285 replies to this topic

[Naekuh]

Red_Falcon, on 03 October 2012 - 04:50 PM, said:

If they wanted us to be heal/buffbots and nothing else, the main site would show this:

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... oh man... u sir have made me spit coffee at my monitor!

FOR GREAT HEALING!!! i want one of those warriors!

[Red_Falcon]

Naekuh, on 03 October 2012 - 05:26 PM, said:

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... oh man... u sir have made me spit coffee at my monitor!

FOR GREAT HEALING!!! i want one of those warriors!

Hehe I just felt the discussion needed some laughs here

[Red_Falcon]

Build updated with better explanations.

[Washi]

You might notice I never said anything about healing, I don't like the healing shouts build, cause the heal amount is pathetic. But anyway, now the explanaition looks better.

[Steelkat]

I have a few comments about this thread.

1. 99 times out of 100, when I am in a Dungeon Group that fails, it's not because of someone's build.
2. To me, the best ability you have is your endurance bar. Stuff that keeps it full is liquid gold in a dungeon, IMHO.
3. GW2 has made huge cracks in the "Holy Trinity" wall, but it's still standing. Do what you do best in a dungeon. Warriors DPS the bestest! /tigger. So do it well.
4. Thanks for posting builds. I enjoy reading all of the explanations. I always learn something new.

I like this build, although I am going a slightly different route with 20/20/15/0/15 & GS/RIfle, but it's not something I'm skilled enough or sold enough on to try to publish. I leveled 35-80 on Explorable Modes though, so it works for me and that's half the battle.

Edited by Steelkat, 03 October 2012 - 09:14 PM.

[Millimidget]

EDIT: Saying the warrior should be responsible for condition removal in TA is like saying the warrior should be responsible for blossom clearing when trying to skip packs in TA. That is to say, other classes do it better; figure out which ones do, and make friends with decent players of those classes.

Washi, on 03 October 2012 - 12:24 PM, said:

I never said it was. All I said that no vit AND almost no condition removal is a bad idea. I mean if you want to only do damage why don't you go full glass cannon?

Because then you'd die all the time?

I'm still not sure what you're getting at, other than that you simply don't like the build because it's not the one you prefer.

Washi, on 03 October 2012 - 03:00 PM, said:

OK I will remember not to criticize any other build, because this forum is only about patting on the back.

If it is as bad as you claim it is, then the build will achieve no traction, and this thread will fall off the first page, never to be seen again.

Edited by Millimidget, 03 October 2012 - 09:35 PM.

[Newsinz]

When I grow up Im gonna try this build.  Currently my warrior is little lol.  Like I said looks like it could be fun.  I like the fact that it's built around damage/defense.  If I wanted condition removal like many have said Id play Guardian.  Warriors dont scream Condition removal to me, they scream "My sword your face, playground at lunch".

Edit:  Im finding it really hard though to not use a sword.  Not because I think its better but because I have a firey Dragon sword that makes me feel all warm and fuzy.  I was thinking of just going conditions with sword but really... I already have a necro that does that well.  Argh.  Axes it is.

Edited by Newsinz, 03 October 2012 - 09:24 PM.

[Domifuling]

Red_Falcon, on 03 October 2012 - 04:50 PM, said:

If they wanted us to be heal/buffbots and nothing else, the main site would show this:

Hahahaha, Red_Falcon, honestly, huge thanks. Stuff finaly starts to make sense. Will start on new gear and respecs.

[Stele]

What Sigil do you recommend for the GS with this build?

[Red_Falcon]

Newsinz, on 03 October 2012 - 09:19 PM, said:

When I grow up Im gonna try this build.  Currently my warrior is little lol.  Like I said looks like it could be fun.  I like the fact that it's built around damage/defense.  If I wanted condition removal like many have said Id play Guardian.  Warriors dont scream Condition removal to me, they scream "My sword your face, playground at lunch".

Edit:  Im finding it really hard though to not use a sword.  Not because I think its better but because I have a firey Dragon sword that makes me feel all warm and fuzy.  I was thinking of just going conditions with sword but really... I already have a necro that does that well.  Argh.  Axes it is.

With this build you can use your sword too. You can get Blademaster trait and Deep Cuts.
Another strong point in this build is that you can use six weapons efficiently.

Stele, on 04 October 2012 - 04:33 PM, said:

What Sigil do you recommend for the GS with this build?

It's personal preference, but I grab sup accuracy on GS.

[Newsinz]

Red_Falcon, on 04 October 2012 - 08:46 PM, said:

With this build you can use your sword too. You can get Blademaster trait and Deep Cuts.
Another strong point in this build is that you can use six weapons efficiently.

Thanks for that

[Fizzgig]

Was that you in this screen shot? You seem to have used it on your OP as if it was.

Edited by Fizzgig, 05 October 2012 - 02:48 AM.

[Narmo23]

Fizzgig, on 05 October 2012 - 02:34 AM, said:

Was that you in this screen shot? You seem to have used it on your OP as if it was.

Oh gawd, lawlz!

[Red_Falcon]

Fizzgig, on 05 October 2012 - 02:34 AM, said:

Was that you in this screen shot? You seem to have used it on your OP as if it was.

Yes I grabbed your numbers to show max DPS obtainable with 25might 25vuln
So far my highest is 22k but I'm using Knight's so I have 16% less crit damage than you.

PS: Thinking about it, I'd like to see HB with that build but 30 discipline and crit dmg banner.
We could seriously hit the 30k mark one day.

Edited by Red_Falcon, 05 October 2012 - 11:06 AM.

[M1k3l]

It's a very solid dungeon build. When I run with my buddies this is how I play. (with slight modification)

However, if I am taking several guildies who are low in level or new to the dungeon, it can have problems but then I switch to my wet nurse warrior. (healing shout)
But that's why I crafted two sets of exotic armor, trinkets and weps.

I enjoy both builds but for very different reasons.

The dps build is fun! The dps build gets things killed in a hurry and is wonderful with a well planned team.
The shout build is fun because I can keep those low level rascals alive so it's not a waypoint to insta-death marathon.

I LOVE that a warrior can be both of these things and I can choose to play either way.

Remember guys, any build that you enjoy and results in success for the encounter is a great build.

Edit:
Red_Falcon, I run 20/20/0/0/30 for my dps build w/ crit dmg banner and it's insane but I have not tested the numbers v/s 20/30/0/0/20  26k is the highest I have hit w/ 25 stacks of vuln.
Using GS and 100b (Captain Obvious demanded that I add that)

Thanks for posting man!

Edited by M1k3l, 05 October 2012 - 12:42 PM.

[Gutz]

Assuming this is a build for warriors in an organised group (where others take the role of condition removal etc.) i wouldn't call this build that bad, though i don’t think more than 2 weapon sets is really needed for said situations IMO.

Endure pain is more of a ‘oh sh*t’ button that shouldn’t be relied upon, if you’re competent with dodging/healing and have good awareness in dungeons etc.


As someone who isn’t in a guild with a vent, and pugs a lot I personally wouldn’t use such a build as it is heavily reliant on the other party members bringing supportive skills (which rarely happens).


As for the traits it could be improved to have better synergy, they seem wasted on the signet mastery as shake it off is 100x better than signet of stamina even more so with the shouts trait which also benefits fgj giving a lot more synergy to your build etc.

Assuming you got shield and traited into it for the 3sec block stance, again same thing that can be said for endure pain applies here, not really needed if you are dodging ranged attacks and using strafe switching to ranged for melee kiting etc.

Edited by Gutz, 05 October 2012 - 01:46 PM.

[Butcher]

You know, I got really pissed because everyone seems to think that GS is the only way to play a Warrior, so I posted a Sword+Axe/Rifle build that ultimately got rejected, even though it could've had potential. It could have...if people weren't such d-bags and decided to scream "HERESY!" in their high pitched, nasally voices.

This is honestly the only really good GS build I've come across so far. People act like Warriors have to have a ton of utilities that support everyone else, but you only need one (maybe two). Every other Profession outclasses Warriors when it comes to support. Ultimately, if you're going to bring a Warrior to the dungeon, do it knowing he can rip shit up and buff you with a banner, condition remover, or three Might stacks.

That's all there is to it. Why is everyone so angry when people suggest something...*GASP*...different?

[Red_Falcon]

Gutz, on 05 October 2012 - 12:51 PM, said:

Assuming this is a build for warriors in an organised group (where others take the role of condition removal etc.) i wouldn't call this build that bad, though i don’t think more than 2 weapon sets is really needed for said situations IMO.

Endure pain is more of a ‘oh sh*t’ button that shouldn’t be relied upon, if you’re competent with dodging/healing and have good awareness in dungeons etc.

As someone who isn’t in a guild with a vent, and pugs a lot I personally wouldn’t use such a build as it is heavily reliant on the other party members bringing supportive skills (which rarely happens).

As for the traits it could be improved to have better synergy, they seem wasted on the signet mastery as shake it off is 100x better than signet of stamina even more so with the shouts trait which also benefits fgj giving a lot more synergy to your build etc.

Assuming you got shield and traited into it for the 3sec block stance, again same thing that can be said for endure pain applies here, not really needed if you are dodging ranged attacks and using strafe switching to ranged for melee kiting etc.

This is not true.

1) I can name a ton of enconters where the mobs uses 1200 range pull+oneshot or dozen others "inevitable death" gimmicks; in those situations dodging isn't enough.
Defy Pain is the only way to counter one-shot when CC'd and out of stunbreakers/dodges, period.
I ensure you, when this happens everyone else dies helplessly but me. Then I mass res with banner.
That is a wipe saver and you will have your team stickying to your leg thanking you.
Not to mention it also prevents a lot of deaths in general.
Similarly, EP can and will prevent your death a lot when you are out of dodges, low health etc.
Invulnerabilities are the best form of survival Warrior gets.

2) As a rule of thumb, you can't say any skill is -always- better than another in this game; each skill shines under certain cirtumstances more than others.
Signet of Stamina is better than SIO in many situations, for instance when you need to dodge more and there's no need for stability; in this case SIO is useless and SoS will save your life.

3) I don't see how this build is any more or less reliant on others than any other Warrior build.
I never needed support from others while sporting this; it was actually them to need my banner for res, when bosses wiped the team and I was alive thanks to this build.

When you post criticism please support it with some evidence.
Making generic, factualized claims without elaborating them is pretty much the same as not posting at all as you're not making any point.

Butcher, on 05 October 2012 - 01:01 PM, said:

You know, I got really pissed because everyone seems to think that GS is the only way to play a Warrior, so I posted a Sword+Axe/Rifle build that ultimately got rejected, even though it could've had potential. It could have...if people weren't such d-bags and decided to scream "HERESY!" in their high pitched, nasally voices.

This is honestly the only really good GS build I've come across so far. People act like Warriors have to have a ton of utilities that support everyone else, but you only need one (maybe two). Every other Profession outclasses Warriors when it comes to support. Ultimately, if you're going to bring a Warrior to the dungeon, do it knowing he can rip shit up and buff you with a banner, condition remover, or three Might stacks.

That's all there is to it. Why is everyone so angry when people suggest something...*GASP*...different?

You nailed it.
Honestly, people should stop considering their build or a particular skill to be "a ton better than everything else in the game".
My build is indeed a very powerful set for damage, survivability and control but for instance it isn't going to be giving buffs like a full support build or dealing condition damage like a condition build.
Every build has its focus and it's purpose.

To be blunt, it seems to me Warriors are currently sticking to two gimmicks, one being full signet builds and the other being full shout builds - and dimissing everything else as garbage.
This happened in GW1 too when Warrior/Monk was popular and everyone was going with it and mocking non-Wammo build, look how it ended being a GW1 joke...

What matters to me is that I'm dealing 20k crits while on a very tanky build and I can switch to full control in a matter of seconds.
Far enough to destroy all dungeons.

Edited by Red_Falcon, 05 October 2012 - 04:20 PM.

[KrayZ33]

Quote

This is honestly the only really good GS build I've come across so far. People act like Warriors have to have a ton of utilities that support everyone else, but you only need one (maybe two)

the reason why people take support skills is because they are there.... for free... as a warrior you don't have to sacrifice anything significant in PvE to gain the benefits and thats the biggest flaw in OP's build imho

Edited by KrayZ33, 05 October 2012 - 04:27 PM.

[Stele]

Fizzgig, on 05 October 2012 - 02:34 AM, said:

Was that you in this screen shot?

@Fizzgig - You have differences with the OP's build but what do you think to his gear set up? IMO gear is much more important to get right as it's expensive to change.

I do think Knight's armour/weapons with full Berserker trinkets seems a better way of doing than Berserker armour/weapons and Knight/Valkyrie trinkets.

Any thoughts?

Edited by Stele, 05 October 2012 - 05:35 PM.

[Domifuling]

Red, do you know if Crit dmg is capped?

[Fizzgig]

Red_Falcon, on 05 October 2012 - 11:04 AM, said:

Yes I grabbed your numbers to show max DPS obtainable with 25might 25vuln
So far my highest is 22k but I'm using Knight's so I have 16% less crit damage than you.

PS: Thinking about it, I'd like to see HB with that build but 30 discipline and crit dmg banner.
We could seriously hit the 30k mark one day.

Also I wanted to say sorry if I seemed like a tool before.

Ehh I was a tool lets face it. I like the build and urge people who want a beefy dps build to try it.
The build may not be for me at the moment, but that does not mean its not good. It also does not mean I won't give it a try later.

Edited by Fizzgig, 05 October 2012 - 07:58 PM.

[Fizzgig]

Stele, on 05 October 2012 - 05:34 PM, said:

@Fizzgig - You have differences with the OP's build but what do you think to his gear set up? IMO gear is much more important to get right as it's expensive to change.

I do think Knight's armour/weapons with full Berserker trinkets seems a better way of doing than Berserker armour/weapons and Knight/Valkyrie trinkets.

Any thoughts?

I think the build is fine as is. I myself have been playing it on the safer end with the build in my guide. Now that I am more confident in my ability to be in melee. I think I will use this as my go to build (once I have the gear) for dps.

As far as gear it really depends on how you feel you can handle yourself in a dungeon.

My opinion has changed as I have played the game and gained more experience and confidence in dungeons. I run a mix of knight, valk, and berserker so my dmg is middle of the road with more hp and toughness. I have been slowly switching to more and more dps gear. Also I have learned that the most important bar you can have in a dungeon is your endurance bar.

Also I wanted to note that some of the best builds are ones that can swap traits on the fly. Being able to swap traits around to fit certain situations can be a huge advantage in many builds.

The only thing keeping me from trying this build is cash flow and being able to buy the over priced Divinity runes.

Heh the only real thing I can make a claim to fame about atm is being clumsy and being able to eat Lt. Kholer's whirling blade attack thingy in AC explore.


...sorry for the double post, multi queue noob here...

Edited by Fizzgig, 05 October 2012 - 08:04 PM.

[Ryuushin]

fancy name post but not so invincible as advertisement said

[Gutz]

Red_Falcon, on 05 October 2012 - 04:16 PM, said:

This is not true.

1) I can name a ton of enconters where the mobs uses 1200 range pull+oneshot or dozen others "inevitable death" gimmicks; in those situations dodging isn't enough.

Sure dodging may not be enough you have heals you have conditon removal you have strafing....

I have done almost every explorable this game has to offer, and only in rare cases did i personally use endure pain as an 'oh sh*t' button.

I can name a ton of encounters where you are meant to dodge certain 'inevitable death gimmick' attacks, remove conditions, move around by strafing, and use your heal if all of those options are exhausted then something is wrong.

Unless ANET built an encounter around endure pain?


Defy Pain is the only way to counter one-shot when CC'd and out of stunbreakers/dodges, period.

What point are you trying to make here? That its an 'oh sh*t' button? I said this in my original post therefore I agree with you here.


I ensure you, when this happens everyone else dies helplessly but me. Then I mass res with banner.
That is a wipe saver and you will have your team stickying to your leg thanking you.

Are you seriously using this story/experience of yours as evidence?

Not to mention it also prevents a lot of deaths in general.

There are multiple ways to prevent death 'in general' dodging, strafing, heals, cond removal etc.

Similarly, EP can and will prevent your death a lot when you are out of dodges, low health etc.

You've stated this already.

Invulnerabilities are the best form of survival Warrior gets.

One of many tools to survive, but not meant to be relied upon. There are more CONSISTENT ways to survive as oposed to a short lived stance on a high cooldown.

2) As a rule of thumb, you can't say any skill is -always- better than another in this game; each skill shines under certain cirtumstances more than others.

Fair enough, I agree so i'll rephrase it, for dunegon encounters SIO is more viable than SOS for many reasons, it has a much lower cd (even without the recharge trait), it's a party wide conditon removal, it removes a stuns etc. I'm sorry SOS doesn't compare here.

Signet of Stamina is better than SIO in many situations, for instance when you need to dodge more and there's no need for stability; in this case SIO is useless and SoS will save your life.

Please name me these 'many situations' where you must always dodge, require no need for condition removal, and no risk of kd/stuns etc. (meaning you only use SOS for its passive in this case, which is ridiclous and a waste of a skill slot if this is the ONLY reason to bring it).

3) I don't see how this build is any more or less reliant on others than any other Warrior build.

This has been pointed out throughout the thread.

I never needed support from others while sporting this; it was actually them to need my banner for res, when bosses wiped the team and I was alive thanks to this build.

Im sorry but youve already mentioned that your party has died and only you lived, if this is proving anything its that theres something very wrong with the party itself. Especially if its the same person alive at the end each time.

When you post criticism please support it with some evidence.
Making generic, factualized claims without elaborating them is pretty much the same as not posting at all as you're not making any point.

Im sorry but i had to laugh here, you pretty much summed yourself up in a nutshell for me.

At no point did you provide any evidence, all you stated was 'i can give you x encounters etc'  'once upon a time my party wiped and i lived therefore my build is amazing at surviving'

You call this evidence? You call this fact? Please look at your own comments, instead of attacking mine.

What i gave was my opinion of your build just like 10 others here, if you can't take an opinon i don't know why you're posting on a forum.

Please stop with the strawman arguments and just accept that others may have a view different from your own.

Edited by Gutz, 06 October 2012 - 02:51 AM.

[Red_Falcon]

Domifuling, on 05 October 2012 - 06:46 PM, said:

Red, do you know if Crit dmg is capped?

As far as my tests went, it shouldn't be capped until atleast 220%.
I haven't gone beyond that mark yet

Fizzgig, on 05 October 2012 - 07:56 PM, said:

Also I wanted to note that some of the best builds are ones that can swap traits on the fly. Being able to swap traits around to fit certain situations can be a huge advantage in many builds.

Yup.
The good thing about this is the ability to swap to other setups on the fly without needing a respec.
You can be a 25k crit Warrior in one fight and a battle controller a moment later.

The core winning feature about the Warrior is the ability to adapt to every situation, that's why I feel adaptable builds are better than those that lock you into a specific setup.

[lbljtaig]

red, what sigils/stats do you use for your weapons?

[Butcher]

KrayZ33, on 05 October 2012 - 04:20 PM, said:

the reason why people take support skills is because they are there.... for free... as a warrior you don't have to sacrifice anything significant in PvE to gain the benefits and thats the biggest flaw in OP's build imho

Yes, because with 30 traits in Toughness, a butt-load of toughness on gear, a quicker regenerating dodge bar, and EP(een?) you sure are sacrificing a whole lot in survivability. I guess, rezzing everyone after what could have been a group wipe (because of superior personal survival) isn't supportive enough.

You so silly.

Ryuushin, on 06 October 2012 - 01:03 AM, said:

fancy name post but not so invincible as advertisement said

Maybe you should actually play the build and learn it before making judgements.

As far as I'm concerned, everyone arguing with red are just flapping their lips with nothing to prove their case. It's just a bunch of people wailing "poast #s pl0x!". Put your disillusions aside for a moment and think beyond the builds utility bar.

Get real, people. Actually try the build for yourself for a while, play it right, and then come in here with a verdict. I've been playing the build for a few days now, and my DPS is sky high. My Sword+Axe/Rifle build falls somewhat short of this Berzerker build, but I'm still working on mine. As it rests, this build is just amazing.

So please stop eating around the fruit in the jello.

[HollowDean]

Is there any video of this build in action? I'd really like to see it

[Won _Doe]

Butcher, on 06 October 2012 - 01:10 PM, said:

Maybe you should actually play the build and learn it before making judgements.

As far as I'm concerned, everyone arguing with red are just flapping their lips with nothing to prove their case. It's just a bunch of people wailing "poast #s pl0x!". Put your disillusions aside for a moment and think beyond the builds utility bar.

Get real, people. Actually try the build for yourself for a while, play it right, and then come in here with a verdict. I've been playing the build for a few days now, and my DPS is sky high. My Sword+Axe/Rifle build falls somewhat short of this Berzerker build, but I'm still working on mine. As it rests, this build is just amazing.

So please stop eating around the fruit in the jello.

Bit defensive? If you're not ready for both constructive/harsh AND pointless criticism, I wouldn't suggest posting builds on most forums. That's always applied since GW1. I personally don't see why the build has to be tried to be commented on, we can see what it does, as well as understanding that it seems to revolve around a 10+ sec Endure Pain. A defensive/offensive stat split isn't exactly exploring new ground, and just because tons of warriors here ask about Signet/GS builds here doesn't mean all warriors are running it.

Edited by Won _Doe, 06 October 2012 - 08:44 PM.