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[Mesmer] Oppa Burst Style - Guide

spvp pvp mesmer burst damage dps mind wrack cof phantasms

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#1 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 09:02 AM

Sooo I was kind of boored of Phantasm play, but I also realise that its the strongest choice atm.
So I came up with this build that doesnt sacrifice Phantasm damage, at the same time lets me actually use abilities and deal some damage myself....

I present to you "What Happend tomyface111!!1!_?!O_O" build
http://gw2skills.net...ckOtsY8xhg9HPCA

This BUILD is Not for people that are new to Mesmers. This build is meant for mostly melee in your face* type of play.

Yes its all in Critical/Power build...
You might want to swap Mirror for Nullfield if you are oh so very fond of it. (this build is more about Melting face thought so be a man... :devil: )

PROS:
*Nice damage (pretty numbers and things go BOOM)
*As long as you play perfectly you will dominate

CONS:
*No toughness is a bitch :D (this is somewhat a Pro for me as it makes me play really well and react to everything fast)


ROTATIONS:

Standart rotation goes something like:
Mirror, Sword3, Sword3, Sword2/Mind Wrack, change to Staff, evade, staff2, evade, CoF.
Then pretty much your standart Mesmer play, I like to Decoy early in the fight to * around with them... I still have blink to escape.....

Just put down Chaos Field, PWarlock, Swap to Swords, PSwordsman, sword3, sword3, sword2. And dont forget to run after them and stick that sword1 in their face and watch it melt to some nice Crit Damage.


Mirror on CD rotation:
Start with staff3, staff5, staff2, swap to swords, sword3, sword3, sword2/Mind Wrack, evade, evade, CoF, sword5, swap to staff, staff3.....
Again I like to go Decoy here to get them confused. Put down chaos field, phantasm and swap to swords ASAP for some sweet assrape with sword2/sword1.

How the build is meant to be played:
1v1
Pretty straight forward, blow them up real fast. (you can refer to the rotations for this)

1v2
This is where Moa Bird should be used 50% of the time. Open on the squishiest guy with standard 1v1 rush em shatter em phantasm their ass play.
Throw Moa on the Tankiest guy when and if he gets annoying. (basically use your judgement)
Also its pretty risky to finish off lying opponents in 1v2+ (this is mainly due to lack of toughness on the build), so just run around evading shit and hang phantasms on the lying opponent. From time to time run up to them and sword2 for extra damage.
If their retarded friend is picking them up run up to both of them and just sword2, sword1+++ both of them at the same time.
Shatter if they manage to get the other guy up and rephantom the squishy.
This happens sometimes, most of the time you will just down both of them after they got their friend up....

Note about Moa:
Thieves can be killed much easier with Moa, so If you are fighting Thief+Guardian its easier to just Moa the thief and ignore the Guardian, their skills are very predictable and easy to dodge.


Group Fights:

Only go in for the Shatter/sword2 combo then get out (depends quite a bit on the situation, sometimes I run around in blob swinging my sword. Most of the time I hang PSwordsman and go staff for range). Try to choose a priority target that you know you can down fast: thieves, elementalists, mesmers.
If someone is targeting you, commence 1v1 on his ass.
Be a little bit more carefull with CDs on Blink and Decoy in group fights. Sometimes things can turn for the worst in seconds and you need to haul ass real fast or get owned.

Opinions very welcome

Due to some very good points from EasymodeX, I came up with a new Build:
WARNING: ONLY USE THIS IF YOU ARE BATSHIT CRAZY!
http://gw2skills.net...ckOtsY8xhg9HPCA

With the added Trait Illusionary Persona you gain anytime anywhere Shatters, which Is pretty IMBA. As long as they are off CD that is.
You do loose a hefty amount of Illusion damage 15%....

Edited by Miss Sukha, 12 September 2012 - 07:15 AM.


#2 Suresh

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 11:58 AM

Tried it, it was effective and definitely did deal some damage, although I do prefer a scepter/sword instead of a staff. Effective build though.

#3 tufy

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 12:30 PM

I was running with something similar for a short while, but found the build to be extremely weak to good kiters - unless you sacrifice Empowered Illusions for Crippling Dissipations, you'll have a hard time catching up. That's one of the reasons I went for 20 Inspiration and Warden's Feedback. Bonus point - if you can get them controlled under the iWarden AND Blurred Frenzy... :devil:

#4 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 12:56 PM

View Posttufy, on 10 September 2012 - 12:30 PM, said:

I was running with something similar for a short while, but found the build to be extremely weak to good kiters - unless you sacrifice Empowered Illusions for Crippling Dissipations, you'll have a hard time catching up. That's one of the reasons I went for 20 Inspiration and Warden's Feedback. Bonus point - if you can get them controlled under the iWarden AND Blurred Frenzy... :devil:

Don't see this as a problem, as long as you are confident in your ability you can use blink offensively then overwhelm him with two shatters and let the phantasms finish the job while you stealth around like an asstwat.
with 20% off sword CDs that sword3 is off cooldown very often.

Mirror can be swapped with stun too....

Edited by Miss Sukha, 10 September 2012 - 01:01 PM.


#5 Jordyloo

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 02:12 PM

Would suggest swapping pistol offhand for sword for several reasons:
1) Burst much higher.
2) Phantasmal duelist > Phantasmal Swordsman because:
a) Ranged
B) Bug where ranged attacks lock on to stealthed targets. (This helps with tracking stealthed thiefs, combined with your cloak or Blurred Frenzy #1 counter to Stealthed Heartseeker spamming thieves. It's an instakill if you have 2 duelists and blurred frenzy on a thief w/ high crit+power)
c) Stacks bleed (@ 55% crit chacne you might not need the "Phantasms gain fury" but adding it will really load on alot more bleeds onto target)
d) Easy Stomps vs Mesmer, Elementalist and Thieves (Mesmers have a random teleporter that may teleport them behind walls or down/up platforms. While contestinga  cap it is not wise to delay cap to stomp them. If you have a duelist on them it will chase them downa nd keep pewpew-ing. The duelist also helps locate stealhers while they are downed.
e) PISTOL OFF HAND OP
3) Blocks right now not implemented to much perfection (not sure about you guys but after weeks of pure pvp I for one still can't easily recognize other classes skills from preanimation. Until i can blocks aren't really worth it yet
4) Pistol 5 combo very effective in team fights and also 1v1. Starting off witha  guaranteed 5 hit will also allow you to hit your phantasm duelist, 3->3 swap stun and blurred frenzy. For extra burst you can doa  mind wreck or have 3 seconds of distortion if you are losing in the exchange (only due to conditions as that is the only source of damage while in distortion phase) . Swapping to staff will allow you to chaos armor and retreat effectively

#6 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 03:00 PM

View PostJordyloo, on 10 September 2012 - 02:12 PM, said:

Would suggest swapping pistol offhand for sword for several reasons:
1) Burst much higher.
2) Phantasmal duelist > Phantasmal Swordsman because:
a) Ranged
B) Bug where ranged attacks lock on to stealthed targets. (This helps with tracking stealthed thiefs, combined with your cloak or Blurred Frenzy #1 counter to Stealthed Heartseeker spamming thieves. It's an instakill if you have 2 duelists and blurred frenzy on a thief w/ high crit+power)
c) Stacks bleed (@ 55% crit chacne you might not need the "Phantasms gain fury" but adding it will really load on alot more bleeds onto target)
d) Easy Stomps vs Mesmer, Elementalist and Thieves (Mesmers have a random teleporter that may teleport them behind walls or down/up platforms. While contestinga  cap it is not wise to delay cap to stomp them. If you have a duelist on them it will chase them downa nd keep pewpew-ing. The duelist also helps locate stealhers while they are downed.
e) PISTOL OFF HAND OP
3) Blocks right now not implemented to much perfection (not sure about you guys but after weeks of pure pvp I for one still can't easily recognize other classes skills from preanimation. Until i can blocks aren't really worth it yet
4) Pistol 5 combo very effective in team fights and also 1v1. Starting off witha  guaranteed 5 hit will also allow you to hit your phantasm duelist, 3->3 swap stun and blurred frenzy. For extra burst you can doa  mind wreck or have 3 seconds of distortion if you are losing in the exchange (only due to conditions as that is the only source of damage while in distortion phase) . Swapping to staff will allow you to chaos armor and retreat effectively

Did a testdummy check, Pduelist crits for around 2.5k Pswordsman for 3.5k and swordsman attacks every 4 seconds....... yes against thieves sometimes you can cast Duelist before they go stealth and duelist will Burst their load into Thieves butthole, but overall damage  wise PSwordsman does loads more.
Magic bullet is really cool yes, Riposte does 3K damage on Crits though and creates another illusion for you to shatter.... so it sort of goes better with the build.

Pistol is always a viable choice the skills on it are very solid.

#7 EasymodeX

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 03:38 PM

View PostMiss Sukha, on 10 September 2012 - 09:02 AM, said:

Sooo I was kind of boored of Phantasm play, but I also realise that its the strongest choice atm.
So I came up with this build that doesnt sacrifice Phantasm damage, at the same time lets me actually use abilities and deal some damage myself....

I present to you "What Happend tomyface111!!1!_?!O_O" build
http://gw2skills.net...ckOtsY8xhg9HPCA

Not bad.  Somewhat close in concept to my original burst shatter build.  My comments:

1.  You're over-investing into Dueling.  Personally I wouldn't take the stealth at 25% trait in this build.

2.  If Shatter is a significant piece of the build, 30 points into Illusions is very attractive for Illusory Persona, on top of the 30% cooldown reduction.  You would have to sacrifice the 10 points in Inspiration.  Personally, this is what I would do, but I would offset that by using Divinity runes (or Adventurer).

Quote

Magic bullet is really cool yes, Riposte does 3K damage on Crits though and creates another illusion for you to shatter.... so it sort of goes better with the build.

Riposte can also straight Daze at 900 range or w/e it is, which is 90% as good as Magic Bullet.

Edited by EasymodeX, 10 September 2012 - 03:39 PM.


#8 Jordyloo

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 03:52 PM

View PostMiss Sukha, on 10 September 2012 - 03:00 PM, said:

Did a testdummy check, Pduelist crits for around 2.5k Pswordsman for 3.5k and swordsman attacks every 4 seconds....... yes against thieves sometimes you can cast Duelist before they go stealth and duelist will Burst their load into Thieves butthole, but overall damage  wise PSwordsman does loads more.
Magic bullet is really cool yes, Riposte does 3K damage on Crits though and creates another illusion for you to shatter.... so it sort of goes better with the build.

Pistol is always a viable choice the skills on it are very solid.

hmm never knew that, might try dual sword build then. But is it 1 attack or multiple attacks? Because I am running a phantasm fury build with bleed stack on crit. I am stacking ard 5-6 bleeds all the time on them for 1k+ dmg power build though making up for dmg difference :P.

View PostEasymodeX, on 10 September 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:


Riposte can also straight Daze at 900 range or w/e it is, which is 90% as good as Magic Bullet.

Prefer Stun > Daze on first target because they can't move :)

#9 Jordyloo

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:04 PM

suggestions might be knights amulet + berserkers jewel as that's always strong combo w/ <2000 armor.

View PostEasymodeX, on 10 September 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:


1.  You're over-investing into Dueling.  Personally I wouldn't take the stealth at 25% trait in this build.

2.  If Shatter is a significant piece of the build, 30 points into Illusions is very attractive for Illusory Persona, on top of the 30% cooldown reduction.  You would have to sacrifice the 10 points in Inspiration.  Personally, this is what I would do, but I would offset that by using Divinity runes (or Adventurer).


Agree with this comment. Would go divinity or scholar with most burst build. And probably invest the stealth at 25% on something more important. Might also invest the "Removes conditions on heals" for somethign better. It's probably worth swapping out mirror images for a more dedicated condition remover such as Phantasmal Disenchanter/Null field (probably phantasmal disenchanter since you get the 20% cooldown reduction on illusions) Maybe the 20points you save here could go into Illusory Persona. the other 10 points going into either 10% crit chance on mind wrack to compliment the 20% dmg increase or +3% dmg/ illusion.

#10 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:06 PM

View PostEasymodeX, on 10 September 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:

Not bad.  Somewhat close in concept to my original burst shatter build.  My comments:

1.  You're over-investing into Dueling.  Personally I wouldn't take the stealth at 25% trait in this build.

2.  If Shatter is a significant piece of the build, 30 points into Illusions is very attractive for Illusory Persona, on top of the 30% cooldown reduction.  You would have to sacrifice the 10 points in Inspiration.  Personally, this is what I would do, but I would offset that by using Divinity runes (or Adventurer).



Riposte can also straight Daze at 900 range or w/e it is, which is 90% as good as Magic Bullet.

It might be viable, but that crit from Dueling applies to your phantasms as well. And at 53% crit damage increase, crit% becomes very powerful which adds damage to all your abbilities. So you win 1 extra shatter, at the same time you loose damage on all your other abilities and phantasms....
Just seems counterproductive to me.

I also love that 25% health stealth, allows you to use Decoy more freely.

#11 EasymodeX

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:07 PM

View PostJordyloo, on 10 September 2012 - 03:52 PM, said:

hmm never knew that, might try dual sword build then. But is it 1 attack or multiple attacks? Because I am running a phantasm fury build with bleed stack on crit. I am stacking ard 5-6 bleeds all the time on them for 1k+ dmg power build though making up for dmg difference :P.

If you have a pure power build, the iSwordsman is still stronger for damage.  For a condition build, iDuelist is stronger with the bleeds

#12 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:21 PM

People need to understand that this is more of a Thief like build: Get in, rape face get out. You are not supposed to be standing there stacking Necro conditions on yourself.
With all the flipping around, blinking, phasing out with sword2 and stealthing I rarelly get so many conditions on me.
I rarely even get hit with anything significant at all.

This is high skill build, you need to feel out your opponent and know when you can pursue him and just burn him down with phantasms and sword1 or when you need to staff5,2,3,stealth and start phantasm play.

#13 EasymodeX

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:24 PM

Quote

It might be viable, but that crit from Dueling applies to your phantasms as well. And at 53% crit damage increase, crit% becomes very powerful which adds damage to all your abbilities. So you win 1 extra shatter, at the same time you loose damage on all your other abilities and phantasms....
Just seems counterproductive to me.

The tradeoff is:

- 10% crit damage
- confusion on illusion death
- some HP

For:

- 20% cooldown reduction on Shatters
- Confusion on Shatter
- Might on Shatter
- 10% crit rate on Mind Wrack, or another t2 trait of your choice
- +1 Shatter (+33% Mind Wrack damage)
- The ability to use Shatters with no illusions, e.g. free daze and distortion


It comes down to playstyle -- both variants will do par damage for a burst pew pew sequence.  The question is later on in the fight with your original version build more damage with more Phantasms up, or the 30 Illusion version with more utility (Daze/Distortion on demand, AOE Shatters, shorter cd Shatters).

View PostMiss Sukha, on 10 September 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

With all the flipping around, blinking, phasing out with sword2 and stealthing I rarelly get so many conditions on me.
I rarely even get hit with anything significant at all.

Which is why 10 points in Inspiration seems irrelevant to the build.

#14 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:33 PM

View PostEasymodeX, on 10 September 2012 - 04:24 PM, said:

The tradeoff is:

- 10% crit damage
- confusion on illusion death
- some HP

For:

- 20% cooldown reduction on Shatters
- Confusion on Shatter
- Might on Shatter
- 10% crit rate on Mind Wrack, or another t2 trait of your choice
- +1 Shatter (+33% Mind Wrack damage)
- The ability to use Shatters with no illusions, e.g. free daze and distortion


It comes down to playstyle -- both variants will do par damage for a burst pew pew sequence.  The question is later on in the fight with your original version build more damage with more Phantasms up, or the 30 Illusion version with more utility (Daze/Distortion on demand, AOE Shatters, shorter cd Shatters).



Which is why 10 points in Inspiration seems irrelevant to the build.

You have a solid case there. A lot of the time though one needs to rely on Phantasms for damage, and I almost never find myself with Phantasms on CD. Having more than 2 is not very productive either since you will overwrite the 3rd like a second after u got him.

#15 EasymodeX

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:39 PM

Thought you were Shattering them for burst?  ;).

But as I said, definitely playstyle-dependent.  If you approach the build from a "phantasm heavy, burst shatter sometimes" perspective, then that structure makes more sense . If you approach it from a "shatter all the time, cool off with phantasms" perspective, then the 30 points in Illusions would be stronger.

#16 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:54 PM

View PostEasymodeX, on 10 September 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

Thought you were Shattering them for burst?  ;).

But as I said, definitely playstyle-dependent.  If you approach the build from a "phantasm heavy, burst shatter sometimes" perspective, then that structure makes more sense . If you approach it from a "shatter all the time, cool off with phantasms" perspective, then the 30 points in Illusions would be stronger.

I do shatter all the time, but there comes a point when you just have to go * and hide behind walls while your Pswordsman owns ass.

#17 EasymodeX

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:56 PM

Yeah but it depends which one you are doing as your primary mode versus secondary mode.

#18 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 05:11 PM

View PostEasymodeX, on 10 September 2012 - 04:56 PM, said:

Yeah but it depends which one you are doing as your primary mode versus secondary mode.

It allows for flexibility, you cannot always run into NecroSoup Nullfield Chaos Storm Engiemines and just blow shit up........

#19 Jordyloo

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 05:14 PM

View PostMiss Sukha, on 10 September 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

People need to understand that this is more of a Thief like build: Get in, rape face get out. You are not supposed to be standing there stacking Necro conditions on yourself.
With all the flipping around, blinking, phasing out with sword2 and stealthing I rarelly get so many conditions on me.
I rarely even get hit with anything significant at all.

This is high skill build, you need to feel out your opponent and know when you can pursue him and just burn him down with phantasms and sword1 or when you need to staff5,2,3,stealth and start phantasm play.

Stealth doesn't stop WoC condition stacking or short boy conditions cus they still shoot towards you regardless of stealth. Not sure about Necros though. But if it's ranged it will probably stack on you as well

#20 Miss Sukha

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 06:23 PM

From respect to EasymodeX oppinions I came up with a new build, I am going to try it now ASAP.
http://gw2skills.net...ckOtsY8xhg9HPCA

Edited by Miss Sukha, 10 September 2012 - 06:27 PM.


#21 RandolfRa

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 12:39 AM

Seems decent. Though I would maybe, just maybe swap staff for great sword. Iberserker strikes so very nicely and has a fine range. In fact, some targets are below 50% just after #4, #2 and #3 of gs.  And besides, that peacemaker gs feels so much more manly than any staff.

Edited by RandolfRa, 11 September 2012 - 12:41 AM.


#22 Kuwabara

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 01:33 AM

wow thread name jacked huehueheuehue. Good job though I like.
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#23 Miss Sukha

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 05:03 AM

View PostRandolfRa, on 11 September 2012 - 12:39 AM, said:

Seems decent. Though I would maybe, just maybe swap staff for great sword. Iberserker strikes so very nicely and has a fine range. In fact, some targets are below 50% just after #4, #2 and #3 of gs.  And besides, that peacemaker gs feels so much more manly than any staff.
second build might be used with GS if you change 10% MW crit for extra Bounce I suppose, I personally find GS very lacking in all aspects but the nr5 skill... PWarlock does way more damage than PBerserker.

View PostKuwabara, on 11 September 2012 - 01:33 AM, said:

wow thread name jacked huehueheuehue. Good job though I like.
Thx bruh, you inspired me to make this Guide xD

#24 tufy

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 06:02 AM

View PostMiss Sukha, on 10 September 2012 - 12:56 PM, said:

Don't see this as a problem, as long as you are confident in your ability you can use blink offensively then overwhelm him with two shatters and let the phantasms finish the job while you stealth around like an asstwat.
with 20% off sword CDs that sword3 is off cooldown very often.

Mirror can be swapped with stun too....



True, it's just that I like to have redundancies to my redundancies so I always have something to fall back to. Still, I might give it another go, though I still think the Warden's dps output on a controlled target, coupled with Blurred Frenzy is unmatched.

Still, I'm not saying the build is bad, far from it - in fact, were I looking for a 1v1, dual swords with decent shatters and lots of stealth sound just right.

#25 Strumfeta

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:08 AM

any build without high tougness suck badly for spvp

#26 tufy

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 06:02 AM

Miss Sukha, I have to take it all back.

I've recently updated my main blade to exotic version, so I had two swords to play again and decided to run a few double bladed builds for a little damage comparison. I was surprised at how much of a difference that small increase in damage can make - stuff that would previously hurt would now melt away with the exact same build.

This made me go back to your traits and try them out again - I can now honestly say that it's pro, absolutely a blast to play. I'll take it to WvW and a few dungeon runs to see how it performs - I suspect I'll be a bit too glass cannony and a little low on support, but so far, it seems to melt things just as fast as warriors do.

#27 Miss Sukha

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 06:42 AM

View Posttufy, on 12 September 2012 - 06:02 AM, said:

Miss Sukha, I have to take it all back.

I've recently updated my main blade to exotic version, so I had two swords to play again and decided to run a few double bladed builds for a little damage comparison. I was surprised at how much of a difference that small increase in damage can make - stuff that would previously hurt would now melt away with the exact same build.

This made me go back to your traits and try them out again - I can now honestly say that it's pro, absolutely a blast to play. I'll take it to WvW and a few dungeon runs to see how it performs - I suspect I'll be a bit too glass cannony and a little low on support, but so far, it seems to melt things just as fast as warriors do.

Oh please, I am blushing ^_^

#28 Falhawk

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 10:49 AM

I tried a similar build and it is pure fun from a spvp perspective. I dumped mirror images for null field in order to get some group condition removal and a combo field for chaos storm. With Deceptive evasion I have no issues with pumping out clones really fast (though it adds a bit more ramp up time than mirror images). I have two Krait runes for a minor increase in bleed and confusion damage (for Sharper images, confusion on death and confusion on all shatters).

This is the build: http://gw2skills.net...qowxgjAHrPOck A

I am not sure whether to go with greatsword (with the new changes!) or staff for secondary weapon. Mind stab may be usable now to bump up burst, since the speed has been increased quite a bit. I would still have access to chaos armor with leap and null field, though I would miss chaos storm. Also, iBeserker would apply bleeds faster than warlock. Whats your thoughts on staff over greatsword?

#29 tufy

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 12:24 PM

I will try a greatsword today for the changes, but I use staff mainly as a defensive / utility tool to my sword setup. Since greatsword is more of an offensive weapon, chances are I'll still prefer staff.

#30 Cofaen

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 03:53 AM

I'll try some of this on a Sword & Pistol | Sword & Focus. Any thoughts?
GS | Sword & Sword is more fun!

Edited by Cofaen, 16 September 2012 - 10:19 PM.






Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: spvp, pvp, mesmer, burst, damage, dps, mind wrack, cof, phantasms

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