ExplosivePinata, on 24 November 2012 - 12:48 AM, said:
Whats next? 1 silver everytime we post a chat message?
I'd love to see that. Guild Wars 2 really needs more irrational taxes. I mean, gold sinks are the best things ever
. So providing a tariff on speaking is for the best. It would have so many fringe benefits - like stopping lower levelled people or those who don't grind as much from talking. And we don't like listening to them anyway
! Bloody riff-raff.
To be honest, I think the game needs more gold sinks, not less! I think they should tax us for crossing zones, too. And if you can't pay the tax, you have to grind in the zone you're in until you can. Also, I think that selling items should have a 10% tax, because that'd be realistic. We're paying to our governments, scarcity exists so taxation is totally valid in a videogame! Real world economies are just like videogame ones!
Okay, I'm done being sarcastic. But these are the arguments I've been reading since this mess began. I've just been shaking my head at the lack of logic of it all.
Just so you're clear, I'm not attacking you ExplosivePinata, I'm using your brilliant point to launch off on a sarcastic rant, because I just want to make it incredibly clear just how singularly dumb this whole affair is. There's no scarcity in a videogame, real world economies are nothing like videogame economies, and there are plenty of games which have done just fine without having gold taxes. But them's the thoughts of a reasonable mind.
Not the point. Nice straw-man, though.
We're saying that it's bad design, because the gold sinks aren't necessary and go against the rule of fun. Does being taxed all the time
sound like a fun activity? It isn't. It doesn't belong in a videogame. It's not fun. It's bad design that would get laughed out of a single- or multi-player game. Instead, we want more
irrational gold sinks.
Some might not be able to afford it, and that would suck for them. But that's not the point. If it's just there to pad out the game and to make the game last longer artificially, which is what a gold sink does, then it doesn't belong in a good game
. If GW2 has it, then GW2 is logically not a good game. It would be better without one.
A good game concentrates on fun
without needing artificial methods to try and fake fun, or padding to make it feel longer just so you feel you've gotten your money's worth. (It wasn't fun, but it took up a lot of my time when I was grinding away! That must mean it's good value for money!)
I'm just so tired of arguments which clearly lack self-respect. As consumers, we deserve fun products for the money we lay down. Not products which try to induce people into believing that they might be kind of fun via artificial constraints, operant conditioning, skinnerbox models, et ctera, et cetera. Gold sinks don't do anything to make the game more fun. Opposedly, they're a tax. They make the game less
If you're actively trying to make your game less
fun, you're clearly doing something wrong.
to make a point... isn't adding lots of artificial constraints what WoW does? You pay for all sorts of different things, like using flying taxis and whatnot. How many WoW fans am I arguing with? That's kind of what I want to know. If I'm arguing with a lot of them, then I can understand. You haven't been playing games
(which are fun), you've been playing WoW (which uses social engineering and various forms of conditioning to make you believe it's fun).
If you play a game, an actual game
, you find that taxes aren't present. I was playing Scribblenauts Unlimited earlier. A brilliant little game. I was moving from place to place and having fun
. I wasn't told at any point that I had to stop and repeat a task over and over in order to gain money. I just proceeded through the game. I didn't ever have anything taken away from me. I didn't find that I was suddenly bleeding starites or starite fragments because of ridiculous taxes.
When you play a game
, you realise how ridiculous taxes are. And how detrimental to fun they are. They don't serve any purpose, they don't help the economy (if they did, Guild Wars 1 would have gold sinks, and yet it doesn't), they don't do anything other than elongate the game artificially. If you're a WoW player, you're in with the crowd that thinks an artificially elongated game is fun.
But I'm not a WoW player. I'm a gamer
. I play a variety of games. And only a very tiny per centage of those (WoW-like MMOs) seem to believe they need taxes. But not even all MMOs believe they need them, GW1 doesn't have them, Champions Online/Star Trek Online doesn't have them. Any game that has a good grasp of what fun
is doesn't have them.
Yet we'll continue dancing around this ridiculous argument.
And the argument of the opposition amounts to this: Guild Wars 1 should have lots of gold sinks added to it, because wtihotu being taxed for everything, it just isn't fun.
...I'm amazed that none of you have realised how nonsensical of an argument this is.
Edited by DuskWolf, 24 November 2012 - 05:47 AM.