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Where to find Mace/Shield builds?


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#1 Havana Crab

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 07:43 AM

So far I have been using Mace/Shield a lot on my guardian (who just hit lvl 80.)  I'd like to read up on some good builds for this setup.  I like shouts, and mainly would like to be able to run dungeons (especially Fractals.)  I have some ideas, but I'd like to know what more experienced players might recommend.  

As my secondary weaponry, I do like scepter/focus a lot, but I switch to Staff and Greatsword for big zerg events to tag as much as possible.  I know asking to be good at all 4 of these is probably a bit too much, but a build that makes the most out of the mace shield combo and would still allow a little dabbling would be good if one is possible (especially with the scepter/focus.)

If it would help to post what I've been aiming for, it's like this except with crappy gear.  I want to be sure, before I actually buy the exotics.

Edited by Havana Crab, 24 November 2012 - 07:44 AM.


#2 jpg1

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 01:49 AM

View PostHavana Crab, on 24 November 2012 - 07:43 AM, said:

If it would help to post what I've been aiming for, it's like this except with crappy gear.  I want to be sure, before I actually buy the exotics.


You build is actually good already, and can actually be used with other weapons. The thing about the Shield is it's a very PVP sort of weapon, most popularly used by Point-Defense Guardians. I personally run with Mace + Focus, and Scepter + Shield when I do Kiting, since Shield of Absorption as the KD + 1,000+ Heal comes handy when you're getting ganged up on by trash mobs.

You did not touch on your Equipment set for the post so I had a bit of a problem taking in the idea of getting Empowering Might for your Honor Master trait. If you're getting a Knight Set, that would be really an awesome choice. You could also consider getting Writ of the Merciful, if you decide on not getting high enough Critical Chance. Symbol of Faith + Writ of the Merciful is a very good bunker combo.

There is also getting Unscathed Contender - it's really a poor trait, unless you'll be running long range for the majority of your fights. Aegis never stays active long enough - it's really used to block big hits from bosses and/or soften multiple hits from them. It's not really meant to increase your offense. I think for Adept Virtues that best things you can get are Master of Consecrations or Vengeful.

Edited by jpg1, 26 November 2012 - 01:53 AM.


#3 Havana Crab

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 03:34 PM

Thank you jpg for the advice.  

View Postjpg1, on 26 November 2012 - 01:49 AM, said:

You did not touch on your Equipment set for the post so I had a bit of a problem taking in the idea of getting Empowering Might for your Honor Master trait. If you're getting a Knight Set, that would be really an awesome choice.

That is a good point.  I've held off on buying any good gear since I'm not sure which to get.  I'm actually wearing masterwork stuff still.  I'm thinking of going Knights or Clerics but I don't know.  I like your idea of going with Writ of the Merciful.  Any advice on Knights vs Clerics vs spending the Karma/Dungeon tokens for Pwr+Vit+Tough armor?

View Postjpg1, on 26 November 2012 - 01:49 AM, said:

There is also getting Unscathed Contender - it's really a poor trait, unless you'll be running long range for the majority of your fights. Aegis never stays active long enough - it's really used to block big hits from bosses and/or soften multiple hits from them. It's not really meant to increase your offense. I think for Adept Virtues that best things you can get are Master of Consecrations or Vengeful.

Good advice.  Aegis does get used up fast.  Suppose I commit myself to the 60 points in Valor and Honor, and can put the last 10 points anywhere.  What might be good for a mace build?  Would Vengeful and M.o.Consecrations be the best choice anywhere on the board?  I'm thinking Signet Mastery for the 20% more use of Signet of Healing, or maybe a 5-5 split with Zealot's Speed and Inspired Virtue.

Edited by Havana Crab, 26 November 2012 - 03:38 PM.


#4 G L J

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 07:18 PM

View PostHavana Crab, on 26 November 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

That is a good point.  I've held off on buying any good gear since I'm not sure which to get.  I'm actually wearing masterwork stuff still.  I'm thinking of going Knights or Clerics but I don't know.  I like your idea of going with Writ of the Merciful.  Any advice on Knights vs Clerics vs spending the Karma/Dungeon tokens for Pwr+Vit+Tough armor?

Cleric's armor is garbage. It weighs healing power at the same rate as other primaries and guardians don't have very good healing power ratios. Guardians have really nice base healing amounts, so it evens out there. Having some healing power is important, but not to the point that cleric's gives.

Knight's armor is good, because it gives you a decent amount of precision - which equates into critical hits - which equates into more dodges and more healing dodges (if you spec into it).

As for soldier's armor (power/toughness/vitality) - it is the tankiest armor while still retaining high damage. You don't get precision so you need to make it up somewhere.

The important thing to note is that a mix of armor provides better results than simply stacking 14/14 pieces of the same triple combination. I see arguments for different combinations, but what you want to shoot for is something in these parameters.
  • 2400-3000 armor
  • 14-22k health
  • 10-40% critical chance
  • I actually forgot the rough amount of power, it's been a week since I've logged in.

~~~

Getting soldier's armor is actually remarkably easy. It takes about two days. Buy the chest and legs with karma, and the rest with dungeon tokens. If you do all three paths in Ascalonian catacombs/honor of the waves you can buy yourself a piece of gear.

#5 TGIFrisbie

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 07:32 PM

View PostHavana Crab, on 24 November 2012 - 07:43 AM, said:

I switch to Staff and Greatsword for big zerg events to tag as much as possible.

Not trying to deviate and someone else is already more helpful than I will be on your questions, but do you find you will actually be participating much in d/e's at 80 anymore?  Most have moved on to the vertical sheep farm....I mean Fractals.


View PostG L J, on 26 November 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

Getting soldier's armor is actually remarkably easy. It takes about two days. Buy the chest and legs with karma, and the rest with dungeon tokens. If you do all three paths in Ascalonian catacombs/honor of the waves you can buy yourself a piece of gear.

It can be even easier if you have the karma, only need the Helm from AC or HotW or with badges in WvW.

If you go full "Soldier" what do you suggest for Jewelery?

Edited by TGIFrisbie, 26 November 2012 - 07:36 PM.


#6 G L J

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 08:25 PM

View PostTGIFrisbie, on 26 November 2012 - 07:32 PM, said:

Not trying to deviate and someone else is already more helpful than I will be on your questions, but do you find you will actually be participating much in d/e's at 80 anymore?  Most have moved on to the vertical sheep farm....I mean Fractals.

If you're karma farming or just farming Orr in general (a little outdated, I know) you might consider picking up magic find gear.


Quote

It can be even easier if you have the karma, only need the Helm from AC or HotW or with badges in WvW.

If you go full "Soldier" what do you suggest for Jewelery?

I use the following as my armor combination:
  • Soldier's armor - 6x dwayna runes
  • Valkyrie weapons - Accuracy sigil
  • Soldier's amulet - Knight's jewel
  • Fractal ascended magic find backpack
  • Knight's rings - knight's jewels
  • Valkyrie accessories - valkyrie jewels.
I'll have a screenshot of my stats in a few minutes, but the idea was simple. I wanted to mix myself with a good amount of power/toughness/vitality - but I originally didn't know how to get the soldier's armor. So I went with a double combo of knight's/valkyrie's gear.

On the attached picture, The crit chance is off. It's supposed to be 21% (30% with food/consumables)

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Edited by G L J, 26 November 2012 - 08:34 PM.


#7 jpg1

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:45 PM

View PostHavana Crab, on 26 November 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:


Snip


If you're not big on getting Inspired Virtues, taking the 10 points to Radiance will give you shorter recharge on Signet Heal, and 100 Precision which isn't bad for any Guardian Build. At level 80 that's about 4%+ increased chance to do critical hits.

#8 Havana Crab

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 06:16 AM

View PostG L J, on 26 November 2012 - 08:25 PM, said:

If you're karma farming or just farming Orr in general (a little outdated, I know) you might consider picking up magic find gear.


I have three other level 80 characters all outfitted completely in Exotic MF gear.  I'm looking for something else on this character.  One that can do Fractals and other dungeons.

View Postjpg1, on 26 November 2012 - 11:45 PM, said:

If you're not big on getting Inspired Virtues, taking the 10 points to Radiance will give you shorter recharge on Signet Heal, and 100 Precision which isn't bad for any Guardian Build. At level 80 that's about 4%+ increased chance to do critical hits.

That sounds pretty good to me.

#9 Havana Crab

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 06:23 AM

View PostG L J, on 26 November 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

Cleric's armor is garbage. It weighs healing power at the same rate as other primaries and guardians don't have very good healing power ratios. Guardians have really nice base healing amounts, so it evens out there. Having some healing power is important, but not to the point that cleric's gives.

I did not know this.  Perhaps I can make up with some healing power on the Jewelry or somewhere else, but go Knight's or Soldier's on the armor.  

View PostG L J, on 26 November 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

Knight's armor is good, because it gives you a decent amount of precision - which equates into critical hits - which equates into more dodges and more healing dodges (if you spec into it).

From Vigorous Precision?  Does that make that much of a difference?  I can see crit adding a little damage, but didn't see it equating into the dodging, as 1 sec vigor sounded not too important.  

View PostG L J, on 26 November 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

Getting soldier's armor is actually remarkably easy. It takes about two days. Buy the chest and legs with karma, and the rest with dungeon tokens. If you do all three paths in Ascalonian catacombs/honor of the waves you can buy yourself a piece of gear.

3 paths per piece or so?  Some of those paths can take a long time to complete depending on the pug.  Still, that might be better than I thought.

#10 jpg1

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 06:55 AM

Healing Power with Trinkets is still not worth it.

For Guardians there are only four viable sets: (1) Knight's, (2) Soldier's, (3) Valkyrie, or (4) Berserker's. (In my opinion)

People think it's quite enough to get bonuses in Healing Power via the Honor Line, and nothing more. Having a lot of sources of healing, it's really not important to stack on that particular attribute.

The one second Vigor actually builds up depending on how often you land a critical hit. It may be hard to notice but it's there.

Yup you only need 180 Tokens for the Helms, Gloves, and Boots. AC is pretty easy and a lot of people run it. (At least for my server.)
It's not bad to get the whole armor from dungeons as its a very good way to get some loots and gold. (I personally got 5/6 pieces in HotW. With the exception of the Shoulders which I got for Karma because I love the skin.)

#11 G L J

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 04:10 PM

View PostHavana Crab, on 27 November 2012 - 06:23 AM, said:

From Vigorous Precision?  Does that make that much of a difference?  I can see crit adding a little damage, but didn't see it equating into the dodging, as 1 sec vigor sounded not too important.  

3-4 seconds of vigor equates to one extra dodge, which equates to a heal from selfless daring and... well... a dodge.

#12 indure

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 06:35 PM

View PostHavana Crab, on 27 November 2012 - 06:23 AM, said:

From Vigorous Precision?  Does that make that much of a difference?  I can see crit adding a little damage, but didn't see it equating into the dodging, as 1 sec vigor sounded not too important.

With a mix of Knight and Valkyrie gear you can easily obtain ~30% crit chance (as high as ~50%) meaning 1/3 of your attacks will crit and since Vigorous Precision has no internal cooldown you can keep up long lasting amounts of Vigor fairly easily.

Also IMO crit chance is the biggest factor dictating player DPS, since regardless of gear choice most guardians end up with similar attack power. In addition, high crit chances coincide well with many of the proc based Sigils and makes the debuff Weakness a lot less powerful.

#13 G L J

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 07:33 PM

View Postindure, on 27 November 2012 - 06:35 PM, said:

With a mix of Knight and Valkyrie gear you can easily obtain ~30% crit chance (as high as ~50%) meaning 1/3 of your attacks will crit and since Vigorous Precision has no internal cooldown you can keep up long lasting amounts of Vigor fairly easily.

Also IMO crit chance is the biggest factor dictating player DPS, since regardless of gear choice most guardians end up with similar attack power. In addition, high crit chances coincide well with many of the proc based Sigils and makes the debuff Weakness a lot less powerful.

high crit chance with low damage doesn't do as much damage as high damage with low crit chance (there's a direct correlation, you need to find a sweet spot in the middle) but it's a bit of a moot point since most of the good guardian armors carry strength anyways.




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