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Orbs will be removed from WvWvW

cheaters hacks exploits wuvwuv wvwvw arenanet orbs

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#1 CharliePrince

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:02 PM

Orbs will be removed from WvW in an upcoming build.

https://forum-en.gui...-upcoming-build

snippet

After a careful reevaluation of orbs of power we have decided to remove them from WvW in an upcoming build. As implemented, orbs tend to strengthen teams who are already winning and make it even more difficult for underdog teams to fight back. In addition, the current implementation seems to be irresistible to hackers/cheaters and will require significant modification to prevent cheaters from having an unfortunately large impact

all I can say is about time

or as we say in Brooklyn

about f'ckin time!

Edited by Corsair, 01 November 2012 - 07:39 PM.
Removed tag


#2 Valkyrja Flame

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:06 PM

Either way, glad to see the orbs removed. It is a strong step toward improving WvW balance as previously it would benefit the winning team more often than not. Hoping that later on down the road, the Outmanned buff will be updated to something useful (such as what the orb buff once gave).

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Edited by Corsair, 01 November 2012 - 07:33 PM.


#3 THE BEST

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:13 PM

View PostCharliePrince, on 01 November 2012 - 07:02 PM, said:

all I can say is about time

or as we say in Brooklyn

about f'ckin time!
Actually, the whole world says that. Brooklyn is nothing special. Thanks though.

#4 1up

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:29 PM

I knew this was coming at least until they fixed them and balanced the orbs out. I think it's for the better!

#5 Corsair

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:37 PM

As a reminder, don't lambast an entire community and remember to refrain from attacking other forum members.

It should also be noted, that if you're going to report a post, replying to it is not a good decision.

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#6 Rotisiv

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:37 PM

As far as the orb issue is concerned, I think its a lazy attempt by Arenanet.

#7 ArlanKels

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:41 PM

View PostCorsair, on 01 November 2012 - 07:37 PM, said:

As a reminder, don't lambast an entire community and remember to refrain from attacking other forum members.

It should also be noted, that if you're going to report a post, replying to it is not a good decision.

Dear Corsair, I think you need a hug for all your hard work cleaning up the thread.
*Hug*

In regard to the content of the thread:
I believe this is what most people have been asking for from ANet for the last month, month and a half isn't it?  The removal of the orbs so as to make it a bit less of a stomp in some scenarios?
It also inherently destroys the issue we've seen with orbs getting glitched in some fashion or another.

Two birds, one stone.  I like it.

#8 Global_GW2

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:48 PM

Yep. It's too bad they had to remove a rather unique dynamic of WvW, but it was the right decision. I look forward to the day when something like this might be able to be re-implemented, but with the lessons learned from what failed with the current implementation.

#9 Azure Skye

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:56 PM

Will it come in when the Halloween stuff goes down or when the big November update. .XD

#10 SaintThunderdome

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:57 PM

View PostRotisiv, on 01 November 2012 - 07:37 PM, said:

As far as the orb issue is concerned, I think its a lazy attempt by Arenanet.
Mostly agree. I know that they were exploited and beaten and picked on like the kid that no one liked at school... but they reminded me of DAoC and good games of capture-the-flag.

Oh well. Maybe they'll come back one day. XD

#11 Louis8k8

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 08:01 PM

Time to say good bye to OP health ;__; No more trolling with 35k hp.

Glad they're taking it out. I hope they look into out-manned buff as well. Even if it's a really weak buff, at least give a relevant PvP/WvW buff.

#12 BnJ

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 11:03 PM

Meh...  Another bandaid fix.

Instead of reworking it and keeping them in for added strategy, they just remove them altogether?  Yeah in their current state, they can make some matches lopsided, but I'd prefer to keep them and just adjust what they actually do.

#13 Global_GW2

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 11:10 PM

View PostShroomhead Fred, on 01 November 2012 - 11:03 PM, said:

Meh...  Another bandaid fix.

Instead of reworking it and keeping them in for added strategy, they just remove them altogether?  Yeah in their current state, they can make some matches lopsided, but I'd prefer to keep them and just adjust what they actually do.

I don't disagree with you about it being a bandaid, but I do think this boo-boo badly needed one, until they can devote the resources to do it right. I'm sure Orbs will make a comeback at some point in the future.

#14 sakura az

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 11:11 PM

I still think the orb and out manned buff should have been swapped.  Oh well Removal is a much needed improvement over the current system.

#15 Velron

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 11:22 PM

Why are people tripping out about the "bandaid fix" when the post very clearly to me states that they plan to bring them back but that it will require significant overhaul. Rather than make us continue to suffer for however long that takes, they are being removed for now. Makes sense.

Edited by Velron, 01 November 2012 - 11:23 PM.


#16 Alex Dimitri

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 12:31 AM

Well better to toss them out then to let people use hack to irritate people from other servers and destroyed them in front of their nose.
Btw we all know how some servers are like steamroller, with orbs they just got stronger and more tougher....which is bonus bad on weaker side (huge demotivator) !

#17 Voison

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 12:39 AM

Glad this is happening.
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#18 cjskater

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 12:42 AM

Even outside the obvious buffs, this also removes a lot of bugs related to keeps themselves.  No more orb defenders keeping a keep contested and destroying the alter, no more worrying about broken alters not repairing, no more bugged keep lord (if that still happens, haven't seen it in a few weeks), duped orbs, etc.  There's way too many positives to be angry about orbs temporarily being removed.

Edited by cjskater, 02 November 2012 - 12:45 AM.


#19 Therion

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 01:22 AM

The obvious solution would have been to swap the effects of the outmanned buff and the orb buff, so the winning team gets extra karma etc. but the losing team has a power boost which helps balance the scales.

Kind of sad that they just removed them entirely, since the orb mechanic leads to a lot of really good fights.

#20 Kleenex

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 01:41 AM

View PostTherion, on 02 November 2012 - 01:22 AM, said:

The obvious solution would have been to swap the effects of the outmanned buff and the orb buff, so the winning team gets extra karma etc. but the losing team has a power boost which helps balance the scales.

Kind of sad that they just removed them entirely, since the orb mechanic leads to a lot of really good fights.

I agree ORB add another strategic point to the game. Oh well like they say good things take time. Hopefully we won't have to wait to long until they introduce some stuff into WvW.

#21 phani_kaushik

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 01:51 AM

View PostLouis8k8, on 01 November 2012 - 08:01 PM, said:

Glad they're taking it out. I hope they look into out-manned buff as well. Even if it's a really weak buff, at least give a relevant PvP/WvW buff.

Yea the last thing I need in WvWvW is ... Magic Find? I can eat a couple of bars & tarts for that. I don't mind getting unexpected cores & lodestones now and then though :P
Atleast now hackers won't be screwing up with one major mechanic that can flip the balance of the entire match and I also hope this along with 7-day transfer limit will keep tabs on server hoppers who just hop to mess with one match rather than genuinely seeking a new home.

Edited by phani_kaushik, 02 November 2012 - 01:57 AM.


#22 Cirus

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 04:47 AM

This is sad news, it will remove an added dimension and incentive of WvW, (protecting and attacking orb keeps are one of the highlights of WvW).

The hacking and exploits of orbs have been a major problem, but can't they be fixed?  It's a real shame for Arenanet to listen to the whiners. It's a step backwards.

#23 two maces

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 07:06 AM

The orbs should not affect WvW directly. They could provide a multiplier to the % increase for PVE , so maybe a Realm with 3 Orbs would get +30% bonus to their Artisan on top of whatever they already had. This would encourage PVE guilds to chase orbs while the PVP guilds can run about doing their thing.

#24 Vulkus

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 07:14 AM

View Posttwo maces, on 02 November 2012 - 07:06 AM, said:

The orbs should not affect WvW directly. They could provide a multiplier to the % increase for PVE , so maybe a Realm with 3 Orbs would get +30% bonus to their Artisan on top of whatever they already had. This would encourage PVE guilds to chase orbs while the PVP guilds can run about doing their thing.

Great idea.  I'm glad we have a temporary fix.  The buffs were too good and the hacking was a real problem.

#25 RabidusIncendia

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 09:54 AM

View PostShroomhead Fred, on 01 November 2012 - 11:03 PM, said:

Meh...  Another bandaid fix.

Instead of reworking it and keeping them in for added strategy, they just remove them altogether?  Yeah in their current state, they can make some matches lopsided, but I'd prefer to keep them and just adjust what they actually do.

Eh, they really had no positive effect.  I'm sure they'll come back later in some form, but when they do, it'll have to be a complete redesign.  Like orbs auto-resetting after 1-3 hours.

Anyways, this is really good news.  At the very least it means anet's listening :)

Edited by RabidusIncendia, 02 November 2012 - 09:55 AM.

Fun while it lasted.  I guess.

#26 Kebtiz

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 01:36 AM

I would like to see what some of you are saying, the outmanned benefit looking more like orb bonus, but also I would like to see it as a stackable boon, ie if the enemy has twice as many people as you you get 5 stacks, 50% more 3 stacks 25% 2 stacks, ect and on down that sort of line (numbers used as explanation, actual values should probably vary)

I would also like to bring to the communities attention another abuse that I saw when I was playing on Maguuma, 2 sisters guilds GOON (Goonion Squad I think) and SFD (Star Fleet Dental) are splinters of the same guild group on Maguuma and have more than once used the orbs as a means to annoy the rest of the server, holding them hostage (making demands ect) or intentionally placing them in keeps that were within minutes of being taken over by steamroll servers.

#27 areainvalid

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 03:50 AM

View PostKebtiz, on 03 November 2012 - 01:36 AM, said:

I would also like to bring to the communities attention another abuse that I saw when I was playing on Maguuma, 2 sisters guilds GOON (Goonion Squad I think) and SFD (Star Fleet Dental) are splinters of the same guild group on Maguuma and have more than once used the orbs as a means to annoy the rest of the server, holding them hostage (making demands ect) or intentionally placing them in keeps that were within minutes of being taken over by steamroll servers.

How is that abuse? GOONs are Maguuma natives, and arent exploiting in any way. Being asshats, sure, but honestly all fair.

#28 Trei

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 06:58 AM

The Orbs just need to have benefits and bonuses that do not directly affect PvP combat.

#29 BandwagonX9000

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 01:12 PM

They claim to remove the orbs because it gives an "unfair" advantage to the winning team, but then ignore that perhaps the winning team is now winning because they managed to get the orb. Or that they have the orb because they would be winning otherwise.

They claim to remove the orbs because in part it helps in regards to cheaters. How about removing speed buffs too, since cheaters use those? Or how about removing the wvw speed buffs from the black lion chests?

They claim they don't want to give the winner an extra advantage. How about doing the same in pve? Gold makes more gold, thus anyone making over N gold per day has an inherent advantage in the economic progression curve. How about capping the gold per day and month pvers get?  Or how about every keep you have over your opponents gets you less and less points? EVERYBODY IS A WINNARRR!

I don't care about the orbs, but these changes are presented with reasonings that border the ridiculous.

#30 RabidusIncendia

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 05:31 AM

View PostBandwagonX9000, on 03 November 2012 - 01:12 PM, said:

They claim to remove the orbs because it gives an "unfair" advantage to the winning team, but then ignore that perhaps the winning team is now winning because they managed to get the orb. Or that they have the orb because they would be winning otherwise.

They claim to remove the orbs because in part it helps in regards to cheaters. How about removing speed buffs too, since cheaters use those? Or how about removing the wvw speed buffs from the black lion chests?

They claim they don't want to give the winner an extra advantage. How about doing the same in pve? Gold makes more gold, thus anyone making over N gold per day has an inherent advantage in the economic progression curve. How about capping the gold per day and month pvers get?  Or how about every keep you have over your opponents gets you less and less points? EVERYBODY IS A WINNARRR!

I don't care about the orbs, but these changes are presented with reasonings that border the ridiculous.

Because this is looking at it from the view of someone who isn't looking at the specifics of balance.

Consider this:  What if orbs gave everyone +1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 hp, essentially ending the match at the first orb, which usually is taken within hours of the match, causing the rest of the week to be a dead match.

Your argument would be the exact same in this case.  So it is a bad argument.  Argue the values not some generic crud.  Orbs simply allowed servers to steamroll players because it gave an advantage equivalent to 4+ friggin level 80 foods, 3 orbs MEANT TWELVE.  It was severely wrong.  What is your answer to this?

Edited by RabidusIncendia, 04 November 2012 - 05:33 AM.

Fun while it lasted.  I guess.





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