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Warrior, outclassed in every way


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#1 renroval

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:23 AM

Warriors don't have anything to offer the group in spvp. They are easily kited, lack damage because they need to stack defense, least condition removal and lack mobility.

There's nothing a warrior can do that other classes can do better.

Roamer? Thieves or elementalists do better

Damage? Thieves or mesmers or any other class can do better while being able to dodge/evade damage and mitigate them as well as warriors

Want to hold the fort? Guardians do that best. Warriors are half as effective.

AoE? Yeah, don't bother with guardians.

Control? Elementalists

There's nothing warriors can offer in spvp that other classes can do better. Really no point in bringing them. I think people are going to realize this very soon and all those "OMG WARRIORS ARE OP" threads will turn to wanting a buff if we haven't already been nerfed by noobs screaming nerfs cause of 100HB (which is the easiest thing to counter in pvp).

#2 LOCOMOFO

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:36 AM

View Postrenroval, on 13 September 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

I think people are going to realize this very soon and all those "OMG WARRIORS ARE OP" threads will turn to wanting a buff if we haven't already been nerfed by noobs screaming nerfs cause of 100HB (which is the easiest thing to counter in pvp).

As long as there are people that can't dodge 100B, those threads will never end.

It's funny, I went to the warrior sub forum on the official GW2 forums today and you know what thread was right at the top with the 2nd most posts?  That's right, you guessed it!  "In my opinion, the warrior needs a nerf."

I clicked thinking, must be a troll thread.  Unfortunately, nope!

#3 Lailendil

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:04 AM

I am sure ANet will react. I can only imagine they are too busy managing account/server issues atm. Should they do any adjustments to professions/skills, that needs time so that they don't end up nerfing/boosting things every two days.

They have always been responsive in GW1, so we need to be a bit patient I guess!

#4 Frigzy

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:33 AM

View Postrenroval, on 13 September 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

Control? Elementalists
I can control single targets way better with my warrior than any other class can.

Oh and by the way, I'm tanky AND I do damage...

#5 geala

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:32 AM

I think Warrior is the weakest profession in the game. There is really a better class for every single aspect except for control (don't think Eles are better, just as good). However Warriors can combine some aspects easier than some other classes. They can offer a more or less balanced build with mediocre damage, defense, control and support. Perhaps that's their reason for being in. The question is, do you need such a class in a competitive group?

#6 Thanatar

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:14 AM

I kinda feel the same, from a WvW point of view. Our potential for control is neglible in big fights (like 10+ people) and damagewise we are just outclassed in so many ways. Not sure if I rolled the right profession for me. :(

#7 Lunacy Polish

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:32 AM

I don't think it's the profession, per se, in the WvW situation.  To make a long rant of mine very short, the game does things to encourage people to stand 1200 units apart and pew pew at each other, and it is human nature to zerg, that's not the game's fault.  So you have zergs pew pewing at distance.

"We" were clearly designed for various degrees of damage and control at short ranges, it is the intended niche, which is absolutely worthless in that scenario.  It's not all we do (any profession can do multiple things even if it's not what the bulk of the profession's skills are about), but it's our strong suit so the current WvW situation kind of gimps warrior; human nature defeats the intended design sometimes imho.  The profession has a similar problem in PvE, and it's not just warriors who are suffering from this behavior.

The best you could do would be to break off into a smaller group and roam or attack less traveled points on the map.

In sPvP I have no comment beyond I feel like a lot of the paradigms change and I could go on for pages.

#8 Thanatar

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:45 AM

Thank you for your insight on this topic. I am usually roaming with a "smaller" group of people, capturing everything we get our hands on. My problem is: I don't fall very fast in bigger fights, since I am good equipped and traited for defense and control. I just feel, that classes like thiefs deal significantly more damage while having good mechanics to a) support the group and B) survive on their owns. I am just having a hard time of doing something useful besides stunning and doing bad damage. Kinda bothers me. :-/

#9 TheHanzou

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:03 PM

Well, i stopped playing my warrior completely and switched to Ranger. Warrior is just so underwhelming compared to any other class. From the tournaments i played today, i did not see a single warrior. All you see is Thiefs,Mesmers,Guardians,Engineers. Other 4 classes, almost never.

Our Utility skills are basically all absolute garbage, especially compared to what all the other classes have, exept for bull charge. No escape, no survivability. Every other utility skill is garbage. Compare the shit we have to Thiefs, Mesmers. AoE Stealth fields? AoE Debuff+Buff fields? WTF really. And we get? A KICK LOL (that actually does no damage at all, Kick on a warrior is so situational that the skill should deal at least 10x the damage it does atm).

Banners are bad, shouts are bad unless you go full support shout heal spec with soldier. Thats about the only thing a warrior can do.

Basically u have 2 options atm, all underwhelming:

Hammer/Shield Stunbot Support shouts . Probably the best spec left, A shame all were good for is support, didnt pick warrior to support.
GS Roamer. Completely outperformed by any other roamer, worst choice we have atm.

So yeah, anything else, someone else does worlds better. What do you pick a warrior for that you arent better of picking another profession?

Edited by TheHanzou, 13 September 2012 - 01:22 PM.


#10 Benkays

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:14 PM

In WvW, I usually run this extreme mobility build...

http://gw2skills.net...UEQEpUMXdJFixGA

Basically, my job is to chase people and immobilize foes while my allies dps them. Or if being chased, my job is to cover my allies while taking hits and get out of the heat wiith my mobility.

Chaser role : You have the warhorn's swiftness. Add to that Whirlwing attack + Rush + Bull's Charge + Throw bolas (more thatn 5s of immobilize) range and you can basically close any gap. All your cripples immobilize for 1s ( which can be good to "fake immobilize" before throwing bolas) and they're ranged. All your skills are on pretty low CD ( except fear me). So you can rinse and repeat a lot...

While being chased : If you are chased. You can't be immobilized because of mobile strikes. Add to that, the glorious warhorn... and basically you can rip off a lot of conditions applied to your buddies and give them swiftness.
My tactic is to be on the front line, so I can take a couple of hits, then get the hell out of there in 2, 3 skills, while applying swiftness to my allies.
Fear me is there so you can save a buddy or yourself from being ganked. I chose this over a break stun because I think that it offers more in a zerging situation.
Banner synergizes well with "Fear me" in case a buddy is down... Fear me then banner, spam warhorn then get in the fort...

Weaknesses :
I don't know if I deal much damage... sometimes I do, sometimes I don't... maybe it's stuff related, my stuff is not great ( mostly blue and yellows, and crappy jewelry, no runes).

Nearby Objectives, you aren't very active... While attacking, I usually try to stop foes to join their tower or fortress. Again, you have 3 immobilizes ( one being very looong ), a kd, and a fear. Otherwise, I HB the gates...

While defending. I switch to GS/Bow. HB the door, then switch to bow, arcing arrow, combustive shot. Getting out of combat, coming back, repeat.

Spvp : I don't bother anymore...It's 8v8 so that may be why... but I didn't find any build that I find enjoyable in the actual "meta". I love playing melee and it's too difficult to me I think... too much clutter, lot of stealthed people and/or pets everywhere. It's just plain disgusting.
I play my mesmer (stealth, PhantAzhhmmmmm), my guardian (aoe aoe) or my necro (ok this one is frustrating too :P)... it's way more fun.

Tpvp : Never tried it... I don't feel comfortable enough to queue alone or with the too few buddies I have. I'll wait if they can implement some kind of Hot join 5v5 or something less intimidating than "Tournaments"

To sum up : WvW is cool (the queue is tough though) but sPvP I think it's too hard for me.

#11 MatchlessGlory

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 02:22 PM

Warrior's are fine. The greatest weakness of the class is that regardless of spec we are not designed for 1v1. Equally we don't perform to our full potential in 4v4 or 5v5.

Warrior's are designed for, and best with, 2v2 and 3v3 situations. Luckily tpvp is full of these situations but it's up to your team to create favorable situations. If you make a team that tries to zerg with a large team, then warrior shouldn't be an ideal class. If you have a team that learns to stay mobile and coordination on locations with 2-3 people you'll do fine.

Individually warrior's are a very basic class to play but with all the map movement and awareness needed they can actually offer a bit of a skill cap.

Edited by MatchlessGlory, 13 September 2012 - 02:23 PM.


#12 UssjTrunks

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM

- Best (direct damage) ranged profession in the game
- Best single target control in the game
- One of the best professions for clearing/holding capture points
- One of the best classes for roaming
- One of the best AOE support skills in the game (battle standard)
- One of the best professions for finishing off targets in group fights (killshot/eviscerate)

The warrior can do a lot of everything, and very effectively too. It's one of the most versatile classes.

Edited by UssjTrunks, 13 September 2012 - 07:51 PM.


#13 Bofonic

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:28 PM

Taugrim's Captain Hammer. No Class can laydown the Stuns and control like we can.

#14 TheHanzou

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:33 PM

I think you are refering to WvW, while we are talking about tournaments.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

- Best (direct damage) ranged profession in the game

Yeah nice for WvW, useless in tournaments. See warrior with longbow? focus him and win. See warrior with rifle? Focus him and win. Sorry to say but our ranged weapons are absolutely not playable in any way in tournaments. Mostly thanks to our awful utility skills, which mean we die everytime we try to take damage traits/amulet.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

- Best single target control in the game

Like what? what is this good for exactly? There is a reason noone plays warrior in tournaments at higher levels of play. Other classes have good control too, and unlike us, they can dish it out in addition to damage(or survivability, depending on spec)  and team utility.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

- One of the best professions for clearing/holding capture points

Warriors are awful at both. I think you were confusing us with guardians.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

- One of the best classes for roaming

No, thiefs rangers ele are worlds apart in terms of roaming, it just happens that roaming is the thing we actually have a spec for that is not completely unplayable. that spec is however awful but whatever, at this point we can be happy its at least playable.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

- One of the best AOE support skills in the game (battle standard)

Battle standart is pretty underwhelming compared to other classes skills in that slot, it actually gets already outclassed by good utility skills (thiefs,Mesmer). Battle standard does not significantly help in any way in a tournament pvp fight, unlike Moa, Thiefs guild, entangle, Tome etc so many more , its not even close.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

- One of the best professions for finishing off targets in group fights (killshot/eviscerate)

your not getting a killshot off because YOU will be the one they are killing. While your team kills something else than a warrior, however due to the underwhelming and bad utility and defensive skills we have, you will go down ages before your target. Eviscerate doesnt deal any more damage or is harder to dodge than even one HS or Pistol whip. Its not a bad skill but its not better than other classes normal skills.

View PostUssjTrunks, on 13 September 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

The warrior can do a lot of everything, and very effectively too. It's one of the most versatile classes.

No hes not, he has absolutely no versatility. The only thing he can do is play Stunbot shout support for his team or Glascannon GS, he is not versatile at all hes completely one dimensional. Thats the main problem because he is so easy to predict, dodging volley/killshot/evis/bull charge/shield stun is really easy because you always know when hes doing them. Evade bull charge and u basically won...Compare that to thiefs or mesmer, where the damage is basically non avoidable, where you can get destroyed from stealth within seconds or where escape is 100% guaranteed? Its not even close.

the main problems are our utility skills, that are so bad compared to the other classes. Where we get 1 thing, other classes get 3 or 4 things, all with the same slot.

I mean can u do a viable stance build? No, because they are bad on their own and do too little dont synergyze with each other.

Can u do a viable Standarts build? No, because they are bad on their own and do too little and dont synergyze with each other.

Can u do a viable Physical spec? no, because they are bad on their own and do too little and dont synergyze with each other.

Thats half of our Skills useless, the only spec that works is Shouts. For the rest its mix and match and hope for the best. Its not enough.

In WvW Warrior isnt that bad because of his Banners and Longbow AoE,

Edited by TheHanzou, 13 September 2012 - 10:57 PM.


#15 Giac

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 02:14 AM

The best defense in this game is mobility in combat and damage evasion. Incidentally that's exactly what this class is not good at.

For those playing at the high levels of TPvP, think about which classes actually engage in melee. It's guardians, thieves and warriors.

Guardians lack in-combat mobility, though they have access to an insane amount of evasion and prolonged stability with a lot of stun breaking utilities that are actually useful for the role they assume. So while they are not hard to catch, they are incredibly hard to lock down.

Thieves have incredible in-combat mobility and evasion. Locking them down is almost impossible. Pistol Whip also offers excellent control, damage and defense all in one ability and thanks to Shadow Return, they can break out of stuns at will, as long as they have initiative.

The warrior has very weak in-combat mobility and is easy to catch. Their strongest burst weapon offers limited evasion and absolutely underwhelming utility, while their burst roots them in place. Once you have fired 100 blades and whirlwind, you better switch weapon set, because any other offers more sustained damage. The warrior's utility skills are one-dimensional, poorly thought through, nonetheless some of them are absolutely mandatory, if you want to deal damage that is considered a threat.

The stun break on frenzy is ridiculous for instance. When are you going to break a stun with frenzy? You'd be insane. In order to use your stationary burst from the GS, you better bring balanced stance and endure pain, or you will simply get shut down or killed. So you have now used up all of your utilities to be able to use the one skill that hurts and if that wasn't enough, you'll have to pick up a control ability as well, forcing you to pick up a hammer (stun), a sword (root) or a mace (stun). After this, you are locked into the GS for at least 5 seconds (more like 10, since not everybody picks up fast hands and even if you do, it doesn't work for the first weapon swap in combat)

That's just too much compared to what a thief needs to do to deal equal or superior damage.

Edited by Giac, 14 September 2012 - 02:18 AM.


#16 Alaroxr

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 02:19 AM

Last week, Thieves and Mesmers were "utterly underpowered"; now they're "overpowered". Last month, Engineers were apparently the "worst and most underpowered", now people love them. Yesterday, Warriors were the "best", today they're the "worst".

Edited by Alaroxr, 14 September 2012 - 02:19 AM.


#17 Giac

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 02:26 AM

View PostAlaroxr, on 14 September 2012 - 02:19 AM, said:

Last week, Thieves and Mesmers were "utterly underpowered"; now they're "overpowered". Last month, Engineers were apparently the "worst and most underpowered", now people love them. Yesterday, Warriors were the "best", today they're the "worst".

People were basing their opinions on larger scale encounters in pvp. Reality is in small scale pvp, things look quite different. If a class can not fulfill their role in a manner that is self sufficient, chances are that class is a weak link. Rarely do you see 3v3s in tournaments, it's mostly 1v1s and 2v2s, at least for the first 10-15s.

The warrior is the weakest class in a 2v1 or 3v2 in the opponent's favor as well.

Edited by Giac, 14 September 2012 - 02:27 AM.


#18 The Dreadnought

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:12 AM

I can agree.. We do need a buff :\ I feel useless.

#19 TheHanzou

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:17 AM

Look, when our Utility Condition Removal is Dolyak Signet, and Mesmer Condition removal is Null Field, what gives? Just go and read some thief and mesmer utility and weapon skills and youre really getting frustrated.

All our utility skills are garbage exept for bull charge, and thats why warriors suck. Dolyak Signet does 1 (or 1,5 things if u count the passive, which isnt even half of vigor) , Null Field does 5 things. Same cooldown. Nothing else to add really.

then look at weapon skills. Mesmer GS? Im getting dizzy reading all the affixes. Projectile finisher, Vulnerability, Might, Bounce, Remove Boon, Cripple, Knockback, AoE Attacks. WTF is this shit, if u know the meme. Its like they took all the things that are possible in the game and threw it on as many mesmer and thiefs skills as they could find.

Why does thief SB have a teleport on a 6s cooldown?? That is nuts. Have u ever seen where they can go with this shit? They can reach places noone else can, and they can escape from everything with this 6s teleport. And thats for a class who has sick strong utility skills and insane burst skills that always either stun or immobilize or function as Gapclosers, i mean YEAH couldnt be any other way i guess? The thing is, its not even USED in combat, only to roam the map. Thats clearly not the INTENDED use of the skill if u ask me. Teleport on 6s cooldown for a single weapon skill? Thats better than most 90s Utility skills.

Thief has no survivability thats his trade off? Compared to Warrior??? How does anyone get this idea.

And whats Mesmers excuse? Phantasms can be killed??? Big Rofl if u ask me. I have had mesmers do nothing but stand behind a corner, move out to cast illusions and phantasms on me and then go back behind the corner, while i defend the point. And they get me down, not with the first one not with the second one, but its dealing more damage than im healing, by FAR. So what am i supposed to do? And thats all without using Moa or anything, once you are half dead Moa will kill you anyway.

Edited by TheHanzou, 14 September 2012 - 03:33 AM.


#20 The Dreadnought

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:19 AM

I made this thread on the GW2 forums, i hope you don't mind.

#21 writethemwrong

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:22 AM

View PostTheHanzou, on 14 September 2012 - 03:17 AM, said:

then look at weapon skills. Mesmer GS? Im getting dizzy reading all the affixes. Projectile finisher, Vulnerability, Might, Bounce, Remove Boon, Cripple, Knockback, AoE Attacks. WTF is this shit, if u know the meme. Its like they took all the things that are possible in the game and threw it on as many mesmer and thiefs skills as they could find.

Everything except actual damage. There are times in pvp where I don't have any boons up and I'll get bursted down by a warrior so dam fast and I can barely move his health.

Edited by writethemwrong, 14 September 2012 - 03:23 AM.


#22 draxynnic

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:46 AM

View PostAlaroxr, on 14 September 2012 - 02:19 AM, said:

Last week, Thieves and Mesmers were "utterly underpowered"; now they're "overpowered". Last month, Engineers were apparently the "worst and most underpowered", now people love them. Yesterday, Warriors were the "best", today they're the "worst".
Apart from engineers getting buffed from the BWEs, it's a matter of different people talking. The grass is always greener on the other side.

Or, to explain a little further: It's a lot easier to see the weaknesses in a profession when you've played it, while when you're from the outside looking in (or, worse, just got trounced by someone using a particular profession), it's generally easier to see what looks strong.

Consider the example a couple of posts up - yes, mesmer greatsword has a lot of stuff added to it on paper. In practise, though... making full use of all of that is easier said than done. Compare to a warrior rifle - the warrior also has a knockback (on half the recharge), a cripple (single-target every 10 seconds, but more controllable than a phantasm), a larger, longer-lasting stack of vulnerability (albeit on a longer recharge), a higher skill-one damage output taking bleeding into account that doesn't rely on the enemy always being at max range, and every skill except the last being a potential projectile finisher rather than just one, leading to better synergy with fields. I'm sure a warrior player can look at that and say it's not all as good as it sounds, but it's easy to look at what something has and think it's too much if you don't have experience with using it (and dealing with the not-always-obvious shortfalls) yourself.

(For the record, the shortfalls on mesmer greatsword are: Reliance on being at maximum range. Reliance on illusion/phantasm AI (the effectiveness of Illusionary Berserker especially can be quite variable). Mind Stab is clumsy to use and deals no more damage or larger area than an elementalist's slot-1 fireball. Illusionary Wave does piddling damage, only buys you a few seconds at the cost of a 30s recharge, and can be dodged at the point of the cone (namely, where the guy you really want out of your face is.)

ArenaNet made a big deal early on about how it's balanced if everyone is overpowered, but human nature being what it is, it's probably more accurate to say that you know you've achieved balance when everyone thinks they're underpowered.

Edited by draxynnic, 14 September 2012 - 04:04 AM.

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#23 UssjTrunks

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:55 AM

View PostAlaroxr, on 14 September 2012 - 02:19 AM, said:

Last week, Thieves and Mesmers were "utterly underpowered"; now they're "overpowered". Last month, Engineers were apparently the "worst and most underpowered", now people love them. Yesterday, Warriors were the "best", today they're the "worst".

This. People have no idea what they're talking about. Opinions are dictated by the FOTM.

Only on the warrior forum will you see a thread dedicated to the class being underpowered. It's quite comical.

View PostGiac, on 14 September 2012 - 02:26 AM, said:

People were basing their opinions on larger scale encounters in pvp. Reality is in small scale pvp, things look quite different. If a class can not fulfill their role in a manner that is self sufficient, chances are that class is a weak link. Rarely do you see 3v3s in tournaments, it's mostly 1v1s and 2v2s, at least for the first 10-15s.

The warrior is the weakest class in a 2v1 or 3v2 in the opponent's favor as well.

No.

People are basing their opinions on the FOTM.

The current FOTM mindset on this forum is that warriors are vastly underpowered (which couldn't be further from the truth). Last month, all you could see were threads about how vastly overpowered we were. In reality, people are just talking out of their asses and following silly trends.

Edited by UssjTrunks, 14 September 2012 - 03:52 AM.


#24 Giac

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 04:13 AM

So, let's assume you were right and people just talked out of their behinds. What's more credible a handful of people playing during a couple of BWEs and stress tests making statements or hundreds of thousands of people after the game has gone live making statements?

I am not saying people are objective, they aren't. But "trends" are a result and never the cause.

#25 UssjTrunks

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 04:20 AM

[quote[u] name='TheHanzou' timestamp='1347575612' post='1928476']
I think you are refering to WvW, while we are talking about tournaments.

[/u][/quote]

So am I. I don't think you've played any though.

[quote[u]]Yeah nice for WvW, useless in tournaments. See warrior with longbow? focus him and win.[/u][/quote]

Longbow is trash, no argument there.

[quote[u]]See warrior with rifle? Focus him and win. Sorry to say but our ranged weapons are absolutely not playable in any way in tournaments. Mostly thanks to our awful utility skills, which mean we die everytime we try to take damage traits/amulet.[/u][/quote]

Wtf is this supposed to mean? It isn't even an argument. Every class can be focus fired.

Here, let me try:

- "See an engineer with rifle? Focus him and win."
- "See a guardian with GS? Focus him and win."
- "See warrior with rifle? Focus him and win."

[quote[u]]Like what? what is this good for exactly? [/u][/quote]

What is control good for? Are you serious? For someone who claims they are an "expert" on tournament play, you would surely understand the importance of CC.

[quote[u]]There is a reason noone plays warrior in tournaments at higher levels of play. Other classes have good control too, and unlike us, they can dish it out in addition to damage(or survivability, depending on spec)  and team utility.[/u][/quote]

Warriors are in the highest armour and health bracket in the game, and they deal some of the highest burst damage in the game. But according to your logic, they can't use CC, deal damage, and have high survivability at the same time. Sound logic. I'd love to know what build you were using. Perhaps I'll give it a whirl. I've always wanted to know what builds the experts run.

[quote[u]]Warriors are awful at both. I think you were confusing us with guardian[/u][/quote]

Half of our utility skills are control skills, and we have a number of weapon skills dedicated to that as well. But of course, we can't clear/defend capture points. All those tournaments where I cleared clocktower of guardians were imagined.

[quote[u]]No, thiefs rangers ele are worlds apart in terms of roaming, it just happens that roaming is the thing weually have a spec for that is not completely unplayable. that spec is however awful but whatever, at this point we can be happy its at least playable.[/u][/quote]

You're right, thieves and rangers are better roamers. However, the ability to have almost 100% up keep of swiftness as well as gap closers on the GS and sword, and our ability to take a beating, make us decent at the role.

[quote[u]]Battle standart is pretty underwhelming compared to other classes skills in that slo, it actually gets already outclassed by good utility skills (thiefs,Mesmer). Battle standard does not significantly help in any way in a tournament pvp fight, unlike Moa, Thiefs guild, entangle, Tome etc so many more , its not even close.[/u][/quote]

This is why battle standard was being used by just about every major team in the betas, right? (I haven't kept up with videos since launch).

[quote[u]]your not getting a killshot off because YOU will be the one they are killing. While your team kills something else than a warrior, however due to the underwhelming and bad utility and defensive skills we have, you will go down ages before your target. Eviscerate doesnt deal any more damage or is harder to dodge than even one HS or Pistol whip. Its not a bad skill but its not better than other classes normal skills.[/u][/quote]

Our utility and defensive skills suck? Have you ever tried other professions? They envy us and all the options we have. Warriors have some of the absolute best CC and defensive skills in the game (how many classes have 7 seconds of invulnerability?).

[quote[u]]No hes not, he has absolutely no versatility. The only thing he can do is play Stunbot shout support for his team or Glascannon GS, he is not versatile at all hes completely one dimensional. Thats the main problem because he is so easy to predict, dodging volley/killshot/evis/bull charge/shield stun is really easy because you always know when hes doing them. Evade bull charge and u basically won...Compare that to thiefs or mesmer, where the damage is basically non avoidable, where you can get destroyed from stealth within seconds or where escape is 100% guaranteed? Its not even close.[/u][/quote]

It isn't my problem that you only play 100B warrior. Maybe you should give other builds a try.

And lol @ thieves being more versatile than warriors. Thieves have two skills that they spam endlessly.

[quote[u]]the main problems are our utility skills, that are so bad compared to the other classes. Where we get 1 thing, other classes get 3 or 4 things, all with the same slot.

I mean can u do a viable stance build? No, because they are bad on their own and do too little dont synergyze with each other.

Can u do a viable Standarts build? No, because they are bad on their own and do too little and dont synergyze with each other.

Can u do a viable Physical spec? no, because they are bad on their own and do too little and dont synergyze with each other.

Thats half of our Skills useless, the only spec that works is Shouts. For the rest its mix and match and hope for the best. Its not enough.
[/u][/quote]

None of those skills (except) banners are useless. Our physical skills and stances are the best in the game. No other class has that level of control and defence.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I wonder if you're just a troll. Oh well, you've gotten a full page response out of me if you are.

Edited by UssjTrunks, 14 September 2012 - 04:20 AM.


#26 UssjTrunks

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 04:40 AM

View PostGiac, on 14 September 2012 - 04:13 AM, said:

So, let's assume you were right and people just talked out of their behinds. What's more credible a handful of people playing during a couple of BWEs and stress tests making statements or hundreds of thousands of people after the game has gone live making statements?

I am not saying people are objective, they aren't. But "trends" are a result and never the cause.

The FOTM is dictated by casual players that don't have a clue how to play the game.

Last month 90% of players were running 100B warrior. This month 90% of players are running HS thief.

These trends only indicate that the player base is comprised of bad players. The real meta game develops around tournament play, where the warrior is still one of the most viable options.

If you don't like it, you can play another profession.

Edited by UssjTrunks, 14 September 2012 - 04:42 AM.


#27 Clyne

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 06:21 AM

View PostUssjTrunks, on 14 September 2012 - 03:55 AM, said:

This. People have no idea what they're talking about. Opinions are dictated by the FOTM.

Only on the warrior forum will you see a thread dedicated to the class being underpowered. It's quite comical.



No.

People are basing their opinions on the FOTM.

The current FOTM mindset on this forum is that warriors are vastly underpowered (which couldn't be further from the truth). Last month, all you could see were threads about how vastly overpowered we were. In reality, people are just talking out of their asses and following silly trends.

I really think you have some sort of confirmation bias of sort in you.
I'm not gonna start a discussion when something is pretty much obvious to conventional logic and wisdom.

Your counters statements, 2 posts up, are mainly builds which we have to specially speced into, sacrificing whatever we have left on the other side of the spectrum. So your points invalidate themselves one after the other, simply because they cannot coexist in a level 80 build.

That is part of the reason why warriors are underwhelming.

Edited by Clyne, 14 September 2012 - 06:24 AM.


#28 kKagari

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 06:31 AM

Wombo comboooooooooooo

#29 Vodkastick

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 06:39 AM

Oh gawd.

Sure, we are a bit underwhelming in some aspects but overall we're not THAT bad. I do well enough in most tourneys I play, though I'm kinda pigeonholed to my support spec.

Why the hate on Banners though? The spec I'm running gives everyone a Regen that ticks for 320 per tick and 10% critdmg + 90precision. And my Battle Standard has saved the day many times with the instant ress it offers.
One awesome thing is that our Mesmer gets a 3 second Protection each time my Regen refreshes, so he essentially has 33% damage reduction up 100% of the time as we move as duo most of the time.

I tried the Captain Hammer spec which was nice as well, but I prefer the utility from my trusty Warhorn over the stuns. The condition removal and boon converting is just golden, as is the root/immob removal and endurance regen. Not to mention the Fumble on enemy targets (which is actually quite good!). My damage is not anything amazing but my teammates dish out enough damage to make up for it.

Edited by Vodkastick, 14 September 2012 - 06:40 AM.


#30 RustyEyeballs

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 08:44 AM

I have to agree with the OP to a degree. I think the warrior is meant to a good mixture of the things mentioned (damage/support/control, etc).  I also agree with the statement that warriors are pretty pigeon-holed into shouts atm.




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