16 replies to this topic

[Milennin]

I'm wondering how useful the stacks of Might from Empower on the Staff exactly are?
When I'm in a dungeon and 4 people are bashing on a boss, is it worth dropping my Greatsword DPS to place Empower on people and be stuck with Staff for 10 seconds or so?
If so, is it still worth it with 2 or 3 people bashing on a boss (in the case of 1 guy being downed or so)?

[Palthiron]

100 Power is ~1% damage for most people. Every pulse gives 35x3 = 115 Power. So 4% per person, 20% boost overall (for a few seconds). Presuming everyone's doing roughly equal DPS, that means that it's probably *barely* a DPS boost. It also has the heal, though.

I think it's more for WvW or zergs.

[paradiselight]

Palthiron, on 04 November 2012 - 11:34 PM, said:

100 Power is ~1% damage for most people.

What? 100 power is 100/(player power)*100% in terms of damage boost. Show me a screenshot of someone with 10k power?

Most players run in the range of 1800 - 1900 power. For calculation purpose, let's take 1900 power. So 100 power is about 5.26%  increase in damage while 12 stacks of power is equivalent to about 22.1 % increase in damage (it's even more for condition damage since condition build usually has lower condition damage than power). It's an insane DPS boost, albeit for only a short amount of time unless the guardian is stacked in +boon duration.

p/s: I have no idea why people think that 100 power is ~1% increase in damage. Please point me to the source of misinformation. I have seen this one time too many.

[Milennin]

So then it isn't really worth swapping out to if my party doesn't need the heals, considering I'll also be waiting for the weapon swap cooldown to get back?

Palthiron, on 04 November 2012 - 11:34 PM, said:

I think it's more for WvW or zergs.

Wouldn't it only affect 5 allies, like most skills do?

[jpg1]

Milennin, on 05 November 2012 - 08:26 AM, said:

Wouldn't it only affect 5 allies, like most skills do?

Which means it will definitely work with all the people running around you. You are basically guaranteed that it will hit something. As to how effective the affected people will use the boost is entirely up in the air though.

I actually disagree with the statement, to be honest. It works really well in Dungeons as you know that you're all dedicated to clearing a boss or a mob. With WvW you actually don't know if the guy beside you will be aware that you buffed him. I don't know if Empower will affect party members first in WvW or if it is a matter of proximity to your character. I'm guessing it's the second.

Edited by jpg1, 05 November 2012 - 08:45 AM.

[Aetou]

12 stacks of Might is a big DPS boost to your party - it's much more than 5% per player although it is quite complicated to show exactly what it is.  

Secondly, Staff damage is not bad.  Against a single target it isn't great but as soon as you are hitting 3 targets or more it starts to really shine (assuming those targets are too dispersed to all be hit by a melee attack, which is often the case.)  So assuming you do no damage for the next 10s is very much a bad assumption too - you just need to position yourself appropriately to really get the most out of Staff.  

Overall I'd estimate that swapping to Staff and using Empower (plus #2 & then #1) probably raises the groups overall damage by about 5% or so while also doing maybe 4k of healing to everyone.  It's useful, and Staff 5 remains an amazing ability too for keeping people safe.

[DeadlyZeus]

If you have Altruistic Healing, then it can also serve as a burst heal

[Action Sloth]

I run a GS/Staff build in dungeons and I notice a big DPS increase when I switch to Staff and use empower, with the added benefit of getting lots of health back from AH. I'd say it's definitely worth switching. Keep in mind that while using staff you get fair damage too, so it's not like your DPS grinds to a halt either. Tossing the symbol out does damage, buffs your team, and if you have AH, likely is healing you, then you have your #2 skill that does fair damage on a low CD if you don't explode it, and my staff auto attack often crits for over 1k, which is significantly less than my GS auto attack, but is far from negligible.

[SpelignErrir]

Alright, think of a midget running around on fire, puking caramel.

That is almost as awesome as empower is.

[ZCKS]

Aetou, on 05 November 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

12 stacks of Might is a big DPS boost to your party - it's much more than 5% per player although it is quite complicated to show exactly what it is.  

Secondly, Staff damage is not bad.  Against a single target it isn't great but as soon as you are hitting 3 targets or more it starts to really shine (assuming those targets are too dispersed to all be hit by a melee attack, which is often the case.)  So assuming you do no damage for the next 10s is very much a bad assumption too - you just need to position yourself appropriately to really get the most out of Staff.  

Overall I'd estimate that swapping to Staff and using Empower (plus #2 & then #1) probably raises the groups overall damage by about 5% or so while also doing maybe 4k of healing to everyone.  It's useful, and Staff 5 remains an amazing ability too for keeping people safe.

This ^

DeadlyZeus, on 13 November 2012 - 04:50 AM, said:

If you have Altruistic Healing, then it can also serve as a burst heal

This ^

&

SpelignErrir, on 15 November 2012 - 03:58 AM, said:

Alright, think of a midget running around on fire, puking caramel.

That is almost as awesome as empower is.

This^.

Sure Your personal damage wont be nearly as good as it would be with the greatsword but it does a nice heal on your/your group while boosting allies damage considerably + with altruistic healing the self healing can be huge.

[Strife025]

I switch to it with an AH build when I need healing, because it's amazing for that. But when just banging on an easy boss and everyone is full hp I don't bother.

It is also good as a way to start might stacks before a fight for your group while they get their stacks up and running. So when there is a talking sequence or before an event starts, sometimes I'll use it to increase damage for the first few skills of the party to up their burst before we get might stacks going. As far as in the middle of the fight though, no I don't switch just for Empower.

You also have to be aware of what your other party members are. I run a 2 war, 2 guard, 1 ele/mesmer dungeon group. When I'm on my war I already have constant 20+ stacks of might up (without GS build), I don't need a guardian to waste damage by switching to staff for 5 more stacks of might and being stuck with it for 10 seconds unless he needs to heal from might stacks with AH.

Edited by Strife025, 15 November 2012 - 06:05 PM.

[indure]

I personally run with a hammer which is a pretty consistent 1,1,1,2 FOREVER and can keep 100% protection and 50% retaliation uptime, so I rarely will switch to my staff for just the 12 might, but when playing with the GS why not?

The GS is more about burst, you can basically spam all your abilities with very little drawback and then basically wait 8-10 seconds for cooldowns while you autoattack. It makes sense to switch to the staff in the 8-10 sec gap to give some group support and end it with Empower back to even heavier GS burst.

[Linfang]

I do GS/Staff works great. Just make sure when you switch to staff in a fight that you do not use your empower before your weapon swap cooldown is gone. Asura's are win with this ability as we spin around on our staff. So we have a spin to win with staff and GS

Edited by Linfang, 19 November 2012 - 05:38 PM.

[Parmo]

One thing I should add ... it stacks with other Empowers!
Myself, and another support Guardian guildie tested it out in WvW last night.
Crazy crazy stacks of Might!

[Mik Hell]

Linfang, on 19 November 2012 - 05:37 PM, said:

I do GS/Staff works great. Just make sure when you switch to staff in a fight that you do not use your empower before your weapon swap cooldown is gone. Asura's are win with this ability as we spin around on our staff. So we have a spin to win with staff and GS

This, I usualy start a fight with Staff, pull with orb or symbol, use line of warding to trap mobs, let my team aoe from a safe distance and give me the time needed to channele empower.

Then it's GS time, jump in and WW

[Warskull]

Empower on its own is mediocre, in conjunction with Altruistic Healing it is amazing.  Think of it more as a self-heal that happens to give everyone else some health and a short bit of might.

[jpg1]

Warskull, on 20 November 2012 - 05:14 AM, said:

Empower on its own is mediocre, in conjunction with Altruistic Healing it is amazing.  Think of it more as a self-heal that happens to give everyone else some health and a short bit of might.

^ I disagree.

With Two-Hand Mastery, you could boon might frequently and make your DPS members happy. The healing is just actually there to cancel out some of the hits you might have taken when you were channeling and keep your team kicking while the might is stacked. (Usually during the middle of the fight.)

You could actually start an encounter with this and speed up the initial spike of damage and repeat when it comes off recharge.

We shouldn't leave an impression that Staff is only effective when you have it with AH. It's simply not the case. Take for example, Ultramatum's build which has 0 Valor but has high praises for the use of Empower.

Edited by jpg1, 20 November 2012 - 09:40 AM.