485 replies to this topic

[Chava Blue]

n00854180t, on 24 October 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

In any case, the tards still arguing that people that bought chests should have known they'd never get a skin can just shut up now: ArenaNet caving and working on a way to fix this proves you wrong, objectively, so your little opinions about it are irrelevant. If there were no problem, they wouldn't have caved and created a way to fix their mistake.

Um... no, it doesn't prove that at all.

It demonstrates that the results of ANet's decision were unintended, and/or that they changed their minds in response to customer feedback. Which, in my opinion, is a good thing to do.

However, the fact that people who bought chests should have known there was a chance they wouldn't get a skin is factually true, since the drops of the BLC are random rather than guaranteed. There's really no way around that.

I do think the drop rate is too low and I'm glad ANet is adjusting it, but I also think people have to be realistic that when you invest heavily in a game of chance, you may still not win.

[n00854180t]

You just agreed with what I said. The fact that they're fixing the problem indicates there is indeed a problem, which means every person saying there isn't is objectively wrong. Opinions don't even enter into it, it's simply fact and is easily and readily evident.

[Lordkrall]

n00854180t, on 24 October 2012 - 05:41 PM, said:

You just agreed with what I said. The fact that they're fixing the problem indicates there is indeed a problem, which means every person saying there isn't is objectively wrong. Opinions don't even enter into it, it's simply fact and is easily and readily evident.

And yet we have no idea if they "fixed" anything or if they had this planned all along, do we?

[n00854180t]

Lordkrall, on 24 October 2012 - 05:43 PM, said:

And yet we have no idea if they "fixed" anything or if they had this planned all along, do we?

Only if you are braindead or you think ArenaNet is. They are scrambling to fix this right now because people that pay money on their Gem Shop are basically telling them they will never spend a dime again. 24 page of posts saying the same thing with new ones rolling in by the minute.

If you think they "planned" to do this, you are either daft or think they are full retard because this was a huge mistake on their part, and their earlier callous "Oh well you had a *chance* to get a skin, and they're rare (despite us never saying they were rare anywhere at all ever)" response doesn't exactly indicate they "planned" this (i.e., the opposite). It took them 20 more pages of angry customers that have spend thousands of dollars on keys to reverse their stance.

Edited by n00854180t, 24 October 2012 - 05:53 PM.

[Chava Blue]

n00854180t, on 24 October 2012 - 05:41 PM, said:

You just agreed with what I said. The fact that they're fixing the problem indicates there is indeed a problem, which means every person saying there isn't is objectively wrong. Opinions don't even enter into it, it's simply fact and is easily and readily evident.

No, problems like that aren't objective - if the overall trend of public opinion about this was positive instead, this wouldn't be an issue even if the facts of the situation were otherwise the same.

The overall trend of opinion seems to be negative, and I think ANet is absolutely right to address that. Sometimes (and this is one of those times) issues of public opinion need to be acted on.

It's still an opinion, though, and people who disagree with it have just as much right to disagree. This is simply an opinion trend that ANet (again, rightly, I think) decided to adjust their decision in response to.

[Lordkrall]

n00854180t, on 24 October 2012 - 05:51 PM, said:

Only if you are braindead or you think ArenaNet is. They are scrambling to fix this right now because people that pay money on their Gem Shop are basically telling them they will never spend a dime again. 24 page of posts saying the same thing with new ones rolling in by the minute.

If you think they "planned" to do this, you are either daft or think they are full retard because this was a huge mistake on their part, and their earlier callous "Oh well you had a *chance* to get a skin, and they're rare (despite us never saying they were rare anywhere at all ever)" response doesn't exactly indicate they "planned" this (i.e., the opposite). It took them 20 more pages of angry customers that have spend thousands of dollars on keys to reverse their stance.

You seems to have a very good understanding when it comes to ArenaNets inner workings, could you please tell me when the next expansion will come and which will be the main dragon? Seeing as you appear to know exactly how they do things you must work for them, right?

[Pipples]

Eon Lilu, on 23 October 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

I'm just glad alot more players eyes are open now to this sort of thing and won't fall for this kind of explotation again.

It's not exploitation. I am still somewhat of what you would call a 'fanboy', but that is only because I think for myself. Was it a cash grab? Yes. Is it required we participate? No. Did they tell us how rare the skins would be? No. Should the drop rate be higher? Definitely.

But SOME of us think and actually let others do all the 'testing' first. I bought gems, but haven't gotten any since the start and wanted a bag slot or two for my magic-find farmer anyway. Once I saw the low drop rate (brought to my attention by everyone else rushing to get loot), I spent said gems on a bag slot and have some left over instead of on keys.

If you spent a ton of money and got crap, it's your own fault. Learn some self control. Some people go to Vegas and lose their house, others go with a budget and either 1) lose said money and stop or 2) win, put the initial investment back int heir wallet and gamble with their winnings, coming out even at worst and rich at best.

[Mireles]

This thread reminds me of grade school when pokemon cards were popular and kids would blow their allowance on booster packs and hop up and down mad they didn't get a Charizard card out of a box of packs.

It is not gambling because you are not risking real money for a chance of more real money.  You bought a product as advertised, they are not required to state the probabilities of items in the packs, nor does it have any obligation conform to your expectations and what you think is "fair".... It is a product as advertised... it shouldn't need a disclaimer....

It is not Anet's responsibility that you use self control over your impulse buying.  Nor are you required to use real money.  You can always buy gems and sell them for gold and buy it off the trade post if you want a sure thing.

Of course anet is going to address the "drop rate" for all the complainers... those same people will then turn around and re-attempt to obtain the item they want.  They obviously created a desirable product to make people want to blow real money on it.  If you don't want to waste money don't blow it.

Anet like any company is in business to make money off of their desirable products... period.  Nobody forced you to buy or participate.

Edited by Mireles, 24 October 2012 - 06:32 PM.

[Solstice]

Pipples, on 24 October 2012 - 06:01 PM, said:

[...]Should the drop rate be higher? Definitely.[...]

Arenanet would never admit it, but it would be somewhat amusing if the reason turned out to be the decimal point was coded in the wrong place. The drop chance for an event item should of been 15%, not the 1.5%(?) that players are reporting based on gathered information.

Edited by Solstice, 24 October 2012 - 06:22 PM.

[Pipples]

Solstice, on 24 October 2012 - 06:22 PM, said:

Arenanet would never admit it, but it would be somewhat amusing if the reason turned out to be the decimal point was coded in the wrong place. The drop chance for an event item should of been 15%, not the 1.5%(?) that players are reporting based on gathered information.

Oh, very amusing. But that's the nice thing about MMOs... they can change things on the fly. Whether it was intentional or accidental, they can go into the code (or the GUI) and change the percentage value, release the patch and post a server announcement to tell us we can restart for an optional update. Bam, problem solved.

[Zorian51]

Solstice, on 24 October 2012 - 06:22 PM, said:

Arenanet would never admit it, but it would be somewhat amusing if the reason turned out to be the decimal point was coded in the wrong place. The drop chance for an event item should of been 15%, not the 1.5%(?) that players are reporting based on gathered information.

If that was the case it would of been put in stealth style in last nights patch. I don't see people saying they are getting more skins out of the chest so I highly doubt it.

[Solstice]

zwei2stein, on 24 October 2012 - 02:14 PM, said:

This is the big question: Why the HELL would you drop 50$ on chests before you even know how they work?

You’ve already answered that question, the type of player who was potentially trying to play the odds at the very start of an event hoping to win big in terms of in-game currency. Arenanet does not smell of roses on this one, but neither are some of these big purchasers’ innocuous players looking to enjoy the Halloween event only to be brutally mauled by Arenanet.

They were purposefully looking to capitalise on the ‘GW1 effect’ of higher trading prices on event-related items at the very start. In their greed they likely figured a necessity to get items on the trading post as soon as possible to cash out before the influx. Presumably chancing the odds that they could net in-game gold in excess of what their $50 would normally get them through gem exchange.

Unfortunately, they can now play the innocent party stating how they were shafted by Arenanet without ever admitting their intended outcome to shaft other players in-game.

But I’m just that cynical and suspicious.

[Gli]

Solstice, on 24 October 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

They were purposefully looking to capitalise on the ‘GW1 effect’ of higher trading prices on event-related items at the very start. In their greed they likely figured a necessity to get items on the trading post as soon as possible to cash out before the influx. Presumably chancing the odds that they could net in-game gold in excess of what their $50 would normally get them through gem exchange.

ANet enabled this behavior by explicitly stating beforehand that these skins exclusive to the BL chests would be tradable. Nothing else that ever appeared in the boxes has ever been tradable.

Was this a not-so-subtle invitation to elicit a spending spree from the greedy people you're talking about?

We'll never know for sure, but a cynical side of me can't help suspecting: "Yes, it was".

[Wayshuba]

Lordkrall, on 24 October 2012 - 05:56 PM, said:

You seems to have a very good understanding when it comes to ArenaNets inner workings, could you please tell me when the next expansion will come and which will be the main dragon? Seeing as you appear to know exactly how they do things you must work for them, right?

OMG, not THIS comeback again. Are you going to incessantly defend their behavior when his post pointed to the FACTS everyone has available. In case you missed them:

Fact: ArenaNet has a big cash shop display showing only Halloween items on buy the BLC keys. No where in that does it indicate the are rare or that you only have a chance to get them.

Fact: In the patch notes with the release, ArenaNet simply stated they added the halloween stuff to the BLCs. No where was it stated that it was rare.

Fact: People dropped a lot of money in some cases to get nothing Halloween from the chests (this one I hope is obvious).

Fact: Many angry customers started complaining on their official forums.

Fact: When the complaints started rolling in is finally when ArenaNet officially responded to say the chance was rare. Basically telling their customers the very low drop rate was indeed intentional and tough luck you lost your money

Fact: After hundreds of complaints, tens of thousands of views, screenshots of the store and patch notes showing how misleading ArenaNet was about the whole thing did they finally officially respond a second time to say they were going to do something about it.

Log in, look at the store, read the patch notes and read the thread on the official forums. These are all in public view. Stop trying to dismiss people as having to have some explicit insite into the company or ESP when these are as plain as day to anyone.

Edited by Wayshuba, 24 October 2012 - 08:04 PM.

[Ritualist]

Solstice, on 24 October 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

Unfortunately, they can now play the innocent party stating how they were shafted by Arenanet without ever admitting their intended outcome to shaft other players in-game.

It's how the cash shop works!
If you throw money at A.Net, then you are SUPPOSED to come out on top over the people who choose to not waste their cash.

Edited by Protoss, 24 October 2012 - 08:18 PM.

[chrisbdrake]

Wayshuba, on 24 October 2012 - 12:57 PM, said:

This points to another issue I have with this cash shop model overall - when did the game industry go from companies producing quality products that gave customers value to little more than online casinos?

You don't know much about casinos, do you?

[TekkaMaki]

*cough* Zynga *cough*

[zwei2stein]

Protoss, on 24 October 2012 - 08:09 PM, said:

Unfortunately, they can now play the innocent party stating how they were shafted by Arenanet without ever admitting their intended outcome to shaft other players in-game.

But I’m just that cynical and suspicious.

I think you are realistic and knowledgeable about gamers. :-)

[Butcher]

Lordkrall, on 24 October 2012 - 04:51 PM, said:

And how do you know that they "caved and decided to create a way"?
Maybe they had that in mind all the time?

Or maybe you need to take off your tin foil hat.

Anyway, I may not be the best informed when it comes to how the TP works, but I did know that they're going to make BLC items holloween craftables. It's a little too late for that, though. I could be enjoying skins now, but I'm not, and now I'll feel unnecessarily pressed for time.

This event is supposed to be fun, which it is, but it'd be more fun if I didn't feel like I had to grind for every damn reward the event offers. It's ridiculous. I thought this game was supposed to be casual in most senses. I understand the need to make players work for cool skins, but during events like this, it should be more like "haha! drinketh from thine cup, thou GW2 supporters!". It's not, though. Instead, ANet took the same approach with holiday items as they do with Legendaries. What the hell.

[tufy]

Wayshuba, on 24 October 2012 - 02:11 PM, said:

The comment about a guildmate getting it for 1g is surprising. Since the TP is across all servers and they have been 40g-45g since launch.

It surprised me as well - had I found it before him, I'd buy and resell it for higher price for sure

That said, even 40g is reasonable for assured item you want and no RNG involved, especially considering he cost of keys.

[Chava Blue]

Butcher, on 25 October 2012 - 12:50 PM, said:

This event is supposed to be fun, which it is, but it'd be more fun if I didn't feel like I had to grind for every damn reward the event offers.

You get the book backpack skin for doing a handful of quests, the devil horns are free in the gem store, you get Trick or Treat bags from drops or knocking on doors, and you can mine candy corn or get that from drops. That's not grind, that's just normal gameplay. (Or not having to do even that, for the horns.) The developers have strongly implied there will be more rewards for future acts.

If you feel like you have to grind for the other cosmetic stuff, that's your business... but the game isn't forcing you to.

I think part of the problem here is people convincing themselves that the event is offering less than it does, and fixating on details rather than seeing the big picture.

Edited by Chava Blue, 25 October 2012 - 04:15 PM.

[Zero_Soulreaver]

It would be so bad if the drop rate was an infinite decimal number that keeps changing. They must have used pie as their drop rate% no  wonder only some people get it on a full moon, in the snow, on a Sunday morning.

I feel bad for anyone who opened well over 50 chests and got absolutely nothing.  That is really unfortunate. I would enjoy it more if it was a 1% drop off of a dungeon boss, at least then if you don't even get it you get some sort of reward doing the dungeon to begin with.

[Eon Lilu]

Here we go again......

Quote

New Lost Shores Items from the Black Lion Trading Company

The Gem Store will be well stocked in November! Unique minis and brand-new weapon skins made just for the Lost Shores weekend event are just some of what the Black Lion Trading Company has in store.

[Akula]

Eon Lilu, on 12 November 2012 - 07:11 PM, said:

Here we go again......

They shot themselves in their foot twice today! That's hilarious, you'd think they learn from mistakes!

Edited by Akula, 12 November 2012 - 07:18 PM.

[Eon Lilu]

I think im going to start a new idea.

F*** the holiday/special event items and skins, it's never going to end.

Edited by Eon Lilu, 12 November 2012 - 07:20 PM.

[Akula]

Eon Lilu, on 12 November 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

I think im going to start a new idea.

F*** the holiday items and skins, it's never going to end.

It surely won't end. Never. Apparently this is the only way ArenaNet is able to make money. Putting up some skins for sale in the gem store directly must be very frowned upon.

[Chava Blue]

Eon Lilu, on 12 November 2012 - 07:11 PM, said:

    Here we go again......

No indication from what you quoted that the items are from BLCs. Just that they're in the gem store. It didn't mention anything to do with RNG. You may turn out to be right, but why not wait and see before leaping to conclusions?

Edited by Chava Blue, 12 November 2012 - 09:22 PM.

[Al Shamari]

I think the Halloween update notes mentioned Black Lion Chests specifically, where this one doesn't say anything about it. I personally speculate that they will be direct buys from the gem store, which I have no problem with...

[Akula]

Chava Blue, on 12 November 2012 - 09:21 PM, said:

No indication from what you quoted that the items are from BLCs. Just that they're in the gem store. It didn't mention anything to do with RNG. You may turn out to be right, but why not wait and see before leaping to conclusions?

Al Shamari, on 12 November 2012 - 10:14 PM, said:

I think the Halloween update notes mentioned Black Lion Chests specifically, where this one doesn't say anything about it. I personally speculate that they will be direct buys from the gem store, which I have no problem with...

Then please, by all means, tell me what that chest is. Looks like a new kind of BLC to me:

Edited by Akula, 12 November 2012 - 10:17 PM.

[Al Shamari]

Akula, on 12 November 2012 - 10:17 PM, said:

Then please, by all means, tell me what that chest is. Looks like a new kind of BLC to me:

I'm sorry, I'm going to speculate via direct quotes instead of some clip art they chose to include on the page. So, if we look at both the present quote and the previous one for the Halloween event...

"The Gem Store will be well stocked in November! Unique minis and brand-new weapon skins made just for the Lost Shores weekend event are just some of what the Black Lion Trading Company has in store."

versus...

"The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!"

Hmmmmmm...

Edited by Al Shamari, 12 November 2012 - 10:30 PM.