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Guardian - Zealot Spike Guide for sPvP and tournaments!

guardian spike guide

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#1 JaxSilven

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 01:57 AM

-- Introduction --


Hey all, my name's Silven, this is my first post here on Guru.
Quick History: Played GW1 at a high level around 2010, played loads of GW2 tournaments with my team [nD] on the SoS server. I also stream =)

Ever since the start of GW2 (the first beta's) I've been more interested in the Guardian's large spike potential, rather than it's ability to run defensive builds. I saw that through traits and burning the Guardian definitely had a lot of untapped potential, taking this in I decided to run sword spike builds from the start.

I've included a quick guide to setting up and playing my build, and I know it's still a while from being completely optimal, but now there's much more of a chance to play and I would really like everybody's feedback!! And hopefully we both may learn something, enjoy!

-- Build --


Traits
  • Zeal: 10 - II
  • Radiance: 30 - II, X, XI
  • Valor: 30 - I, X, XII
  • Honour: 0
  • Virtues: 0
Armour
Knights Amulet with Berserker Jewel
Divinity Runes

Utility Skills
  • Signet of Resolve
  • Smite Condition
  • Judge's Intervention
  • "Stand Your Ground!"
  • Renewed Focus
Weapons
  • Sword/Focus (Air, Accuracy)
  • Scepter/Shield (Bloodlust, Bloodlust)
Optionals
  • Valor V > Valor X
    Amazing condition removal over Amazing spike, if Contemplation don't bring V.
  • Honour II > Zeal II
    Shout recharge is excellent support while sacrificing a lot of damage, in team fights not as important.
  • Contemplation of Purity > "Stand Your Ground!"
    The ability to remove covered poison, bleeding or immob instantly is amazing (especially the poison to heal).
  • Hammer of Wisdom > "Stand Your Ground!"
    Knockdown with 2.5k extra damage on your spike (more compact than bane but more predictable, also consider Virtue V or Zeal VI) and control!
  • Bane Signet > "Stand Your Ground!"
    Knock down with ~1k damage on your spike.
  • Tome of Courage > Renewed Focus
    Use ToC with SYG, an amazing support skill!
  • Greatsword (Bloodlust) > Scepter/Shield
    High AoE damage, punishes enemies for balling and nice Jump and control, way less utility and defence though.
Here it is on a build creator:
http://www.gw2build.....0.10.30.30.0.0




-- Usage --


General
  • Your main spike is:
    Virtue of Justice, Zealot's Defence, Smite Condition, Judge's Intervention all at the same time
  • This can be improved by:
    - Smite and/or chains of light before your main spike
    - Shield of Wrath before your main spike then spiking just as it ends for the 4-5k bonus damage
    - Shield of Judgement after the main spike
    - "Stand Your Ground!" to inflict retaliation if they're trying to damage you too
  • Shield of Wrath is your best defensive skill, blocks the next 3 attacks and the is removed, but it blocks any attacks while the animation is up (may be a bug, I don't know), so you can effectively block a lot more. Explodes for 3-5k damage when blocks aren't used up.
  • Chaining blocks and blinds is extremely easy!
    - Your first aegis
    - Ray of Judgement
    - Flashing blade
    - Virtue of Courage
    - Shield of Wrath
  • To stop people stomping your allies, use shield of absorption to knock them back soon as they jump into the air (you can also spike them and either kill them or force them off the player)
  • To get your own teams' stomps use SYG, a lot of the enemies can also be blinded by virtue of justice or blocked by courage.
    Warrior: When they hold the hammer back use your virtue/SYG
    Guardian: If you have the reflexes to use it as they use bubble do it otherwise just use your block/SYG when they stop attacking (if they don't attack just use it straight away)
    Elementalist: They can't stop you =)
    Necromancer: When the green symbol above their head appears use your virtue/SYG
    Ranger: Use your virtue/SYG when they stop attacking or soon as you can if they don't attack
    Mesmer : They can't stop you =)
    Thief : When they teleport instantly use Judge's Intervention and you'll stomp them anyway, it's really sick!
    Engineer: Use y our block/SYG when they stop attacking
  • When facing burst builds use, Shield of Wrath or Renewed Focus to block it completely. Flashing Blade or JI to teleport out of the burst. SYG to break stun and retaliate the damage. Shield of Judgement to give yourself protection. Or V of courage to block the stun. You can also just spike them back with retal and easy win. (you can also use the scepter to just stay out of range vs a war for example) =)
  • When facing bunker builds, pressure them as much as possible. Spike then flashing blade to keep up with them and just keep dealing damage, when you see the tell tale signs of a heal skill (same for almost all classes) use SoA to knock them back, this can either kill them, make them panic, or make them run away.

-- Videos --


Here's my stream channel:
http://www.twitch.tv...ven/b/330637261


And here's the youtube video!


Here's a quick 1v1 vs a Warrior who wanted to play against me.


-- Conclusion --



Here are my other builds:
Crit Mid Bunker
http://gw2skills.net...Nudk1siYQw jJBA

Standard Mid Bunker
http://gw2skills.net...Oudk7s2YEx jJBA

Khylo Mid Bunker
http://gw2skills.net...Nudk1s Y8x jZEA

Obviously their are a lot of optionals, these are builds I'm going to be doing a guide for later on, and there are a few more!

Any requests for more videos I'm definitely up for, and I have a fair few uploaded!
Thanks for watching!
- Silven

Edited by JaxSilven, 19 December 2012 - 01:13 PM.


#2 Misses Tsuki

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 03:55 AM

Nicely done :) Find it a lot better than most typed out guides here.

Only 2 remarks if I may ...

1) Perhaps try to include more footage of tourny play or just random sPvP or even WvW, just so people can see how this build decks out in those situations. Giving the guide is very nice, but people like to see it more in action. Specially for most it goes "seeing=believing".

2) Please put your mic a bit further from your mouth ;) Keeps the attention to what you're saying instead of your breathing ^^.


I'll certainly check in on this a bit in the future :)

Cheers

#3 JaxSilven

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 04:03 AM

Thanks for the feedback!!
It was intended purely as a guide, the gameplay was to show simply how to use the build (Knockdown -> F1 -> Zealot's) and I definitely have the intention of uploading more tournament play soon! ^^ Although there is a lot of content on my stream or youtube channel already!

And I'm currently waiting on a snowball mic, it may be on a backorder it's been a month...or they stole my money =(((.
I have a razer one atm but it doesn't seem to measure up to my old $10 ones ...
thanks!

#4 Misses Tsuki

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 04:25 AM

View PostJaxSilven, on 01 September 2012 - 04:03 AM, said:

Although there is a lot of content on my stream or youtube channel already!


Link to the utube channel pls :)  Can't seem to find it on your stream info.

PS: Might wanna switch your stream section to GW2 instead of SCII if you wanna attract some viewers ;)

#5 JaxSilven

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 04:43 AM

http://www.youtube.c...ut?feature=mhee

and thanks!

#6 JaxSilven

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 12:56 PM

Actually refined this a lot since last night!!! Thanks to viewers and friends!!
Going to post up the changes once I get some footage tomorrow! =D

#7 Misses Tsuki

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:39 PM

What are your streaming hours generally speaking? :)

#8 JaxSilven

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 10:32 PM

From about 06:00 or 07:00 GMT through to about 15:00 GMT if I have the internet Download, which I didn't as much this month thanks to having to download gw2 so many times XDDD

It also depends on my work, but right now I am =D

Edited by JaxSilven, 01 September 2012 - 10:33 PM.


#9 Aodan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 02:40 AM

ZD is a highly avoidable attack. Guardians burst is not to be relied on it unless you have strong cc in order to get the full combinations off.

I would like to see more Tpvp against good teams using such methods. Otherwise I don't see this as much of a guide.

#10 JaxSilven

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 03:12 AM

Well if you actually watch the video, you see it has strong cc...
sigh..

+ there are a few games on my stream

Edited by JaxSilven, 02 September 2012 - 03:14 AM.


#11 Aodan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 04:04 AM

View PostJaxSilven, on 02 September 2012 - 03:12 AM, said:

Well if you actually watch the video, you see it has strong cc...
sigh..

+ there are a few games on my stream

Saw them, not impressed. and I mean strong CC as a whole in the comp for Tpvp. Relying on just Signet of Wrath and Chains of Light is decent for one profession, but against competent players one will more than likely be dodged and the wined up time on ZD is pretty back before it actually connects. Sword is still the best burst single target option for the guardian, but against good players, it is avoided more than it actually connects.

The best Burst available atm is a well timed Chains of Light with Smite stack into a ZD followed up by a well timed Shield of Wrath + SC + JI combination (which you would probably need another IMMO to get off). The only utility combination that meets this SC+JI+SigOWrath. Which you only have 1 of those 3.

And I main Guardian for my team and have rung for others.

It's honestly not a personal attack against you, but I would prefer people don't mislead others into believe such poorly crafted builds are a good basis to even begin to be a "guide".

But hey people will follow you, just like Mister Eriko. Just makes my wins easier.

Edited by Aodan, 02 September 2012 - 04:14 AM.


#12 Morhilion

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 04:28 AM

View PostAodan, on 02 September 2012 - 04:04 AM, said:

Saw them, not impressed. and I mean strong CC as a whole in the comp for Tpvp. Relying on just Signet of Wrath and Chains of Light is decent for one profession, but against competent players one will more than likely be dodged and the wined up time on ZD is pretty back before it actually connects. Sword is still the best burst single target option for the guardian, but against good players, it is avoided more than it actually connects.

The best Burst available atm is a well timed Chains of Light with Smite stack into a ZD followed up by a well timed Shield of Wrath + SC + JI combination (which you would probably need another IMMO to get off). The only utility combination that meets this SC+JI+SigOWrath. Which you only have 1 of those 3.

And I main Guardian for my team and have rung for others.

It's honestly not a personal attack against you, but I would prefer people don't mislead others into believe such poorly crafted builds are a good basis to even begin to be a "guide".

But hey people will follow you, just like Mister Eriko. Just makes my wins easier.

So how about you post your build so we can compare them instead of completely trashing his?

#13 Aodan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 05:16 AM

View PostMorhilion, on 02 September 2012 - 04:28 AM, said:

So how about you post your build so we can compare them instead of completely trashing his?

I'll one up you and even record tomorrow even if the servers are laggy and post a vid. I'll even screen shot how many people have privately msg'd me about guardian builds and feedback.

I was going to actually write the Guardian PvP guide, but apparently Guru mods rather have Master Eriko lacking guide instead of mine, so I gave up on trying to "teach" the general guardian population.

But here, some SC's to hold you over.

Me against Nightmare (QA and Dev team) BWE3
http://imageshack.us...641/gw052h.jpg/

Against a random guild team
http://imageshack.us...13/gw031oc.jpg/
http://imageshack.us.../4/gw019bj.jpg/

Oh lets just have one against a team that's actually trying to be in esports
A game against Epeen
Posted Image
By at 2012-09-01

Keep in mind my team is newly formed and has tons to work on, but we smash almost all average teams.

Edited by Aodan, 02 September 2012 - 06:18 PM.


#14 Red_Falcon

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 10:17 AM

View PostAodan, on 02 September 2012 - 04:04 AM, said:

snip

You are correct that his build is not a complete burstlock combo, I personally use a similar build to yours except I use hammer for immob+MB instead of scepter.
But you also give too much credit to the average Joe out there (which is a mistake I've been doing until recently too).
Until the blizz crowd is gone from pvp you can easily plow through most people without needing an all-out 1vs1 demolition build on you.
80% of people in spvp are WASDing, keyboard-turning, skill-clicking button mashers; even when you get to high ranks they still make at least 50% of your opponents (I guess bads got there by farming other bads).
Very few people are aware of the Guardian's weak point.

Therefore, I find it better to have a build that allows you to mow your lawn while still having enough tools to deal with the situation where you get bads in your team and they get rolled so you need to keep 2 to 3 players tunneled on you while the bads come back from the waypoint.
Because while plowing through bads is awesome, it doesn't hold capture points, and sadly the outcome of games is about points so you need a way to rebalance the game in your favor when your teammates are getting rolled.

#15 nofe

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 10:42 AM

that was some huge damage you did on the warrior, are those videos from BWE and stress test?  I've used builds like this and I can't seem to match that damage at all.

Also, Red_Falcon, what's wrong with WASD?  I used WASD...

#16 JaxSilven

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 01:39 PM

View PostAodan, on 02 September 2012 - 04:04 AM, said:

Saw them, not impressed. and I mean strong CC as a whole in the comp for Tpvp. Relying on just Signet of Wrath and Chains of Light is decent for one profession, but against competent players one will more than likely be dodged and the wined up time on ZD is pretty back before it actually connects. Sword is still the best burst single target option for the guardian, but against good players, it is avoided more than it actually connects.

The best Burst available atm is a well timed Chains of Light with Smite stack into a ZD followed up by a well timed Shield of Wrath + SC + JI combination (which you would probably need another IMMO to get off). The only utility combination that meets this SC+JI+SigOWrath. Which you only have 1 of those 3.

And I main Guardian for my team and have rung for others.

It's honestly not a personal attack against you, but I would prefer people don't mislead others into believe such poorly crafted builds are a good basis to even begin to be a "guide".

But hey people will follow you, just like Mister Eriko. Just makes my wins easier.

I don't think you've read or watched anything I've said, firstly I hadn't had much of a chance to talk to many guardian players before now because the game itself is so antisocial and thus had a lot of room for improvement!
Secondly, I'm not sure if you're referring to bane signet when you talk about wrath? Because I've been using bane for most of the time.
Thirdly, if you'd watch my new video, where I said I'd refurbished the build quite a bit, you'll see a lot of things have changed to pretty much what you've written BUT, before you wrote it.

And lastly, I can't upload replays of tournies from before because the game lags a bit while streaming and I liked to keep it lag free while actually playing. I do, however, have a lot more impressive screenshots if you wanna get all e-peen on me.

And to everybody else, for some reason my stream this morning crashed and didn't end up saving, so I'll have to redo it tomorrow! Hopefully the damn tournies are up =(

@ nofe
These vids are from the last week only, if you spec correctly against a damage spec'd war you'll hit extremely high. I'll be making a how-to video tomorrow morning!

#17 RamzaBehoulve

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 02:47 PM

View PostMorhilion, on 02 September 2012 - 04:28 AM, said:

So how about you post your build so we can compare them instead of completely trashing his?

He doesn't need to give out his build if he doesn't want to. He didn't just meaninglessly trash the presented build. He argued and explained why it is limited in efficiency. Plus OP itself made improvements beforehand to his first build that went in the direction of Aodan's remarks.

If you post a guide on a forum, expect to be criticized.

Edited by unraveled, 03 September 2012 - 12:04 PM.
No need for personal commentary thanks.


#18 JaxSilven

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 02:57 PM

My stream is up now ^^

nvm, thanks for shutting down pvp... =(

Edited by JaxSilven, 02 September 2012 - 03:22 PM.


#19 Morhilion

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 04:07 PM

View PostAodan, on 02 September 2012 - 05:16 AM, said:

I'll one up you and even record tomorrow even if the servers are laggy and post a vid. I'll even screen shot how many people have privately msg'd me about guardian builds and feedback.

I was going to actually write the Guardian PvP guide, but apparently Guru mods rather have Master Eriko lacking guide instead of mine, so I gave up on trying to "teach" the general guardian population.

But here, some SC's to hold you over.

Me against Nightmare (QA and Dev team) BWE3
http://imageshack.us...641/gw052h.jpg/

Against a random guild team
http://imageshack.us...13/gw031oc.jpg/
http://imageshack.us.../4/gw019bj.jpg/

Oh lets just have one against a team that's actually trying to be in esports
A game against Epeen

By at 2012-09-01

I wasn't trying to offend you i was just curious as to what kind of build you are using. I look forward to the videos :) .

#20 Aodan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 06:19 PM

View PostJaxSilven, on 02 September 2012 - 01:39 PM, said:

I don't think you've read or watched anything I've said, firstly I hadn't had much of a chance to talk to many guardian players before now because the game itself is so antisocial and thus had a lot of room for improvement!
Secondly, I'm not sure if you're referring to bane signet when you talk about wrath? Because I've been using bane for most of the time.
Thirdly, if you'd watch my new video, where I said I'd refurbished the build quite a bit, you'll see a lot of things have changed to pretty much what you've written BUT, before you wrote it.

And lastly, I can't upload replays of tournies from before because the game lags a bit while streaming and I liked to keep it lag free while actually playing. I do, however, have a lot more impressive screenshots if you wanna get all e-peen on me.

And to everybody else, for some reason my stream this morning crashed and didn't end up saving, so I'll have to redo it tomorrow! Hopefully the damn tournies are up =(

@ nofe
These vids are from the last week only, if you spec correctly against a damage spec'd war you'll hit extremely high. I'll be making a how-to video tomorrow morning!

There was plenty of a chance before the game even came out to get feedback from other good guardian players or knowledgeable ones. Hince why I'm kinda "attacking" your guide.

#21 JaxSilven

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:45 PM

View PostAodan, on 02 September 2012 - 06:19 PM, said:

There was plenty of a chance before the game even came out to get feedback from other good guardian players or knowledgeable ones. Hince why I'm kinda "attacking" your guide.

I don't mind about feedback, and I even enjoy harsh feedback.
The problem I have is that you didn't read, nor watch, anything I posted then continued to comment on it. What was the point in that? It's not constructive, it's baseless and irrelevant. If you want to actually take the time to watch and read then sure I do welcome your feedback (no matter how negative).
It helps me improve and hopefully others too.

#22 wandering vagabond

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:45 AM

Can someone actually link some builds for those of us who are pretty new? :P

I don't know what half the acronyms in this thread even mean.

#23 NovAtan

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:16 PM

View Postwandering vagabond, on 03 September 2012 - 10:45 AM, said:

Can someone actually link some builds for those of us who are pretty new? :P

I don't know what half the acronyms in this thread even mean.

Here's the offensive guardian build that I use. I change a few things if the other team isn't running condition heavy but this is generally a safe bet.

http://gw2skills.net...Nuak1soYQxGiJEA

A few things to note:

-your survivability comes from your blinds and shields rather than toughness, be sure to rotate them (without them you're pretty squishy)
-meditations heal you
-don't rely on zealous defence for damage (as it is easily dodged , your sword 1 skill does great damage

I don't have any video footage to share as I don't fraps but hopefully the other guardians here will post more of their's.

#24 Misses Tsuki

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:56 PM

His original build

Be aware that he made some adaptations to it, which I'm not 100% sure off which he swapped out.

You can swap out the Slot Skills for those mentioned by Aodon if you wan't a bit more single target burst damage.

As for acronyms in here, here is a short list of this topics acro's:

* ZD = Zealot's Defense - Sword Skill
* CoL = Chains of Light - Scepter Skill
* SoW = Shield of Wrath - Focus Skill
* SC = Smite Condition - Slot Skill
* JI = Judge's Intervention - Slot Skill
* IMMO = Immobilize (refers to any immobilizing skill)

#25 JaxSilven

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 02:55 PM

I linked my new build in the OP
http://www.gw2build.....0.10.30.30.0.0

with Bane signet as an optional, and yes, don't "rely" on ZD for damage, but definitely try your best to enforce it, it's the highest damage a Guardian has.

#26 Aodan

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:44 PM

View PostJaxSilven, on 03 September 2012 - 02:55 PM, said:

I linked my new build in the OP
http://www.gw2build.....0.10.30.30.0.0

with Bane signet as an optional, and yes, don't "rely" on ZD for damage, but definitely try your best to enforce it, it's the highest damage a Guardian has.

1. Ogre is stupid good, you should be using at least 4 then 2 divinity if your going a highly offensive build. The marginal crit dmg/chance loss is a great trade for a pet that will bump your dps up significantly.
2.  CoP is only really needed in tournament against heavy condition comps, even then it can be a waste of a utility as you can get more productive condi removal without wasting a utility solely on it.
3. Why get focused Mind for SC when CoP/JI are already instant. one major for a marginal 1 second cast doesn't seem very note worthy. Why not try Purity or Ret Armor.
4. Renewed Focus is a very selfish elite, in hot join, I guess you could get a lot out of it, but in tournament, smart use of ToC is huge.

Edited by Aodan, 03 September 2012 - 04:46 PM.


#27 Lilitu

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 06:12 PM

As someone who hasn't yet played a Guardian, I'm interested in what Aodan considers a better build.

#28 Aodan

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 06:46 PM

View PostLilitu, on 03 September 2012 - 06:12 PM, said:

As someone who hasn't yet played a Guardian, I'm interested in what Aodan considers a better build.

Base build
I usually run 4 Ogre / 2 Divinity
(Which is a huge diff between me and OP, the rock dog adds a whole other level of offense to the build)

There are variations I run of this when considering Map in Tournament Rotation, and opposing comps:

-If they run a lot of conditions, then usually I stick to something like this or switch out JI for SoWrath and grab Inscribe Removal instead of Powerful Blades
-If they are running heavy burst/glassy, then I will go 10/30/30 and go a more bursty and less condi removal (usually for FoN/Legion)
-etc

There are also two other builds I run that are more of the High Power/Toughness variety if team comp is going for more Durable. I usually don't run a meditation Guardian for BoK

Edited by Aodan, 03 September 2012 - 06:51 PM.


#29 JaxSilven

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 02:06 AM



new video is up!
my stream keeps crashing while zoning unfortunately so it only recorded one of the games

#30 Beezarre

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 10:15 AM

View PostAodan, on 02 September 2012 - 04:04 AM, said:

Saw them, not impressed. and I mean strong CC as a whole in the comp for Tpvp. Relying on just Signet of Wrath and Chains of Light is decent for one profession, but against competent players one will more than likely be dodged and the wined up time on ZD is pretty back before it actually connects. Sword is still the best burst single target option for the guardian, but against good players, it is avoided more than it actually connects.

The best Burst available atm is a well timed Chains of Light with Smite stack into a ZD followed up by a well timed Shield of Wrath + SC + JI combination (which you would probably need another IMMO to get off). The only utility combination that meets this SC+JI+SigOWrath. Which you only have 1 of those 3.

And I main Guardian for my team and have rung for others.

It's honestly not a personal attack against you, but I would prefer people don't mislead others into believe such poorly crafted builds are a good basis to even begin to be a "guide".

But hey people will follow you, just like Mister Eriko. Just makes my wins easier.

I use sword/focus and scepter/shield too. Identical with Jax. And I use my ZD ONLY when I know the opponent doesnt have opening to evade it. Either he is cornered or cc. It is not like there are no other burst for Guardian other than ZD. There is no cookie cutter build in gw2, only the one that suit the player's playstyle the most. And my playstyle is identical with Jax. So it is not surprise my build is almost identical to his. By saying my build is better than yours in gw2 is absurd and....WoWish.




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