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How to build a Guardian properly.


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#151 Aaron The Guardian

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 06:48 PM

View Postmorpai, on 24 September 2012 - 01:15 PM, said:

I agree with the OP, this traits are quite mandatory. I think that the aspect that helped me the most in dungeons is the ability to change important major traits on the fly. utilities can make or break an encounter, and I found myself switching them nearly before every major fight. This is the build im using, of course the major traits will be switched according to the utilities im using. The only thing I don't need is improving meditations cause they don't bring anything for the rest of the group.

http://gw2skills.net...LA;TQAgzCos2YsB

I use full cleric gear.
Is this a pvp setup or pve and dungeon?

#152 G L J

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 06:36 PM

View PostAaron The Guardian, on 08 October 2012 - 06:48 PM, said:

Is this a pvp setup or pve and dungeon?

Looks like PvE.

#153 Strife025

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Posted 09 October 2012 - 08:55 PM

Okay I get your trying to help noobs not be utterly useless, and maybe these "mandatory" traits may help that somehow, but some of your mandatory traits are laughable.

First off, 15 in radiance is never mandatory. It is excellent for PvE farming and killing tons of trash mobs. For any hard content and dungeons it is useless compared to other traits/builds. By going 15 into radiance you severely limit your ability to hit a few major traits that provide synergy.

Think about this, the hardest things in PvE are dungeons. The hardest thing in dungeons are groups of 2-3 silver mobs and bosses. 15 in Radiance is wasted traits. It is good for farming and DEs, but those events are so easy it's hardly mandatory.

It is never mandatory to take traits at the same time which fight for your 3 skill slots (i.e. consecrations and shouts). In a shout build it is mandatory to take 20% shout cooldowns, in a consecration build it is mandatory to take targetable and length/cooldown traits, but it is never mandatory to take them at a same time. That just waters down your build.

I run a build for WvW and PvE that has neither 15 radiance or virtues, and I bet it is one of the most effective guardian builds after personally trying a large variety of builds, over the course of leveling 2x level 80 guardians, having completed almost every dungeon path in the game with daily guild/friend speed runs, and having 2 sets of exotic armor, and one of each type of weapon with specific stats and runes based on their purpose. Certain things are mandatory for certain builds, saying every guardian needs to have the mandatory traits you listed which are spread all over the place is just limiting builds that are actually very strong depending on your build/purpose.

Noobs who take "mandatory" traits will still be noobs, because they haven't really researched a build they are interested in, taken the time to learn it, or asked questions to become a better player. There are far better focused builds which do not take all of the mandatory things you listed.

Edited by Strife025, 09 October 2012 - 09:01 PM.


#154 Delirious

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 12:02 AM

Do you mind sharing? Seems like there have been a few people touting their build as the best or better but conveniently don't post it.

View PostStrife025, on 09 October 2012 - 08:55 PM, said:

I run a build for WvW and PvE that has neither 15 radiance or virtues, and I bet it is one of the most effective guardian builds after personally trying a large variety of builds, over the course of leveling 2x level 80 guardians, having completed almost every dungeon path in the game with daily guild/friend speed runs, and having 2 sets of exotic armor, and one of each type of weapon with specific stats and runes based on their purpose. Certain things are mandatory for certain builds, saying every guardian needs to have the mandatory traits you listed which are spread all over the place is just limiting builds that are actually very strong depending on your build/purpose.

Edited by Delirious, 10 October 2012 - 12:11 AM.


#155 Strife025

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 12:10 AM

View PostDelirious, on 10 October 2012 - 12:02 AM, said:

Do you mind sharing?

I have a thread on the first page of the forums here which should be easy to find with my name, I try not to link stuff in other people's threads.

#156 Ritz

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 07:35 AM

View PostStrife025, on 09 October 2012 - 08:55 PM, said:

Okay I get your trying to help noobs not be utterly useless, and maybe these "mandatory" traits may help that somehow, but some of your mandatory traits are laughable.

First off, 15 in radiance is never mandatory. It is excellent for PvE farming and killing tons of trash mobs. For any hard content and dungeons it is useless compared to other traits/builds. By going 15 into radiance you severely limit your ability to hit a few major traits that provide synergy.

Think about this, the hardest things in PvE are dungeons. The hardest thing in dungeons are groups of 2-3 silver mobs and bosses. 15 in Radiance is wasted traits. It is good for farming and DEs, but those events are so easy it's hardly mandatory.
Finally someone is talking about the truth, after 158 posts cant believe it.
Yes 15 radiance is laughable in dungeons, I bet OP didnt know a thief can keep all mobs in his field blinded all the time.
Its better for a guadian to focus on something that other classes cant achieve like tanky/healing abilities, instead of going for burn(elementalist) or blind(thief) that work only 1/10 effectively compared to other classes.

#157 G L J

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 05:18 PM

View PostRitz, on 10 October 2012 - 07:35 AM, said:

Finally someone is talking about the truth, after 158 posts cant believe it.
Yes 15 radiance is laughable in dungeons, I bet OP didnt know a thief can keep all mobs in his field blinded all the time.
Its better for a guadian to focus on something that other classes cant achieve like tanky/healing abilities, instead of going for burn(elementalist) or blind(thief) that work only 1/10 effectively compared to other classes.
I wasn't going to say anything about it, but I sort of feel the same way.

To be honest, I find that going 15 in radiance is overkill for dungeons. I find that there usually aren't enough enemies to kill quickly for the refresh to be worth it and other classes do burning/blind better. The best real use I've found for it is the three stacks of might and the retaliation, which is laughable in a boss fight.

So far, the most ridiculous team composition I've been in is guardian/buff-elementalist/balanced-elementalist/thief/thief. The amount of utility, tankiness, and damage that my friends and I can put out is hysterical. I don't even have to try on some parts, just drop my hammer's symbol of protection and laugh at the damage. Use stability on the bosses with pulls and roll away from the instagib attacks. Then again, that team comp is really silly good.

Edited by G L J, 10 October 2012 - 05:20 PM.


#158 Aaron The Guardian

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 07:02 PM

Hello everyone. I am unsure of what I want to do with my guardian build wise. Right now I am using 0 15 5 30 20 with a hammer and scepter/ focus. I am using cleric amor. I'm wondering if I should be using a different build and curious what traits in armor I should focus on other than cleric's.

View PostAaron The Guardian, on 10 October 2012 - 07:01 PM, said:

Hello everyone. I am unsure of what I want to do with my guardian build wise. Right now I am using 0 15 5 30 20 with a hammer and scepter/ focus. I am using cleric amor. I'm wondering if I should be using a different build and curious what traits in armor I should focus on other than cleric's.
Also I think I am going to switch to a mace and shield or wondering if it would fit my role bettter.

#159 Vallazar

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 02:28 AM

After reading the first page and such, this is the build I came up with:

http://en.gw2skills....LpXrNGbc24txsBA

Thoughts? I was thinking about going mace/shield instead of mace/focus. I haven't decided yet.

#160 Aaron The Guardian

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Posted 13 October 2012 - 06:54 AM

View PostG L J, on 10 October 2012 - 05:18 PM, said:

I wasn't going to say anything about it, but I sort of feel the same way.

To be honest, I find that going 15 in radiance is overkill for dungeons. I find that there usually aren't enough enemies to kill quickly for the refresh to be worth it and other classes do burning/blind better. The best real use I've found for it is the three stacks of might and the retaliation, which is laughable in a boss fight.

So far, the most ridiculous team composition I've been in is guardian/buff-elementalist/balanced-elementalist/thief/thief. The amount of utility, tankiness, and damage that my friends and I can put out is hysterical. I don't even have to try on some parts, just drop my hammer's symbol of protection and laugh at the damage. Use stability on the bosses with pulls and roll away from the instagib attacks. Then again, that team comp is really silly good.
What is your build?

#161 G L J

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Posted 13 October 2012 - 11:53 PM

View PostAaron The Guardian, on 13 October 2012 - 06:54 AM, said:

What is your build?

asdf

Quote


20/0/10/20/20 - Hammer/ Sword&shield - Signet of resolve, "Stand Your Ground!", Sword of Justice, Hammer of Wisdom, Tome of Courage

~~~

Zeal - 20 points; Spirit Weapon Mastery, Eternal Spirit

Spoiler

Valor - 10 points; Purity

Spoiler


Honor - 20 points; Writ of Exaltation, Two-Handed Mastery/Writ of the Merciful

Spoiler

Virtues - 20 points; Improved Spirit Weapon Duration, Absolute Resolution

Spoiler


#162 Littlefeather

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:00 AM

Each build has its own "mandatory" traits. My build is completely different and serves me best at what role I take in a dungeon and WvW. I dont count Dynamic events as anything important, as any one on any class can faceroll their keyboard to get gold.

Honestly, I dont want to post video's of my guardian in a dungeon because I dont want it to get nerfed again, and me posting my build does nothing for the guardian public because most dont even know what role they want to take with their guardian.

My experience with my guardian is more than likely completely different from some one else's intent of their's. Before you ask other people what you should trait for or stat like or anything like that, ask yourself what role you want to take your guardian with.

#163 sandman1008

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 06:38 AM

Well, as already stated by many, 15 in Radiance is not mandatory. When I frst started off at level 80, I tried somethings out and found I was dying a lot. So, I did some research and found this build someone called the Boon Healing dungeon build. Here's a variation of it that I'm currently using: http://gw2skills.net...7BG9Rd01DHSiYIA

It's actually ironic that I started using this build seeing as how only days before my friend and I said we didn't like shouts much. Anyway, in this build, you become a sort of tank healer. The only downside to this build is that your symbol really only affects others in melee. With that said, I have found very few bosses in the game that I can't melee for the duration of the fight. And when coupled with another guardian (me using mace/shield, the other a hammer), it's almost impossible to take us down.

When it comes to damage dealing, of course you're going to suffer. However, I still put out enough damage with the help of my cleric gear that I'm not too much of an offensive liability.

I'm currently experiementing with gear and runes, but for the most part, I found a build that makes running dungeons easier for me and the group. Also, when solo'ing I rarely find myself in a bind unlike how I used to. And even in sPvP I found that this build was pretty effective. Just the other day, my friend and I were doing sPvP (he's a necro), and we were able to take 3-5 people at once hold them off for almost the entire match. By the time we were finally taken down (after killing a few of them ourselves), our team had almost accumulated the point total we needed to win the match.

I may try to get cute and try some other builds in the future, but I'm gonna be sticking with this build for a while.

#164 berzerker7

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 08:12 AM

I don't think anything is "mandatory." There are many great builds that you can run as a guardian. Personally, stacking everything I have into survivability is key to me being helpful and maintaining condition removal when needed. The pure shout/condition removal build is what I've found to be the most use for PvE. It's almost exactly the build in the previous post, except I use a Greatsword as the main instead of the mace. My secondary is pretty much anything, but mostly I use scepter/shield or staff. You have great control over the battle with the condition removal, and the heals won't matter *as* much because of all the conditions that aren't affecting allies, also having them converted to boons helps. If heals are getting desperate, Tome of Courage 5 skill will take care of everything.

Specifically, the link to my build is here: http://gw2skills.net...LbWuskZtaYUwuBA

It's not entirely accurate though, I have about 2050 power, and around 21-22k health. Full vit/tough gear across the board will leave you tanky with loads of support for the whole team.

Edited by berzerker7, 05 November 2012 - 08:13 AM.


#165 Dzaruk

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Posted 09 November 2012 - 11:03 PM

Quick question :
What is the best sigil on Greatsword for DPS?

Cheers.

#166 Sovelin

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:17 AM

Does this guardian build work well for solo PVE as well? Or is this more for WvW? I'm completely new to the game and want to make a guardian. Started with a ranger, got him to 5, didn't enjoy they style (pet annoyed me).

#167 Dasryn

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 11:43 AM

View PostRed_Falcon, on 24 September 2012 - 04:09 AM, said:

*snip*
Do a favor to yourself and your friends: don't be a mediocre Guardian.
Be a successful Guardian.

@ Red_Falcon - i think this is a great starter guide to building an effective guardian.  its really given direction and purpose to someone just starting out.

i think a lot of people are forgetting that this is just a skeleton basic development with 30 more points to do as you please.

i think a lot of people are trying to reject what is essentially truth because they are mad they didnt think of it themselves.

kudos to you red falcon!

P.S. - can you please make one of these for elementalist?  my wife plays staff ele and we are in desperate need of direction.

Edited by Rickter, 15 November 2012 - 11:44 AM.


#168 Dasryn

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:56 AM

View PostRed_Falcon, on 24 September 2012 - 04:09 AM, said:

2) 15 points in Radiance for signet CDs and especially Renewed justice (very important for dungeon DPS of your team, gives tons of might combined with Virtues minor) and Justice is Blind.

hey i was looking through here again and i was hoping you could explain something for me.   what if. . . you dont use any signets?  well i use the Signet of Resolve (that heals) but its the only one.  i have one consecration (that i proly will switch out with a shout) and the rest are shouts.

it just seems like an awful lot of points to put into something that will only benefit you if you use signets a lot.

#169 Red_Falcon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:37 AM

I'm sorry I can't give help to Guardians anymore.
I stopped playing Guard a few patches ago so what I would suggest couldn't reflect the current state of the class.
Hopefully these informations are still helpful and there is some other Guard around willing to help you guys :)

#170 Montaque

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:54 PM

http://gw2skills.net...6S21ajxGnN2b82A
I go with this.
I have a friend who is a fully decked dps warrior so I just work to keep him up and buffed, everyone else is just a meatshield for him basically hahaha.

#171 Zhalig

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 05:03 AM

What's your view on the AH style? from what I have seen it is highly customizable and can fill a number of roles, I am just 60 and have done no pvp whatsoever so I haven't really tried it out much yet, though it seems more geared toward pvp or dungeons to me. https://forum-en.gui...play#post532407

#172 Heart Collector

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 12:02 PM

I'm currently sitting on an 80 Thief which I play with my buddy, but I've also revisited my human Guardian (lvl 41) and I've begun enjoying him again.

I'm wondering what kind of build would be suited for general leveling/open world purposes, which includes solo and duo play and dynamic events - and the occasional dungeon. I'm a bit fickle when it comes to weapons as I like "shaking things up" every so often so I'd like it to be versatile in that respect. Also, after playing my thief, I prefer quicker combat and some mobility, and was wondering what I could do in this respect with my Guardian - and I like to strike a balance between offence and defence.

I've found that I really like 15 in radiance for the VoJ renewal for solo stuff. I'm enjoying the sword/torch combo ATM for its faster pace, low CDs and general pyromanic tendencies :lol: though as I mentioned before I switch up my weapons on a whim. But my backup set is always scepter/focus, which tends to get me out of tight spots effectively through kiting and the very useful focus #2. Obviously I'd change my weapons in DEs if necessary since the team's success is the most important thing.

I know that leveling is easy and doesn't require any "meta" effort to speak of - but I do like to have a theme and cohesion in my builds and don't want my traits to be all over the place, hence my request for advice!

I hope this is enough to go on :)

#173 Xunlai Agent

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 01:44 PM

There are no such things as mandatory traits and some of the stuff suggested here only makes sense if you are running shouts. The Guardian class has a weird trait tree that requires you to spread your points for a fair number of builds out there, however the suggestion that there are mandatory traits is laughable at best...

#174 Dasryn

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 05:40 AM

Falcon (the OP) has abandoned this thread and the Guardian class a long time ago, no sense in reviving a dead thread.

#175 Odin de Valhall

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:16 PM

Hello Guardians ;)

I'm in love with this type of gameplay :

View PostSlivers, on 24 September 2012 - 02:55 PM, said:

Great post, Red_action!  The information presented is beneficial to everyone regardless of playstyle or current build ... players can take it or leave it, but everyone should at least understand why the information and choices given are a strong foundation. Whether or not they are right for you is up to everyone individually.

Regardless, one point of understanding and misunderstanding seems to be the constant PvE terminology. Since there are multiple PvE scenarios, understand that optimizing for differing PvE situations is needed.  For example, with the basics from the OP, here is how things play out for me since I have not reached 80 yet (builds are what I am working towards, obviously):

Solo PvE Leveling Build; maximizing DPS with little worry for damage or conditions:
http://gw2skills.net...BtPQQYPwoMC uFA

PvE Group Events with Bosses; changing weapons and  7-10 skills:
http://gw2skills.net...BtPQQYPwoMqjuFA

Dungeons (limited exposure); changing most things around:
http://gw2skills.net...yS7DEE7BGzYHvFA

I hope this helps understanding how to apply the OP's information as well as why the OP doesn't have "A BUILD" and, instead, the basis for PvE builds.

Again, nice work Red_Faction!

I'l really hesitating in with kind of armor rune and accessories i can bring.
I've work a long time on my warrior, witch is quite fun and different. But here it's hard to find the good way.
I want to get the same equipment for all pve, wvw and dungeon map just changing my utility skill and attribute in different situation.

Cleric is good enough ? Knight ? Valkyries ? mix ?
Rune of soldier, or Flock, maybe Celestial...
How many Power, Crit chance and healy power you need at least in this type of build ?

Thanks for helping me perfecting my guardian game-play.

Sorry for my english . :wacko:

Edited by Odin de Valhall, 23 January 2013 - 05:50 PM.


#176 AzureRogue

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 07:49 PM

I'm still not totally down with the mostly condescending nature of the OP, but in terms of gear needed it really doesn't matter for most of PvE.  Run in full berserker's and you'll still be fine.  I run a simple AH+EM build with my guard in almost full berserker's (still use two knight earrings w/ ruby jewels, though) with runes of the soldier because I often run shouts.  Never had a problem (only on Fractal 17 right now on my guardian, though).  I also currently run 0/10/30/30/0.  I often hear that I'll want to allocate 10 to virtues when in higher fractals for consecrations but it hasn't been absolutely necessary yet.

Also with new ascended amulets coming out soon it will delay the need for strict builds even in fractals another few levels as AR max is about to go up again.

#177 budong

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 10:20 PM

Thanks for the guide.  Reading this made me want to dust off my Guardian and give it another go.  I think my biggest problem was not being sure which direction to go with initial traits and this has helped clear through the clutter of possibilities.

#178 GammaWolf

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:47 PM

15 points in radiance is a total waste, all that does is make trash slightly easier which isn't needed.

Spirit bow is also terrible compared to pure of voice + soldier runes.  The CD is far to long, and the effects are unreliable compared to shouts removing conditions which also proc altruistic healing.

0-0-30-30-10 is pretty much the best build right now.

#179 Royal_Guardian

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Posted 29 April 2013 - 09:20 PM

Somebody probably already answered this somewhere in the 7 pages of text, but after about 3 pages I got bored, so I figured I would just post my question. Is there a build that is effective for general PvE and dungeons/group play that doesnt require too much trait changing? I mean, changing a single trait for consecrations instead of spirit weapons or something is fine, but I dont want to have to go to the trait master every time I want to do dungeons :P I want to have max survivability, and weapons/gear doesnt matter at all, I'll run with whatever. Anyone got any ideas for specific traits?

#180 NatasMC

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Posted 29 April 2013 - 09:26 PM

0-0-30-30-10 beast in all aspect of the game




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