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Digest this thief build d/p condition build?


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#1 Keepers

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 06:11 AM

I want to be able to replicate this build in wvw since I am interested in going dagger pistol condition build. mind you this guy posted his traits, but I am also intesrested in the armor and runes that could provide the condition damage he is procing and the amount of health (19.5k) and still have decent stealth time.

Video Link

Edited by Keepers, 01 February 2013 - 02:18 PM.


#2 Sinnacle

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 03:26 PM

View PostKeepers, on 01 February 2013 - 06:11 AM, said:

I want to be able to replicate this build in wvw since I am interested in going dagger pistol condition build. mind you this guy posted his traits, but I am also intesrested in the armor and runes that could provide the condition damage he is procing and the amount of health (19.5k) and still have decent stealth time.

Video Link

Its pistol/dagger

He is running 20/0/30/20/0

I think bill runes 2x krait runes 2x afflicted 2x centuar since I never see food in his videos that gives him 45% bleed duration with his 20 points in Deadly arts thats 65% and then a sigil of agony for 75% condition duration for 7 second bleeds.

He runes full carrion gear his bleed damage varies because he is getting stacks of might from going in stealth.  

This build is pretty well known but that is what he is running.  Also a sigil of corruption.

#3 Killacam

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 04:41 PM

View PostSinnacle, on 01 February 2013 - 03:26 PM, said:

Its pistol/dagger

He is running 20/0/30/20/0

I think bill runes 2x krait runes 2x afflicted 2x centuar since I never see food in his videos that gives him 45% bleed duration with his 20 points in Deadly arts thats 65% and then a sigil of agony for 75% condition duration for 7 second bleeds.

He runes full carrion gear his bleed damage varies because he is getting stacks of might from going in stealth.  

This build is pretty well known but that is what he is running.  Also a sigil of corruption.

sigil of corruption on pistol and sigil of agony on dagger, he switches offhand to d/d or shortbow depending on what he's doing.

everything else is spot on and I am pretty sure that everyone has a full carrion suit now thanks to everyone's favorite: Wild Bill.

side note: did he quit or get banned finally? haven't seen a new video in a long time.

#4 Sinnacle

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 06:12 PM

View PostKillacam, on 01 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

sigil of corruption on pistol and sigil of agony on dagger, he switches offhand to d/d or shortbow depending on what he's doing.

everything else is spot on and I am pretty sure that everyone has a full carrion suit now thanks to everyone's favorite: Wild Bill.

side note: did he quit or get banned finally? haven't seen a new video in a long time.

Mmm who knows maybe he comes back after the next major update that is suppose to help WvW.

#5 eiland

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:49 AM

I posted this super long replay on 1 of his vid, but have not been answered yet so lets see what u guys think:


Great gameplay as usual, but got a few question for you about your build -

Why all that invest in Deadly Arts and venom? for SPVP you are getting that 20% cond duration +45% from sigils and 10 from Agony u r reaching the 75% for the 7sec pistol bleed, but for WvW u get the rare pizza for a 40% and 115% is most prob an overkill.

So the other benefit are the venom themselves, so poison from spider venom helps little in dmg but is important for healing denial, but..


u get a very long 'poison on steal' anyhow. And immobilize is great for burst but for a cond bleed u can c in the vids it has very little effect on the fight. The last benefit is 'leeching venoms' but imo 'shadow embrace' will save u a lot more than those small heals.
What is very good for burst that a p/d sorely needs is 'shadow refuge' firing 5 shot in that dark field not only heals u for good sum but also steal that life from the foe. so this great skill is even better for pistol thieves.

sry for the super long post, I'm running P/D myself and having great fun and success but also (as i think i saw in your vids) having problem killin those very good ele bunker or a very very good guardians. therefore I am always lookin for ways too improve my build.
Any replay will be appreciated, thnx

#6 Killacam

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:36 PM

View Posteiland, on 03 February 2013 - 06:49 AM, said:

I posted this super long replay on 1 of his vid, but have not been answered yet so lets see what u guys think:


Great gameplay as usual, but got a few question for you about your build -
Why all that invest in Deadly Arts and venom? for SPVP you are getting that 20% cond duration +45% from sigils and 10 from Agony u r reaching the 75% for the 7sec pistol bleed, but for WvW u get the rare pizza for a 40% and 115% is most prob an overkill.
So the other benefit are the venom themselves, so poison from spider venom helps little in dmg but is important for healing denial, but..

u get a very long 'poison on steal' anyhow. And immobilize is great for burst but for a cond bleed u can c in the vids it has very little effect on the fight. The last benefit is 'leeching venoms' but imo 'shadow embrace' will save u a lot more than those small heals.
What is very good for burst that a p/d sorely needs is 'shadow refuge' firing 5 shot in that dark field not only heals u for good sum but also steal that life from the foe. so this great skill is even better for pistol thieves.

sry for the super long post, I'm running P/D myself and having great fun and success but also (as i think i saw in your vids) having problem killin those very good ele bunker or a very very good guardians. therefore I am always lookin for ways too improve my build.
Any replay will be appreciated, thnx

I'll be honest the two classes you mentioned are pretty much rock to our scissors and no matter how we build they are just gonna remove the conditions and commence the pwning.

All your Ideas are valid but it's all about how you like to play. He wants as much healing as possible so he can constantly be up in your face using cnd, which in turn is blinding them. Having 2 ways to poison is invaluable in multiperson fights because steal is on a 45 second cd. Also power effects condition damage so the stacks of might are the most important part of using your venoms and at that same token 20 pts into the power tree is awesome, 20% faster venoms = 20% more might = tons more damage and that's what this build lacks.

Also 115% condi duration is not overkill! it's awesome!

This build makes you a god in the current state of WvW and you still beat every guard or ele that isn't specced for surviving/condition removal.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it as they say.

#7 eiland

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 07:34 AM

My meta build for WvW is this: http://intothemists....VNV0fgm9fZH91VP
+ super veggie pizza u reach 75%
now comparing this to wild bills - i have 14s posion on steal 35s cooldown, and 7s posion on weapon swap - 10s cooldown, plus posion from main hand dagger (or the SB if i use that as 2nd set)  more than enough imo,  I try to apply poison  mostly when foe is already hurting before they want to heal.
what i do get instead is 200 cond dmg >> 200 power ,for this build. and the having room for the thief's 2 best utilities, no need explaining. mayb just saying again that 'sneak attack' through ihouse deal great dmg plus heals for a lot more then what 'leaching venoms' gives for the other build.
So bill is a great player and does great with his build, i just don't c how he won't be even better with this one.

#8 Phigment

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 08:53 PM

View Posteiland, on 06 February 2013 - 07:34 AM, said:

My meta build for WvW is this: http://intothemists....VNV0fgm9fZH91VP
+ super veggie pizza u reach 75%
now comparing this to wild bills - i have 14s posion on steal 35s cooldown, and 7s posion on weapon swap - 10s cooldown, plus posion from main hand dagger (or the SB if i use that as 2nd set)  more than enough imo,  I try to apply poison  mostly when foe is already hurting before they want to heal.
what i do get instead is 200 cond dmg >> 200 power ,for this build. and the having room for the thief's 2 best utilities, no need explaining. mayb just saying again that 'sneak attack' through ihouse deal great dmg plus heals for a lot more then what 'leaching venoms' gives for the other build.
So bill is a great player and does great with his build, i just don't c how he won't be even better with this one.

Similar to my build for sPVP when I ran p/d condition setup.....Just one change I would make though....The gain 2 initiative from stealth does not have much of a positive for you. Basic attacks are auto shot, CnD, then occasional SS and DD spam (especially after the nerf to DD, it was my burst ability if the target had pet, rock dog or a catapults)....anyways, I think your better served by going with something more useful, as you already have initiative buffs from trickery line.

#9 Sinnacle

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 02:41 PM

P/D is just P/D no matter how you slice it and as the other poster said you just can't do anything about super bunker eles and guardians with the condi removal its basically a draw or a 30 minute fight who wants to fight for 30 minutes some random person.  Someone is gonna come jump in anyway.

Also about bill he just plays how he wants thats what works for him.  Its not like he can't go pay the small retrait fee and try something else.  The concept is the same for the most part across p/d. Why bills videos are funny to watch is because at least for me I feel like its harder to pull off P/D if your running 2 venoms and not refuge or your utility bar is filled with blinding powder and shadow refuge.

That is whats good about P/D though is you can run 20/0/30/20/0 and then 10 minutes later retrait and run whatever it is you run.   I change stuff all the time Ill run my normal setup and then see a fight and say hey lets mess with caltrops and reduce cooldown on tricks and play with that.  

Also sigil of doom is pretty shitty 7s poison on weapon swap?  You be better off getting a sigil of battle for 105 condition damage and power for 20 secs.  23 secs if you have 20 in acro.  Or geomancy sigil 3 stacks of bleeds for 12 secs if you have 75% duration is better than a 7s poison.  

Spider venom is good cause if you hit all 5 shots which isnt hard to do thats almost 45 secs of poison.

Edited by Sinnacle, 07 February 2013 - 02:42 PM.


#10 Quack530

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 09:43 PM

View Posteiland, on 06 February 2013 - 07:34 AM, said:

My meta build for WvW is this: http://intothemists....VNV0fgm9fZH91VP
+ super veggie pizza u reach 75%
now comparing this to wild bills - i have 14s posion on steal 35s cooldown, and 7s posion on weapon swap - 10s cooldown, plus posion from main hand dagger (or the SB if i use that as 2nd set)  more than enough imo,  I try to apply poison  mostly when foe is already hurting before they want to heal.
what i do get instead is 200 cond dmg >> 200 power ,for this build. and the having room for the thief's 2 best utilities, no need explaining. mayb just saying again that 'sneak attack' through ihouse deal great dmg plus heals for a lot more then what 'leaching venoms' gives for the other build.
So bill is a great player and does great with his build, i just don't c how he won't be even better with this one.

your link doesn't work anymore.  Mind sharing the build you call your meta WvW build?  I'm curious because I just bought a full Carion's set for WvW and I'm having trouble learning how to optimize it.  Thanks for your time.

#11 eiland

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 07:39 AM

link is still working for me, but just try to copy this:
http://intothemists....TNV0fgm9fZH91VW

Some more remarks while i'm at it
- still debating with my self if the offset should be d/p or s/p. My gameplay is to wear the enemy down with p/d and then switch to the offset for more direct dmg to finish them off (can be tedious bringing down an enemy with cond removal with your bleeds)
so s/d is still hits nice with no crits and you have inf strike, while d/p has poison, more burst and you stealth with Black powder + HS
- sigil of doom > geomancy  for the p/d imo, when i swtich to the offset i am at mele range so geomancy will hit for sure, but when i switch back i am usally at distant again, or just stealth and switch to get sneak attack off and geomany might break it
- about gear, i really would prefer toughness over vitality for this build, because of the great heal it allready has and the fact that fight takes some time, but there is no  cond/pow/tough  gear..  so the 2 options we got to increase thougness is mixing in rabid or knight/soldier. with rabid u will lose direct power, because crit% is wasted for us, and with the others u will keep ur direct dmg up but will lose cond which this is what the build is about. best mix for me right now is all carrion + ascended gear like that- http://wiki.guildwar...of_the_Deceiver

(p.s i call it meta because my real gear is bad, dont have time to grind for it :) so i am mostly at the mists)

#12 Fade_Guin

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 04:09 PM

Here's a P/D build I'm working on. I have all the gear except the two new ascended accessories.

Some highlights:

Health (base): 19335
Armor: 3198
Cond. Dur: 50%
Condition damage: 1,291 w/ sigil of corruption (swapped out after 25 stacks with sigil of battle)

Still working on what traits will work best at this point, however.


http://gw2buildcraft...0.d|0.0.0.0.0|e

Edited by Fade_Guin, 07 March 2013 - 04:10 PM.





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