22 replies to this topic

[Thorfinnr]

Hi All!

Just looking to get some advice on what would be a couple of the better ways to configure my Thief for WvW at lvl 50.

Obviously not maxed on gear or anything, and only have 2 tiers of traits available.

Thinking a roamer/scout would probably be best, with lots of stealth. I'm thinking I would have a hard time trying to do any kind of damage output since I am not lvlv 80 yet.

Thanks for any advice.

[Korra]

At lvl 50 don't go WvW, and don't even worry about a build.

Just the thinking of being a roamer at lvl 50 is compleltly absurd. Get you ass to lvl 80, get bsk gear and run a backstap build and join the club of the " Fotm thieves".

It's the truth.

[Lordkrall]

Korra, on 25 January 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

At lvl 50 don't go WvW, and don't even worry about a build.

Just the thinking of being a roamer at lvl 50 is compleltly absurd. Get you ass to lvl 80, get bsk gear and run a backstap build and join the club of the " Fotm thieves".

It's the truth.

Why?
It is very possible to start form level 2 and get to level 80 by only doing WvW. The upscaling makes even a lvl 5 player rather useful for some task (harassing supply lines, taking sentries, scouting and so on) not to mention in a zerg or as a defender.

Edited by Lordkrall, 25 January 2013 - 09:11 PM.

[Thorfinnr]

Korra, on 25 January 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

At lvl 50 don't go WvW, and don't even worry about a build.

Just the thinking of being a roamer at lvl 50 is compleltly absurd. Get you ass to lvl 80, get bsk gear and run a backstap build and join the club of the " Fotm thieves".

It's the truth.

I have a lvl 80 to play in W v W, but I like to try things out. I'm thinking using iHouse and other stealth skills+speed+stunbreak+maybe a stun to hit people with, would let me scout and be able to get away from the heavy hitters if i were to be spotted.

Again, looking to play the game and have fun. I'll be lvl 80 eventually with my Thief, but I don't plan to be the "norm"...i.e. backstab, pistol-whip, pick your Fotm...I'm a little more creative than that...I ask because I like to take others input into consideration...so your thoughts are duly noted.

Thanks...I think?

Lordkrall, on 25 January 2013 - 09:10 PM, said:

Why?
It is very possible to start form level 2 and get to level 80 by only doing WvW. The upscaling makes even a lvl 5 player rather useful for some task (harassing supply lines, taking sentries, scouting and so on) not to mention in a zerg or as a defender.

Sounds like that could be fun!

[Korra]

Lordkrall, on 25 January 2013 - 09:10 PM, said:

Why?
It is very possible to start form level 2 and get to level 80 by only doing WvW. The upscaling makes even a lvl 5 player rather useful for some task (harassing supply lines, taking sentries, scouting and so on) not to mention in a zerg or as a defender.

You can level a char only in wvw, yes.

Usefull? No.

End of discussion.

Thorfinnr, on 25 January 2013 - 09:33 PM, said:

I have a lvl 80 to play in W v W, but I like to try things out. I'm thinking using iHouse and other stealth skills+speed+stunbreak+maybe a stun to hit people with, would let me scout and be able to get away from the heavy hitters if i were to be spotted.

Again, looking to play the game and have fun. I'll be lvl 80 eventually with my Thief, but I don't plan to be the "norm"...i.e. backstab, pistol-whip, pick your Fotm...I'm a little more creative than that...I ask because I like to take others input into consideration...so your thoughts are duly noted.

Thanks...I think?



Sounds like that could be fun!

To be honest, while your intentions are "good" they will not be reflecting in the game, scouting as scouting can eb done by any class and it takes 5seconds to get the info of a place.

Defender? Attacker? I call it Meat shield.

[Lordkrall]

Korra, on 25 January 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:

You can level a char only in wvw, yes.

Usefull? No.

End of discussion.

I suppose you have never tried it then? Nor seen a upscaled character in WvW?

A good lvl 10 can easily kill a bad lvl 80.
And killing caravans is quite easy aswell.

[Yski]

I'd suggest going with small groups at low levels.

You won't really lose 1v1s if you know what you're doing, but I doubt you'd get that many kills as a roamer due to the lower damage and if multiple players show up you wouldn't be able to do much else than run. With a group you can still rez and finish downed players, you can build and man siege weapons and perhaps even get some kills thanks to all the aoe.

Besides, with a group you can take supply camps and even towers, meaning you'll also gain xp faster that wat

Edited by Yski, 26 January 2013 - 08:48 AM.

[Rezo]

Lordkrall, on 26 January 2013 - 08:30 AM, said:

I suppose you have never tried it then? Nor seen a upscaled character in WvW?

A good lvl 10 can easily kill a bad lvl 80.
And killing caravans is quite easy aswell.

Good lvl 10 can of course kill lvl 80 but only if lvl 10 is thief and lvl 80 is engi for egzample.And beside WvW is mostly just zerg vs zerg so you will be eaten alive at lvl 10 if you will not camp solo  players.

[Lordkrall]

Rezo, on 26 January 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

Good lvl 10 can of course kill lvl 80 but only if lvl 10 is thief and lvl 80 is engi for egzample.And beside WvW is mostly just zerg vs zerg so you will be eaten alive at lvl 10 if you will not camp solo  players.

Not really, a good player can defeat a bad player no matter the level and profession.

A lowlevel solo:er won't however go into combat with groups of enemies, he will harass supply lines, take sentries or man Siege Weapons. All these things can be done quite easily at lvl 10.

[Rezo]

Lordkrall, on 26 January 2013 - 09:31 AM, said:

Not really, a good player can defeat a bad player no matter the level and profession.

A lowlevel solo:er won't however go into combat with groups of enemies, he will harass supply lines, take sentries or man Siege Weapons. All these things can be done quite easily at lvl 10.

Have you tried doing WvW as engi on low lvl character in small group?Any lvl 80 in good gear with stomp and smash you like an egg.

[Jan Roman]

I would advise watching the chat for some information. Go with larger groups, stay reasonably away from the fight and use ranged weapon to dela some damage (probably a shortbow as a thief). You can be very useful at walls shooting down on the enemy. With some experience I would say you will be able to survive very well. In addition, I would build your traits in a more healing/defensive way - trait for healing and boons after stealthing. If you were able to trait properly, you could deal a reasonable amount of damage without dying much (and even if you die on walls, you'll get ressurected quickly). Don't get into a close range combat though, you will die unless facing a noob.

[MrForz]

Rezo, on 26 January 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

Good lvl 10 can of course kill lvl 80 but only if lvl 10 is thief and lvl 80 is engi for egzample.

Engi's like.. the class with the BEST preparations in order to destroy a Thief, and most of them out there know that. :/

[Blexxor]

Korra, on 25 January 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

..... get bsk gear and run a backstap build and join the club of the " Fotm thieves"....

It's the truth.

you made my day... BEST

[Moonmate]

I have an 80 guardian and elementalist - the elementalist leveled almost all in WvW from 10-80.  I'm starting up another thief currently and I can say from experience that it is very possible to do and you are NOT useless.  In fact, many of the things upscaled people can do to contribute (killing dolyaks, keeping areas contested, annoyingly flipping camps or just putting up diversionary swords) are better than 80s running in a zerg ending up dying and taking resources to heal/revive.  

Also, with the recent update they have actually made the upscaling better - I notice it on my thief now in WvW that the damage seems a bit higher and I have more defense than I did on the elementalist while upscaled.  As to thief, what I am doing is manning siege as much as needed (excellent way to get badges), and if following a zerg or out going from point to point, just equipping p/p and SB.  This will allow you to stay mostly at ranged to either harass or run since you can spam Unload and or interrupt when you see people using certain skills (churning earth, etc).  The SB will let you tele away if you have to, but also actually does some decent damage with Cluster Bomb and, disregarding the dmg, still gives combo fields for friends.

Just my 2 cents.  I had to restart my thief from one I had at 67 due to some personal issues, so I have at least those 67 lvls of thief experience in WvW to speak from.

Edited by Moonmate, 31 January 2013 - 05:43 PM.

[Killacam]

Korra, on 25 January 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

At lvl 50 don't go WvW, and don't even worry about a build.

Just the thinking of being a roamer at lvl 50 is compleltly absurd. Get you ass to lvl 80, get bsk gear and run a backstap build and join the club of the " Fotm thieves".

It's the truth.

this is true. stop being lazy. you are literally screwing your server over if you are not 80, i mean most 80's are garbage let alone the fact that it shows the other team a big green arrow to let them know how bad you are.

[Thorfinnr]

Killacam, on 01 February 2013 - 04:58 PM, said:

this is true. stop being lazy. you are literally screwing your server over if you are not 80, i mean most 80's are garbage let alone the fact that it shows the other team a big green arrow to let them know how bad you are.

Nuthin' lazy about it...have already hit 80 with other toons...and now working on this one...but want to wander out into W v W...from other posts there seems to be plenty of stuff someone below 80 can do in WvW...strategic application of people and resources for best effect, tactical distraction, etc...i guess it takes a more strategic mind to see these possibilities...being 80 doesn't automatically make you effective...I have seen some 80s that were awful...and at 50 I was actually doing better than they were...so while having the stats and such helps...having the skill and aptitude to know what you should and shouldn't be doing is also helpful, and to identify how a skirmish/battle/seige is evolving can be crucial...situational awareness is something many people should focus on rather than just being of the mindset "80 = automatic awesome"...

Moonmate, on 31 January 2013 - 05:42 PM, said:

...many of the things upscaled people can do to contribute (killing dolyaks, keeping areas contested, annoyingly flipping camps or just putting up diversionary swords) are better than 80s running in a zerg ending up dying and taking resources to heal/revive.

Thanks for the tips!

Jan Roman, on 26 January 2013 - 10:58 AM, said:

I would advise watching the chat for some information. Go with larger groups, stay reasonably away from the fight and use ranged weapon to dela some damage (probably a shortbow as a thief). You can be very useful at walls shooting down on the enemy. With some experience I would say you will be able to survive very well. In addition, I would build your traits in a more healing/defensive way - trait for healing and boons after stealthing. If you were able to trait properly, you could deal a reasonable amount of damage without dying much (and even if you die on walls, you'll get ressurected quickly). Don't get into a close range combat though, you will die unless facing a noob.

Thanks for the tips!

Edited by Thorfinnr, 01 February 2013 - 05:25 PM.

[Entombed]

Korra is completely right here. Going into WvW under leveled has a lot more negatives than positives.  You are essentially wasting your time, and the people waiting in the queue behind you.

Seriously, craft to level 80.  Leveling 1-80 through crafting (can easily find online guides), will get you to cap in about 8 hours, and cost you about 50g.  

You are kidding yourself if you think you are even remotely useful.

If you are not going to listen to reason: just focus on shortbow and acrobatic traits, and carry a shadowstep and some stealth moves.  Stay at range, use your stun breaker often, and try to survive.

Edited by Entombed, 02 February 2013 - 02:13 AM.

[Lordkrall]

Entombed, on 02 February 2013 - 02:12 AM, said:

Korra is completely right here. Going into WvW under leveled has a lot more negatives than positives.  You are essentially wasting your time, and the people waiting in the queue behind you.

Seriously, craft to level 80.  Leveling 1-80 through crafting (can easily find online guides), will get you to cap in about 8 hours, and cost you about 50g.  

You are kidding yourself if you think you are even remotely useful.

If you are not going to listen to reason: just focus on shortbow and acrobatic traits, and carry a shadowstep and some stealth moves.  Stay at range, use your stun breaker often, and try to survive.

And you quite clearly have no sense of strategy or tactics.

I started a Warrior a few days ago, planning on leveling it up completely using only WvW.
I am currently at lvl 15 and I do loads of useful things.
Such as defending keeps.
Building siege.
Taking NPC-camps (Ogres, Hylek, Dredge in EB).
Taking Supply camps with 1 or 2 others (or solo if the camp is not upgraded)
Killing Dollys
Defending Dollys
Protecting supply camps.

All these things are very possible to do even as low as lvl 5.

[Jan Roman]

I woud like to add that after recent changes, which were brought by the latest patch, the lvl upscaling works better than I thought. I am a vitality condition thief, I have over 20k base HP. I was running SE story mode with a friend, who has lvl 73 ranger. He had 12543 HP, I had just over 12000 HP, so I guess the system now works as it should and you'll survive much better in WvW.

[Khalif]

depends on what you want to do, if you are likely to solo/roam, i suggest the bleed build:




it allows you to essentially solo camps in around 0:45-1:00.





however, the bleed build is limiting in Zerg play.

so if you are the type of player that likes to do sieges, bleed is not for you, instead go crit:








play with builds you like, and you will enjoy the thief.

[Hankchinaski]

Appreciate the feedback and tips in this thread.  I have a level 42 thief and I absolutely hate levelling... right now I primarily just spvp but would like to get some more wvw experience.  I haven't done it in a while so I might not have experienced this new upscale buff you guys are talking about but my experience in wvw was kind of annoying.  I was getting killed by packs of wolves   If I ran into enemy players I would mostly have to run or stay along the edges and try to add some measly contribution.  I never really found a solid group to run with which I know would make a big difference.  

That being said, I think as a low level thief I agree with what some other people said which is to focus your traits on defensive lines like shadow arts or acrobatics.  The shortbow is VERY useful in wvw for mobility getting around the map, escaping, and providing some utility/combo fields in zergs.  Also, I think shadow refuge is a must (especially if traiting into shadow arts) for it's utility.  Shadowstep is probably another very useful one to take and possibly the signet that makes you run faster since getting around the map is probably the worst part of wvw (at least for me - it's boring as hell).

[Entombed]

Lordkrall, on 02 February 2013 - 09:46 AM, said:

And you quite clearly have no sense of strategy or tactics.

I started a Warrior a few days ago, planning on leveling it up completely using only WvW.
I am currently at lvl 15 and I do loads of useful things.
Such as defending keeps.
Building siege.
Taking NPC-camps (Ogres, Hylek, Dredge in EB).
Taking Supply camps with 1 or 2 others (or solo if the camp is not upgraded)
Killing Dollys
Defending Dollys
Protecting supply camps.

All these things are very possible to do even as low as lvl 5.

Rofl.  My guild of 3 people are quickly becoming known as some of the best gankers on our server.  We are 2 mesmers and one thief strong, and we have taken forces massively outnumbering us.  So the whole comment "no sense of strategy" is not only blatantly ignorant, it's repugnant.  

Just ask Sea of Sorrows or Jade Quarry this weekend about [POOR], specifically [SF] or [SS].

There's a very big difference between:  You can do ___  with "You should do ____"  Everything you described could be done much better (more efficient and effective) by a level 80.

Edited by Entombed, 11 February 2013 - 03:28 AM.

[Antithesis]

Entombed, on 11 February 2013 - 03:22 AM, said:

There's a very big difference between:  You can do ___  with "You should do ____"  Everything you described could be done much better (more efficient and effective) by a level 80.

Never understand why people who cannot help try to disparage others. Comments like the one above is a waste of internet space.

No kidding a lvl 80 can do things better than a lower level? WOW! Information like that is really useful.

Listen to the folks who say you can help at any level in wvw. I have leveled a couple toons just in wvw and am working on a thief. Of course there are many things you can do to help the team especially if you can run in a party.

Of course you can level by crafting faster, so what and who cares.

Maybe someone who has played the class a while in wvw will offer up some useful information to lower levels.