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Sigils; Earth vs Strength


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#1 Killyox

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 12:59 PM

Droping this here but Strength > Earth for condi build with p/p + bombs and even p/s + bombs

Reason? Earth has 5s internal CD and works only on single target.

Strength has no internal CD, with rabid amulet you crit a lot, you do a lot of aoe and you get 3+ stacks of might easily. So 35-105 power/condi dmg easily. More, most of your attacks are AoE in some form so due to that you quickly catch up and exceed dmg lost by switching earth. Throw in the fact that confusion and burn get huge boost from it and it's kinda obvious Strength > Earth.

Play with it and love it. Strength + corruption on p/p is kinda sweet :)

EDIT: As of 14th Dec this is no longer viable. SoS got ninja nerf and received 10s Internal CD. Before it had none. That and the fact that on weap swap sigils are now viable!

REJOICE!

EDIT 2 One of my personal favorites is now Superior Battle. 9 stacks of might doable without any traits or +boon dur really. Geomancy and Hydromancy are also great especially for condi/bomb kit specs. Combined with enhanced performance and HGH 20+ stacks are easy to keep up.

Edited by Killyox, 15 December 2012 - 12:45 PM.


#2 Lunar Eclipse

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 01:12 PM

Personal preference i guess. 100 condition damage translate to about 5 damage per second per stack. 1 Extra stack of bleed is about 100 damage per second (depending on how much cond damage u stack of course) which procs a lot. Again, personal preference =)

#3 Killyox

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 01:25 PM

View PostLunar Eclipse, on 20 November 2012 - 01:12 PM, said:

Personal preference i guess. 100 condition damage translate to about 5 damage per second per stack. 1 Extra stack of bleed is about 100 damage per second (depending on how much cond damage u stack of course) which procs a lot. Again, personal preference =)

Not quite.

Earth is limited to single target, Strength buffs all condition dmg on all targets.
Earth sometimes procs on targets you dont focus. Doesn't matter with strength.
Gain on Confusion dmg and on Burn is far far bigger then gain on bleed.
Earth gives 1 stack of bleed, Strength through might buffs all of your stacks. With pistol #1 you can have 3-4 stacks and they all get dmg bonus, same with burn and poison and confusion.
When you aoe people that dps from earth is nullified in split second :)

Earth will be superior in p/s build bunker in 1v1 situation. Add in pet/minion and Str is about on par. Add burns and conf dmg and it's better.

Edited by Killyox, 20 November 2012 - 01:37 PM.


#4 Lunar Eclipse

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 04:35 PM

good point, alrite

#5 MrForz

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 04:55 PM

Strength will work only if you send ALOT of different conditions and especially burning damage. Which means that Blowtorch is a must for the Might buff to give even more awesomeness and besides... the AOE.

The only problem is the proc itself. assuming you actually have 49% crit chance (30 in Firearms and Rabit Amulet). You have 1/3 chance to gain Might on half of your hits, it's not alot. In 1v1 you'll feel like you have no sigils at all. In massive fights you may get 2 stacks of Might and that's it. Then at very rare times you get to have 5 Might stacks in a 1v1.

It can be surprising at times but it's rather meh. A bunker would prefer using a Sigil of Water + Purity if they want to get rid of Earth. If one really wants Might he'll choose the Enhance Performance trait. Or try to cook something with Juggernaut. (Or mix both of them, along with the sigil of Strength)

Edited by MrForz, 20 November 2012 - 04:58 PM.


#6 Lianzin

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 08:24 PM

Sigils are all kinda meh for engi, specially if you use a lot of kits (which you should)

#7 Killyox

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 09:52 PM

View PostMrForz, on 20 November 2012 - 04:55 PM, said:

Strength will work only if you send ALOT of different conditions and especially burning damage. Which means that Blowtorch is a must for the Might buff to give even more awesomeness and besides... the AOE.

The only problem is the proc itself. assuming you actually have 49% crit chance (30 in Firearms and Rabit Amulet). You have 1/3 chance to gain Might on half of your hits, it's not alot. In 1v1 you'll feel like you have no sigils at all. In massive fights you may get 2 stacks of Might and that's it. Then at very rare times you get to have 5 Might stacks in a 1v1.

It can be surprising at times but it's rather meh. A bunker would prefer using a Sigil of Water + Purity if they want to get rid of Earth. If one really wants Might he'll choose the Enhance Performance trait. Or try to cook something with Juggernaut. (Or mix both of them, along with the sigil of Strength)

thing is 1 stack puts you at/above earth sigil. I often have between 2-5 stacks np.

Water is crap as bunker engie due to very low + healing. It won't make a difference. The faster you kill enemy as bunker the less you will have to heal.

Juggernaut is plain bad (mostly due to its mechanic and FT) but that is for seperate discussion :)

I don't discuss here at all "wanting" might. I discuss sigils. And fact is Strength > Earth. This topic is not limited to bunkers. Also bunker engies use bomb kit. Bomb kit's burning + confusion gain decent buff from it when you get it to proc and then use it while having buff up. Earth doesnt work nor has any effect with bombs.

On a side note, if they ever allow on weap swap sigils to kits try 6x grenth rune + sigil of hydromancy:)

#8 ZCKS

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 04:27 PM

True strength will net you more AOE damage in the long run.

That being said if your using a high crit chance & 2x rune of earth then it will net more single target in the long run as their internal cool downs are seperate. (they just cant proc at the same time)

#9 Killyox

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:25 PM

But corruption is superior to both runes. That's why there's little reason for going double earth.

You can go for earth + strength if you get downed too often.

Edited by Killyox, 28 November 2012 - 06:27 PM.


#10 Killyox

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 09:53 AM

As of 14th Dec this is no longer vianle. SoS got ninja nerf and received 10s Internal CD. Before it had none. That and the fact that on weap swap sigils are now viable!

REJOICE!




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