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Raids in GW2?


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#121 elmprotector

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 11:28 PM

View Postasbasb, on 14 December 2012 - 09:04 PM, said:

I'm pretty positive that there will be 10+ man raids in the future. They could easily redelegate their dungeon developing resources from creating 3 5 man paths into one 5 man and one 10 man path, for instance. Or just one super awesome path, that a 5 man team(pugs) could run up to a point, and a 10+ man raid would be able to finish. The AR level of the dungeon could be calculated by the average of all the raid members, not the one with the lowest score. That prevents raid guilds from being punished too much for taking in someone that has fallen a bit behind.

Oh there are so many ways to make it work in GW2, and there are quite a few people requesting it. Here, on the OF, and in game.

Glad you feel positive... now go read and listen to the dev interviews before release.. if you can still feel confidant then you live in a dream world.

#122 Rhydian

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 02:05 AM

Might as well they already have rails.

#123 Trei

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 02:28 AM

View PostRickter, on 14 December 2012 - 07:28 PM, said:

same gear, different ways to obtain, what's the big deal?  but raids will give larger guilds the OPTION - the option to run large scale instanced pve content.
Do you seriously believe most raiders would actually go through the whole process needed to set up raids and run them regularly... if the exact same rewards can be acquired elsewhere?


You are in a very small subset within a subset of a player segment that accounts for a fraction of each entire playerbase of various MMOs.

You can do a simple experiment: make a guest account in WoW forums and ask the question "should the highest tier raid gear in the game be made acquirable somehow for non-raiders?"

#124 Dasryn

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 03:23 AM

View PostTrei, on 15 December 2012 - 02:28 AM, said:

Do you seriously believe most raiders would actually go through the whole process needed to set up raids and run them regularly... if the exact same rewards can be acquired elsewhere?


You are in a very small subset within a subset of a player segment that accounts for a fraction of each entire playerbase of various MMOs.

You can do a simple experiment: make a guest account in WoW forums and ask the question "should the highest tier raid gear in the game be made acquirable somehow for non-raiders?"

its just an option for larger guilds that dont want to pvp to be able to attempt content with each other.  and idk, maybe they could add some kind of extra incentive but not in the form of gear.  idk man, i just think that raids should at least be an option for the guilds that are large enough that would appreciate having this kind of content to be able to schedule.

pugs can still do FotM, then everyone is happy.  guilds become much more relevant than they are.  its a win win.  idk how you can be so against this.

#125 Trei

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 03:39 AM

View PostRickter, on 15 December 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

pugs can still do FotM, then everyone is happy.  guilds become much more relevant than they are.  its a win win.  idk how you can be so against this.
Is this "option" worth -

a] the amount of resources needed to design, create and implement content good enough to attract the small percentage of players who can raid?

b] the ire of the large percentage of players who do not want to even entertain the mere thought of the possibility of considering to think about the feasibility of raids in the game?

How do you justify the use of these same resources on content only a small percentage of players would ever see, over much more accessible content for the entire playerbase instead?

If you can be satisfied with just cut-n-paste scaled-up versions of existing dungeons with existing dungeon loot, then you belong to an even tinier sub-sub-segment.

Edited by Trei, 15 December 2012 - 03:41 AM.


#126 Dasryn

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 06:24 PM

View PostTrei, on 15 December 2012 - 03:39 AM, said:

Is this "option" worth -

a] the amount of resources needed to design, create and implement content good enough to attract the small percentage of players who can raid?

b] the ire of the large percentage of players who do not want to even entertain the mere thought of the possibility of considering to think about the feasibility of raids in the game?

How do you justify the use of these same resources on content only a small percentage of players would ever see, over much more accessible content for the entire playerbase instead?

If you can be satisfied with just cut-n-paste scaled-up versions of existing dungeons with existing dungeon loot, then you belong to an even tinier sub-sub-segment.

i suppose you are correct Trei.  i mean, dont get me wrong, im not an advocate of "raids" per se, i just wanted pve instanced content that guilds could do together.  because right now, this game is not really catering to guilds.  guilds are cookie cutter and offer nothing to hold guildies together.  its not personable.

#127 Trei

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 06:32 PM

I understand your concerns.

I am not against raids itself, I am against the real reasons few would ever admit why most raiders want raids.

#128 elmprotector

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 11:32 PM

View PostTrei, on 15 December 2012 - 03:39 AM, said:

Is this "option" worth -

a] the amount of resources needed to design, create and implement content good enough to attract the small percentage of players who can raid?

b] the ire of the large percentage of players who do not want to even entertain the mere thought of the possibility of considering to think about the feasibility of raids in the game?

How do you justify the use of these same resources on content only a small percentage of players would ever see, over much more accessible content for the entire playerbase instead?

If you can be satisfied with just cut-n-paste scaled-up versions of existing dungeons with existing dungeon loot, then you belong to an even tinier sub-sub-segment.

every other mmo that caters to hard core raiders waste the resources to do it.  But arenanet has said no.  They understand that money is with casuals who want 5 man no trinity and no gear grind.

#129 Jairyn

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 11:40 PM

I'd be more interested in seeing more, better, deeper raid-level dynamic events to cater to this gameplay than something funneling people out of the world. Set in proper context, these could provide challenging content requiring organized groups, without breaking down to utter exclusivity and all the detriments that entails.

"The whole game is the end game." I want that. Complex, challenging, spontaneous, epically proportioned open-world raid content for everyone.

Edited by Jairyn, 15 December 2012 - 11:42 PM.


#130 Dasryn

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 01:05 AM

View PostJairyn, on 15 December 2012 - 11:40 PM, said:

"The whole game is the end game." I want that. Complex, challenging, spontaneous, epically proportioned open-world raid content for everyone.

believe it or not, Dynamic Events such as the Shatterer are like this.

the problem is that content doesnt happen often enough.  dynamic events as a whole dont happen often enough.  werent we told that if we didnt want to do hearts we could level just by doing DEs?  hardly. . . right?

#131 Trei

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 01:46 AM

View PostRickter, on 16 December 2012 - 01:05 AM, said:

the problem is that content doesnt happen often enough.  dynamic events as a whole dont happen often enough.  werent we told that if we didnt want to do hearts we could level just by doing DEs?  hardly. . . right?
Uh... that's almost exactly how I'm leveling my alts.

Personal story will drive me to a level wall every other chapter whereby I would start wandering around and do DEs as I find them.

Often, hearts in the DEs' paths inevitably get completed without me actively doing them.

The problem is what speed you expect to be reasonable and acceptable for leveling with just one form of activity.

Even if I take out the potential exp from story and hearts, leveling speed would still be perfectly fine, for me.

Because I accept the fact that I would never be anywhere near as fast than players who opt to do more than me.

Edited by Trei, 16 December 2012 - 02:31 AM.


#132 Arquenya

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 02:54 AM

View PostRickter, on 15 December 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

i suppose you are correct Trei.  i mean, dont get me wrong, im not an advocate of "raids" per se, i just wanted pve instanced content that guilds could do together.  because right now, this game is not really catering to guilds.  guilds are cookie cutter and offer nothing to hold guildies together.  its not personable.
That's true. No guild halls, GvG or big instances.
I also miss it, a lot of GW's features that brought people more together.

One advantage of bigger dungeons would be that my guardians buffs and support skills would affect more people; 600 range isn't that big. Perhaps they should give slightly bigger dungeons a try, something between 5-mans and zerg ... ?

View PostRickter, on 16 December 2012 - 01:05 AM, said:

the problem is that content doesnt happen often enough.  dynamic events as a whole dont happen often enough.  werent we told that if we didnt want to do hearts we could level just by doing DEs?  hardly. . . right?
Yes, it's hard to find them, especially in lower zones. I often see "event nearby" but the maps shows nothing? While in the Dredge area you see almost all DE's across them map. Other DE's I've only seen happening once - while levelled 9 human characters through Queensdale (and still come there quite often). What that's concerned, WAR had those world events that had a timer and a 1/2, 2/3 and 3/3 so you knew when what was going to happen.

Edited by Arquenya, 16 December 2012 - 02:55 AM.


#133 Jairyn

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 03:08 AM

View PostRickter, on 16 December 2012 - 01:05 AM, said:

believe it or not, Dynamic Events such as the Shatterer are like this.

the problem is that content doesnt happen often enough.  dynamic events as a whole dont happen often enough.  werent we told that if we didnt want to do hearts we could level just by doing DEs?  hardly. . . right?
On demand would definitely be nice, i know the GW2 devs like to speak ill of the NPC outposts full of !s, but I would be pleased as punch if there was that equivalent for event triggers. I love when I see that symbol.

If incessant on demand raid scale content is considered too restrictive in a main map, place an instance portal to an open raid instance and keep the open dynamic event structure. Also whole zones could be designed around this, like Orr but lots more variety. Hopefully we'll at least see that much in the future. More challenge zones.

Edited by Jairyn, 16 December 2012 - 03:11 AM.


#134 Dasryn

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 03:43 AM

View PostJairyn, on 16 December 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

On demand would definitely be nice
exactly, make more DEs on demand! :)




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