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GW2 longevity?

gw2 longevity

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#361 elmprotector

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 03:52 PM

View PostKnuckledust13, on 25 October 2012 - 08:52 PM, said:

No, it doesn't have potential for longevity.

First of all, they plain and simple lied to their old and most loyal customers on their many pre-release interviews and Manifesto. The game we received is NOTHING like the game they pictured. Sure, it can be fun from level 1 to 40 but then you see how rushed it was and how badly done things became.

Grinding 750 hours for a skin is NOT my definition of fun. And since the grind for gear from other MMOs is replaced by the grind for fluff here in GW2, it is not any less grindy. You are simply grinding for different things. People will say "you don't have to" get that skin, but you also don't have to grind for that higher tier gear. This is not fun and the design sucks.

Now we are on skins: the VASTLY MAJORITY of the skins besides Greatswords.. plain suck. This is not even arguable. Just take a look at every dagger and offhand. This also proves how rushed the game was.

The game relies heavily on RNG and gamble to achieve things. It feels like a Online Casino to use the Mystic Forge to get, for instance, clovers. After grinding hours and hours for karma and buying the shards, you can simply lose it all gambling.

Skill system: don't get me started. When was the last time you played a mmo with such a dull skill system? I really could not believe at first that I would be stuck forever with that five skills, if I chose to keep using the weapon. I honestly have no idea what the hell the person in charge was thinking. This is the most unimaginative, unfun and boring skill system I have seen. You could as well unlock all trait points at level 1 and have nothing else to do, because progression is also non-existant in the game.

Fanboys can argue all they want, no one returns to level 1 areas "for fun". No one runs CoE "for fun" because it is simply harder than other dungeons. No normal human being can possibly think grinding 750 hours for a cosmetic item on a mmo is fun. If you worked for 750 hours and received an average joe $30/hour, you could buy a mother*ing car

I got around 120 friends on my list since release. On early days, there would be a minimum of 80 to 90 people logged at all times. Now when I see six people it is a miracle, and probably weekend. I logged about 30 minutes for the past month because the game has no incentive to keep MMO players playing. Maybe if you want to play barbie....

Well you sound like a hard core who didnt listen to ArenaNet before release.   All the complaining I hear is from people who dont understand what ArenaNet is doing.  This is not a grind for power game.  You will not be more powerful because you spend more time in game.

I still see Que's in WVW so yeah its dieing.....  To those who talk about balance.  LOL there are no MMO's that are totally balanced.. but the great thing about spvp or wvw.. you can play any class at any time you dont have to level a class to play one in wvw or spvp.  And Spvp especially is set up where skill is king.  And to a hard core it scares them.   Just read the hard cores posts it ooozes "I spend more time in game but I dont receive mega power over those who dont.

If pop was dieing why do I get a que getting into WVW?  I want to do any instance it takes me at most of 10 mins to be running one with a full group.  The special events gw2 has had have been great fun... wait sorry most power gamers are not looking for fun they want time = power and they just refuse to admit they were told for MONTHS that time was not going to = power.

Sorry hit enter by accident so only half posted.

All I see is tons of casuals having fun and a small group of power gamers who are screaming like babies because they are not getting what they want.... when arenanet told you for months that this game was not made for power gamers.  

And I always say this... power gamers have been found to be only 10% of the playing community by multiple studies.  But they post and scream to look like more.  Casuals have fun and play.. power gamers complain and moan most of the time because they are not being catered too like a rich kid.

This is my 2 cents game will be rolling great with casual players for years to come... and one day the power gamers will finally listen to arenanet and learn to play casual or just leave.

Edited by elmprotector, 11 November 2012 - 03:55 PM.


#362 Asudementio

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 05:28 PM

View PostLarsen, on 11 November 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

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Literally nobody has ever said they want this game to be WoW. It's a strawman argument made up by fanboys who need something to insult the "haters" over.

I just can't get over how hilariously hostile, dishonest, irrational and wildly fervent people are in defense of the fact that this game has no productive activities that aren't depleted in a matter of less than a month. So illogical. "The game has almost no content and I like that, don't ask for it to change or I'll insult you and direct personal attacks against you!"

Personally, I think there's a subset of players who are very pleased that there's finally a noteworthy game where they can be among the most accomplished (because there's almost nothing to accomplish) without any kind of skill or effort whatsoever. Thus, they defend a game that has no content and terrible gameplay purely because it's the game that lets bad players be among the best.

If you consider any of the repetitive tripe in other MMOs productive and the endgame content available in GW2 not then shame on you because they are equally grindy and equally meaningless. Oh and thoughts like your third statement should probably be kept to yourself- they are rather stupid.

Edited by Asudementio, 11 November 2012 - 05:30 PM.


#363 MFGrady

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 05:59 PM

View PostLarsen, on 11 November 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

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Literally nobody has ever said they want this game to be WoW. It's a strawman argument made up by fanboys who need something to insult the "haters" over.

I just can't get over how hilariously hostile, dishonest, irrational and wildly fervent people are in defense of the fact that this game has no productive activities that aren't depleted in a matter of less than a month. So illogical. "The game has almost no content and I like that, don't ask for it to change or I'll insult you and direct personal attacks against you!"

Personally, I think there's a subset of players who are very pleased that there's finally a noteworthy game where they can be among the most accomplished (because there's almost nothing to accomplish) without any kind of skill or effort whatsoever. Thus, they defend a game that has no content and terrible gameplay purely because it's the game that lets bad players be among the best.

I'm not sure what you mean. Exactly what is productive about ANY VIDEO GAME? Video games are counter productive in nature.

I have been doing the same things since release, which is PS, map exploration. WvW, and dungeon runs. I have two characters at 80 and I'm working on a third, and even though I am doing the same thing NONE OF MY EXPERIENCES HAVE BEEN THE SAME.

You state it very clearly that you want this game to be WoW with your expectations. The only games that have what you are looking for are WoW and games that try to profit off of its formula.

Please define content. There's the huge world, multiple professions, multiple crafts, dungeons, WvW, sPvP, all of which remains relevant regardless of whether you are level 5 or level 50.

When you say there is not content, you mean to say "There is no content that is gated by time consuming, tedious and repetitive tasks which will give me a statistical advantage over other players." If you actually enjoyed playing the game, you would be content with the content (ha) but its clear that you don't. I think that Guild Wars 2 can use more challenging content, but I ACTUALLY ENJOY PLAYING THE GAME AS IT IS. If you don't like the game as is, in the event that they add a carrot on a stick, you'll be bored the moment you catch it, because you, and let me spell this one out for you: DON'T. LIKE. THE GAME.

This isn't surprising considering most of you don't even like WoW, otherwise you would have never left in the first place.

#364 seanyo_82

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 06:02 PM

This topic really isn't going anywhere is it?

To sum up the whole entire thread; different people like to do different things in games.

#365 Dasryn

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 06:33 PM

View PostLarsen, on 11 November 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

[/background][/size][/font][/color]

Literally nobody has ever said they want this game to be WoW. It's a strawman argument made up by fanboys who need something to insult the "haters" over.

I just can't get over how hilariously hostile, dishonest, irrational and wildly fervent people are in defense of the fact that this game has no productive activities that aren't depleted in a matter of less than a month. So illogical. "The game has almost no content and I like that, don't ask for it to change or I'll insult you and direct personal attacks against you!"

Personally, I think there's a subset of players who are very pleased that there's finally a noteworthy game where they can be among the most accomplished (because there's almost nothing to accomplish) without any kind of skill or effort whatsoever. Thus, they defend a game that has no content and terrible gameplay purely because it's the game that lets bad players be among the best.

its not a straw man argument, the number one criticism is that there is no endgame content.  endgame content that is standardized by wow.  dont tell me that its a straw man argument when you are clearly gauging your version of end game content to that of wow's.

#366 Red_Falcon

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 08:29 PM

View PostLarsen, on 11 November 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

[/background][/size][/font][/color]

Literally nobody has ever said they want this game to be WoW. It's a strawman argument made up by fanboys who need something to insult the "haters" over.

I just can't get over how hilariously hostile, dishonest, irrational and wildly fervent people are in defense of the fact that this game has no productive activities that aren't depleted in a matter of less than a month. So illogical. "The game has almost no content and I like that, don't ask for it to change or I'll insult you and direct personal attacks against you!"

Personally, I think there's a subset of players who are very pleased that there's finally a noteworthy game where they can be among the most accomplished (because there's almost nothing to accomplish) without any kind of skill or effort whatsoever. Thus, they defend a game that has no content and terrible gameplay purely because it's the game that lets bad players be among the best.

Funny how you said "productive activities".
Some people don't game to produce, they produce 8 hours a day already and play games to relax and have fun.
The day mom kicks you out of home and you'll start wearing a paper hat 8 hours a day you'll realize the value of having a game waiting you home that offers a ton of entertaining things and no required treadmills that feel like another job.

Yes, GW2 is a game for people with a real life beyond the game, it isn't a substitute for a job or instruction.
I actually believe it's very bad and unhealthy - if not life-ruining - that a game offers you content that makes you work like a job so you feel like you're doing something like normal people, while you're actually just the equivalent of an RMT farmer, 'cept you make no money.


Games like WoW are just like trash TV who keep children busy while bad parents ignore them.
A game should offer entertainment, not addiction.

#367 RabidusIncendia

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:03 PM

View PostRed_Falcon, on 11 November 2012 - 08:29 PM, said:

you're actually just the equivalent of an RMT farmer, 'cept you make no money.

:3 that sums it up in less than a sentence.
Fun while it lasted.  I guess.

#368 Red_Falcon

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:31 PM

Addictions and building an illusory life inside a virtual world are never good things, regardless of the settings.
If you can play games you can also watch movies, read books, call people, chat, talk, etc.

I don't want to sound like a strict parent mind you, I'm talking out of experience.
Back in my teen days I had a car crash and had gotten addicted to a game and lost 7kg of muscle mass (which is a lot due to my height), had problems with my sight and no social life for months.
I would never promote a system of addictions that transforms a healthy person into a maggot - I'm happy Anet promotes controlled play and doing other things.

I know WoW kind of made it a standard that MMO stands for addiction, but it isn't actually what MMOs were made for.

Edited by Feathermoore, 11 November 2012 - 10:40 PM.
removed quoted deleted content


#369 xLOKIx0830

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:05 PM

PvE - Very little longevity. 1-80 leveling is very entertaining and much better than any other mmo I've played. But, once you've hit level 80, and reach "end-game", it's all grind. I like the concept of having all the content in the game available to you at any time, which means I can always do what I enjoy doing. The hard truth here, though, is that there isn't enough variety and challenge spread throughout the world to give level 80's incentive to go out of the level 80 zones.

The halloween update really sparked my hopes for this game, because if they're able to do stuff like that every 1-2 months, this game has a very promising future. I'm also giddy just thinking about the update on the 15th. As it stands now, PvE has little longevity, as it's mostly about accumulating prestige and looks (that are very time consuming and expensive to get), but the updates they release have the potential to increase PvE longevity by a lot. As I said earlier, all the content is available to you at level 80, the problem is the variety and challenge. More content will only alleviate that problem.

PvP - A ton of longevity. The name of the game here is combat, and gw2 nails it. This is the most balanced game I've seen at launch, and it's only getting better as the game gets updated. The fights are interesting and engaging, skill based, and rewarding. sPvP is a great distraction from PvE and huge time sink, although it can get a little zergy at times. tPvP is extremely well done and gives me the most enjoyment in the game, win or lose. WvWvW is interesting and is a good mix between PvE and PvP.

There are some problems, no doubt. But if Anet is able to keep this relative balance, and add some more essentials, such as spectator mode, ranking, and more weapons and traits, this game will have a bright future for the PvP scene.

#370 Glov

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:13 PM

think we just need more dungeons/etc for PvE, since, just like GW1, all you can do on "end-game" is titles. I think this problem will be solved in time, but people will never stop asking for new dungeons every week o two.

#371 Leger

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:15 PM

View PostxLOKIx0830, on 11 November 2012 - 10:05 PM, said:

PvE - Very little longevity. 1-80 leveling is very entertaining and much better than any other mmo I've played. But, once you've hit level 80, and reach "end-game", it's all grind. I like the concept of having all the content in the game available to you at any time, which means I can always do what I enjoy doing. The hard truth here, though, is that there isn't enough variety and challenge spread throughout the world to give level 80's incentive to go out of the level 80 zones.

The halloween update really sparked my hopes for this game, because if they're able to do stuff like that every 1-2 months, this game has a very promising future. I'm also giddy just thinking about the update on the 15th. As it stands now, PvE has little longevity, as it's mostly about accumulating prestige and looks (that are very time consuming and expensive to get), but the updates they release have the potential to increase PvE longevity by a lot. As I said earlier, all the content is available to you at level 80, the problem is the variety and challenge. More content will only alleviate that problem.

PvP - A ton of longevity. The name of the game here is combat, and gw2 nails it. This is the most balanced game I've seen at launch, and it's only getting better as the game gets updated. The fights are interesting and engaging, skill based, and rewarding. sPvP is a great distraction from PvE and huge time sink, although it can get a little zergy at times. tPvP is extremely well done and gives me the most enjoyment in the game, win or lose. WvWvW is interesting and is a good mix between PvE and PvP.

There are some problems, no doubt. But if Anet is able to keep this relative balance, and add some more essentials, such as spectator mode, ranking, and more weapons and traits, this game will have a bright future for the PvP scene.

Yeah I pretty much disagree with that entirely.

#372 Gervase

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:20 PM

Personally, I don't think so. My guild used to have 210 members, usually logging each day at different times of the day, now we are about 4 left, out of those 4 only one logs daily the rest, rarely. Problem is, this game got no real end game, no real mid game, hell it barely feels like a game at all. SWTOR failed cause they created a single player game and tried to sell it as a MMO, AION Failed cause it was a standard Korean mmo, same as Tera. If you are a person who plays PvE every once in a while and take months to get 10 levels, then maybe the game might long live for you, but even then areas are so death you can't really enjoy it fully if at all. Many times a boss will be in the area you need to work on for your heart quest and no one will come to assist you, since there is no one besides bots around.

Spvp was really fun at the start, but same maps = same strategy and once a mesmer appears, you go hide, a guardian appear you ignore him, so on it goes. WvW was destroyed when they allowed people to move around servers freely, specially since almost everyone in there is a pve n00b looking for free exp and karma. These days I can go 9 v 1 and easily kill at least 7 of them, hell if there wasn't a down state I could take all of them out no problem, that's how bad the population playing it is.

Main problem lies within reaching 80, doing so is a joke, if you craft your own gear you be 80 in about 2 days max, unless you are super casual like some of my friends who reached 80 in about a week. Quest repeat themselves way too much, kill sons of svarmir, kill fire legion...events are always escort this person...protect them while they do X thing, yeah nothing fancy or interesting, in fact after leaving the starting areas you are better off ignoring the dynamic events.

Now you are 80...so what? If you have a crafting discipline in a day or 2 you can get fully geared, with new karma rewards from dailies, you can get a full set of temple gear no problem, just craft/buy yourself a weapon and you done, then what? Nothing, dungeons aren't challenging, in fact they feel more like a test of patience than a skill test, is like saying in other games you need to train yourself to do good and feel rewarded after, here you just stare at the game trying to not blink until the game forces you to, then they reward you with a few coins and that's it.  

The game is build around skins, yet all the skins look horrible, I bought myself a citadel of flames axe, it looked like if a 5 years old kid painted some crayola lines in a paper gave it to his dad and make him so proud he turned it into a ingame skin. Crafted weapons...my god...give me my lvl 1 sword any day, cause those look even worse. Want a decent skin from karma recipe vendors or mystic forge...? Prepare to grind for days upon days upon days, this would mean longevity but nop they aren't worth it.

Cultural armor is another goal, bad stats, insane prices, don't even look all that good.

World bosses....? You can solo those, their AI is so simple you can stand there hitting them and kill em on your own, except the claw of Jormag, who is a test of patience...Rewards for killing them? Lol yeah sure.

This leads to the final solution, you get some magic find gear, go around killing crap in orr and try to gamble for a pre legendary...sounds like Diablo 3 to me....and god Diablo 3 was a huge failure.

The story...there seems to be no lore at all, well there is but is so simple and linear you really don't feel like part of it after you leave your starting zone.

Exploring the world? Finished in 2 days...got 2 gift of exploration which i destroyed since they only occupied my inventory space.

Everything needs money and everything is a money sink. Sounds like those old days where the king would squeeze every penny from the peasants in taxes...way points price makes you not even want to travel lol.

People might say you paid only 60 bucks for this you don't have the right to ask for more content cause you aren't paying a subscription. Well allow me to tell you, you are wrong. Many people paid tons in gems to get stuff they thought would help them in the future, many many games out there cost 60$ specially console ones, all of them gives hours upon hours of fun, FPS, Rock star games like GTA series. red dead redemption so on. People who paid these 60$ are your clients, if they aren't happy with your content they will leave, then when you release your expansions, they will not buy, you release your new town skins, nop not here, not gonna buy either.

With those 60 bucks, I could have bought the new rift expansion, or WoWs, or 4 months of a game subscription or many condoms or food, or many months of porn sites subscriptions. Is not the amount you paid for it, is the fact that you decided to invest into Arena Net's product, if they fail to deliver well, next time they come around with something way better, guess wut? We aren't buying.

#373 xLOKIx0830

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:29 PM

View PostLeger, on 11 November 2012 - 10:15 PM, said:

Yeah I pretty much disagree with that entirely.

Care to explain? Just saying you don't agree hardly contributes to the discussion.

#374 Tenicord

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:34 PM

I don't think it has longevity right now. I'm already bored. Sure there are things to do but nothing that keeps me as interested as when I leveled to 80 a couple times. I'm kinda embarrassed that I was such a vocal supporter of the game, but oh well. Elder Scrolls online and the reboot of FFXIV might be where it's at... but the truth is, other than Aion and Terra, I've never gotten so bored with MMO so fast.  But there is no monthly fee so I can always come back when they fix the game and add real endgame content and adjust the heart rewards ect.

#375 Gervase

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:43 PM

View PostTenicord, on 11 November 2012 - 10:34 PM, said:

I don't think it has longevity right now. I'm already bored. Sure there are things to do but nothing that keeps me as interested as when I leveled to 80 a couple times. I'm kinda embarrassed that I was such a vocal supporter of the game, but oh well. Elder Scrolls online and the reboot of FFXIV might be where it's at... but the truth is, other than Aion and Terra, I've never gotten so bored with MMO so fast.  But there is no monthly fee so I can always come back when they fix the game and add real endgame content and adjust the heart rewards ect.
Hard to see anything with Final Fantasy on the title as a worthy product.

Square Enix is a good example of what might happen to Anet, back in the 90's any game created by Square soft was a must have, some of enix too, they join together and bam, all their games are a must ignore. Blizzard seems to be heading in that direction as well.

#376 MFGrady

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:49 PM

View PostGervase, on 11 November 2012 - 10:20 PM, said:

Somewhat Reasonable Opinion

I understand what you're saying, but you really cant hold it against ANet that you don't enjoy the game, when many others due. I was disappointed with SWTOR, Champion Online and APB, not because I thought they would be the next WoW killer, but because their approach looked to be refreshing and I like playing in virtual persistent worlds. SWTOR was failed WoW clone, CO broke 90% of the promises it made during development, and APB was bug ridden hack fest. Like a sensible adult, I moved on and tried something new, and those games are still around, with or without me.

You get what you pay for. People paid for gems, and the enjoyment they get from those gems are up to them and what they decide to spend them on. I haven't spent a single penny on Gems, and I hold this game in much higher regard than I did CO, or APB, or Mabinogi, games which I blew more money on than I should because it was necessary to enjoy the game. Buying Gems does not entitle you to any more say or content than someone who doesn't, because you are buying Gems for stuff in the Gem store. That is all. That's like saying that Walgreens should have arcade machines in them because you buy toilet paper from there.

At the end of the day GW2 isn't the game you wanted, probably wasn't before you bought it, and probably won't be in the future. We'll do quite alright without you and whatever 250 odd people you seem to represent.

#377 Gervase

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:59 PM

You may be ok without me, but as more and more people who loved the game at the start start to feel like me, you will not feel as well as you do today. Massive amounts of people are leaving by the day, not only that but those who are leaving are those worth having around, those who make pvp and wvw a challenging and enjoyable activity. When more like me and those odd like me leave, you will see more Q_Q thread about pvp and WvW being a worthless zerg fest. This not only makes more people leave, but scare people away from even trying the game if they haven't.

#378 Dasryn

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 11:18 PM

all i can say is research products before you buy. truly know what it is you are going for and what it is that you want in a game.

i bought the game on 10/31/2012.  the game released 8/28/2012 - i took my time, i did my research, i waited for the reviews.

i am wise.

i am having a great time.

i dont expect more than what i have now.

so sorry you are sad and disillusioned and felt you were promised something you werent, but guess what? GW1 was a niche title with a smaller community, GW2 will get along just as fine.

Edited by Feathermoore, 11 November 2012 - 11:19 PM.
remove flamebait


#379 RabidusIncendia

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 11:22 PM

Well if you only played the game 12 days I can see why you'd have these opinions.  Actually shoot, why are you even arguing about GW2 longevity if you've just scratched the surface?

Edited by RabidusIncendia, 11 November 2012 - 11:27 PM.

Fun while it lasted.  I guess.

#380 BovinityCow

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 11:38 PM

Quote

If it then turns out that my "new, special pizza" is a pizza without toppings, have I delivered on my promise?

Yep.

GW2 made this HUGE point of talking about all the things they were removing from the "Typical MMO". They were removing tanks and healers and quests and raids and progression and this and that.

So naturally, a lot of us were thinking, "Wow, surely they'll be replacing all that with something awesome!"

Nope. We got the pizza with no toppings, because they removed every single topping to be "original".

For example, look at the Trinity thing. They removed it alright. What did they replace it with, though? Nothing. The PvE in this game plays exactly like a "typical MMO" would play if you took 5 DPS into a dungeon. You'd be kiting and running and CCing stuff and generally trying to not get hit. There's just nothing original, nothing that says "This is Guild Wars 2!" in the content.

So much removal went on, and so little effort seemed to go into filling the void left over. There's a lot of people like myself that were hugely excited about the concept of a "new" type of MMO and ended up being horribly disappointed when we got just another WoW clone in denial with all the content stripped out of it.

#381 MFGrady

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:22 AM

View PostBovinityCow, on 11 November 2012 - 11:38 PM, said:

Yep.

GW2 made this HUGE point of talking about all the things they were removing from the "Typical MMO". They were removing tanks and healers and quests and raids and progression and this and that.

So naturally, a lot of us were thinking, "Wow, surely they'll be replacing all that with something awesome!"

Nope. We got the pizza with no toppings, because they removed every single topping to be "original".

For example, look at the Trinity thing. They removed it alright. What did they replace it with, though? Nothing. The PvE in this game plays exactly like a "typical MMO" would play if you took 5 DPS into a dungeon. You'd be kiting and running and CCing stuff and generally trying to not get hit. There's just nothing original, nothing that says "This is Guild Wars 2!" in the content.

So much removal went on, and so little effort seemed to go into filling the void left over. There's a lot of people like myself that were hugely excited about the concept of a "new" type of MMO and ended up being horribly disappointed when we got just another WoW clone in denial with all the content stripped out of it.

The only way this game is a WoW clone is if you define WoW as "The first game to have a persistent fantasy world". They are worlds apart.

What you miss when they removed the trinity is the fact that there shouldn't have been one in the first place. Combat is not restricted to "Tanks tank, healers heal, dps DPS". The only reason why you end up with 5 people running around trying to do DPS is because that's all everyone wants to be: DPS. People who enjoy tanking and healing are a minority: most people who do so do it out of the desire to be wanted or out of necessity. The reason why combat without the trinity system is so hectic is because people are so brainwashed by it, they try to have a trinity without the proper tools and wonder why it doesn't work.

Speaking of pizza, you imply that pizza with tons of toppings is automatically better than pizza without. I'd take simple fresh cheese pizza over a frozen pizza with expired and bland toppings on it.

#382 BovinityCow

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:32 AM

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The only way this game is a WoW clone is if you define WoW as "The first game to have a persistent fantasy world". They are worlds apart.

It's a WoW clone in denial. There really nothing much to debate about that, Guild Wars 2 has not moved the genre ahead, innovated anything in the genre, or changed how future MMO's will be developed. It's just your standard hotkey based third person MMO.

The big difference between WoW and GW2 isn't what GW2 added, it's what they took away. Namely, any content. There's simply not much to do, and the frequency with which that observation came up even in the first month of the game should have been pretty telling. Even the super-endgame-ultimate-weapons that they touted so much don't actually involve any content...you just turn yourself into a RMT-Farmer for weeks or months and eventually buy it.

Wow, thanks, A.Net. That's content, alright!

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What you miss when they removed the trinity is the fact that there shouldn't have been one in the first place. Combat is not restricted to "Tanks tank, healers heal, dps DPS". The only reason why you end up with 5 people running around trying to do DPS is because that's all everyone wants to be: DPS. People who enjoy tanking and healing are a minority: most people who do so do it out of the desire to be wanted or out of necessity. The reason why combat without the trinity system is so hectic is because people are so brainwashed by it, they try to have a trinity without the proper tools and wonder why it doesn't work.

You try to make it all sound so exciting and unique, and yet you didn't address the issue at all.

GW2 made a huge deal out of removing the trinity, but didn't put anything in it's place. The combat isn't "hectic" or "exciting", it's exactly how I played in EverQuest or World of Warcraft if I were trying to kill a tough mob without a tank or a healer around. There's nothing new or innovative about it. There's nothing that says, "This is what Guild Wars 2 brought to the table."

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Speaking of pizza, you imply that pizza with tons of toppings is automatically better than pizza without. I'd take simple fresh cheese pizza over a frozen pizza with expired and bland toppings on it.

I never understood why people nitpick analogies. It really doesn't make any sense.

#383 Dasryn

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:40 AM

View PostRabidusIncendia, on 11 November 2012 - 11:22 PM, said:

Well if you only played the game 12 days I can see why you'd have these opinions.  Actually shoot, why are you even arguing about GW2 longevity if you've just scratched the surface?

what did you say?  i barely scratched the surface?  meaning, there is so much content in the game that nearly half a month of playtime is "barely scratching the surface"?

i mean, there are people in this very thread claiming that GW2 has less than a month of content, yet you are telling me that in almost half a month, ive "barely scratched the surface".

lol, you people.

Edited by Rickter, 12 November 2012 - 12:40 AM.


#384 MFGrady

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:42 AM

View PostBovinityCow, on 12 November 2012 - 12:32 AM, said:

It's a WoW clone in denial. There really nothing much to debate about that, Guild Wars 2 has not moved the genre ahead, innovated anything in the genre, or changed how future MMO's will be developed. It's just your standard hotkey based third person MMO.

Wow, thanks, A.Net. That's content, alright!


You try to make it all sound so exciting and unique, and yet you didn't address the issue at all.

GW2 made a huge deal out of removing the trinity, but didn't put anything in it's place. The combat isn't "hectic" or "exciting", it's exactly how I played in EverQuest or World of Warcraft if I were trying to kill a tough mob without a tank or a healer around. There's nothing new or innovative about it. There's nothing that says, "This is what Guild Wars 2 brought to the table."

If you play this game like you played WoW or EQ, There's not really much I can say to you.

If you judge a game based on its control scheme, then we would agree that the playstation move, Wii, and Kinect have been the most innovative and profitable games since gaming, AMIRITE? Last I recall, games were fun because they were fun, not because they broke some form of record of "most interesting game to have 10 hot keys" award. Sorry you don't enjoy the game, and luckily your enjoyment of the game has little no bearing on it's success, despite what you may believe.

You're never going to see a super ground breaking MMO because that requires everyone to have super, ground breaking PCs to play, and your MMO developer knows that the only way to have an successful MMO is to make sure the lowest common denominator can play, whether its a skill issue or a PC issue.

#385 BovinityCow

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:55 AM

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If you play this game like you played WoW or EQ, There's not really much I can say to you.

Sigh. You just keep missing the point. Actually, I think you're intentionally evading it moreso than missing it.

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If you judge a game based on its control scheme, then we would agree that the playstation move, Wii, and Kinect have been the most innovative and profitable games since gaming, AMIRITE? Last I recall, games were fun because they were fun, not because they broke some form of record of "most interesting game to have 10 hot keys" award.

Again, I....don't even know what this has to do with the topic.

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Sorry you don't enjoy the game, and luckily your enjoyment of the game has little no bearing on it's success, despite what you may believe.

Actually, it does. Last I checked, the fewer players that like a game, the worse off it does in the long run.

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You're never going to see a super ground breaking MMO because that requires everyone to have super, ground breaking PCs to play, and your MMO developer knows that the only way to have an successful MMO is to make sure the lowest common denominator can play, whether its a skill issue or a PC issue.

Super...high end PC? What? You're just all over the map here, do you even know what the topic is? =)

#386 Cobalt60

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:56 AM

Guru should have a requirement that your GW2 account name.#### is attached to your forum name.

That way we can see how many people claiming the game will not last and is doomed and has no content are still plugging 6 hours a day into the game 6 months from now.

#387 BovinityCow

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:00 AM

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Guru should have a requirement that your GW2 account name.#### is attached to your forum name.

That way we can see how many people claiming the game will not last and is doomed and has no content are still plugging 6 hours a day into the game 6 months from now.

Bovinity.8609

For the record, there's still a lot I like about the game. But it's all in the "potential" column right now and not in the "reality" one. =/

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Yes, GW2 is a game for people with a real life beyond the game, it isn't a substitute for a job or instruction.
I actually believe it's very bad and unhealthy - if not life-ruining - that a game offers you content that makes you work like a job so you feel like you're doing something like normal people, while you're actually just the equivalent of an RMT farmer, 'cept you make no money.

It's funny how people speak as if other MMO's FORCE you to play them, but then give a pass to GW2's absolutely staggering grinds.

You can play any other MMO exactly the same way that you can play GW2, if you want to. Log in, do whatever you want. Go farm in the latest farming zone, do a couple dungeons, craft some stuff, whatever. In fact, probably the majority of WoW players DO play exactly like this in most of their gaming time.

The cardinal difference is that on the day you feel like doing more than just farming and grinding, the content is there. In GW2 it just isn't.

Edited by BovinityCow, 12 November 2012 - 01:12 AM.


#388 elmprotector

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:08 AM

View PostCobalt60, on 12 November 2012 - 12:56 AM, said:

Guru should have a requirement that your GW2 account name.#### is attached to your forum name.

That way we can see how many people claiming the game will not last and is doomed and has no content are still plugging 6 hours a day into the game 6 months from now.

I would be happy if they would just leave and let all of us who are in a 10 min que for wvw or waiting less then 10 mins to find a group to do a instance alone.

Really they want wow in a gw2 shell and were told by the devs of gw2 that GW2 was not going to cater to the power gamers... that time in would not = more power.  But yet they still bought the game and want the makers of the game to change it to there likes and screw the rest of us.  

This explains just how Obama got elected.. this group doesnt listen to what is going on and just ignores what is going on.  And when it bites them in the butt they get mad.  Go read all the interveiws wit the devs before release.... they warned you that this was not going to be a game you wanted to play.

#389 BovinityCow

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:14 AM

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This explains just how Obama got elected.. this group doesnt listen to what is going on and just ignores what is going on.  And when it bites them in the butt they get mad.  Go read all the interveiws wit the devs before release.... they warned you that this was not going to be a game you wanted to play.

You know you're on solid ground when the opposing side of the debate starts taking talking points from Fox News and applies them to the topic. =)

Besides, you still just don't get it. You guys can't do any better than the same old, tired, worn-out strawman where you claim that everyone with criticism about the game really wishes that GW2 was WoW. Over and over and over you guys chant this stuff, even when it's not related to the topic at all.

People don't want WoW, they want something to do. They want GW2 to grow a spine and get an identity of its own, not just define itself by what they are NOT bringing to the table.

Edited by BovinityCow, 12 November 2012 - 01:18 AM.


#390 Feathermoore

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:26 AM

Stop claiming people are looking for another WoW. Especially when they explicitly tell you that is exactly not what they are looking for. It prevents discussion and any posts of the nature will be dealt with as such.


Treat this as a blanket warning to post constructively or not at all.

Edited by Feathermoore, 12 November 2012 - 01:27 AM.

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