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Did anet fire their gw1 armor team ?


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#1 stormofstatic

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:47 AM

Was thinking about armor in gw2 lvling to 80 armor only comes in the same 3-4 styles that i have seen shared with all classes im excluding the racial armor for now, as it looks like it was made by gw1 art team :P

but for the normal sets it seems like a backwards step lets see  from proph only not factions nightfall or EOTN

lets take ranger for examle

also known as collector armor ie hand in 5 trophy to get a part

rawhide
Krytan
Tyrian

then 1.5k armor

Fur-Lined
Drakescale
Druid
Studded

then 15k armor with different looks

Elite Fur-Lined
Elite Drakescale
Elite Druid
Elite Studded Leather

then
Obsidian armor

thats 12 different looking armor sets and each class has the same so thats 72 different armor styles in gw1 i dont even think gw2 has that many, so in a game all about farming looks why cut down the amount of different skins ? which is why i asked did anet fire their gw1 armor art team.

if u want to count all games as guild wars then its a massive 216 without the new 4 classes as they dont have access to the other armor vendors apart from obi from what i remember anyways.

#2 Sierra Echo

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:48 AM

5 races * 8 dungeons * 3 classes = 120

#3 BreadBuddy

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:50 AM

I miss the Kurzick metal thong.

#4 stormofstatic

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:52 AM

View PostSierra Echo, on 18 November 2012 - 12:48 AM, said:

5 races * 8 dungeons * 3 classes = 120


no its the same sets so 8 dungeons = 3 sets per dungeon they dont have different looks per class  so total would be 8 by 3 (med heavy light)

Edited by stormofstatic, 18 November 2012 - 12:54 AM.


#5 Scizzor

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:01 AM

View Poststormofstatic, on 18 November 2012 - 12:52 AM, said:

no its the same sets so 8 dungeons = 3 sets per dungeon they dont have different looks per class  so total would be 8 by 3 (med heavy light)

... You don't quite understand how armor is designed? Anet has to design 1 armor set for each race and each armor type. The same armor on a human is not the same on the char. The game doesn't magically re-size the human armor to fit all other races. The graphics team have to design the armor to fit each class. He meant that it's a lot of work designing just one new armor type because adding one armor -> 5 races x 3 classes = 15 whole armor designs for just one armor set. In conclusion, it's a lot of work.

#6 stormofstatic

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:08 AM

View PostScizzor, on 18 November 2012 - 01:01 AM, said:

... You don't quite understand how armor is designed? Anet has to design 1 armor set for each race and each armor type. The same armor on a human is not the same on the char. The game doesn't magically re-size the human armor to fit all other races. The graphics team have to design the armor to fit each class. He meant that it's a lot of work designing just one new armor type because adding one armor -> 5 races x 3 classes = 15 whole armor designs for just one armor set. In conclusion, it's a lot of work.

so we have less cause they had to work more ? i dont think even blizzard pulled that one lol gnome vs tauren.i dont think blizz sits and does armor to each they just rescale them just like mounts scale down (gnome) and up (tauren) i would think gw2 engine would alow this  instead of having to make sets x10 times (male/female) as that is just pointless waste of dev time.

#7 Ghostwing

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:34 AM

View Poststormofstatic, on 18 November 2012 - 01:08 AM, said:

so we have less cause they had to work more ? i dont think even blizzard pulled that one lol gnome vs tauren.i dont think blizz sits and does armor to each they just rescale them just like mounts scale down (gnome) and up (tauren) i would think gw2 engine would alow this  instead of having to make sets x10 times (male/female) as that is just pointless waste of dev time.

no, the armor for each race is definitely remodeled in WoW as well, not simply scaled.

#8 Mastruq

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:12 AM

And the is the case here, just like ghostwing said about WoW. The issue with each set requiring more effort by the designers is very real: GW1 1 skin per profession, thus 8 skins per set. GW2 1 skin per armor type (light/medium/heavy), modeled to each race (i.e. 5x), thus 15 skins per set. Nearly twice the work effort required per armor set in GW2 compared to GW1.

And while I do see the workload problem, I think like 3-4 more skins while leveling would have been needed. Or unique different skins from crafting, drops and karma at least instead of the massive cross-source reuse we have. The second issue is variety, I feel they use the same patterns too much across all sets (dusters for medium armor for example). I havent found one closed robe so far that I like, mainly because there are only 1-2 in general that dont look like a swimsuit with feathers or feature a pants-with-a-tail design.

Edited by Mastruq, 18 November 2012 - 02:13 AM.


#9 ogrejd

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:13 AM

View PostScizzor, on 18 November 2012 - 01:01 AM, said:

... You don't quite understand how armor is designed? Anet has to design 1 armor set for each race and each armor type. The same armor on a human is not the same on the char. The game doesn't magically re-size the human armor to fit all other races.

Actually, for most of the pieces (especially coats, legs, and shoulders) of most of the sets that drop in the world, that's exactly how it looks to have been done (the only real exception being Charr feet).

#10 Graystone

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:15 AM

View Postogrejd, on 18 November 2012 - 02:13 AM, said:

Actually, for most of the pieces (especially coats, legs, and shoulders) of most of the sets that drop in the world, that's exactly how it looks to have been done (the only real exception being Charr feet).

There are a few exceptions, but that's how it's done in this day and age lol.

#11 Dasryn

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:34 AM

i would like to see more armor styles in game but i understand the development time that goes into making so many unique sets.

GW1 has more armor skins most liekly because they only had the human body model to create skins for.  i imagine it is a lot easier for them reskin over the same model than it is to make armor that fits the multiple races in GW2.

#12 NuclearDonut

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:41 AM

View PostScizzor, on 18 November 2012 - 01:01 AM, said:

... You don't quite understand how armor is designed? Anet has to design 1 armor set for each race and each armor type. The same armor on a human is not the same on the char. The game doesn't magically re-size the human armor to fit all other races. The graphics team have to design the armor to fit each class. He meant that it's a lot of work designing just one new armor type because adding one armor -> 5 races x 3 classes = 15 whole armor designs for just one armor set. In conclusion, it's a lot of work.
Lol have you seen the armor on the non-human races? Look at the Norn males when they're wearing non-racial gear, the shoes are literally just melted over their feet. Look at the waist area of Sylvari males, there is another weird modelling problem there. I have a feeling that "magically re-sizing the human armor" is exactly what they did. More on topic though, I think we definitely have enough armor skins, but we don't have enough armor differentiation or variety among those skins. I can't tell the difference between 90% of medium armors when looking at it from behind.

#13 sty0pa

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:32 AM

View Poststormofstatic, on 18 November 2012 - 01:08 AM, said:

so we have less cause they had to work more ? i dont think even blizzard pulled that one lol gnome vs tauren.i dont think blizz sits and does armor to each they just rescale them just like mounts scale down (gnome) and up (tauren) i would think gw2 engine would alow this  instead of having to make sets x10 times (male/female) as that is just pointless waste of dev time.

Someone has NO IDEA what goes into making character models and, similarly, armor models/skins for those character models.

#14 HawkofStorms

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 06:37 AM

Your math is awful and you don't understand the complexities of armor design/character modeling
https://www.youtube....h?v=dbYAJ_oK1-E

#15 Sierra Echo

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 02:48 PM

45 race sets
24 dungeon sets
15 order sets
21 crafted sets
18 karma sets
3 wvw sets
12 looted sets
not sure if forgot some or counted double but that's
138 different Sets
And that's 510 modeled sets, I really don't see the problem

#16 Sheepski

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 02:57 PM

View PostNuclearDonut, on 18 November 2012 - 02:41 AM, said:

Lol have you seen the armor on the non-human races? Look at the Norn males when they're wearing non-racial gear, the shoes are literally just melted over their feet. Look at the waist area of Sylvari males, there is another weird modelling problem there. I have a feeling that "magically re-sizing the human armor" is exactly what they did. More on topic though, I think we definitely have enough armor skins, but we don't have enough armor differentiation or variety among those skins. I can't tell the difference between 90% of medium armors when looking at it from behind.

Plus, when previewing armour on my Asura, his toes/claws whatever are clearly visible poking through the boots...

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#17 Leriel

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 03:25 PM

There is quite alot of sets http://www.gw2armor....light_list.php. Your list had 12 armor sets per class, here is 23 armor sets per class.

Not all are really seen, since for some pieces you have to go to heart vendors and buy/preview.

#18 NuclearDonut

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 04:04 PM

View PostSheepski, on 21 November 2012 - 02:57 PM, said:

Plus, when previewing armour on my Asura, his toes/claws whatever are clearly visible poking through the boots...
Indeed, I can never tell the difference among footgear on Charr and Asura. Oh well, I guess it's one less piece of gear to worry about.

Edited by NuclearDonut, 21 November 2012 - 04:05 PM.


#19 Imaginos

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 06:37 PM

View PostScizzor, on 18 November 2012 - 01:01 AM, said:

... You don't quite understand how armor is designed? Anet has to design 1 armor set for each race and each armor type. The same armor on a human is not the same on the char. The game doesn't magically re-size the human armor to fit all other races. The graphics team have to design the armor to fit each class. He meant that it's a lot of work designing just one new armor type because adding one armor -> 5 races x 3 classes = 15 whole armor designs for just one armor set. In conclusion, it's a lot of work.

Except norn and sylvari don't take nearly as much rework of the base human model, because they are designing the armor on humans first, as it does to rework that armor for a charr or asura. So you need to take that into consideration too.

View PostMastruq, on 18 November 2012 - 02:12 AM, said:

And the is the case here, just like ghostwing said about WoW. The issue with each set requiring more effort by the designers is very real: GW1 1 skin per profession, thus 8 skins per set. GW2 1 skin per armor type (light/medium/heavy), modeled to each race (i.e. 5x), thus 15 skins per set. Nearly twice the work effort required per armor set in GW2 compared to GW1.

And while I do see the workload problem, I think like 3-4 more skins while leveling would have been needed. Or unique different skins from crafting, drops and karma at least instead of the massive cross-source reuse we have. The second issue is variety, I feel they use the same patterns too much across all sets (dusters for medium armor for example). I havent found one closed robe so far that I like, mainly because there are only 1-2 in general that dont look like a swimsuit with feathers or feature a pants-with-a-tail design.

There are skins they have designed that aren't in game yet, like tribal and most npc outfits that could be used as armor or town clothes.

View PostNuclearDonut, on 18 November 2012 - 02:41 AM, said:

Lol have you seen the armor on the non-human races? Look at the Norn males when they're wearing non-racial gear, the shoes are literally just melted over their feet. Look at the waist area of Sylvari males, there is another weird modelling problem there. I have a feeling that "magically re-sizing the human armor" is exactly what they did. More on topic though, I think we definitely have enough armor skins, but we don't have enough armor differentiation or variety among those skins. I can't tell the difference between 90% of medium armors when looking at it from behind.

Same goes for light armor. They almost all look the same from the back. No real distinct outlines at all.

#20 slowerpoke

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 06:44 PM

There is probably a fear by them they will be accused of copy pasting the armor. The game is still young and so many potential sets to add will take time, probably as skins in the cash shop.




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