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Forget about Ascended gear, Has Anet been honest about anything?


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#361 SonicTHI

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 06:42 PM

Achievement unlocked: Under New Management
"Clamber across the consortium's construction to reach ancient ruins."

#362 Illein

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 06:52 PM

View PostCorvindi, on 18 November 2012 - 05:49 PM, said:

Oh, because 20-60 gold is so easy to get?  Still 20-60 hours of farming at a good rate of 1 gold per hour, and that's if the mat prices don't keep climbing.  So yes, still pay to win.

View PostRunkleford, on 18 November 2012 - 06:19 PM, said:

Well, I don't see  20-60 gold or 2 weeks of "casual dungeon farming" for one piece of armor being very casual friendly.

The point wasn't whether it's casual friendly or not. I was arguing the point that this is the ultimate breaking point of Guild Wars 2 now being officially PAY TO WIN.

Which it is not. It certainly isn't casual friendly at all.

#363 ScoutMATH

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:00 PM

we have already the "no gear treadmill to gear treadmill" part. when will be the "no monthly fees to monthly fees" part?

i'm excited....


to quit..

#364 Baldur The Bold

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:14 PM

I had a glimmer of hope.

It was brief and short lived.

I really liked doing fractals. I enjoyed playing them with my guildies and it felt like things were really starting to come together.
Then I found out that I need at least 50gold to craft Ascended gear. Unless I am wrong, I need to money in order to continue to progress in the fractals dungeon. I don't have alot of gold at all and not only is the legendary item out of reach but now the new dungeon will become unplayable as well?

Please correct me(and I hope people do) if I am wrong in this regard.

Edited by Baldur The Bold, 18 November 2012 - 07:15 PM.


#365 Corvindi

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM

View PostIllein, on 18 November 2012 - 06:52 PM, said:

The point wasn't whether it's casual friendly or not. I was arguing the point that this is the ultimate breaking point of Guild Wars 2 now being officially PAY TO WIN.

Which it is not. It certainly isn't casual friendly at all.

Casuals desperate to catch up without doing that grind will spend money on gold to cut down on that grind.  This is a very typical pay to win formula.  This gear should never have been introduced in the first place, but it certainly should not have had any cash shop tie in due to the superior stats that can be used in other PVE and in WvW.

#366 Draycon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM

OK, where to start, where to start.... oh I know, how much of a broken record this is?

Firstly, none of know why they changed tings from what they said they were PLANNING to do, it could be there were too many problems like the companion system, or that they were told they had to change things by the testers, or maybe they hate you all and don't want your business?

None of us know the reasons why but I can certainly say they aren't lying, why would a company lie when their survival is on the line?

Have things been done wrong? Yes.

Can things be improved? Yes

Have they been listening? Lets see....erm... yep, looks like it, sadly they've been listening to people who enjoy complaining about the tiny things like gear stats rather then fixing the needed things like bugs and balancing professions a bit better.

Who is really to blame? This is a simple one, the people who have unrealistic expectations, who are the people that jump on the bang wagon and randomly shout the same thing out when a new game has been announced "WoW killer! its gonna be a WoW killer!" (Yes, I keep an eye on several video game forums in my spare time) Even the Elder Scrolls MMO that's been announced its now marked as a WoW killer, surely this alone has to say something about how the expectation of games and technology in general has had a very steep climb over the years.

Why has new content been released so quickly? People kept complaining they had nothing to do, they were apparently bored and trolled endlessly about it. However they could have tested it a bit more before releasing it.

Now I haven't done the new content or dungeon yet so I wont comment about it, but my biggest complaint so far, and really my only real complaint is these one time events. The horrible, laggy and pointless one time events that I never got anything for doing!

What I wish for more then anything else is bringing back the Districts of GW1, and the instanced game play in some areas, not all just some.

Personally I don't care if you flame my post, I'd read it and laugh at the funny bits, but flaming really doesn't bother me all that much.

#367 Lhim

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM

Well written OP. I stopped playing for several reasons (some from that list and some other issues). I kept an eye on the forums, hoping for a positive change, but every update seems to be a step in the wrong direction....

#368 Yllibas

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:35 PM

A lot of what the OP says, is true. But the fact remains, at least for me, the basic gameplay mechanics are fun and that keeps me playing.

#369 Illein

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:40 PM

View PostCorvindi, on 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

Casuals desperate to catch up without doing that grind will spend money on gold to cut down on that grind.  This is a very typical pay to win formula.  This gear should never have been introduced in the first place, but it certainly should not have had any cash shop tie in due to the superior stats that can be used in other PVE and in WvW.

You realize that "Pay to Win" - means that those who pay RL money will have an unattainable advantage over those who don't, right?

I bolded the word, because I am not sure you're aware of that. As that is simply not the case in Guild Wars 2.

#370 Corvindi

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:44 PM

View PostIllein, on 18 November 2012 - 07:40 PM, said:

You realize that "Pay to Win" - means that those who pay RL money will have an unattainable advantage over those who don't, right?

I bolded the word, because I am not sure you're aware of that. As that is simply not the case in Guild Wars 2.

No sir, I realize that is your definition.  It is extreme.  Technically, a .0000001 chance of obtaining an item with a stat advantage after 9,8889 hours of farming makes it not pay to win by your definition, which is of course ridiculous.

#371 ScoutMATH

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:46 PM

it's now pay to win. because you have to pay for the best statted item and gear treadmill.

before its pay to look cool. because the maxed are exotics. the cheapest exotic set has the same stats as your 1 zillion gold exotic set.

#372 Draycon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:48 PM

View PostScoutMATH, on 18 November 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

it's now pay to win. because you have to pay for the best statted item and gear treadmill.

before its pay to look cool. because the maxed are exotics. the cheapest exotic set has the same stats as your 1 zillion gold exotic set.

So you buy gear in the store now? News to me.

#373 ScoutMATH

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 07:49 PM

if the gear will cost you zillion gold, you will be forced to buy @ the walmart of illicit gold traders.

coz if you buy @ a.net, you will be put below the poverty line, in real life. no food and no rent.

Edited by ScoutMATH, 18 November 2012 - 07:49 PM.


#374 DuskWolf

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 08:14 PM

View PostDraycon, on 18 November 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

So you buy gear in the store now? News to me.
Oh, don't be intellectually dishonest. Please. It's not clever. If anything, it's unbecoming, and it doesn't help any of us. ArenaNet continue to run this game into the ground thanks to people like you, obsequious yes-men who won't tell them if they do anything wrong.

What he's saying is that you can get the gear for gold. So now you either have to grind (like WoW) or you can just pay-to-win. Both of these options are the antithesis of Guild Wars 2's supposed design ethos. Ascended equipment should never have made it into the game. I'm sure that this is just the first in a chain of bad decisions that's going to ruin the game.

But everything is fine, right?

GW2 fans, you depress me. I've never known a more spineless lot. This new treadmill is wrong. As is the fact that they're ignoring problems with the game in favour of adding gear treadmills. You know, now is the time to actually put your foot down and say that this isn't okay. Being obsequious and kissing up doesn't help to make this game great in any way.

All that's doing is sending ArenaNet mixed messages.

#375 Draycon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 08:21 PM

View PostDuskWolf, on 18 November 2012 - 08:14 PM, said:

Oh, don't be intellectually dishonest. Please. It's not clever. If anything, it's unbecoming, and it doesn't help any of us. ArenaNet continue to run this game into the ground thanks to people like you, obsequious yes-men who won't tell them if they do anything wrong.

What he's saying is that you can get the gear for gold. So now you either have to grind (like WoW) or you can just pay-to-win. Both of these options are the antithesis of Guild Wars 2's supposed design ethos. Ascended equipment should never have made it into the game. I'm sure that this is just the first in a chain of bad decisions that's going to ruin the game.

But everything is fine, right?

GW2 fans, you depress me. I've never known a more spineless lot. This new treadmill is wrong. As is the fact that they're ignoring problems with the game in favour of adding gear treadmills. You know, now is the time to actually put your foot down and say that this isn't okay. Being obsequious and kissing up doesn't help to make this game great in any way.

All that's doing is sending ArenaNet mixed messages.

You depress me by thinking that waving your e-peen around is helpful, moaning for the sake of it is not helpful and complaining here isn't helpful in the slightest? Do you seriously think anyone from the Dev team really come to this site  to see what people are saying? No, they don't, so get off my back, and I've not heard of anyone using the pay to win method on this game because there is NO point!

#376 raspberry jam

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 08:24 PM

View PostDraycon, on 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

What I wish for more then anything else is bringing back the Districts of GW1, and the instanced game play in some areas, not all just some.
Having districts instead of the ancient and outdated solution of shards and overflows would be great. They do it like this so that WvW can give PvE bonuses but seriously, who cares about those. WvW would work just fine (or at least as fine as it does now, which on the other hand is not fine at all) even if the teams were not server bound.

View PostDraycon, on 18 November 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

waving your e-peen around
But he's not doing that. He is arguing, and arguing well. In fact he is doing the opposite of waving one's e-peen. I don't think you even know what the term means. Stop using it.

#377 Draycon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 08:27 PM

View Postraspberry jam, on 18 November 2012 - 08:24 PM, said:

But he's not doing that. He is arguing, and arguing well. In fact he is doing the opposite of waving one's e-peen. I don't think you even know what the term means. Stop using it.

OK, on that one I got a bit annoyed... to put it mildly, and I'm sorry about that. In saying that I still do not see how its pay to win when gem prices are all over the place.

#378 Runkleford

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 08:44 PM

View PostIllein, on 18 November 2012 - 06:52 PM, said:

The point wasn't whether it's casual friendly or not. I was arguing the point that this is the ultimate breaking point of Guild Wars 2 now being officially PAY TO WIN.

Which it is not. It certainly isn't casual friendly at all.

Ah ok. Sorry I missed your point. I don't think it's quite Pay to Win either but I do think that it's heading towards where buying gems to convert to gold will be the easier option than grinding for some of this stuff.

#379 ScoutMATH

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 08:57 PM

View PostDraycon, on 18 November 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

You depress me by thinking that waving your e-peen around is helpful, moaning for the sake of it is not helpful and complaining here isn't helpful in the slightest? Do you seriously think anyone from the Dev team really come to this site  to see what people are saying? No, they don't, so get off my back, and I've not heard of anyone using the pay to win method on this game because there is NO point!

but if you post your whines in the official forums, your thread will get deleted or worse you'll be banned.

yes, they check community sites like guru.

#380 Baldur The Bold

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 02:41 AM

Can anyone answer if Ascended items with inscriptions to counter agony is required for lvl 10+ FotM? Because if so that is an elitist stance form Anet that I cannot fathom.

#381 Helliion

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 04:25 AM

ANET promised more than they can handle. A lot of players came into the game with high expectations because ANET set the bar for GW2 too high. So no doubt people will get disappointed and leave because the game is worse than they expected not because they have unrealistic expectations.

Edited by Helliion, 19 November 2012 - 04:27 AM.


#382 Skolops

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 04:58 AM

View PostCorvindi, on 18 November 2012 - 05:54 PM, said:

I didn't read the books, so I'm not spoiled for Charr, I like playing one.  However, the stories in general bore me silly in this game, and the Engineer class is such a major letdown!  I do get how hard balancing for PvP is, as much as someone can get it who has never gotten ulcers trying to actually do it, but even so, Engineer isn't anything like I expected and hoped it would be.

As for games that have more responsiveness, I'm all for them, even if my reflexes aren't what they used to be, it gets old mashing a button six dozen times before it fires off.  Bioware, though.  Not sure I trust them to make another MMO.  Unless they've learned a whole lot from SWTOR on the basics.

I personally love SWtOR.  I think it's at least as good an MMO as GW2 - though one which is different in a lot of ways... different, not worse.  

As for things like ability delay, SWtOR has something I desperately wanted in this game: an ability que - and an adjustable one at that!

#383 DuskWolf

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 05:48 AM

Oh, misread... nevermind. Expecting so much white knighting.

Edited by DuskWolf, 19 November 2012 - 05:51 AM.


#384 Thoran23

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 06:06 AM

View PostDraugadan, on 15 November 2012 - 01:48 PM, said:

Typical fanboy reply. The game didn't even come close to delivering what it promised, yet you have the nerve to tell people who talk about it to just leave the game.

Yes, this isn't the game for us. This is also not the game that ArenaNet promised to create these past years. That was the game for us.  This is a game for people with more money than time, hence the grinding meant to encourage gem purchases. This isn't the game we were promised because NcSoft thought they could capitalize on the hype.

If you're fine with that, good for you. But don't tell others to simply quit the game, if they're not.

Im the last person you could call a fanboy, srsly.
But i already got my second level 80 in full exotics and im at about 12k kills in WvW.
It takes about1-2 Weeks to bring an alt to max gear, so idk what all this crying is about.
Ive sen almost nothing of the game because i only do WvW and i still like it most of the time.
Alot of the game needs to be fixed or maybe changed but its for sure the only game i play for a long long time.

If you got a job and some RL left, its by far the best MMO you can get.

Edited by Thoran23, 19 November 2012 - 06:12 AM.


#385 Heart Collector

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 06:27 AM

View PostCorvindi, on 18 November 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

Casuals desperate to catch up without doing that grind will spend money on gold to cut down on that grind.  This is a very typical pay to win formula.  This gear should never have been introduced in the first place, but it certainly should not have had any cash shop tie in due to the superior stats that can be used in other PVE and in WvW.

If you can get it in-game with effort, it's not pay to win. And even if it was, so what? Yeah, someone got their gear with RL cash, boo frickin hoo. Who cares? You earned your gear the hard way, be proud of it and stop bothering about what other people do.

And for the record... Though I'm more casual than hardcore now, I don't expect to have the goodies a more hardcore player has. Why should I? As long as there is something that I with my limited time can earn I'm content. I don't feel entitled to everything a hardcore player gets and even if I could buy it with RL cash I wouldn't... Because it would defeat the point of playing the game.

EDIT: I don't care for p2w and would never pay extra for an item, but I'm not really against it unless it offers an advantage over even a hardcore players stuff, e.g. a better item you can only get with real money. If its available in-game with time and effort, I don't care. I'd prefer only cosmetic stuff of course, but it doesn't ruffle my feathers too much.

Edited by Heart Collector, 19 November 2012 - 06:31 AM.


#386 psytic

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:33 AM

This isn't on A Net at all.

This battle fundamentally is between casuals and hard cores  A Net has to choose, do we want to keep casuals happy or do we want progression so that hard cores don't leave in droves because there is no goals and they are bored. You just CAN not keep both camps happy. As long as casuals feel they are entitled to the same gear as someone who is a hardcore player, it will be impossible to keep both groups happy.

So really, at this point they look to be trying to keep the hard cores which in all honestly is probably the ones that will stick it out with the game and stay any way so imo it's a wise choice. As for casuals, your demands seem unrealistic. You can be like me and just not care that you may never see a single piece of legendary gear. Personally I don't give a *, I don't need the best gear to have fun I don't care if I ever have it. If the ability to have the best GEAR is the reason that you stay in this game then obviously the actual game play isn't that fun and you should look for another game.

MMO's need progression or eventually everyone even the casual of the casualist will eventually get all the gear he ever wants and tire of the same gameplay and move on. Games need goals, life ffs needs goals. A goaless and challengeless game is not sustainable. A Net sees this now and they are trying to right the ship.

#387 Illein

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:39 AM

View PostBaldur The Bold, on 19 November 2012 - 02:41 AM, said:

Can anyone answer if Ascended items with inscriptions to counter agony is required for lvl 10+ FotM? Because if so that is an elitist stance form Anet that I cannot fathom.

I've completed Level 10 just yesterday - that's where AGONY kicks in, but so far it hasn't been required really. It'd help of course, but if you manage not to get hit by particular things, you're as good as gold for now. I suppose that will change at level 20+ maybe already at 15+.

Then again, chance of ascended rings seems not to be TOO slim. So you will get your first agony res by then anyway - the only issue right now seems to be the fact that it's very hard to get the STATS on those rings you want...

And of course that the Back piece is rather expensive still. They could have made it 50 T6 mats and it'd still have been a hell of a grind for people who don't want/can't fork out an easy 20-60g for it, but 250 T6 mats is ridiculous. I'd like to have an ArenaNet Dev farm 250 of those puppies once in his life. It takes weeks, if not months.

#388 ilr

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:41 AM

View PostNedra, on 18 November 2012 - 06:38 PM, said:

Those who complain : Face it, the game is bad. If the other ones don't see this, why tell them ? They don't need us for this.

Just get over it and play something else. The best way to show that (just like me) you dislike what Anet did is to stop playing.
Stopped playing days ago  :(   ...not out of protest either, I'll still go back and play GW1 every now and then I hope.

But dang... when I see how bad they're mishandling the bugs, the testing, their "promises", and this Infusion system...  it's hard for me to stay motivated to play ANY online games anymore.  They've succeeded in weening me off something that years of ADHD self-help completely failed at.  I guess I should be grateful?  That's not what I want though, I wanna wake some morning here and find out it was all a bad dream.  I want to enjoy this medium damnit.  This ain't fair.

#389 Baron von Scrufflebutt

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:43 AM

View Postpsytic, on 19 November 2012 - 08:33 AM, said:

MMO's need progression or eventually everyone even the casual of the casualist will eventually get all the gear he ever wants and tire of the same gameplay and move on. Games need goals, life ffs needs goals. A goaless and challengeless game is not sustainable. A Net sees this now and they are trying to right the ship.

GW2, without legendaries, let alone ascended gear, already has goals that are more than comparable with the goals found in the majority of games on the market. The problem is that the goals demanded from MMOs are completely unrealistic.
And it might be time to accept that the games that do not provide these unrealistic goals, are actually the better games than those that do.

#390 Zippor

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:46 AM

Reading into hype on the 21st century... what a world I live at.




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