1975 replies to this topic

[Lordkrall]

ogrejd, on 13 November 2012 - 07:42 PM, said:

Wouldn't surprise me.  After all, we wiped them (and the White Mantle) out on the way to the Door of Komalie.

Then we killed the last of the previously-extinct Mursaat a few years later in Eye of the North - after finding out that at least some White Mantle survived (the Mursaat was explicitly stated to only have survived because it had put part of himself inside Justiciar Naveed).  We wiped them out as well.

Then we find out a few years after that that we'd only slightly discomfitted the White Mantle and that they somehow had plenty of Mursaat constructs hanging around, giving orders. We wipe them all out again (The Battle of Lion's Arch).

Then, of course, in the missing parents Personal Story arc for Humans, we find out the White Mantle are still around.  I therefore see no reason why the Mursaat won't show up again, like *roaches (Seriously? The first part of the word gets censored? The filter really needs some fine tuning and to stop looking at substrings :/).

It has been stated several times that Lazarus the Dire did NOT die completely.
The part in Naveed is most likely not the only part.

Also keep in mind his last words in that quest:

"Accursed human! You have done this to me! I will not forget this!"
"Countless generations will suffer for your actions this day!"

[Korra]

In the wiki it says they can be obtainable via Mystic forge.

[AureliusRex]

Princess Fatora, on 13 November 2012 - 07:37 PM, said:

Nah, that's a blatant falsehood. Let's do some math, will we? 1% of magic find on an exotic is worth 12,4 of a stat.
The total difference of a yakkington ring over a exotic MF ring is 5 in two stats and 3% magic find, for a total of 47,2 stat points. 37,2 of those in the main stat.

Total stats of an exotic?
63+63+87 = 213

Total stats of an ascended item: 260

Nearly 20% difference.

Five times as much as you claimed. Math is hard :>

People are having a hard time comprehending that magic find is part of an item's stat budget.   It was likely no accident that Anet chose that particular stat item to present in its blog.  I imagine you would have a different response if they showed a berserker's ring that had 3% more crit damage on top of more power and precision.

[RedStar]

Korra, on 13 November 2012 - 07:51 PM, said:

In the wiki it says they can be obtainable via Mystic forge.

If you need 750 charged lodestones, might as well get them the other way >.>

Until we have new informations on the different ways it can be obtained, it's too early to be happy or angry about it.

[Mireles]

Fumbler, on 13 November 2012 - 07:42 PM, said:

Yes, but this game was advertised as a "different" game.  Not having gear grinds was a major plus for alot of the people that decided to play this game.  The people that purchased the game not knowing that there wouldn't be a carrort to chase (other than for cosmetics), should have done more reasearch to realize this game wasn't for them.

It's as simple as that.  It's wrong to promote aspects about your game that are different from other MMO's to draw people in and then blatantly go in a different direction to appease the carrot-chasing WoW kiddies.

Where did they advertise the number of tier levels of gear?

What lead you to the conclusion on how difficult they are to obtain?

For all you know these rewards can be obtained on the first level of a dungeon... like i said before, complaining about your own assumptions.  And were talking like +5 difference in each stat of these rings... a character has well over 1000 of points in each attribute, were talking less than a percent difference in overall stats of each item's effect vrs exotic items...  if your going to complain about that why not make all gear equal stats to not offend anyone's since of grind...

Edited by Mireles, 13 November 2012 - 08:06 PM.

[Lordkrall]

Princess Fatora, on 13 November 2012 - 07:37 PM, said:

Nah, that's a blatant falsehood. Let's do some math, will we? 1% of magic find on an exotic is worth 12,4 of a stat.
The total difference of a yakkington ring over a exotic MF ring is 5 in two stats and 3% magic find, for a total of 47,2 stat points. 37,2 of those in the main stat.

Total stats of an exotic?
63+63+87 = 213

Total stats of an ascended item: 260

Nearly 20% difference.

Five times as much as you claimed. Math is hard :>

And yet MF does not in anyway or form increase your power.

Why assume that all else + % will have the same amount as MF?

You can get food with +30 % MF but you can't get food with +30 % crit damage.

[Jairyn]

I'll throw in a little anthropology: Jane Goodall and her team studied chimps. In order to attract chimps to them for observation, they would offer the chimps bananas. Then, the trouble began. More and more chimps started showing up, stealing bananas. The grad students would try to lock them in enclosures, the chimps would break in, anyway. Over time, given access to a guaranteed, yet finite resource, the chimps became increasingly violent and territorial amongst each other, with dominant males beginning to monopolize the banana supply and force a brutal hierarchy upon the other chimps.

Previously, the chimps tended to forage far and wide in smaller bands, a system that was more ecologically and socially sustainable, it was the introduction of the certain-yet-scarce bananas fro. A singular discrete location that seemed to be the root of all evil.

E-peen swinging is real.

[Fizzypop]

Lordkrall, on 13 November 2012 - 07:57 PM, said:

And yet MF does not in anyway or form increase your power.

Why assume that all else + % will have the same amount as MF?

You can get food with +30 % MF but you can't get food with +30 % crit damage.

Because magic find is part of the stat budget and thus it would be for other items such as berserker or knight- which would increase power. That's how items in this game work.

[Own Age Myname]

DOSGAMES, on 13 November 2012 - 12:09 PM, said:

If I had to guess, I'd say Ascended armor will be the end of it. But, I could totally see new dungeon-based infusions that are introduced.  About a week ago, in a previous thread, I basically predicted all this happening.

Hopefully my premonition continues.  I think if the linear progression is dungeon based, it'll help out players who may not have had time to play a particular one. "No worries, the next dungeon will come out with new infusions, I'll be on the same playing field as everyone else"

Anet is smart, I think they'll hammer this out.

Anet and smart in the same sentence. Good joke. They have some amazing ideas, they did in GW1 and now in GW2...but they always end up ruining it by listening to a minority. I've stated this many many many times on this forum in the past; ANet will ruin this game because they listen to the community too much. I've been ridiculed for stating this, but all my predictions haven't been wrong.

I started noticing this since they announced potions way back when (thankfully they got rid of them), but that was just the start of a trend I really didn't like. I tried to keep my rose-tinted glasses on because despite all the flaws in GW1 it was a great game because at it's core it wasn't even an MMORPG so there was a limit where it could change...but GW2 isn't different enough to have changes that move it towards a traditional MMO not effect me.

Where's Teste to rage when you need him??

Edited by Own Age Myname, 13 November 2012 - 08:18 PM.

[Ghostwing]

I wouldn't mind so much if they gave us something for our exotics. Let's say hypothetically the new gear is earned by a token system similar to the one we have now. If we already have exotics (whether from dungeons, crafted, or karma bought), it'd cost less tokens to earn the new stuff than someone who will skip the current tier of gear thinking it'd be more efficient use of their time (because it is).

The question of who is still going to run the current tier of dungeons has to be asked as well.

[DuskWolf]

Were any of you really surprised? Even the first beta wasn't close to what their manifesto promised, and ever since then they've done nothing other than add grind and higher prices. More grind! Higher prices! The game is a cynical exercise in how much you can control people with marketing.

This is a case of leading a horse to grind, and it will drink it all up. This is why we have endlessly skinnerbox games, which are devoid of strategy and fun. You spend most of your time grinding in a bored way until you get your next piece of gear. So you can fight the next boss. So you can get the next piece of gear. So you can fight the next boss. Being lead by your hand from one zerg-zone to the next.

I'm not at all surprised by this. What sickens me is that none of you seem to want to take a stand for the game that could have been. This is why I've long since given up on GW2. Roll on Neverwinter.

[Ardeni]

Lucas Ashrock, on 13 November 2012 - 04:41 PM, said:

Oh don't worry. You will figure it out when joining a group just to have some fun doing a dungeon the first question is : "are you ascended?" " No" And you're kicked. And kicked. And kicked.

I bet we'll have just as much of this as we have "Do you have full exotics?" at the moment (as far as I've seen nobody does that atm).

Edited by Ardeni, 13 November 2012 - 08:20 PM.

[skuko]

ArenaNet made me realize, that all mmos are the same crap, no matter how you sugarcoat it.

[n00854180t]

Jairyn, on 13 November 2012 - 07:31 PM, said:

Why does whoever is in charge of the cash shop suck so bad at their job? If this is really about money, I think having at least one thing actually worth buying from BLTC would make a big difference.

The #1 seller in GW1 is costume skins. The #1 sellers in LOTRO are cloaks and robes. We get random useless boosters.

If only Lindsey Murdock and whoever is ruining the store could just be sacked and sanity restored.

Yeah really. The economy and the gem store have been really poorly handled. They need to can whoever is responsible for it and their ass backwards idea that an in game economy must ape a real life economy in order to be fun (when it's really the opposite of fun in every way).

Aside from this new random dedication to pleasing the one kid that actually wants a gear treadmill at the expense of 99% of the player base, the economy and loot/rewards are easily the worst thing about the game.

[Own Age Myname]

skuko, on 13 November 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

ArenaNet made me realize, that all themepark mmos are the same crap, no matter how you sugarcoat it.

FIFY. There's still hope, lots of new sandbox MMOs are in the making.

Edited by Own Age Myname, 13 November 2012 - 08:23 PM.

[xarallei]

OdinWalhalla, on 12 November 2012 - 03:57 PM, said:

Some people are obviously having the attention spawn of a fly. A new (harder) dungeon will be coming so what did you expect? Skins, skins, skins, skins and oh did I forgot skins?

There would have been zero incentives to do the dungeon, because right now a lot of people are decked in rare/exotic gear. Since the actionbar, trait and skillsystem is so limited they only had one option left....introduce "better" - although they've mentioned - sligthly better gear, called ascended.

Slightly better does not mean all your rare/exotic stuff will be useless now:

And when they add a new tier? What then? All you people saying it's not a big deal and you don't "need" ascended.....you don't honestly believe they will stop here? Because they won't.

This whole thing goes against their philosophy, pure and simple. We were sold a game without a gear treadmill and now they are adding one. Doesn't matter how "small" it is at the moment. It's there and it's only going to get worse. End level gear is supposed to be accessible, like it was in GW1. The rare stuff was just for the skins. This new end level gear is tied with dungeons. It's just poor design. Really kind of lazy on their part. How about giving us more pvp modes or more mini-games like polymock or SOMETHING. Actual content and not some artificial way of prolonging people's play time. It's just very disappointing. The game has so much potential, why mess with it by adding a treadmill?

[Arngrim Einheri]

CalmLittleBuddy, on 13 November 2012 - 03:21 PM, said:

No one has 'the same skill level'. One is always better. Same build implies same class. I hardly ever go one on one with the same class. Plus there's environment, tactics, world bonuses, allies, NPC... so much going on that the LEAST factor is a few upticks from a piece of gear.

Again, I drag level 10s into WvW with common grey gear and get more kills than deaths. Do you honestly think it will change that? I win by being clever and good, regardless of gear. If I EVER get beat by gear, that's my own damn fault, not the gear.

I will shred ANY pixel armor, and out juke ANY weapon. Not 100% of the time, but often enough to make anything but the most outrageously imbalanced gear moot. It's just not an issue.

If anything, I like a challenge and welcome players with even better gear. The. Gear. Doesn't. Matter.

I'm aware that in principle this new stuff could be a move towards providing superior advantage via a gear grind. In principle. But the mechanics behind the game and my own game experience has shown that level 10 gear can hang with level 80 exotics when played properly. Tiny uptick doesn't worry me at all.

Dude don't you understand I was pointing out an hypothethical situation? It's a no brainer situation. Player A has X build, Y skill and a determined gear. Player B has X build, Y skill and better gear than player A.
If we take a 1 vs 1 scenario Player B will win more times than Player A.

[Mireles]

I like how people pretend we don't have a gear treadmill now.... White -> Blue -> Green -> Yellow -> Orange -> Red.

Try to stick a pink between orange and red people start trippin.

Oh no you might actually have a good reason to do a dungeon now.. what a crap game! /sarcasm

Edited by Mireles, 13 November 2012 - 08:30 PM.

[Fizzypop]

Ardeni, on 13 November 2012 - 08:20 PM, said:

I bet we'll have just as much of this as we have "Do you have full exotics?" at the moment (as far as I've seen nobody does that atm).

except to get further in the instance you'll need the stats that can only be gotten from infusions which only apply to ascended gear. Eventually, it will be necessary unless you want to carry someone. The only good thing is they are planning to update other instances rewards so maybe it won't be so bad, but that all depends on how they do it.

[Da-Noob]

I really need more details to make a judgment call on this.  From the article I read, the only thing I saw about making or getting them was "Players will be able to acquire Ascended Rings in the Fractals of the Mists dungeon, and Ascended items worn on the back can be acquired through special Mystic Forge recipes."

Now there are Mystic Forge recipes and there are "Mystic Forge recipes"  if the recipes are something along the lines of exotic ring + 50 dungeon token drops, then I don't have much of an issue because it will be accessible to the average person who has modest time to devote to the game, and that's really what it's all about.  When people first heard that lv.80 exotics weren't going to be flat out given to you when you hit 80, there was plenty of negative replies about how people had to grind for gear, but anyone who played a decent amount of time would be able to  get the same gear as the unsocial, unemployed person who would be receiving the "you have been playing 12 hours, please take a break" message if it was GW1 without having a super tedious grind for them.

Long story short.  If infused items = frequent / modest drop rate and easily doable mystic forge recipe = I don't mind.  However If infused items = 1-10% dungeon drop rate and recipes on par with legendaries in terms of time needed to grind for items =  boo

EDIT: although the item color is pink  and pink quality items will go nicely with my mesmer /snaps fingers and struts off.

Edited by Da-Noob, 13 November 2012 - 08:48 PM.

[Perm Shadow Form]

Grinding... is good, well... at least now, maybe, I'll have something to do.

[Xenesis]

Mireles, on 13 November 2012 - 08:28 PM, said:

I like how people pretend we don't have a gear treadmill now.... White -> Blue -> Green -> Yellow -> Orange -> Red.
Try to stick a pink between orange and red people start trippin.
Oh no you might actually have a good reason to do a dungeon now.. what a crap game! /sarcasm

There's no difference between orange and red, they were suppose to be the end of gearing, now they're sticking pink above orange and red, which will eventually also move red up to pink, then next year they will introduce purple epics and red again will move up.... Question is will they automatically boost stats on legendaries or will just make the new ones with the higher stats, man the popcorn that would be needed for that storm would be legendary.

Back to the levels, look at when you start getting exotics, near the end of the leveling cycle. All white blue green means while leveling really is the money you get when you sell it to the vendor or the mats you get when you salvage. Rares are fodder for making ectos and exotics. They could have added all the fruity colors and still kept the same stats, just add the shiny new slots on them for the pve areas they are made for. Just leave the pvp area out of it.

And no I still don't have a reason to do dungeons, have a good reason to stop caring about wvw though.

[Ardeni]

Fizzypop, on 13 November 2012 - 08:39 PM, said:

except to get further in the instance you'll need the stats that can only be gotten from infusions which only apply to ascended gear. Eventually, it will be necessary unless you want to carry someone. The only good thing is they are planning to update other instances rewards so maybe it won't be so bad, but that all depends on how they do it.

And... You know this how?

Edited by Ardeni, 13 November 2012 - 08:49 PM.

[Alaroxr]

Exotic Ring:
Pow- 63
Pre- 63

Ascended Ring:
Pow- 68
Pre- 68

If you have full Exotics now, you don't need to grind for an Ascended set. In fact, if you want to use Runes or want to customize your stats with Orbs, then getting Ascended is a BAD idea. Even so, there will only be THREE new Ascended items that will be ~8% better. A back slot (which you've all been waiting for) and two Rings.

However, I don't like the idea of forcing us to get the gear to counter the new enemies and counter Agony.

Edited by Alaroxr, 13 November 2012 - 08:59 PM.

[Own Age Myname]

Only be 3...for now. Anet even said this.

[Myugen]

Da-Noob, on 13 November 2012 - 08:42 PM, said:

When people first heard that lv.80 exotics weren't going to be flat out given to you when you hit 80, there was plenty of negative replies about how people had to grind for gear, but anyone who played a decent amount of time would be able to  get the same gear as the unsocial, unemployed person who would be receiving the "you have been playing 12 hours, please take a break" message if it was GW1 without having a super tedious grind for them.

What I remember reading alot of complaints about was the grinding. It's not fun to grind. When level 80 dungeon exotics needed 100 runs...people complained, and it HAD to be changed because it was ridiculous. It is NOT fun to run a dungeon 100+ times. Even now, I already go zombie mode running dungeons because more than a few times is boring and I don't think ANYONE enjoys it.

Now my opinion (not picking a fight with you bud, just that part of your post caught my attention ) My biggest beef with this new "tier" is its a new ladder to grind up and accomplish, because gearing out a character with dungeon exotics means atleast 8 runs of 3 paths. Not enjoyable.

And to the people saying "it's just a minor stat difference, doesn't matter" well, in WvW going in with a character that is leveled-up to be "relevant" (as they said) still leaves you around 500-800 stat difference, an enourmous amount.

Edit: HORRIBLE spelling mistake. Anything else is probably fine hehe

Edited by Myugen, 13 November 2012 - 09:00 PM.

[Alaroxr]

Ardeni, on 13 November 2012 - 08:49 PM, said:

And... You know this how?

It tells you that you need Infusions to counter Agony, which enemies use more of as your progress in difficulty.

[Mireles]

Xenesis, on 13 November 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

There's no difference between orange and red, they were suppose to be the end of gearing, now they're sticking pink above orange and red, which will eventually also move red up to pink, then next year they will introduce purple epics and red again will move up.... Question is will they automatically boost stats on legendaries or will just make the new ones with the higher stats, man the popcorn that would be needed for that storm would be legendary.

Back to the levels, look at when you start getting exotics, near the end of the leveling cycle. All white blue green means while leveling really is the money you get when you sell it to the vendor or the mats you get when you salvage. Rares are fodder for making ectos and exotics. They could have added all the fruity colors and still kept the same stats, just add the shiny new slots on them for the pve areas they are made for. Just leave the pvp area out of it.

And no I still don't have a reason to do dungeons, have a good reason to stop caring about wvw though.

They said in their official blog there going to move legendary that exist up, and new ones created after.

Who said anything about purple items?, there is that making assumptions to complain about to try make your argument more sufficient i was talking about.

If less than a percent difference per item in your over all combat stats is a good reason not to care about WvW in its entirety go right on ahead, it will be just fine without you.

Would you prefer they made all gear have the same stats?  I mean exotics are harder to obtain than rares. wheres the fuss about that?  
would you prefer it if they just added it into your inventory for no effort at all?
or are you just trying to find things to complain about and reasons why you don't want to play a particular part of the game?  
Just because you don't like dungeons, people shouldn't be able to obtain rewards better than yours gear playing them?
... please...

Edited by Mireles, 13 November 2012 - 08:59 PM.

[karekiz]

Ardeni, on 13 November 2012 - 08:49 PM, said:

And... You know this how?

"The only way to mitigate Agony damage is by building up resistance through Infusions, a new type of upgrade component that can be acquired in the Mystic Forge." - so Infusion is the only way to "cure yourself", you cannot dodge this.  You can NOT cure this as stated here: "This extremely dangerous condition ticks percentages of player health away and can’t be cleansed by normal means."

Your only choice to build up Resistance....I mean infusion to the "dot" or whatever.  You don't have "X" you can't do "Y".

"For now, Infusions slots can only be found in gear of a new rarity type: Ascended." - Ascended gear with infusion slots.  The only benefit is they added "for now...."  which means nothing atm.

Edited by karekiz, 13 November 2012 - 09:00 PM.

[Thorniss]

We already have so many MMOs with grind systems... i decided to join GW2 mostly for its non-grind philosophy... and now this surprise. I'm really disappointed, really.