August 2012 - 01:34 AM, said:

So you hate mail and trading? Okay, how are you going to trade to a specific person then without risk of someone else buying off the auction house?

Of course clicking isn't hard, but having to click each and every individual one is pretty ineffecient.
I don't, I'll buy or sell it off the Auction House. If there is none on the market, it is obvious that the item isn't going to be sold in 5 seconds and that person will buy it on the Auction house.

If that person is your friend, then there is no issues on the trust game. If he/she is not trustworthy, don't trade with him/her and tell him/her to buy it on the Auction House. What does P2P trading offer better than the Auction House could?

-------------

A few clicks is inefficient? Is this sarcasm I am reading or are you bad at shift and click click click click the equipments that are organized in a straight line?

#22 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 31 August 2012 - 02:12 AM

This is what I don't get:
If you argue that inspect shouldn't exist and cite that people will copy builds and use what is best as the reason, you're setting your arguement up to not be taken seriously.
It's pretty obvious that most builds are copied off wikis anyway - not from inspecting some random player.

If you're going to make an arguement against a feature that is generally good for any MMO, at least make up a passable reason aside from "I don't want people to be mean to me".
(Which may be hard, since these features are generally hard to argue against unless you argue illogically... ;) )

#23 Kerdain

Kerdain

    Vanguard Scout

  • Members
  • 155 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 03:55 AM

Agree to all 4, I was frankly surprised there is no CoD option for mail. At first I was ok with no direct trade, but now, that I have played the game, and saw that the mail system can and will go down.. we really need direct trade.

#24 Evo Sapien

Evo Sapien

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 52 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 03:59 AM

They shut down mail so that hackers had no way to trade away money and items from accounts while they took measures to prevent it. This is why person to person trading being gone was good.

What is the point of inspecting someones gear if half of it has been transmuted?

COD seems fine.

Dueling in perhaps an instanced area only, or forbidden within cities please.

Edited by Evo Sapien, 31 August 2012 - 04:00 AM.


#25 ZigKid3

ZigKid3

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 80 posts
  • Location:CA
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 31 August 2012 - 04:22 AM

View PostMiteshu, on 31 August 2012 - 02:11 AM, said:

I don't, I'll buy or sell it off the Auction House. If there is none on the market, it is obvious that the item isn't going to be sold in 5 seconds and that person will buy it on the Auction house.

If that person is your friend, then there is no issues on the trust game. If he/she is not trustworthy, don't trade with him/her and tell him/her to buy it on the Auction House. What does P2P trading offer better than the Auction House could?
no risk of it getting sniped.
I have no problem with the mail, and believe me it definetly is great. I just don't see why we can't have both trading and mail. If trading was added, how will it negatively effect the game? If you don't want to use it, then don't simple as that, don't ruin it for everyone else who would like to have the system when you could just simply not choose to use it.


View PostMiteshu, on 31 August 2012 - 02:11 AM, said:

A few clicks is inefficient? Is this sarcasm I am reading or are you bad at shift and click click click click the equipments that are organized in a straight line?
Oh, okay, attacking the person in a debate, that definetly helps your argument.
I'll put it simply: doing two button clicks without bothering the other person, or having to ask the other person first and then that person has to make 8-12 clicks themselves?


View PostEvo Sapien, on 31 August 2012 - 03:59 AM, said:

They shut down mail so that hackers had no way to trade away money and items from accounts while they took measures to prevent it. This is why person to person trading being gone was good.
They could do the exact same thing by disabling trading if they wanted too, it's not really that different.

Edited by ZigKid3, 31 August 2012 - 04:24 AM.


#26 Diathon

Diathon

    Fahrar Cub

  • Members
  • 30 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 04:23 AM

The main problem that I personally had with the AH was that I'd have to leave whatever I was doing to sell/buy items. Since they've made the AH available from any area of the world I see no need for P2P or CoD. We simply have to wait for the AH to come up and that's in Anet's hands.

I've really missed dueling. It's great to try out tactics or skills without true risk. It's also a fun way to pass time if you need to wait around on your party members or something.

Inspect gear...eh, I really don't care either way. I'm not interested in what other people are wearing because it doesn't matter as much as how they play in this game. You can build your stats nicely with gear and still be terrible. You can, and many do at this time, wear gear that isn't so great and still rock if you've truly put any effort towards learning your class. I make my decisions about who I'll play with AFTER I play with them.

I do have a problem with people saying they don't want their skill/stat build to be copied. If you've found a build or way of gearing that really rocks why would you not want people to know about it? I can understand you might not want them to LOOK like you, that makes sense to me, but having the same stats/build? Just sounds like a very selfish person who's afraid of competition.

#27 Miteshu

Miteshu

    Seraph Guardian

  • Members
  • 1987 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 05:54 AM

View PostZigKid3, on 31 August 2012 - 04:22 AM, said:


no risk of it getting sniped.
I have no problem with the mail, and believe me it definetly is great. I just don't see why we can't have both trading and mail. If trading was added, how will it negatively effect the game? If you don't want to use it, then don't simple as that, don't ruin it for everyone else who would like to have the system when you could just simply not choose to use it.

Are you kidding me? Did you ignore my post on how P2P trading negatively effect the game?

Let me repeat it for you...

Quote

GOLD SELLERS(bots) AND WTS SPAM
It will be easier to spot a gold sellers when they are sending gold to players. Gold sellers are the parasites of the economy. Having no P2P trading makes it easier to spot gold sellers. If a gold farmer sends 100 gold to a player, it is something that is worth investigating. ArenaNet can easily make a judgement and ban the gold seller.

Removing WTS spam(Waiting to Sell), will clean up the chat. I will no longer have to see people selling crap when I can just have meaningful conversation instead.

If P2P trading is added, I will have to deal with WTS spam and unnoticed Gold sellers because trading is there. It will affect me whether or not if I dislike trading to players.


Quote

Oh, okay, attacking the person in a debate, that definetly helps your argument.
I'll put it simply: doing two button clicks without bothering the other person, or having to ask the other person first and then that person has to make 8-12 clicks themselves?
8-12 clicks for that person to show their entire equipments is good enough not to waste the Dev's time to make a silly feature like inspect equipments.

8-12 clicks will take less than 5 seconds.

#28 ZigKid3

ZigKid3

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 80 posts
  • Location:CA
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 31 August 2012 - 06:42 AM

View PostMiteshu, on 31 August 2012 - 05:54 AM, said:

Are you kidding me? Did you ignore my post on how P2P trading negatively effect the game?

Let me repeat it for you...

It will be easier to spot a gold sellers when they are sending gold to players. Gold sellers are the parasites of the economy. Having no P2P trading makes it easier to spot gold sellers. If a gold farmer sends 100 gold to a player, it is something that is worth investigating. ArenaNet can easily make a judgement and ban the gold seller.

Removing WTS spam(Waiting to Sell), will clean up the chat. I will no longer have to see people selling crap when I can just have meaningful conversation instead.

WTS spam won't be an issue as the auction house will still exist. the trading will be more for more personal transactions. WTS spam only becomes a major issue when games don't have an auction house, not when games have a trade feauture. not mention you will still see people saying WTS because of mail. so adding a trade option won't effect it in any way.

As for tracking gold sellers, they can still look up transaction history of that character in the same manner, the investigation is no different.

View PostMiteshu, on 31 August 2012 - 05:54 AM, said:

8-12 clicks for that person to show their entire equipments is good enough not to waste the Dev's time to make a silly feature like inspect equipments.

8-12 clicks will take less than 5 seconds.
Customer satisfaction. Is it a small feature? yes. but If players find a bunch of small things they don't like with game it piles up.

Edited by ZigKid3, 31 August 2012 - 06:42 AM.


#29 Soki

Soki

    Sylvari Specialist

  • Members
  • 828 posts
  • Location:My own little world \~w~/
  • Guild Tag:[Bern]
  • Server:Isle of Janthir

Posted 31 August 2012 - 07:29 AM

Having no P2P trade does not make gold sellers easier to spot.
For all intents & purposes, Mail functions exactly the same for the server as P2P trade does - just that instead of one person's item disapearing from them and apearing in the inventory of the recipient, both players lose and gain what they put into the window.

I cannot stress this enough: Every single MMO handles mail in a similar way - and speaking from experience of maintaining a Ragnarok Online and Final Fantasy XI personal server in the past, I've seen that the server views the transactions with just as much effectiveness, with both transactions taking up a similar amount of space.

It is complete ~bullshit~ that it's easier to track Mail than Trade - unless ArenaNet is doing it in a ridiculously roundabout way.

To be perfectly frank with you, since Gold Selling is officially sanctioned in-game already, Gold Sellers are almost without a leg to stand on in this game anyway. There is no reason for there to be no way to directly trade item-for-item with a player - especially not in the interest of discouraging Gold Sellers.

#30 prplxd

prplxd

    Asuran Acolyte

  • Members
  • 53 posts
  • Location:Ontario, Canada

Posted 31 August 2012 - 07:42 AM

Definitely for everything, especially person to person trade.
Mail might not always be available (with maintenance and such), and I'd like to feel like the items I'm giving to a friend are securely being sent over.
Those must be some damn powerful pigeons. Carrying a heavy chest piece, 2 greatswords, some gold ingots...
And I feel pretty dumb sending a pigeon to give my friend - who is 5 feet away from me - an item.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users