104 replies to this topic

[sanji2k3]

Well, reading all these "this build sucks more than....dunno...britney spears" makes me kind of smile

I tested the Build yesterday for about 2 hours. and honestly...i LOVE it...nuked down 1on1 everything in my way. (biggest moment slaying a hs spamming thief that didtn realise or didnt know the effect of e5. perhaps just a bad example...but i was happy anyway )

Perhaps its just my personal feeling..but i think it has a lot more survivability than the SSS Builds or sth like that.

Indee, not the mobility of a thief, not as tanky as a guardian..but...you know what...thes the reason the profession is called Elementalist

But like you said in your OP....its horrible in tPvP...therefore i will always take my staff

[SuperNova]

I'm glad you liked it.

It has dual survivability with all the earth stuff and the "free" E5 with the focus.  When you think about it that is a big thing, as it is allowing the SoF to remain.  It works because...

1) No big red circle or telegraphed move.  10K damage that is very rarely dodged is something nobody else gets from one ability.

2) Earth 5 on the focus frees up the slot that is normally used on mist form or some other "oh shit" move.  Quite often most people would choose to ditch SoF in favour of that then complain about having no damage.

3) If I'm taking 14000 damage from one 100b then every other elementalist build must be squishy as hell vs even normal hits - way too much.  That might be an issue with the prof that will be fixed but for now I believe that if you are to stand any kind of chance while being focused then you need to be able to survive a couple of heartseekers.

4) Earth and Air 4 (missile deflection/destruction) is 9 seconds of ignoring ranged attacks, the air one being especially good due to the 400 range and 6 seconds.  That's pretty good for yourself but also good support.  Honestly I can't remember the last time I cared about ranged - it's so laughably one-sided in my favour it's basically not fair.  I can literally lock out any single ranged prof for 20 seconds, at which point most of the cooldowns will be back so I can do it again.

[SuperNova]

Isms, on 07 September 2012 - 01:37 AM, said:

I've questioned it too. I'm usually in the middle of the battle with this build, so SoA usually helps with the blind (and especially with the quick activation). It helps with telegraphed skills like eviscerate as well. It really just depends on your preference. The 20s cooldown is nice too.

Yep I've questioned the Water signet in mine, thinking the Air one might be better for the short duration and the AoE, but I don't think the 10% movement is very useful for me, and having the passive cleanse is probably the better idea.  The instant cast is the most attractive thing about the Air one...there's nothing quite as annoying as missing or being obstructed while casting a signet and basically having it lost for another 20 seconds.

[Doomsday Jesus]

I've been rocking this build and it seems to do alot of good in tournaments. Granted I'm pretty new to Elementalists and so I don't know why staff is considered the best for that form of pvp. Maybe just aoes on the point ?  Anyways I play as an almost exclusive support by keeping targets blind/knocked down/ and remove ranged dps from the equation while putting SoF on whatever target is called. Dragon tooth and phoenix does respectable damage to people standing on points.

That being said, I've lost to very few 1v1's  also with this build. In a fresh start duel I'd take this build over alot of other dueling builds in the game. Sadly you don't duel in tournaments, you often get attacked 1v2 or 1v1 and then a heart seeker thief leaps out while your spells are on cooldown. In those situations, even being caught wrong footed this build has performed very well. I give it a +1

[nukularpower]

Just wanted to say thanks for posting this build - it is far more effective than any of the other crap I was trying.  You made me not delete my elementalist.  So ya, thanks!

and note:  The total range denial is one of the reasons I love it.. Air 4 is awesome.  I just wish all the water skills in this setup didn't totally suck.

What would you think about Centuar runes in this build?  You only get a tiny bit of condition damage from the Elementalist runes, and it gives a very large bleed duration and swiftness duration boost.

Edited by nukularpower, 08 September 2012 - 01:59 AM.

[Elker]

I love this build! ty so much for posting it, i was looking for a better way to play my ele

[SuperNova]

nukularpower, on 08 September 2012 - 01:50 AM, said:

What would you think about Centuar runes in this build?  You only get a tiny bit of condition damage from the Elementalist runes, and it gives a very large bleed duration and swiftness duration boost.

Not a bad choice but I feel the elementalist runes just work with everything.  The extra chill duration can be a lifesaver as well.  I tried a few including Undead but I always had the feeling that elementalist was the most well rounded.

[Zandik]

SuperNova, on 06 September 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

(New Build - thanks to politesowter)
http://gw2skills.net...UloKbVuqkVNAZ6B

Funny, I ran this exact same build several days ago, however with a soldier amulet to get even more toughness. Honestly, in the long run I ended up not really liking it. I enjoy being able to play as a roamer and the build just doesn't have the burst to drop people before their teammates show up. Even with toughness, I felt the survivability wasn't as strong as I'd like either and the lack of mistform for 'oh shit' moments and invuln stomping. It was good in theory and perhaps when running with other players, but not ultimately its not for me.

[SuperNova]

Yeah I know what you mean.  It's not bursty and it doesn't feel dynamic, but I feel that it is effective and possibly a bit cheesy.  With everyone else using cheesy builds I don't mind for now.  I've suprised a lot of players of other profs with this actually.

I'm happy to use it until SoF gets nerfed, which I'm sure it will.

[Ramin24]

Here I fixed this build for you. . .

http://gw2skills.net...UloKbVuqkVNWY6B

[SuperNova]

You are possibly correct that the 10 in Water is better than the 10 in Arcane...however there is also the problem that by stacking conditions your opponent might actually be more inclined to go for a fast cleanse which is counter to your wishes.  It's a tough one but I think I'll stay with Arcane for now.

I was running armor of earth at earth 20 but ditched it for elemental shielding.  Again that's a tough one.  In the end you can go too far in defences or too far in offence and end up not doing what you want.  If I was going for more defences I'd probably keep the 3 signets, ditch the 10 in Air and go with 20 Arcane taking Final Shielding.

If I had to take a stunbreaker I'd go with Lightning Flash at 45s cooldown.  I really don't rate Armor of Earth that highly on a 90s cd when Lightning Flash can get you out of the zone where you need stability anyway.

Edited by SuperNova, 09 September 2012 - 02:38 AM.

[kazimbr]

Thanks for the build! As a noob PvPer, I was looking for a starter build just to have some fun, and this is working quite well

[Giamonti]

Never tried a signet build before. I just tried this build in sPvP and a tournament and it actually worked very well. I thought condition builds sucked for ele but it actually does realllly good damage while being somewhat durable. 1v2's are very easy to win with this build. One thing though, you put too much emphasis on Signet of Fire. Yes it does good damage over the long run, but if it gets cleansed then what?

Just saying, let people know to still use the Signet of earth root + Dragtooth+pheonix wombo combo. It still hits for decent damage, and your bleeds are CRAZY stupid with good condition damage. I prefer nightmare over elementalist runes simply because elementalist lacks condition damage/duration and trades that for power, which you dont need for this build.

[SuperNova]

Yeah you're probably right - I just wanted to make people realise the importance of SoF in the build instead of thinking it was optional or it could be removed for something else.  Of course you still need to pull off some decent hits with the other stuff in order to make it work.

Nightmare runes look ok, but losing that 20% chill and fire duration from elementalist looks hard to give up for me.

[Vanillea]

This build is somewhat similar to mine recent experiment. Here is a few thing that you could consider:

This build has great condi dmg but it is not the selling point. Yes, signet of Fire nad Earth 1 is amazing but the dmg potential of the build is not just that. You really have to take advantage of the free Fury and combo potential you got Air 5 and SoE makes fire combo doable whenever phoenix is off CD.

You need more stun breaker. Even if Earth 5 is a free stun-break, it is in 50 s cd and you have no passive stun break. So you should consider at least one in the utility. You don't really need Signet of Water simply because Phoenix and Magnetic Surge are amazing cleans. And since you want  a little mobility to compliment Focus, I would say Lightning Flash is a great choice.

[nukularpower]

I've gotta say that just putting a staff on this build is fun as hell.  Signet of Earth/Water makes Earth 2 amazingly easy to land, and with this build, it does 10k bleed damage ALONE.  That plus Earth 5 (another immobilize) gives another 5kish worth of bleeds, plus 7.5k from fire signet.. those 3 skills are enough to kill someone with no cleanse alone.

Recommend trying it.

Edited by nukularpower, 09 September 2012 - 10:18 PM.

[SuperNova]

nukularpower, on 09 September 2012 - 10:15 PM, said:

I've gotta say that just putting a staff on this build is fun as hell.  Signet of Earth/Water makes Earth 2 amazingly easy to land, and with this build, it does 10k bleed damage ALONE.  That plus Earth 5 (another immobilize) gives another 5kish worth of bleeds, plus 7.5k from fire signet.. those 3 skills are enough to kill someone with no cleanse alone.

Recommend trying it.

I've had a look at something similar in pve but haven't yet tried the staff in pvp.  I really miss the good ranged defences while on the staff and it feels a bit more vulnerable to me.

If I go this way I think I'd be inclined towards earth/water attunements for slows and heals, while still keeping SoF for the extra damage pressure.  I'll give it a go though.

[Rhynox]

Little off topic, in tpvp, does anyone use focus?  It's my favourite part of the ele, the defensive options are just awesome, but all ele's eem to be support or glass cannons.

[drk87]

Rhynox, on 09 September 2012 - 11:36 PM, said:

Little off topic, in tpvp, does anyone use focus?  It's my favourite part of the ele, the defensive options are just awesome, but all ele's eem to be support or glass cannons.

You lose 2 good fire skills for really bad ones, you lose ride the lightning (biggest loss imo) which is good for both offense and defense, also updraft, lose earth knockdown... well really you just lose better skills for worse ones... the invulnerability is nice from earth with focus and so is swirling winds but i don't think focus is even comparable with dagger... has nothing to do with "support or glass"

[Rhynox]

drk87, on 10 September 2012 - 12:20 AM, said:

You lose 2 good fire skills for really bad ones, you lose ride the lightning (biggest loss imo) which is good for both offense and defense, also updraft, lose earth knockdown... well really you just lose better skills for worse ones... the invulnerability is nice from earth with focus and so is swirling winds but i don't think focus is even comparable with dagger... has nothing to do with "support or glass"

I dunno, I think fire's probably straight up better with oh dagger, but the other three are as good if not better imo.  Aoe daze and single target chill from water, aoe range protect and single target knockdown for air, reflect/cure condition and invul from earth.  Dagger has a better fire field and damage, water is pretty much equal, air has more mobility and less control, and earth is damage vs survivability.  I wouldn't say the two aren't even comparable.

[SuperNova]

I think the only real losses are ride the lightning and churning earth and rtl isn't really needed for a 900 range build anyway.  Fire Shield is meh sure but it's not so meh when casting it gives you fury, swiftness and protection.  D/D has poor condition removal and no ranged defences so when you start zapping around the place with rtl you might as well put a target on yourself.  The differences in survivability (and playstyle) is almost enough to make you feel you're playing 2 different profs.

[SuperNova]

Isms, on 06 September 2012 - 08:28 PM, said:

Honestly you're missing out on half of your build's potential. I do run a focus aura build in tournaments and it works very well. You are slightly tanky, but more focused on shutting down potential threats with constant stuns, chills, knockdowns, etc.
http://gw2skills.net...sjYH7Oudk7MMYWC

Your goal here is to stay with your team and keep up perma swiftness, fury, and protection on the group, as well as the benefits from the auras themselves. DPS is not your concern with this build, but more of a byproduct. It's your job to lock down the most potential threats with your chills, and lock down targets with knockdowns and immobilizes. I honestly feel this build is more like a mesmer in GW1 than anything else in this game, as it is a cruel build to play. I'd avoid the scepter at all costs with this build, as the dagger lightning aura stun is too important, and dagger water has too many chills to pass up.

I was testing this in the mists earlier and noticed that Powerful Aura seems to be very random in when it chooses to buff allies.  Standing near people the aura's would sometimes proc on them and sometimes not.  Fire Shield in particular (Focus 5) is pretty bad for just not applying to nearby people.  This is at the same range - neither me nor them moved yet sometimes a particular signet or ability just wouldn't be shared.  You might want to do a bit more testing on it.  The range is so very short that it has dubious worth anyway imo.

Edited by SuperNova, 10 September 2012 - 12:36 PM.

[Thyophelis]

Hi, i ve been trying to use this build for 2 hours now since i realy  wanted a build with glyph of earth. I have to say, it is suboptimal to put it nicely. No healing, no gtfo. focus is just so inferior to dagger, all you get is 2 good defensiv skills. If i could see into the future it might be decent, but to switch into earth for obsidian armor and some blocking, there s rarely much time, when  you get immobalized  and pounded on by warriors and thiefes.  Till you fire your def cooldows you re allready below 50% hp without any good healing to back up. I assume you run arround all the time with earth and switch to fire sometimes to spike someone with the imobalize. The build shows all the elementalists class downsides. It rellys on the stupidity of your opponent and we have to invest so much Attributes and equip for some stayingpower that our dmg drops to the level of a ranger pet.
All you can do is kill some noob without condition removal or assist in a group fight.

To consider anything in this class tanky is just a joke. what you need is some sort off endurance gain to be able to kite, HP and some good heals, beacause you will be immobalized and pounded on by thiefes and warriors.

I have to say i was looking forward to the elementalist from Anet because in GW you could mix some awesome builds together.
what they made out of the elementalist is such a disapointment. It s a freaking mix of 3sec cast or delay pve spells that you are forced to use and anyone with a donkey brain will dodge. Not even the running text dummie falls for it after you knocked him down. And the halfway decent spells have atleast a 20sec cooldown
the only Atunement with decent cooldowns is lightning and we all have to admit, lightning does crap dmg. If you don t agree go check it out on a heavy armor dummie.
I do impressiv 1.5 k crits on them and my equip is +10 to all stats and 2% crit dmg.
ATleast 20% armor penetration would be a step in the right direction.

I don t understand why people keep trying to make arguments that this class is viable.
If you wana do yourself a favor just try any other class and never look back before they do a whole revamp of the spells. You cannot expect to force people to play a pve char in a game that it s supposed focus is competitiv pvp. I m pretty confident that ele s will be the least used class in Tournaments. an elementalist is allways gona be a liability. or he s gona be down several times every match or his dmg is gona be ignorabel. And no i don t consider a class that can pbaoe heal twice for 5k every 30sec a healer. Have you looked at the dmg that is around? People already get spike for 15k in seconds while immobalized.

To miself: I Ve been desperately trying to make the elementalist work. I agree it is a more difficult to play class then some others. It still doesn t achieve what other classes can with alot less effort.
I use a S/D build with 30 in arcane. Not that it would be a world beater, but it offers more mobility, kiting, and extra hp s. DMG is crap, but more reliable, then in this build where you just hope someone doesn t remove your bleeds and burning. And yea maybee there s good dmg in a D/D build, but no way in hell you get me to be in melee range all the time and just ask to be destroyed.

[SuperNova]

Thyophelis, on 10 September 2012 - 01:13 PM, said:

Hi, i ve been trying to use this build for 2 hours now since i realy  wanted a build with glyph of earth. I have to say, it is suboptimal to put it nicely. No healing, no gtfo. focus is just so inferior to dagger, all you get is 2 good defensiv skills.

Ok lets see.

Fire 4 has a combo Field, Fire 5 is passive damage reflection not unlike retaliation (in this case it also give you fury and swiftness for 5 seconds and protection for 3s)

Water 4 has a 3 1/2 seconds chill, Water 5 has a 2 second aoe daze.

Air 4 has a 6 seconds projectile destroyer over 400 range, Air 5 has a 2 second knockdown.

Earth 4 has a 3 seconds projectile reflection while removing 3 conditions, Earth 5 has a 4 second invulnerability.

I'm pretty sure you're getting a lot more than "2 good defensive skills".  What's so good about o/h dagger?

Quote

If i could see into the future it might be decent, but to switch into earth for obsidian armor and some blocking, there s rarely much time, when  you get immobalized  and pounded on by warriors and thiefes.  Till you fire your def cooldows you re allready below 50% hp without any good healing to back up. I assume you run arround all the time with earth and switch to fire sometimes to spike someone with the imobalize. The build shows all the elementalists class downsides. It rellys on the stupidity of your opponent and we have to invest so much Attributes and equip for some stayingpower that our dmg drops to the level of a ranger pet.
All you can do is kill some noob without condition removal or assist in a group fight.

You can't do damage when you're dead.  Offhand dagger lacks any kind of decent ranged defence and has poor condition removal - that's why people have to dip into water or start using slots to do that job.

Quote

To consider anything in this class tanky is just a joke. what you need is some sort off endurance gain to be able to kite, HP and some good heals, beacause you will be immobalized and pounded on by thiefes and warriors.

You mean like vigor from phoenix?  Or swiftness on demand?  Or healing constantly due to Signet of Restoration?  Are you sure you tried it out?

Quote

I don t understand why people keep trying to make arguments that this class is viable.
If you wana do yourself a favor just try any other class and never look back before they do a whole revamp of the spells.

If you're expecting a complete class overhaul you aren't going to get it.

Quote

I use a S/D build with 30 in arcane. Not that it would be a world beater, but it offers more mobility, kiting, and extra hp s. DMG is crap, but more reliable, then in this build where you just hope someone doesn t remove your bleeds and burning. And yea maybee there s good dmg in a D/D build, but no way in hell you get me to be in melee range all the time and just ask to be destroyed.

So you're running S/D but don't want to be in melee range.  What is the dagger offhand for?

Edited by SuperNova, 10 September 2012 - 01:43 PM.

[Thyophelis]

Fire 4 has a combo Field, Fire 5 is passive damage reflection not unlike retaliation (in this case it also give you fury and swiftness for 5 seconds and protection for 3s)

I have to admit i haven t worked with combofields that much, so i cannot comment if it makes fire 4 any decent.
Fire 5 ist just horrible, ok you can buff yourself every 40sec and for amazing 3sec you cause 1 sec burning. common ...i want to cry when i read this spell.
... ok so we get swiftness once more, hurra, it s like we don t get it from another source. certainly fury is cool but tell me with what spell are you gona smash them? with a 1.5k crit from lightning? or a great dragon tooth that will be dodged if your opponent s got half a brain?

The rest is not so bad i admit, but there s no dmg in it, chill, knock back (if it lands) and daze are certainly nice tools but still you re still relying on 2 conditions + 1 fire spike to kill your oponnent? In the mean time you have a 4 sec imunity and maybe 3-4 dodge rolls to keep you safe from melee?

The protection you get from projectiles is certainly nice, but i have to say the ratio that i ve been killed by an engi or ranger, let alone ele is like 1 to 10 by what i get killed by guardians, warriors and thiefes.

dagger provides you with 2 gtfo spells in air and a pbao knockdown in earth, the fire 5 is about the best dmg you can get as an ele, water provides you with a 5k heal and chill shield that lets you gain distance combined with air. I may not be able to down someone but I certainly wona have a shimmer of hope to get away if i get jumped by 2 classes.

getting into melee is basicly unavoidable at the curent state with 40% of the people running warriors and thiefes and there is a good reason for that. Actually i think it s designed that way, look at the range of dagger specc. They expect you to go into melee but naked.

signetof rejuvenation is awesome (not as good as in gw1 but o well) if you go 30 in earth absolutely awesome. the swiftness you re talking about you get anyways by swaping to air on a regular basis, so i don t see that as a great +
phoenix is certainly a awesome spell, but self explaining on a 20 sec timer.

If you're expecting a complete class overhaul you aren't going to get it.

actualy that s what i would wish for, but there s certainly not gona be a such thing. What i hope for is that they will look at is the current state of armor and the difference of hitpoints from the different classes. Warriors and specially guardians survivability is way over the top. I actually wonder, do eles have a higher base Power then other classes? or do we get nothing for beeing cannon fodder?

and i certainly hope they remove 3 sec cast / delay spells from the game, or give us access to some Haste for faster casting.

I am sorry I don t wanna put your build down. I just need to get some steam of at the frustration that it is to play as an ele. I remember in GW1 Beta where i would run with a 2h Hammer and a lightning specc and could go toe to toe with warriors. The removing of the trinity was wakening hopes, that we could swap to earth and tank something. But obviously that didn t happen.

Edited by Thyophelis, 10 September 2012 - 04:10 PM.

[BorzE]

I notice your using swap sigils in your weapons.  How does this work for an ele?

Edited by BorzE, 10 September 2012 - 06:43 PM.

[khelben]

Thanks a lot for this. I've been having quite some fun with it in random sPvP games.

But is this build viable for WvWvW? Is losing the long range attacks from staffs a huge loss?

Thanks!

[Bearmallet]

BorzE, on 10 September 2012 - 06:42 PM, said:

I notice your using swap sigils in your weapons.  How does this work for an ele?

When we switch attunements it triggers the sigils.  Some aspects of this game aren't as transparent as others. Like I didn't imagine I could use both my Elite summon and my lesser summon at the same time, blew my mind. Is it viable? I dunno, but I have two water elementals now and I'm loving it.

[Isms]

SuperNova, on 10 September 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

I was testing this in the mists earlier and noticed that Powerful Aura seems to be very random in when it chooses to buff allies.  Standing near people the aura's would sometimes proc on them and sometimes not.  Fire Shield in particular (Focus 5) is pretty bad for just not applying to nearby people.  This is at the same range - neither me nor them moved yet sometimes a particular signet or ability just wouldn't be shared.  You might want to do a bit more testing on it.  The range is so very short that it has dubious worth anyway imo.

I've noticed the lack of the fire shield, but the game has a built in mechanic that reduces the amount of special effects on your screen at once, and I assume that this is it.

[Zehkari]

Tried it and liked it.

My only concern is from using signet of fire for PvE and PvP I have noticed the range on it is pretty poor, when the tooltip points out 1200 range, which is exactly the same as signet of earth the two are completely different on range. Can anyone confirm that signet of fire range is a tooltip error or the range is actually bugged?

Edited by Zehkari, 11 September 2012 - 07:40 PM.