233 replies to this topic

[Daesu]

Ualtar, on 21 November 2012 - 12:20 AM, said:

now yes.  Then? not so much.

Then you have not read my post.   http://www.guildwars...60#entry2090006

To be fair you have to compare current GW1 with current GW2.  When GW1 was created, ArenaNet was a small startup, low on resources, and no experience shipping a game.  Now, ArenaNet has more resources and has gained vast experiences creating and maintaining GW1 for 7+ years.  

Comparing 3 months old GW1 with 3 months old GW2 would be implying that ArenaNet didn't learn anything from 7+ years of creating and maintaining GW1.

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 01:05 AM.

[Eir]

RedStar, on 20 November 2012 - 10:16 PM, said:

Runes are another subject. Some were as expensive as they could get (100k Vigor runes anyone ?) and some were kind of cheap because not a lot of players were using them.

Oh hey, something really stupid I remember : req 8 and even worse req 7 weapons...See ? Anet had some form of gear grind in GW1 . And more seriously, some builds actually took advantages of those weapons, even if it was kind of minor. But then again, every number in GW1 is minor, so even a difference in 10 damage is important.

Do you actually know why these things where so expensive?
it was mostly cause of the PvP community.
They wanted to use their PvE characters in PvP so they needed the best runes insignias.

And about the weapons.
most of the time they were just collector things.
but then the PvP community came back with this again.
Q7 and Q8 shields were needed for the monks to use only 8 in tactics to get the full armor bonus
same as with weapons ppl could set attributes lower so they could use those attribute points in another attribute line.
warriors used those weapons and shields so they would still keep the full armor bonus and weapon dmg while being effected by the condition weakness(Weakness gives -1 to all attributes).

i played alot of PvE and alot of PvP in GW1, and im 100% certain i spent more money for items i wanted to use in PvP then i have payed for anything for PvE

now On Topic again.

I dont really dislike GW2 but from the start it was heading the wrong direction already.
mobs taking several minutes to take down bosses are even worse...

PvP has become almost a complete joke in how unfinished it is.

as in the recent patch,
i couldnt join in the events but from what i have heard it wasnt that fun......
as in the new gear, Its another step towards the wrong direction.
PvE shall stay something i might keep doing it from time to time.

But PvP im still waiting and hoping that is shall get better but sadly i dont think it wont.


Ps.
yes i would pay a shit ton of money for just an upgraded GW1

Edited by Eir, 21 November 2012 - 01:09 AM.

[Daesu]

Eir, on 21 November 2012 - 01:05 AM, said:

I dont really dislike GW2 but from the start it was heading the wrong direction already.
mobs taking several minutes to take down bosses are even worse...

PvP has become almost a complete joke in how unfinished it is.

Maybe from your perspective, but probably not from Crystin Cox's perspective.

Harder PvE content means, more repair cost, more waypoint cost, more need for max stat gear, more need for gold, driving gem sales up = Profit!

Yes we have been complaining for a long time already but ArenaNet has chosen not to do anything about it.  It is not like they do not understand the concepts which GW1 was designed on, which they have been maintaining for the last 7+ years.  But they have to balance the needs from the players vs needs from Nexon.

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 01:11 AM.

[Graka]

Starting to understand why anything past the front page of GW2Guru is useless to look at, first entire forum page of Tyrian assembly is the same people complaining about the same crap in 20 different threads. It is like the epitome of a circle jerk of bitching.

I just dont understand one thing, if you hate this game so much, believe Nexon has so much control that they are ruining the game, believe that the manifesto is in flames, anet is lying liars, Crystin Cox is the queen of greed, mmos have to have a gear grind therefore anet is stupid, cash shop is only meant to rip you off, dungeons are terrible, there is no end game, and in other words Guild Wars 2 is the biggest pile of steaming shit to ever be produced.... Why are you playing? And if your not playing, why are you complaining endlessly in multiple threads about the game instead of playing another game.

I'm not trying to be an ass I'm generally curious cause for many of the posters here to be in multiple threads saying the same thing there has to be a reason you feel the need to state your opinion multiple times.

Edited by Graka, 21 November 2012 - 01:30 AM.

[Daesu]

Graka, on 21 November 2012 - 01:30 AM, said:

Starting to understand why anything past the front page of GW2Guru is useless to look at, first entire forum page of Tyrian assembly is the same people complaining about the same crap in 20 different threads. It is like the epitome of a circle jerk of bitching.

I just dont understand one thing, if you hate this game so much, believe Nexon has so much control that they are ruining the game, believe that the manifesto is in flames, anet is lying liars, Crystin Cox is the queen of greed, mmos have to have a gear grind therefore anet is stupid, cash shop is only meant to rip you off, dungeons are terrible, there is no end game, and in other words Guild Wars 2 is the biggest pile of steaming shit to ever be produced.... Why are you playing? And if your not playing, why are you complaining endlessly in multiple threads about the game instead of playing another game.

I'm not trying to be an ass I'm generally curious cause for many of the posters here to be in multiple threads saying the same thing there has to be a reason you feel the need to state your opinion multiple times.

Maybe because multiple threads are converging to the same topic?  And perhaps this issue of ascended items and gear grind has been on many people's mind?  Otherwise, even if 1 poster complain everyone else would flame him back (like what happened on this forum 3 months ago).  Now, many people are actually complaining and agreeing with the complainers.  

Could it be that there are good reasons to complain?  Shocking, I know.

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 01:38 AM.

[ScoutMATH]

i have the right to complain if the chef purposely put broken glasses on my soup.

As for you, enjoy your soup with that broken glasses.

[RandolfRa]

Zippor, on 20 November 2012 - 03:00 PM, said:

Games like ME3 don't have even a fraction of the longetivity that a MMO with vertical progression has, these games are intended as a timesink most of the time. It will be fun for a while to tackle so called 'challenging' ME3 multiplayer but it's not that challenging in the end, same case with GW2 only in different flavor (worse flavor most would argue). The real challenge will always be competition, in otherwords, PvP. But in GW2 the real competition is not affected by the power creep, sPvP is an isolated game mode that will play by changing balance only. WvW was never real PvP, don't even think about it.

Simple question: why it is not real pvp? Do realise that not everyone cares for the steril, pseudo-fps king of the hill crap.

Zippor, on 21 November 2012 - 12:12 AM, said:

What I wish is that people would take their issues to the official forum, instead of spreading the same issue into five different topics in here.

They just get banned.

Edited by RandolfRa, 21 November 2012 - 02:16 AM.

[Kuldebar]

I don't hate ANet, but I am no longer going to play their games. The very last straw for me was their official forums and its utterly insane policy of deleting posts that quote devs, or use "ANet" in the title. I won't go into it here, but here's a reddit summation of my post:

Your post in ANet & Player interaction was infracted.

I will miss the game, but I can't think of any way I can accept this type of treatment and indifference from a company that I thought was different.

I think Skyrim, heavily modded, perhaps with a side of nudity, is just what I need now.

Edited by Kuldebar, 21 November 2012 - 02:39 AM.

[LFk]

I lay out the blueprints to a building, I pitched the idea. Later, I saw that there was a problem with it, make an attempt to fix it, then turn around to see the tenants complaining that I didn't stick to my original plan?! This is what this noise sounds like to me.

The argument might be: Well, this ascended gear is not a fix. Sure. It might not be. But a company has attempted to identify an area to improve a game, and went for it. I want a game company to continue to find ways to improve their product. Stubbornly sticking to a video they made when pitching the original idea is garbage. That's no way to run a company, and by extension, no way to run a game.

That video was them pitching their game concepts, not signing a contract swearing to live or die by it. I would have been really impressed if they fulfilled it to the word. Good, polished products rarely look anything like their originals.

I'm generally disappointed in ArenaNet, and I loathe defending them here.

For example, the constant bugs are a nuisance, and I can't understand why they don't have GMs that can reset bugged events. That seems like a huge oversight in a game where it seems every zone has a bugged event (or three). The inability to even make a static NPC behave like a static NPC reeks of incompentence, and I roll my eyes every time something like this happens (like the scavenger hunt for the Lost Shores event).

This is the kind of complaint I can get behind.

As far as I'm concerned, the Lost Shores event put in one of the most beautiful and entertaining dungeons I've ever played into the game. More than that, I love the blueprint of it. I can only hope they continue to add to it, I can only imagine a dungeon with tens (hundreds?) of instances, randomly chosen.


Those who continue to complain about the gear ceiling or "changing" of the original philosophy of the game, though ... I guess I feel bad for you.The kind of attitude I generally see will not permit a great many of you to enjoy much of anything except games that promote instant gratification. For the record, I didn't approve of the addition of ascended gear, either, but I do tend to be focused on what I enjoy, rather than the reverse. The additional tier just doesn't seem like that big of a deal compared to how much I enjoyed Fractals.

Edited by LFk, 21 November 2012 - 02:40 AM.

[Levelord]

Kuldebar, on 21 November 2012 - 02:32 AM, said:

I don't hate ANet, but I am no longer going to play their games. The very last straw for me was their official forums and its utterly insane policy of deleting posts that quote devs, or use "ANet" in the title. I won't go into it here, but here's a reddit summation of my post:

Your post in ANet & Player interaction was infracted.

I will miss the game, but I can't think of any way I can accept this type of treatment and indifference from a company that I thought was different.

I will miss your fanatical fanboy defense of Anet and Guild Wars 2. I'm serious.

The forums aren't so much fun to read anymore when I can't get my daily dose of humor by reading how fans justify anything and everything Anet does. I remembered one forum post where a guy posted that he didn't receive his costume that he paid for at the gem store and that Anet support didn't want to give him anything (despite having records of the transaction).
Then he got flamed to the moon and back, because apparently it's absurd to expect something that you paid for legitimately. I had such an amazing time reading how utterly delusional the fans are that they'd go to such extremes. It was such a fascinating social anomaly to see and read about.

Now I can see people waking up and it depresses me. I was hoping that my theory of human stupidity was true.

[Kuldebar]

LFk, on 21 November 2012 - 02:39 AM, said:

I lay out the blueprints to a building, I pitched the idea. Later, I saw that there was a problem with it, make an attempt to fix it, then turn around to see the tenants complaining that I didn't stick to my original plan?! This is what this noise sounds like to me.

The argument might be: Well, this ascended gear is not a fix. Sure. It might not be. But a company has attempted to identify an area to improve a game, and went for it. I want a game company to continue to find ways to improve their product. Stubbornly sticking to a video they made when pitching the original idea is garbage. That's no way to run a company, and by extension, no way to run a game.

That video was them pitching their game concepts, not signing a contract swearing to live or die by it. I would have been really impressed if they fulfilled it to the word. Good, polished products rarely look anything like their originals.

I'm generally disappointed in ArenaNet, and I loathe defending them here.

For example, the constant bugs are a nuisance, and I can't understand why they don't have GMs that can reset bugged events. That seems like a huge oversight in a game where it seems every zone has a bugged event (or three). The inability to even make a static NPC behave like a static NPC reeks of incompentence, and I roll my eyes every time something like this happens (like the scavenger hunt for the Lost Shores event).

This is the kind of complaint I can get behind.

As far as I'm concerned, the Lost Shores event put in one of the most beautiful and entertaining dungeons I've ever played into the game. More than that, I love the blueprint of it. I can only hope they continue to add to it, I can only imagine a dungeon with tens (hundreds?) of instances, randomly chosen.


Those who continue to complain about the gear ceiling or "changing" of the original philosophy of the game, though ... I guess I feel bad for you.The kind of attitude I generally see will not permit a great many of you to enjoy much of anything except games that promote instant gratification. For the record, I didn't approve of the addition of ascended gear, either, but I do tend to be focused on what I enjoy, rather than the reverse. The additional tier just doesn't seem like that big of a deal compared to how much I enjoyed Fractals.

Nice try, but your tenants have a right to complain if you take a jackhammer to a building they are living in. And that is exactly what is happening here, let's not misunderstand that point. Some inattentive tenants may not mind the noise and disruption, but others most certainly will.

You seem to be reasonable, but GW2 is the last in a long line for me, and in the span of 2 weeks they have utterly lost my confidence.

[Daesu]

LFk, on 21 November 2012 - 02:39 AM, said:

That video was them pitching their game concepts, not signing a contract swearing to live or die by it. I would have been really impressed if they fulfilled it to the word. Good, polished products rarely look anything like their originals.

Of course, otherwise it would have been a legal risk and this debacle would have ended quickly.

Quote

Those who continue to complain about the gear ceiling or "changing" of the original philosophy of the game, though ... I guess I feel bad for you.The kind of attitude I generally see will not permit a great many of you to enjoy much of anything except games that promote instant gratification.

Thanks for pinning the blame on us instead when it is ArenaNet that went back on their own design philosophy, and did a bait-and-switch.

Anyway nice try to assuage our anger and disappointments but you are only making it worse.

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 02:49 AM.

[Shroomhead Fred]

RandolfRa, on 21 November 2012 - 01:54 AM, said:

They just get banned.

Exactly, I just got another fresh ban today.  Something about a build up of infractions...

Thing is I make a point not swear when I post and stay constructive, but because most of my posts lately are negative towards the game and decisions at ANet, a lot of them get deleted and I get more infractions.  The modding on the official forum are up there with worst I've ever seen.  Least they could do is point out exactly how I broke their strict set of rules!  I guess rule number one is only positive posts allowed.

They really know how to piss off their customers, I'll give em that.

Edited by Shroomhead Fred, 21 November 2012 - 03:06 AM.

[Kuldebar]

Shroomhead Fred, on 21 November 2012 - 03:00 AM, said:

Exactly, I just got another fresh ban today.  Something about a build up of infractions...

Thing is I make a point not swear and stay constructive, but because most of my posts lately are negative towards the game and decisions at ANet, a lot of them get deleted and I get more infractions.  The modding on the official forum are up there with worst I've ever seen.  Least they could do is point out exactly I broke their strict set of rules!

They really know how to piss off their customers, I'll give em that.

That is exactly where I am at, you sum it up nicely.

[Graka]

Daesu, on 21 November 2012 - 01:37 AM, said:

Maybe because multiple threads are converging to the same topic?  And perhaps this issue of ascended items and gear grind has been on many people's mind?  Otherwise, even if 1 poster complain everyone else would flame him back (like what happened on this forum 3 months ago).  Now, many people are actually complaining and agreeing with the complainers.  

Could it be that there are good reasons to complain?  Shocking, I know.

If this is true, then why as I said is it the SAME 20 PEOPLE, IN THE SAME THREADS. If it was complainers I see more than just these 20. Almost every thread consists of this Complainer1: "Man I hate gw2 for X, Y" Complainer2:"Man I hate it for X, Y too, and Z, you should see this other thread where i said the same thing " Complainer 3:" you should see this thread I hate it for X and Z" and the other 17 complainers are hating it for exactly these 3 reasons and continue to bitch about it in the thread over and over and over and over and over.

And you still didn't answer my questions other than to say there are reason to complain there for I complain therefore I am a complainer therefore I will complain about the same stuff over and over in multiple threads because.... because what? You don't seem to have any goal or plan other than to psyche yourselves out about how shitty this game is. You still haven't responded to why you hang around, do you have hope things will get better? Cause it seems not, its just oh well nexon took over game is done put a fork in it. But I'm going to hang around to complain cause I need to feel enough people agree with me so I'm not alone. Oh and just on the ascended gear, you lose the benefits of all the runes for some protection or damage the higher of fractals you get when you have to switch to ascended gear. And using one of the earlier posters logic the 20 of you that continually complain equals lets do the math oh gee um, 520, out of over a million. Yep, you guys really have a case, but don't let me get in the way of you making more threads to complain about the same stuff.

Hopefully at some point the mods will make these forums again useful for those that want to actually get information about the game.

[LFk]

Daesu, on 21 November 2012 - 01:08 AM, said:

Anyway nice try to assuage our anger and disappointments but you are only making it worse.

I'm not here to assuage your anger. I'm not trying to hold your hand.

I am pinning a greater portion of the blame on the community, and by extension, me and you.
ArenaNet is not without fault, but the constant stream of complaints is really a flaw of the community.

Prior to complaining about Ascended items, people complained about Legendaries (which incidentally, were in adherence with the so-called Manifesto). People complained that the gap between Exotics and Legendaries were too large. People complained that they felt no progression. There is an entire (stickied!) thread of nothing but whining about it, and they got it.

Well those complains have stopped now. Now, people complain about the very thing they campaigned for, the step between the Exotics and Legendaries. Do you see what i'm getting at? You may not be one of those who campaigned for it, but there was an angry mob on the official forums that did. Now, there's the angry mob against the angry mob changes, and if they change things again there will be another angry mob. .

This gripe is the flavor of the month. Nothing ArenaNet does can and will be good enough. They can rig the game to deliver you a high quality massage right in your home while bathing your eyes with magical rays of happiness, and people will complain about the bandwidth requirements.

The problem is you.

I don't really expect or anticipate i'll change your mind. This is the era of the entitled gamer, and particularly entitled gamers that don't enjoy hearing that they are. It's bad enough that the word 'entitled' itself is now being swung around like a pejorative, but I'll keep using it as long as it's the truth.

Back when people wanted Legendary precursors nerfed in cost, and more of a sense of progression between Exotics and Legendaries, I made posts opposing the change.

Now, people are railing against the progression above Exotics, saying it violates the original principle of the game. I am again opposing this.

If they listen to you, equalize the stats at the top end with Exotics/Ascended, and then people complain about it again, I will oppose them also.

You see, the only thing I'm mad at ArenaNet for with regards to this, is that they are making rash changes based on flash mobs in the forums. You just happen to represent the current mob I'm against. This is not "listening to the community". This is not responsible game design, and this is what I fault ArenaNet most for. The developers could really take a page out of DOTA's book, if and of you are familiar with the game. Balance changes are always done delicately, with small increments of change. Most of the cries of "IMBA" in the forums are largely ignored in favor of very gradual change. This produced a game which I have played, and was popular for a decade and more.

They have no reason to listen to one guy, so I'm essentially spitting into the wind.
ArenaNet will likely bounce from mob to mob, trying to listen to their demands. Invariably, one group will not be happy with the changes requested by another group, and so on, and so forth, until everything is just a convoluted mass.

This, Daesu, is your contribution to destroying the game. Worst of all, both sides believe they are trying to save it.
You all still have a chance to stop, and try to work sensible changes into the game. Starting with reporting bug fixes, moving onto suggestions for streamlining events, then offering ideas for improved dungeon concepts. I'm not hopeful, though.

Edited by LFk, 21 November 2012 - 06:57 AM.

[chrisbdrake]

Daesu, on 21 November 2012 - 12:07 AM, said:

Runes are cheap.  Just check the rune vendor.

So what?  The introduction of runes, ruined everyone's current weapon when they were introduced.

[LFk]

Kuldebar, on 21 November 2012 - 02:45 AM, said:

Nice try, but your tenants have a right to complain if you take a jackhammer to a building they are living in. And that is exactly what is happening here, let's not misunderstand that point. Some inattentive tenants may not mind the noise and disruption, but others most certainly will.

You seem to be reasonable, but GW2 is the last in a long line for me, and in the span of 2 weeks they have utterly lost my confidence.

Kuldebar, the jackhammer is an opinion.

You (and for that matter, me, since I didn't want the ascended items) believe this is destroying it. Others believe this is fixing it. You have to understand the both sides can't be right, yes? When they apply whatever you believe the "fix" is, in this case making Ascended items equal to exotics, others will come and ask why you broke it.

I understand the compulsion to believe that you are right, otherwise why would they be your beliefs? I think the primary problem i'm having is that very few are expressing that sensibly, being willing to work with what is in place. They simply declare the whole thing screwed, and that upheaval is the only solution. Scroll up in this thread. That sounds about right doesn't it?

As an aside, this is not a problem that is isolated to the video game world. This is also one of the largest factors that hamstrings the US political process.


Your initial reason was sensible enough, though. You stated a reason for leaving, and that's your prerogative. For what it is worth, I don't enjoy the way they police their forums, either. It's a lot more militaristic than I'm used to for a game.

Edited by LFk, 21 November 2012 - 06:55 AM.

[Darkobra]

fs23otm, on 20 November 2012 - 06:20 PM, said:

The manifesto means nothing... it is not written in stone....

God it is like Jerry Maquire and the Mission Statement.... It was just a mission statement.....

That's perfectly fine in a conference room. You don't release that to the public unless you intend to do that.

[Daesu]

chrisbdrake, on 21 November 2012 - 06:43 AM, said:

So what?  The introduction of runes, ruined everyone's current weapon when they were introduced.

So it was too hard for you to get a cheap rune from the rune vendor?  I don't see the problem.

LFk, on 21 November 2012 - 06:34 AM, said:

This, Daesu, is your contribution to destroying the game. Worst of all, both sides believe they are trying to save it.
You all still have a chance to stop, and try to work sensible changes into the game. Starting with bug fixes, moving onto streamlining events, then offering improved dungeon concepts. I'm not hopeful, though.

Great!  If I destroy this game, they can move into a new direction and listen to their community this time.  We don't need any extra gear grind!  I am saying this again just in case our voices are still not heard and we would not stop complaining to them until ArenaNet listens and starts addressing our concerns instead of simply banning anyone who brings this up in their official forums!  Our concerns have not been addressed which is why we need to voice them out again and again.

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 07:02 AM.

[Colika]

Well, greens were kind of obsolete (with few exceptions) when Nightfall came into the picture. While the weapon damage stats remained, the customization allowed some measure of additional power for skill builds.

In truth, I don't really mind. It's endgame stuff for those who have done everything else. As long as I don't need Ascended gear to complete my story, I'm good.

ScoutMATH, on 20 November 2012 - 08:17 PM, said:

did they raised the level cap? did they put strong weapons? did they require people to grind? were the things that you got on 2005 became obsolete?

try again.

[LFk]

Daesu, on 21 November 2012 - 06:57 AM, said:

Great!  If I destroy this game, they can move into a new direction and listen to me this time.  We don't need any extra gear grind!  I am saying this again just in case our voices are still not heard.

Believe me, they heard your voices.
The community is why the Ascended gear is in the game in the first place.

Example:
https://forum-en.gui...irst#post690163

This is from weeks ago, prior to Ascended items. One of many. You can even see what I had to say about it back then. I didn't mind the suggestion, but I was very confident ArenaNet would not do this. Well, they listened, and now we have Ascended items. Congratulations, community.

The community is why the Karka chest dropped precursors.

Example:
https://forum-en.gui...e/23#post682478

You can enjoy that million page thread of me trying to argue that precursors should be kept rare while others wanted them to come off trees. Looks like I lost that one too. Thanks, community!


This is not me randomly tossing blame. I can pull thread after thread.These were both heavily pushed-for ideas in the official forums, suggestions made by a very large group of players, with plenty of anger and rage behind it to. The community wanted ascended items.

ArenaNet did more than listen to your voices. They're practically taking directions from you, and I want them to stop. If you get enough people together, they'll hear you about this, too. So they can take out the ascended gear. Another group will want them back in, declaring the game destroyed, and I will facepalm.

I'm actually not surprised you think this helps. This is what passes for progress these days, anyway.

Edit: I corrected your quote for you. You are not the community. I repeat: "the community" is what pushed Ascended items to be added into the game.

Edited by LFk, 21 November 2012 - 07:16 AM.

[Daesu]

Graka, on 21 November 2012 - 06:12 AM, said:

If this is true, then why as I said is it the SAME 20 PEOPLE, IN THE SAME THREADS. If it was complainers I see more than just these 20. Almost every thread consists of this Complainer1: "Man I hate gw2 for X, Y" Complainer2:"Man I hate it for X, Y too, and Z, you should see this other thread where i said the same thing " Complainer 3:" you should see this thread I hate it for X and Z" and the other 17 complainers are hating it for exactly these 3 reasons and continue to bitch about it in the thread over and over and over and over and over.

Are you kidding me?  I counted much more than just 20 people here, even more outside, who are against this gear grind.

LFk, on 21 November 2012 - 07:02 AM, said:

Believe me, they heard your voices.

Then they haven't come forward to address this with the community instead of simply mass banning those who brought this up in their official forums, then pretend that everyone is happy.

LFk, on 21 November 2012 - 07:02 AM, said:

Edit: I corrected your quote for you. You are not the community. I repeat: "the community" is what pushed Ascended items to be added into the game.

I guess you didn't read the poll results then.

http://www.guildwars...ascended-items/

It seems your definition of "what the community wants" is simply whatever ArenaNet wants them to have.

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 07:14 AM.

[farkov47]

To me the Fractals Difficulty Scale is a segregation of players that was very unnecessary.
I wouldn't quit the game at this point, but the RNG nature of the fractals make exploration a pain in the butt.
I just want to do all the fractal and forget about it

To me, Legendaries is the first cue that there's something that grinders can strive for.
Tokens for Dungeon Set was an acceptable target. I achieved it with a few weeks of regular guild runs. I was happy and content.
Legendary continues to go out of reach for me and I accept that. I was looking forward to new dungeons to run and when Lost Shores was announced, I'm kinda happy.

Then Fractal Difficulty Scale came. Realization went to my head: I can't do this for the gear, it's too rigid of a system. I'd need to find regular people to run with, plan around and stuck to the schedule lest I slow down their progress.

A.Net's way of 'leave it to the players to sort their party problems' reeks of nonsensical. This is a problem they've created themselves. How can they not see this coming?

[LFk]

farkov47, on 21 November 2012 - 07:10 AM, said:

Then Fractal Difficulty Scale came. Realization went to my head: I can't do this for the gear, it's too rigid of a system. I'd need to find regular people to run with, plan around and stuck to the schedule lest I slow down their progress.

A.Net's way of 'leave it to the players to sort their party problems' reeks of nonsensical. This is a problem they've created themselves. How can they not see this coming?

Hm. Well, I can't disagree with you. I don't think of this as a problem because I have friends to run it with, who are willing to repeat low levels to catch up stragglers.

For the solo gamer, the fractals is more of a hassle since it bears far more repetition than an ordinary dungeon. I think ArenaNet's reason (excuse) for leaving out a comprehensive LFG feature was to make the game more "social", as in forcing people to talk to each other instead of just clicking into a party, and running the dungeon without saying a word to each other.

My opinion is that this failed, because all it resulted in was some map chat spam, and people talking in a curt series of abbreviations. "LFG FoTM Lv3" "k inv" "rdy?".

I think an inbuilt interface for finding parties would greatly improve  your game experience, allowing you to progress the fractals at your own pace without the stress of finding an appropriate group. If that is something you want, I'd definitely agree with you. I think this is a feature that most modern MMOs should pack. Forced socialization is not actually socialization.

Edited by LFk, 21 November 2012 - 07:27 AM.

[LFk]

Daesu, on 21 November 2012 - 07:09 AM, said:

I guess you didn't read the poll results then.

http://www.guildwars...ascended-items/

It seems your definition of "what the community wants" is simply whatever ArenaNet wants them to have.

That poll only hampers your argument. First of all, there is about a sample size of 1,000.

For argument's sake, let's assume this sample is representative. For the first question, both 'yes' and 'no' control a good potion of the respondents. The margin is about 14%, or 180 people. Neither one has a majority (over 51%). This is in line with what I said: That there are lots of people on both sides. Some don't even know what they want yet, and want to see.

Furthermore, the poll's only large margin of victory (70% - 12%), is the one that overwhelmingly demonstrates players are generally unconcerned about the change, and will keep playing.

You should probably find a poll that shows a greater skew, or more helpfully proves your point. It should be pretty easy to find one, and if not, pretty easy to just generate one. One of the greatest fallacies with polls is that the respondent count is heavily tied to how passionate a given group is, not the actual number of people for or against.

You can refer to this brief exchange I had with game economist John Smith as to the flaws of surveys:
https://forum-en.gui...ge/2#post684032

Edited by LFk, 21 November 2012 - 07:41 AM.

[Lordkrall]

Daesu, on 20 November 2012 - 11:22 PM, said:

Only 5%?  I can give +100 armor to everyone around me with just "Save Yourself!" every 6s, and deal 140% of the damage back with "Pain Inverter", who cares about your LB title then?

Like I have said, PvE skills determine your performance in DoA more than LB title does.

And by the way, you can farm to max your LB title in 1 to 2 days.  Probably need more gold than 2 days worth of farming to get all your Ascended.

You do seem to ignore the fact that "Save Yourself!" needed rather major grind in order to reach that level and so did Pain Inverter.

[chrisbdrake]

Daesu, on 21 November 2012 - 06:57 AM, said:

So it was too hard for you to get a cheap rune from the rune vendor?  I don't see the problem.

So you don't have a problem with the ascended items being better than exotics then?  Your problem is that ascended items are too hard?

Lordkrall, on 21 November 2012 - 07:44 AM, said:

You do seem to ignore the fact that "Save Yourself!" needed rather major grind in order to reach that level and so did Pain Inverter.

Some people like to ignore the facts that don't support their position.  They are usually the conspiracy types.

[Daesu]

LFk, on 21 November 2012 - 07:38 AM, said:

That poll only hampers your argument. First of all, there is about a sample size of 1,000.

Ah...I see, your argument is that because there isn't enough sample size therefore there are more people who supports the gear grind than there are against, in reality.  What do you base that on?  Did you perform a proper poll then?  What sample size did you use?

Edited by Daesu, 21 November 2012 - 08:02 AM.

[Larsen]

Quote

A.Net's way of 'leave it to the players to sort their party problems' reeks of nonsensical. This is a problem they've created themselves. How can they not see this coming?

It would actually have been fine if they'd also implemented the features necessary for a "social" group-making platform, but GW2 lacks such extremely basic features as a /who command, the ability to inspect people, and a way to confirm that they actually have the build they say they have. These things have been in basically every MMORPG ever made, and removing them is what's really nonsensical. Without them (and without traditional PvE roles), what's really the point of forcing people to interact prior to gameplay? You have no way of verifying that what they're saying is at all true, or suggesting a better setup of gear/traits. That leaves rather little premise for pre-invite communication.

If those things had been in, the absence of an automated LFG tool would be more of a design choice than simply a missing feature. You can argue in favor of both sides, since a dungeon finder tends to completely remove the element of human interaction and discourages any kind of community or accountability. I can see why they might have gone 'well, I certainly would prefer to be able to have a brief word with someone before I decide whether or not I want to group with them, so let's make that a feature of the game...'

...but then they shouldn't have simultaneously taken a hundred steps backwards in the MMORPG development timeline, neglecting features that freaking Everquest launched with.

I mean, really.

Edited by Larsen, 21 November 2012 - 08:01 AM.