17 replies to this topic

[ZudetGambeous]

We finally have a dungeon where every point is going to matter and we can no longer WP zerg, making defensive stats and builds much more valuable.

Up until this point i've been using a Valk armor/Zerker jewelry set to get ~18k hp with ~88% crit dmg.

This was fine for burning down easy dungeons, but I feel like I need some toughness now. Is there anywhere with some calculations on an optimal mix between vit and toughness?

Also what builds are going to be most valuable for thieves now? Anyone have a great dungeon build? I've been thinking of picking back up my venom sharing build, but I feel like there might be better builds out there for running dungeons.

We'll certainly know more after this weekend, but now is a good a time as any for getting ready.

[Rachmani]

This logic seems flawed. I started with a much more defensive approach as fresh lvl 80 and now a days I play with full Berserker - and without WP zerg.
Also without knowing anything... I'd say now ain't a good time for theorycrafting into the blue.

[Red_Falcon]

We have absolutely zero data on the dungeon, its mechanics, its mobs, and especially our imminent nerfs, therefore it's useless to discuss a strategy.

As for your questions, how did you get 18k health?
Valk gives 200ish Vitality IIRC.

[Minion]

Nothing short of a brick will will stop me getting into melee range with my squishy armour. COME AT ME BROS.

[Lycrus]

I will still use my current build.

running 10/30/0/0/30 i believe.

using mostly dmg armor with hp/toughness jewelry.

using every weapon set i can and have. im only misisng underwater weapons.

most of the times when i do trash, its sword/pistol blinding. it works so good that ic ant deny its usefulness. i have seen it too often that when i dont use it, the trash is a lot harder for rest of the grp.

other weaponsets come in play in different situation.

i swap traits and skills around as the situation needs it. there is no perfect build for me and there will never be. thief going dungeon with d/d only, and only dmg traits without swapping them from encounter to encounter? ye..gimp yourself more^^

what i wanna say is...be versatile and it will work out. balanced builds are most of the times more viable

[Vadune Lafrey]

I use this build Crit/Power (S/P) exclusively in Arah Exp and FotM levels 10+. 90% of the time SB is my secondary set, however I swap to P/P when appropiate. I use full Berserker w/Ruby Orbs.  Sword Sigil is Strength; offhand pistol is Accuracy; Short Bow is Blood.

This build is not for everyone, since it relies on hair-trigger evades and constant concentration. Valk armor may be substituted instead. However, from what I've found, adding health/toughness is not particularily helpful, as certain boss hits can one shot an unlucky guardian. I find myself downed no more often than other classes with much higher health and toughness, and that downed is nearly always because I failed to dodge properly. Deadly Arts (I) - 50% damage increase while downed, helps tremendously. On the less difficult fights, I swap Deadly Arts (I) to (IV) - Sundering Strikes.

For Skills, I find myself using Withdraw more and more, swapping otherwise back to Signet of Malice. Scorpion Wire, Roll for Initiative,  and Shadowstep are also useful in many instances.

Your mileage may vary, but this setup has worked very well for me in high end content. Muscle memory and understanding each mob's mechanics (and how to combat them) are more important than "x" build at this point.

Edited by Vadune Lafrey, 28 November 2012 - 06:36 PM.

[Rachmani]

So you play more or less a standard S/P build . Anyway, Vadune Lafreys build works well as you can play many sets with it. S/P, SB, P/P, D/D & D/P for Jade Maw.
I prefer S/D, specifically traited for of course, but lacking the ability to switch to P/P (and do significant damage with it) is a major drawback in fractals, as far as I can tell. So from my knowledge 20/30/0/20/0 is probably as good as it gets - which probably doesn't mean alot given our rather BAD group support.

[Vadune Lafrey]

Rachmani, on 28 November 2012 - 07:01 PM, said:

So you play more or less a standard S/P build .

Standards are the standard because they are proven to work. But otherwise, I swap between P/P (still getting solid crits even without the +5% pistol trait), and SB in Fractals, only going to P/P past level 10 Fracts where a missed dodge is an agonizing death (puns ftw ).

Then again I'll melee almost every boss, because I'm vicious like that. Come at me bro! I only occasionally get my face (and pride) destroyed doing that.

I slightly disagree with you on us having bad group support.  S/P 5 + auto-attack is useful when things get hairy for the party, not to mention blind tanking occasionally is fun.

[Rachmani]

I well.. it's not bad-bad, I was of course exagerating Pistol 5, SB 4 with weakness on poison, even daze for getting rid of defiant... all solid. Just not the same raw group power guardian or warrior bring to the table - and they don't trade damage for it, too.
Still, I mostly agree with you, and haven't felt useless so far so it's all good I guess.

[wolfpaq777]

i find 20 points in the shadow arts tree to be the best group utility investment one could possibly make.

[Spanker]

I run full berserker and until now (10+) as long as the team is balanced its ok. But I fear things will change on 20+

[Reikou]

Currently Rank 21 FotM.  I am of the opinion that the optimal build for every class in PvE is glass cannon, provided the player is good.

http://intothemists....-BW4bRm8bRm85Bl

Basically what I'm using.  Standard backstab build, full Berserker Gear, Runes of the Wurm for some vitality, and the Practiced Tolerance trait.

I've had no problem with this build at all.  Just need to know when to switch to shortbow, and when is a good time to DPS with daggers.

Trying to build bulky is one of the worst things you could possibly do as a thief.  Don't do it.

Edited by Reikou, 01 December 2012 - 05:25 AM.

[Rachmani]

In your example build, you just picked random major traits, didn't you?
Anyway... ever tried 30/30/10/0/0 or 20/30/20? They're both better for backstabbin' and the second one comes with blind on stealth (great for fractals) or any other trait of your liking. I've found 15 points in trickery to be awfully ineffective if you're not aiming for conditions.

[Vadune Lafrey]

I'm not sure if you're referring to my or to Reikou's build, but in both I can see the logic behind every major trait choice (biased slightly with my own build, of course).  I constantly find myself changing out traits and utilities during Fractals, as the situation/party make-up demands.

Regardless, it's been my understanding that radical deviations from standard thief builds are not necessary until 30+ FotM. There's been some interesting theorycrafting on /r/guildwars2 on builds such as these, but I can't comment from experience yet how effective (or necessary) they are.

Edited by Vadune Lafrey, 02 December 2012 - 07:19 PM.

[Alderaan]

I must be the only person on the planet that cannot stand playing or playing with glass cannons.  I spend more time reviving these people than i do killing stuff.

I run a specific spec that's tailored to my play style (0/30/20/20/0) and synergizes well with the group i usually play with.

[Rachmani]

You're not alone! I can't afford to play glass cannon everywhere as I'm colourblind and have serious issues with red circles on some surfaces

[wolfpaq777]

Alderaan, on 05 December 2012 - 03:12 PM, said:

I must be the only person on the planet that cannot stand playing or playing with glass cannons.  I spend more time reviving these people than i do killing stuff.

I run a specific spec that's tailored to my play style (0/30/20/20/0) and synergizes well with the group i usually play with.

These people would need rezzes no matter how they spec'd.  Bad is bad.  A few hundred vit/toughtness isn't going to change that.

[Vysander]

Alderaan, on 05 December 2012 - 03:12 PM, said:

I must be the only person on the planet that cannot stand playing or playing with glass cannons.  I spend more time reviving these people than i do killing stuff.

I run a specific spec that's tailored to my play style (0/30/20/20/0) and synergizes well with the group i usually play with.

I gave you a like because you're the first person I've seen mention my trait set of preference.

I do fine in fractals. So far up to lvl 26, and am running berserkers armor with divinty runes, triforge pendant, karka earing, and a yakkington ring and backpack, as well as a condi heavy ring (RNG rings ftw).

Although it is making me look into using something besides my remaining berserkers jewelry (outside of fractals), the bump to my bleeds and the extra bit of vit is nothing to scoff at.

Edited by Vysander, 06 December 2012 - 04:25 PM.