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How to take on a Mesmer

mesmer pvp how to 1v1

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#1 Sephorai

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 12:04 PM

I want to give you guys some general advice that hopefully makes fighting mesmers a heck of a lot easier. This is info comes from an old thread on the Ele forum but I figure for anyone who goes onto the Mesmer section to learn about the profession would benefit (feel free to correct my posts)

This is my original post on the Ele thread:

The first and most important bit of info you have to assertain is where is their damage coming from (I'll cover the main 2 I've seen).

One of the most popular sources of their damage is their phantasms (their purple clones). Depending on what weapons they have each phantasm is different. 
Pistol: Duelist~An illusion with duel pistols who does an animation extremely similar to the thief unload. 
Focus: Warden~An illusion that spawns next to you and starts spinning axes in a bubble around you (don't sit in it)
Staff: Warlock~ An illusion that blasts you with an attack similar to the staff auto attack. Very easy to over look
Greatsword: Beserker~An illusion that spawns next to you and does the warrior spin attack. (cripples)

The number one rule for fighting a phantasm Mesmer is KILL THEIR PHANTAMS. A phantasm Mesmer with no phantasm is a Mesmer with hardly any damage. The warden you can mostly ignore for the most part, he does massive damage but only if you sit in his bubble which isn't hard at all to avoid. The Duelist and Warlock need to be your prime targets. The majority of the time they aren't spawned in melee range so they remain in general safety if you choose to ignore them. The Warlock and Duelist together can hit you for about 8-10k if you just ignore them. Make it your priority to kill them. Also rembrandt that as soon as their summoned they use their attacks so pay attention so you can dodge that initial spike. The Beserker is simpler to take care of since he is spawned next to you. As soon as you see the Mesmer point his great sword towards the sky, dodge. Cus the Beserker spawns and immediately spins onto you. Dodge and make short work of it. When those phantasms are down spike that Mesmer as hard as you can (save your spike for the Mesmer not te clones). I know they seem unbeatable but once you learn how to counter this build it becomes significantly easier. 

The second type of Mesmer is in my opinion the superior build (others may disagree) is the shatter Mesmer. Shattering is the second part of the Mesmer class mechanic during which they detonate their illusions for different effects (damage, confusion, daze, and distortion). A properly specced Shatter Mesmer also has the shatter effect on himself so in total it amounts to 4 shatters when fully stacked. Do not and I repeat DO NOT allow yourself to get hit by a full stack of shatters. On crit each shatter will hit for about 2k (8k total) and that's excluding the damage from the duelist (another 2k) and blurred frenzy (about 2-3k). Most mesmers will begin their spike rotation by summoning their duelist, then the Pistol 5to daze you and sword 3 to immobilize you (creating 2 clones and a third if they were smart and dodge rolled before teleporting with sword 3), casting blurred frenzy and hitting his Mind Wrack (damage shatter) thus hitting you with all 4 shatters, a duelist, and a blurred frenzy. Never ever allow this to hit you. Most form, lightning flash, dodge the pistol shot/immobilize clone just do not allow yourself to get hit. If you see multiple clones running toward you (and the Mesmer usually is close enough too) get ready to dodge cus he is shattering. If toucan avoid his shatters the Mesmer is practically harmless for about 10 secs where he gets his mind wrack back. Also killing his clones before he shatters them also works wonders. Btw the reason I believe this build is better is because it's not as easy to counter, and it's much more useful in team fights because your damage is aoe instead of mostly single target.

The next bit of advice comes from Lord Sojar:

You forgot about a condition based toughness stack mesmer, which I frequently use in PvP.

It's similar to the shatter build, except instead of relying on the shatter dmg, we rely on a massive condition stack to get the job done.  

Easiest way to counter this is to transfer, if possible, the conditions back to the mesmer, put your own conditions on the mesmer, or to cleanse yourself constantly.  In this instance, the biggest mistake you can make is to try to DPS down the mesmer with raw dmg, as it only serves to kill you faster thanks to confusion stacks and the fact that said mesmer can have 2k+ toughness.  

It seems, at first, that a mesmer with this build doesn't do much dmg... but once those stacks are on you, you're in trouble.  So, best advice is, don't let it get that far; cleanse well and cleanse often.

As an ele, you can use water attunement to aid in healing you through these condition stacks, and potentially try and out survive the mesmer.  Remember, don't go for brute dmg when against a condition mesmer; turn their own game against them and stack bleeds  and burning. 



Hope this helps you and everyone who has trouble with mesmers no matter which profession you play. 


#2 Allmightybob

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 07:07 AM

Generally what kills me is hard CC and quick spikes whenever I have Blink on cooldown.

#3 RandolfRa

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 12:19 PM

In WvW, I personally hate fighting tanky builds that use long lasting conditions for damage. I try to burst them down before they can use their condition spreads or before the conditions deal too much damage, but if they have good defence, that may not always work. Some of us shatter mesmers don't bother to bring any condition removal.
Burst thiefs, warriors, and other idiots who think that rushing at me is a good idea, I find much easier to deal with.

Edited by RandolfRa, 28 November 2012 - 12:21 PM.


#4 Sephorai

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 01:21 PM

As long as I help some1 :P

#5 rastazi

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 09:07 AM

I run a full Carrion specced Sword/Torch shatter mesmer with 21.5k hp in WvW. This is for WvW so it may not apply exactly, but the confusion damage will still be significant. I can drop bunker eles and any sort of thief pretty easily, so I'll shed some light from my perspective to see what the best counters are:

My goal is to dump confusion on you. I can pop 12 stacks in 2 seconds and each action you do is going to cause you about 4.5k of damage (2.25k in sPvP). I do not run any condition mitigation because all of my utility slots are critical (decoy, blink, and mirror images). I very, very rarely get conditions flipped on me.

My favorite class to fight is bunker guardians. They think they are invincible, they get 12 stacks, they melt themselves. My least favorite class are condition thieves or bunker D/D eles. Here's how I drop some common builds:

D/D Ele:
Wait for water attunement to go up and avoid the obvious crap along the way (dodgeroll the RTL opener and no I'm not falling for your teleport earthquake the fifth time, quit trying it). As soon as you are on water for about 5 seconds, I drop phantasms and stealth up with the torch 4. As soon as I appear I use mindwrack + mirror images + confusion shatter. Most eles will be in DPS mode and in fire or earth attunement at this point and are easy kills. In long drawn out fights, I keep resetting distance and targetting with blink + decoy, staff 2, and torch 4 for stealth. In fights like this I will typically always have a wall of shatters up and chasing the target, so I have 3 to 6 clones I can run around behind and act like after drop-targetting myself with some form of stealth. Good eles turn this into a battle of attrition and take two element rotations for me to drop -- one to get them to 1/3 health and one to finish you off after the next round of recharges come back.

B/S glass thieves:
Pretty much entirely a game of how fast I can hit my distortion shatter.

1) Distortion shatter
2) Mirror images
3) Dodgeroll + Mindwrack
4) Sword 3 + 2 and confusion shatter to finish, or Staff 2 to reset distance depending on my HP

BS thieves that don't get me on the opener are easy game.



Heavy condition thieves:

I don't run into these often enough but they give me massive problems because of no condition mitigation. Typically I have to reset battle as soon as they hit me:

1) Distortion shatter
2) Staff 2 -> Blink -> Decoy (reset battle, LoS on terrain)
3) Hide/heal depending on condition intensity, stealth up with torch 4, and jump the thief


Hopefully this will show you how a confusion shatter mesmer approaches a fight and give you some ideas to counter it.

#6 Sephorai

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:49 PM

Thanks mate :) the more people helping out with advice the quicker people can better understand your class. Just to harp in on what you were saying, if you don't carry an condition flips (like me cus I'm an Ele and we don't have any flips) you have to understand that confusion hurts you for attacking and it does true damage. You have to have to HAVE TO be actively removing condition stacks and when you have them DO NOT attack or it doesn't matter how muh toughness you have you will melt.

#7 Cl1p

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 02:37 PM

View Postrastazi, on 30 November 2012 - 09:07 AM, said:

snip

I've been avoiding this forum since release and I'm utterly supprised to find my excact build & playstyle  (same utilities, same strategy) here I play this build in WvW and haven't seen any mesmers so far with my build :P
Cool (y)

Edited by Cl1p, 30 November 2012 - 02:38 PM.


#8 Sephorai

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 02:38 PM

Yeah you'd be surprised at home similarly some people think :P

#9 BorzE

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 04:02 PM

View Postrastazi, on 30 November 2012 - 09:07 AM, said:

snip
Great info thx.  Couple of questions.

How is your dps other than confusion?
How much can you keep confusion up?
I guess Im wondering if it is possible for an opponent just to wait for your confusion to wear off and then DPS you down?





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