196 replies to this topic

[Bloodtau]

DuskWolf, on 16 November 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

@Gremlin

No, sorry. I've been following GW2 since it was announced in PC Gamer back in '07. The fact of the matter is is that most of the complainers are just like me. We followed the marketing, and we bought in on the ideal. What they delivered is almost a WoW clone, and with every step they bring it closer to being WoW. This ist he antithesis of both Guild Wars 1 and their marketed design goals. They promised us, they swore to us, that the game would not be a watered down WoW clone. The Manifesto was all about that.

What's happened is that they've delivered a game which just isn't really all that different to WoW at all. And when you look at other games on the market out there right now, games like Champions Online, Everquest II, Dungeons & Dragons Online, and Guild Wars 1, all of which are markedly different to WoW, the fact that they backpedalled and made something that was so close to WoW is... well, it's both a disappointment and a betrayal of what they marketed this game as. As fans and loyalists, we feel betrayed and disappointed. GW2 had the potential to be something, instead it's just another also ran, trying to make a grab for the WoW throne.

It'll go down in MMORPG history not as a brilliantly fresh, new, and different thing, but as being much like WAR and TOR, in how they promised but never delivered on any of their promises. And how they altered their game, trying to follow the WoW cash cow, never realising how foolish that was, or why that wouldn't work.

It'll fade into obscurity and be forgotten. It'll never have greatness in its current state. It has potential, yes. And that that will never turn into greatness just makes me feel... sad. But this is a game that's destined to be forgettable.

This guy hit the nail on the head perfectly.

[MazingerZ]

Lucav, on 16 November 2012 - 09:13 PM, said:

Would you be up in arms if they added a tier between rare and masterwork with intermediate stats? It seems to me that all they are doing is filling in a gap in gear progression with the added benefit of a gating mechanism for hardcore players. The proof in the pudding is if they add any more tiers after legendary with increased stats. If they do, I will be the first to the picket line I assure you. At this point I am indifferent.

Uh, no?  Because that's not raising the stat ceiling?

The point is that Ascended stats are greater than Exotics.

Currently, Legendaries have the same allocated number of stat points as Exotics.

Legendary stats will rise to meet the Ascended stats.

There is an overall gain in the stat ceiling for the game.

Edited by Fluent Fox, 17 November 2012 - 10:52 AM.
NO need for name calling, let's keep it friendly please.

[Lucav]

Can we just agree to not be outraged until we actually SEE what this entails? I for one am willing to give anet the benefit of the doubt, they did well in gw1, I trust them to get it right. Even if they do not, its not like I am paying a sub for this game.

Edited by Lucav, 16 November 2012 - 09:49 PM.

[Ketingo Ketango]

I've seen loads of new players arriving over this trial weekend. The low level human zone on my server is hugely populated again.

[beadnbutter32]

Seeing how the massive 'event' is completely messed up, a real SNAFU, new dungeons bugged, event bugged.  not working as intended.
Yea that is going to help, allot.
Got into one of new dungeons, but team was all screwed up, some players were invisible, some did not show in team but did show in team chat, some could not attack. With only a couple of us able to attack, things did not go well, then players started getting DCed. so we all left and tried to re-enter, but got booted by another crash.  Tons of people at the new dungeon entrance going, "WTF!"

[BlasBlas]

MazingerZ, on 16 November 2012 - 08:40 PM, said:

That is not a treadmill.  You've no idea what you are talking about.  That is a track.  You can choose to take the more scenic route, you may choose to pick up a few other things on you way, but the end result is the same as the person who decided to just head for the finish line.  After that, you stop and you decide whether you want to go back down the track and see what you missed or if there was something you want.  What Ascended gear does is move the marker forward another couple hundred miles.  And if you don't run it, then you won't have the same level of ability as the people who choose to.  They will be more powerful than you via a stat system.

That was the beauty of the intent.  The rewards after getting the best gear were cosmetic.  It never hurt your capability, and they never reduced your capability by introducing more powerful gear.  Ascended changed that.

I don't understand your explanation of a treadmill or a track or adding a couple hundred miles analogy.

And there is a difference between lvl 80 gear.  There is regular, fine, master, rare, exotic.  They aren't the same.  Some are better then the others.  You cannot craft soldier exotics.  You have to run dungeons for them.  If I do not want to do dungeons but the soldier's stats were what I want, that means I cannot have them.  I'm failing to see what has changed.

[MazingerZ]

What's changed is the promise that that what you earn will never be devalued by new stuff.

If you ran those dungeons and got the soldiers gear, they won't introduce a new set of dungeons with BETTER Soldiers gear.

That has changed.

[BlasBlas]

Resolve, on 16 November 2012 - 09:14 PM, said:

Their reasoning was to "bridge the gap" between exotics and legendaries. They do this by adding a new tier of stats. How does that make sense? They could've made ascended have the exact same stats and just took half the time/money a legendary takes to get. That's "bridging the gap".

I think Hardcore players spend more than casual ones and gave my reasoning. Do you think it's the other way around?

Anet have added higher stats for people to get. This isa way to get players who left interested in the game again, ie the "nothing to do at 80" people. If they didn't have anything to gain would Anet be pushing forward with this move and angering people? Of course they wouldn't.

It's weird some people are so passive or uncaring about this. Feedback is pretty important, if everyone was fine with this then what's stopping them from adding another tier and things become impossible to do without a set level of gear. There's already signs of this with the infusion upgrades having different qualities and they even mention needing them for the harder parts. At what point do you start caring? 100 hours of grinding? 1000?

I guess it just makes sense to me.  Maybe I see it differently.

I do think that casual ones spend more, but I do not have data to back it up.  Its just an assumption I gather from they way everything has moved to F2P and have been very successful at it.

Anet made a choice.  Their choice could not please everyone.  Usually someone would make a choice that pleased the majority.  I couldn't tell you who the majority is and how many are angry about it.  They have a better picture of it then I do, and yes they could have still make the wrong decision.

I think feedback is very important.  Going to Arenanet's website and voicing opinions through the appropriate channels is a very good idea.

Edited by BlasBlas, 16 November 2012 - 09:56 PM.

[Xaragoth]

I quit a little while back when I noticed that to even get a little bit of money, I had to constantly grind for multiple hours a day, instead of just playing the content I enjoy. There were also a few changes around launch that made me suspicious.


Ascended Gear and the likes pretty much confirm any suspicions I had about GW2. Gonna wait and see if they wake up and overhaul things to make the game enjoyable. I love the world and pvp, but the pve gameplay is shit.

[Gremlin]

DuskWolf, on 16 November 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

@Gremlin

No, sorry. I've been following GW2 since it was announced in PC Gamer back in '07. The fact of the matter is is that most of the complainers are just like me. We followed the marketing, and we bought in on the ideal. What they delivered is almost a WoW clone, and with every step they bring it closer to being WoW. This ist he antithesis of both Guild Wars 1 and their marketed design goals. They promised us, they swore to us, that the game would not be a watered down WoW clone. The Manifesto was all about that.

What's happened is that they've delivered a game which just isn't really all that different to WoW at all. And when you look at other games on the market out there right now, games like Champions Online, Everquest II, Dungeons & Dragons Online, and Guild Wars 1, all of which are markedly different to WoW, the fact that they backpedalled and made something that was so close to WoW is... well, it's both a disappointment and a betrayal of what they marketed this game as. As fans and loyalists, we feel betrayed and disappointed. GW2 had the potential to be something, instead it's just another also ran, trying to make a grab for the WoW throne.

It'll go down in MMORPG history not as a brilliantly fresh, new, and different thing, but as being much like WAR and TOR, in how they promised but never delivered on any of their promises. And how they altered their game, trying to follow the WoW cash cow, never realising how foolish that was, or why that wouldn't work.

It'll fade into obscurity and be forgotten. It'll never have greatness in its current state. It has potential, yes. And that that will never turn into greatness just makes me feel... sad. But this is a game that's destined to be forgettable.

Having never played WOW I can not judge on an accurate comparison, though I could understand a company trying to emulate WOWs sucess in some way.

I think its early days yet wvw will change and probably work eventually.
The equipment changes are due to players being too successful perhaps by genuine effort perhaps not.
Thwere has been a major rethink in light of this and several future updates have been rushed out.
I do dislike the gem store as prices are way ott for some items and I do think the reasons for doing it were entirely cynical.

I think it went something like we are likely to get a load of wow players coming over and they are used to shelling out cash monthly.
Lets put a load of stuff in the gem store and hope these people buy a shed load,

I am liking the game so am happy to play the parts I like and await improvements elsewhere.

[Arkantos]

Bloodtau, on 16 November 2012 - 09:14 PM, said:

If this game wasn't free to play, it would be a ghost town by now.
People can try and defend it all they want but face it, other mmo's that have done bad in recent years and performed better and had more content than GW2 currently has.
People are still here because it's free.

That's because the game wasn't designed around a subscription model like most other MMOs. Bad argument is bad.

[Larsen]

I don't even think GW2 is that terribly similar to WoW, it's just a boring game with low-quality content and almost nothing to do. A few of the underlying systems are good - manual evasion is pretty cool, the trait system is fine, I don't even mind the weapon-based skillset concept - but the gameplay and content is so terrible that it ruins the entire experience. It's like all the development resources went into systems and mechanics, leaving unpaid interns to design the actual game. I don't think it's very similar to WoW. That game has content and things to play for, and the gameplay at least seems like it was designed with people who had some kind of plan. GW2 is just... discount.

[raspberry jam]

Arkantos, on 17 November 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

That's because the game wasn't designed around a subscription model like most other MMOs. Bad argument is bad.

GW2 uses a B2P business model, but gameplay-wise, it's designed no different from P2P MMOs.

[ilr]

Going on the 3rd day straight I haven't logged in.... can't bring myself to do it.
Always told people I'd be playing this casually, for another 7 years just like I was in the first one.
As long as that sense of purpose is always there, finding the motivation is never a problem, right?
I could log into GW1 right now and still find something to do that my motivation feels good about.

What's the purpose here now?  Build more alts that will just be smashed under this oncoming Infusion Train?
I'm a very visually oriented player ... Stats do nothing for me, especially when they sour the game for casual play.

[ViM]

Bait-and-switch tactics never work out in the long run.

[AlixIcebane]

Arkantos, on 17 November 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

That's because the game wasn't designed around a subscription model like most other MMOs. Bad argument is bad.

Quoting memes and saying stupid stuff is worse. Sub or no sub doesnt change shit anymore.

It's time to organize a massive boycott of gem purchases until buggs are fixed.
RIOT TIME!!!

[Waage83]

Rickter, on 14 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

i hate to say it, but this is me lol!  i really get into the role, i do a lot of research on what traits and skills i should have equipped, i play like a hardcore. . . but in the end, life wins.  i get maybe 2 hours a day to play?  mon-fri, and on the weekends its like anywhere from 4-10 hours a day.

dont dont really PLAN on getting exotics, but i do think that will come in time.  my main goal is to get the tier 3 culturals.  i have a lot of grinding to do and i dont even wnat to think about exotics legendaries and ascended gear until im decked out.

*hoping for a price drop soon!

IN my guild there is a idea we always use. Good Enough. It is not about perfect max level gear in all cases it is about gear that is good enough.

I am in full exotic, but it is barley better then good cheaper rares. OR getting lover level Exotics that are cheaper.

People worry about gear more then they should.