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After 500+ hours on my Elementalist, here is my Dungeon build

elementalist dungeon guide

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15 replies to this topic

#1 n3cryptik

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:10 AM

Evasive Arcana was nerfed, this build is no longer viable.

Edited by n3cryptik, 15 November 2012 - 11:32 PM.


#2 Fenice_86

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:33 AM

ehm... Sir... Utilities, Healing and Elite skill are missing ^_^

Also: with a +10% condition duration and only +50 healing power what's the point to take weak spot and shooting winds?
Having a chance of 60% to add 1 stack of vulnerability (+1% dmg...) for 5.5secs with a crit chance of? how much u got?
i guess around 25%, this trait doesnt seem worthy to me, u'll be lucky if u can put 3 stacks of vuln at time.
About shooting winds let's say u got around 1200-1500 precision that means u are going to add 60-75 Healing Power
which means a regeneration increase of about 9HP/sec (useless imho)

To sum it up: i would move 5 points from Air to Water and i would change shooting winds with something related to my utilities (which u did not mention)

Best regards :)

Edited by Fenice_86, 15 November 2012 - 09:35 AM.


#3 Vayra86

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:38 AM

Kudos for this build. Provides some good insights, nicely described too.

#4 Elfen Lied

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:47 AM

TBH really bad build. The way dungeons are now, and I've done a fair share of them, just go full POWER, PREC, CRIT and dodge. There's no hard boss in this game, there's just retardedly designed bosses, and with those kind of bosses it makes no difference if you're wearing full def or full off gear. If he reaches you, you're dead, just bcs some idiot couldn't think of an encounter that will have a few mechanics in it.

#5 n3cryptik

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 05:08 PM

View PostFenice_86, on 15 November 2012 - 09:33 AM, said:

ehm... Sir... Utilities, Healing and Elite skill are missing ^_^

Also: with a +10% condition duration and only +50 healing power what's the point to take weak spot and shooting winds?
Having a chance of 60% to add 1 stack of vulnerability (+1% dmg...) for 5.5secs with a crit chance of? how much u got?
i guess around 25%, this trait doesnt seem worthy to me, u'll be lucky if u can put 3 stacks of vuln at time.
About shooting winds let's say u got around 1200-1500 precision that means u are going to add 60-75 Healing Power
which means a regeneration increase of about 9HP/sec (useless imho)

To sum it up: i would move 5 points from Air to Water and i would change shooting winds with something related to my utilities (which u did not mention)

Best regards :)

You're right and I can't believe I forgot them. Buffed my crit rate sits at 47% and can vary upwards due to Sigil of Perception. Factoring in Fury from stance dancing you can sit comfortably around 60-70% crit rate with this build. Elementalists suffer casting on-hit effects because the only really effective way to layer them is with Lava Font+Meteor Shower on top of each other. That kind of thing doesn't happen very often. That being said, Weak Spot is still a free Sigil of Frailty and this build works well with the on-critical heal food too.

Elfen Lied said:

TBH really bad build. The way dungeons are now, and I've done a fair share of them, just go full POWER, PREC, CRIT and dodge. There's no hard boss in this game, there's just retardedly designed bosses, and with those kind of bosses it makes no difference if you're wearing full def or full off gear. If he reaches you, you're dead, just bcs some idiot couldn't think of an encounter that will have a few mechanics in it.

I think your differentiation between 'hard' and 'retarded' is semantics, but anyways. Going full Berserker's makes you a liability in dungeons where bosses are putting out global AoEs or conditions. Every time you get down you are putting out zero DPS and someone else has to come pick you up. This is separate from the fact that Elementalist DPS cannot come close to Warrior DPS and maintain the same level of survivability they have. In light of that, it's better to focus on something that our class can do that no one else can, hence the combo field play.

#6 Shadow209

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:31 PM

I would use Emerald instead of Beryl.

It has been shown a few times, that toughness is usually better than vitality. Since eles have low base HP boosting vit isn't a bad thing, but you have your armor for that.
Plus you have a chance to inflict burn on crits, so precision may be better than crit damage as well (and you may want to use on-crit sigils)

Down side is, that Emerald has lower power, since toughness is it's main stat (but you gain more survivability in return). If you want to be more offensive, you could also mix Emerald and Ruby trinkets.

#7 Flaming_Foxx

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:14 PM

View PostShadow209, on 15 November 2012 - 06:31 PM, said:

I would use Emerald instead of Beryl.

It has been shown a few times, that toughness is usually better than vitality. Since eles have low base HP boosting vit isn't a bad thing, but you have your armor for that.
Plus you have a chance to inflict burn on crits, so precision may be better than crit damage as well (and you may want to use on-crit sigils)

Down side is, that Emerald has lower power, since toughness is it's main stat (but you gain more survivability in return). If you want to be more offensive, you could also mix Emerald and Ruby trinkets.

Funnily enough I've heard that the Elementalists base toughness is so low that boosting Vitality instead is more worthwhile because it has a better change of increasing survivability xD. -no clue what to believe anymore-

#8 n3cryptik

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 08:15 PM

View PostShadow209, on 15 November 2012 - 06:31 PM, said:

I would use Emerald instead of Beryl.

It has been shown a few times, that toughness is usually better than vitality. Since eles have low base HP boosting vit isn't a bad thing, but you have your armor for that.
Plus you have a chance to inflict burn on crits, so precision may be better than crit damage as well (and you may want to use on-crit sigils)

Down side is, that Emerald has lower power, since toughness is it's main stat (but you gain more survivability in return). If you want to be more offensive, you could also mix Emerald and Ruby trinkets.

View PostFlaming_Foxx, on 15 November 2012 - 07:14 PM, said:

Funnily enough I've heard that the Elementalists base toughness is so low that boosting Vitality instead is more worthwhile because it has a better change of increasing survivability xD. -no clue what to believe anymore-

@Shadow: Toughness is usually better than vitality, especially concerning cleave mechanics and etc. However, there are a few bosses on several paths that have Confusion/Poison/Lifedrain mechanics built in that necessitate having a boosted HP pool. That's why I use Beryl, to work in a bit of versatility. Also given that Fractals is going to feature a constant lifedrain mechanic, I don't think it's wise to invest too heavily into toughness. Lastly my Precision stat is tailored to provide roughly 50% critical rate before factoring in Fury. I don't believe investing more Precision into this build would benefit it in the long run, given that the damage aspect is secondary rather than the primary focus of any Evasive Arcana build.

@Foxx: I worked both into this build to give it more options in a wider variety of dungeons. If you really want to break it down you'll end up building special armor sets for each dungeon to tailor your stats to each boss mechanic. That's kind of overcomplicating things so I believe this is a comfortable middle-ground alternative.

I forgot to mention Utility skills, Elites, and my general stat distribution. I'm editing those all into the guide now.

Edited by n3cryptik, 15 November 2012 - 08:18 PM.


#9 n3cryptik

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 08:46 PM

I've added in two new sections regarding utility skills, elites, and stats for you guys to digest. Hopefully this helps you understand the purpose of this build a little better, as some people seem to be misconstruing this build for a frontline DPS role.

#10 blindude

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 08:59 PM

View PostFlaming_Foxx, on 15 November 2012 - 07:14 PM, said:

Funnily enough I've heard that the Elementalists base toughness is so low that boosting Vitality instead is more worthwhile because it has a better change of increasing survivability xD. -no clue what to believe anymore-
the lower a stat is the better result you get by increasing it and its generally better to avoid over investing on one stat for that reason.
(After a point the point the percentage increase is not worth it in comparison to the benefit the ssame points would give if they were added to some other lesser stat)
Besides that toughness with healing is better in sustain fights and vitality better at surviving big bursts.Seeing how dungeon bosses can get you down with one attack which could trasnlate as a burst  id say vitality is better there

Edited by blindude, 15 November 2012 - 09:00 PM.


#11 Bakelith

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:21 PM

Quote

Also given that Fractals is going to feature a constant lifedrain mechanic, I don't think it's wise to invest too heavily into toughness
I'm pretty sure I read that Agony drains a % of hp, so the amount of vit won't matter (in fact having more vit will make it harder to heal).

#12 Shadow209

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 10:42 PM

Well, the best thing is to increase both tough and vit.

The advantage of increasing tough is, that you will loose less HP when you get hit. Ao basically it makes your healing skills more effective, since they always heal the same amount of HP, no matter how high your max HP are (so percentage is higher).

The advantage of vit is, that conditions always deal the same amount of damage, regardless of your tough.

If it's true, that agony drains a certain percentage it is better to invest into tough. Why? Having more tough, thats true, but having more vit means loosing more HP, so you will have to heal more.

For me the situation is clear, since my main is a necro. I have plenty of HP, no need to boost them even further, so tough is the better choice.
But then I have also heard from guardians, that they prefer tough over vit for better healing, although guardians have low base HP (the same as ele).

The reason, why I said survivability is better on Emerald than Beryl is that Emerald has tough as -main stat, while vit on Beryl is only a Minor stat.

The other reason, I suggested Emerald is, because I think, precision is better, than critical damage. On-crit abilyties will trigger more often and I think (though I'm not sure yet), that boosting prec is also better for your damage output than crit. This means it could make up a little bit for the power lost since it is a Minor stat on Emerald.

Edited by Shadow209, 15 November 2012 - 10:43 PM.


#13 n3cryptik

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 10:58 PM

View PostBakelith, on 15 November 2012 - 09:21 PM, said:

I'm pretty sure I read that Agony drains a % of hp, so the amount of vit won't matter (in fact having more vit will make it harder to heal).

I didn't mean that vitality will mystically counteract the effects of Agony, that would be what Soothing Mist and Regeneration are for. What I meant is that the increased vitality pool increases your effective health versus direct damage, conditions, and Agony moreso than stacking Toughness. I'm not advocating pure vitality over pure toughness, I believe every dungeon build should find a comfortable middle ground between the two.

View PostShadow209, on 15 November 2012 - 10:42 PM, said:

Well, the best thing is to increase both tough and vit.

The advantage of increasing tough is, that you will loose less HP when you get hit. Ao basically it makes your healing skills more effective, since they always heal the same amount of HP, no matter how high your max HP are (so percentage is higher).

The advantage of vit is, that conditions always deal the same amount of damage, regardless of your tough.

If it's true, that agony drains a certain percentage it is better to invest into tough. Why? Having more tough, thats true, but having more vit means loosing more HP, so you will have to heal more.

For me the situation is clear, since my main is a necro. I have plenty of HP, no need to boost them even further, so tough is the better choice.
But then I have also heard from guardians, that they prefer tough over vit for better healing, although guardians have low base HP (the same as ele).

The reason, why I said survivability is better on Emerald than Beryl is that Emerald has tough as -main stat, while vit on Beryl is only a Minor stat.

The other reason, I suggested Emerald is, because I think, precision is better, than critical damage. On-crit abilyties will trigger more often and I think (though I'm not sure yet), that boosting prec is also better for your damage output than crit. This means it could make up a little bit for the power lost since it is a Minor stat on Emerald.

I don't know if you saw, but I use Emerald jewels on my Beryl pieces. Otherwise yeah, balancing the two stats is the best way to go for dungeons especially if you don't feel like investing in multiple gears sets to suit each dungeon. I agree Precision is better than critical damage to an extent, but a small amount of it does need to be injected into the build. Like I've said before, this build ranges between 50-70% critical rate which is comfortable considering its purpose isn't strictly DPS. I would much rather 12% critical damage than 2-3% more critical in this circumstance.

#14 Shadow209

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 11:25 PM

Yeah, I just saw, you are using Emerald Orbs, I think this is a good combination.

I did some math, using the info on the wiki, especially the formula on the Critical Hitpage

This are the numbers for lvl 80 I calculated, I don't guarantee, they are exact, though.

Beryl:
critical chance: 59,52% critical Damage: 69%
expected Damage = Base Damage * 71,83

Emerald:
critical chance: 70,19% critical Damage: 37%
expected Damage = Base Damage * 62,07

Beryl with Emerald Orbs:
critical chance: 65,48% critical Damage: 54%
expected Damage = Base Damage * 69,1

So when you use Beryl with Emerald Orbs your expected Damage isn't much lower, but your chance to trigger on-crit effects is a bit higer. Also you only loose 50 power.

#15 n3cryptik

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 11:31 PM

Evasive Arcana was nerfed. This build is no longer viable.

#16 Murmer

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:31 AM

Seeing the topic of this thread, then the response that it's not viable anymore... gutting.





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