753 replies to this topic

[chuckles79]

Wotah, on 06 February 2013 - 08:54 PM, said:

So it's just more competition you're afraid of.  I see.

I assume you are just trying to start something; because there is no logical leap from what I said to that.

[Sulking]

AngelSpark, on 06 February 2013 - 10:52 PM, said:

Sure you may have congratulated us before, but almost every post of praise I have seen before has had some kind of allusion to how you guys are great, have been training hard, or "been kept on your toes".

Isn't that just making a problem out of nothing? Who gives a flying fudge! Guild pride -- learn something about it!

[MikeSr]

I hope Sea of Sorrows folks would "man up". Instead of throwing your toys out and having massive panic attacks regarding you not ROFLZERGSTOMPING other servers - why don't you catch up to JQ in terms of skill and courage. Theory crafting and workshops are fine but they wont help when you don't have the balls to face even numbers.

You guys built an extremely arrogant server with massive coverage advantage. While you still retain your arrogance, you numerical advantage is not as massive as it used to be. You guys use culling abuse as your main weapon - GW2 has entered its 6th month and this shows your clear lack of skill and innovation. If you ever want to move beyond your escapist and carebear workshops I suggest you watch live stream or recorded video of WvWvW from any guild on Blackgate, Sanctum of Rall or Jade Quarry. Only then you will know how to do real WvWvW.


I hope you will be able to act like a grown up for once and take my sincere advice. See you in WvWvW when you are not attending workshops

Edited by MikeSr, 06 February 2013 - 11:33 PM.

[crowea]

MikeSr, on 06 February 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

I hope Sea of Sorrows folks would "man up". Instead of throwing your toys out and having massive panic attacks regarding you not ROFLZERGSTOMPING other servers - why don't you catch up to JQ in terms of skill and courage. Theory crafting and workshops are fine but they wont help when you don't have the balls to face even numbers.

http://mos.millenium...ervers/view/37/

JQ is ahead on the score mainly because of getting a high +ppt over several hours post-oceanic pre-NA time some nights. SoR and SoS need to work out how to counter that if we are to beat JQ on score.

Rest of the matchup the three servers are pretty evenly matched, and even during the oceanic time (when I'm on)  SoR and JQ have challenged SoS during its strongest time period.

SoR especially has been awesome to fight against. I am hoping that it will be SoR JQ and SoS next week again (but who knows).

[Bankzilla]

MikeSr, on 06 February 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

Kid

When is this guy getting banned?

[DeadlyShield]

JQ skilled? Sorry i gonna laugh a while. Be right back after 1 year. This is freaking hilarious. I give it to SoR that they are quite good in what they do to keep their side of the map but JQ. Puahahahaha. The only reason your on top is your coverage nothing else. Sad to say. Im rather have SoR being number 1 then you guys. SoR shown skill during this match up.

Even I can doubt that JQ has "skill" there is no way you all cant argue that you guys have better coverage. I only remember seeing SoR being outmanned during oceanic but never JQ. SoR manage to keep their side of the map while being outmanned. Now thats skill.

Edited by DeadlyShield, 07 February 2013 - 12:08 AM.

[CalmLittleBuddy]

Paramex, on 06 February 2013 - 09:17 PM, said:

Im just registered for the sake of this post, im on SoS and i must say im absolutely agree on this.



That is something that make me wonder as well, why we on SoS never have some kind of community teamspeak. I even post on SoS forum and suggesting that SoS need this thing, not only its usefull for map coordination its also important stuff for some guilds that were considering to transfers to SoS before the end of free transfers. Alas it seems nobody on SoS care about this



Well said, most WwW guilds on SoS tends to treat pugs like garbages and put the blames on them if something goes wrong and then they wonder why they dont get reinforcement when they outnumbered by enemy zerg. Now if only some of WwW guilds on SoS knew how to better treat their pugs.
(hint: Patone alone by himself start a guild on December and in only 1 month his guild was able to recruit more than 400 members. He was the sole commander in EB before he quit few weeks ago and whenever he ask the pugs to rally on him ,he alwas got himself a BIG zergs ready to follow his command. go figure...)

note: im not Patone nor i was a ex/member of his guild, im just some casual pug on SoS although by posting this im afraid im gonna be accused i was a JQer pretend to be on SoS

Sad as it is, JQ used to be a lot like this BEFORE AoS, EMP, FIRE and many other top guilds really took the ball ran with it.  They invited ALL folks to come as you are, do what you can and they'd work around what you did. They have done serious work making PuGs and Solos feel wanted and worthwhile. It's made all the difference. I am (now) a solo player in a 1 man guild. But they treat me as an equal, and I've repaid them for this.

And it almost went the other way. I almost left JQ. Mostly it was Stei that kept me here. He didn't care that my guild had only 5 people. He never even asked. He knew that 5 players know 5 other players who know 5 other players. I'm just 1 mesmer on the battlefield, a decent enough player. But outside of the map, I can help motivate, recruit, plan, raise morale and put out fires. One player can influence MANY others. Especially players outside the core WvW Guild structure. We can pull folks with a passing WvW fancy and get them hooked.

It's all about making EVERYONE feel like the leader of the most important guild on the server. When you do that, folks put their best forward.

If Random players and casual players and first timers don't feel important and useful, they leave. And who knows what ends up leaving with them. If you give everyone a chance, you get success stories. Those build a server.

My guild is my server. I JQQ.

[DeadlyShield]

Sorry not a troll. Please try agian anyways. Do you guys even know who play during oceanic and SEA time on your server?

[Jedbacca]

The guilds I have been getting familiarized with are FoO and I already know Yaki.  For Pacific/Aussie-ish timezones I see a lot of mixed tags, I'm still new to these neck of the woods and have not spent the proper time to get to know those commanders yet.  I was able to do that on SBI, but things have been quite hectic for me personally, so I've only been active during NA Prime.

I do however have a few Aussies and some late nighters that really haven't pointed anything out to me yet, we've just been excited to have teams to game with since we came to JQ.

Edited by Jedbacca, 07 February 2013 - 12:22 AM.

[DeadlyShield]

Let me help you guys, EB there was AoS. there is DC, EMP, VaL was also in EB last night. I see mostly VaL and AoS. So yeah. These are the guilds you have.

SoS has only AFS in EB. And SoR had Choo. And you guys still haven't manage to take highest point tick during that time. Well i cant say that you NA guys don't have skill since i rarely play with you guys but as far as oceanic time goes, its not the coverage your lacking, its the skill. SoR is the ones lacking coverage for that time zone.

Edited by DeadlyShield, 07 February 2013 - 12:27 AM.

[phabby]

Cannot post in the gw2 forum  cause of login probs, so I will come here, I want to say how impressed I am  with the SOR guys for being so honest, on the gw2 forum in T1 they have asked for help in game to find the hacker on there side that is  flipping camps. Just to stand up and  say this takes great pride and an honesty  above most  and for this I salute you .

On sor bl last nite we at sos did notice camps being flipped without swords and flip so fast it was not right. I hope we can all work together and find this guy for SOR .

Again I salute you for your honesty

cheers phabby

[Kreen]

DeadlyShield, on 07 February 2013 - 12:18 AM, said:

Sorry not a troll. Please try agian anyways. Do you guys even know who play during oceanic and SEA time on your server?

Yes and I have quite often played with them. Do you?

[EvilSinzGW2]

MikeSr, on 06 February 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

I hope Sea of Sorrows folks would "man up". Instead of throwing your toys out and having massive panic attacks regarding you not ROFLZERGSTOMPING other servers - why don't you catch up to JQ in terms of skill and courage. Theory crafting and workshops are fine but they wont help when you don't have the balls to face even numbers.

You guys built an extremely arrogant server with massive coverage advantage. While you still retain your arrogance, you numerical advantage is not as massive as it used to be. You guys use culling abuse as your main weapon - GW2 has entered its 6th month and this shows your clear lack of skill and innovation. If you ever want to move beyond your escapist and carebear workshops I suggest you watch live stream or recorded video of WvWvW from any guild on Blackgate, Sanctum of Rall or Jade Quarry. Only then you will know how to do real WvWvW.


I hope you will be able to act like a grown up for once and take my sincere advice. See you in WvWvW when you are not attending workshops

So Vihar-like.

[Stei]

CalmLittleBuddy, on 07 February 2013 - 12:06 AM, said:

Sad as it is, JQ used to be a lot like this BEFORE AoS, EMP, FIRE and many other top guilds really took the ball ran with it.  They invited ALL folks to come as you are, do what you can and they'd work around what you did. They have done serious work making PuGs and Solos feel wanted and worthwhile. It's made all the difference. I am (now) a solo player in a 1 man guild. But they treat me as an equal, and I've repaid them for this.

And it almost went the other way. I almost left JQ. Mostly it was Stei that kept me here. He didn't care that my guild had only 5 people. He never even asked. He knew that 5 players know 5 other players who know 5 other players. I'm just 1 mesmer on the battlefield, a decent enough player. But outside of the map, I can help motivate, recruit, plan, raise morale and put out fires. One player can influence MANY others. Especially players outside the core WvW Guild structure. We can pull folks with a passing WvW fancy and get them hooked.

It's all about making EVERYONE feel like the leader of the most important guild on the server. When you do that, folks put their best forward.

If Random players and casual players and first timers don't feel important and useful, they leave. And who knows what ends up leaving with them. If you give everyone a chance, you get success stories. Those build a server.

My guild is my server. I JQQ.

Second this sentiment 100% it's not about guilds its more about the server than anything else. Which is why you will never see any of our guilds claiming anything for themselves but rather for the server. JQ has always bee pug/solo friendly it's THE REASON we are successful. It's not any of the one transfers but the community as a whole is the reason that we even got those transfers and are in the position we are at this time.

@Deadlyshield if FOO is so bad why do they flip map's faster than anyone I've ever seen? I personally respect everyone on all servers and never said someone was unskilled because they can't maintain a ppt. PPT doesn't reflect skill it reflects coverage and numbers. But there are always those hectic fights in open field that do actually result in a show of skill or whatever you want to call it.

[Kreen]

DeadlyShield, on 07 February 2013 - 12:27 AM, said:

Let me help you guys, EB there was AoS. there is DC, EMP, VaL was also in EB last night. I see mostly VaL and AoS. So yeah. These are the guilds you have.

SoS has only AFS in EB. And SoR had Choo. And you guys still haven't manage to take highest point tick during that time. Well i cant say that you NA guys don't have skill since i rarely play with you guys but as far as oceanic time goes, its not the coverage your lacking, its the skill. SoR is the ones lacking coverage for that time zone.

Well who am I to doubt your post, but what of the mighty MERC and MagiKarp The Magnificent? I can see how wrong I was, I thought SoS was the official Oceanic heartland but actually you have very few people. I am really sorry to see that. When MagiKarp was posting those 450+ ppt screenies only a month ago every morning when I woke up I can see how he earned his Magnificent Title. What a true hero in our midst.

In other news. Nice showing tonight SoS and SoR. Great to see you out in force and pushing hard. Was on EB tonight and had alot of fun fights with your folks. Good to see some VoTF out there on EB as well.

P.S as much as I find Mr Mikes posts slightly amusing, even I, trollmaster general, often feel the urge to back away slowly. Mike, please tone it down a bit for all our sakes (I know, I know, pot black kettle..)

Edited by Kreen, 07 February 2013 - 01:04 AM.

[Q xoxo]

Weekends fight is skill - when all 3 server is full
Weekdays fight is coverage - when 1-2 server had outmanned buff

3WP @ SOR i could only imagine one thing = escorting dolly / spawn camping for hours
good job nonetheless

[GoGoGhosty]

It's frustrating to watch how both sides behave towards this. JQ and SoS have literally swapped places in forum attitude as they have swapped in score, and both sides have been to thick headed to realize it.

SoS: Remember how annoying it was to have every win de-legitimized by JQ and SBI when we first came to tier 1. First it was holiday's, or events, and when none of those were on it was all about how we only won because of coverage. We got slammed about only playing in zergs, slammed about our skill etc etc...don't be like this. It sucked to have happen to us so don't do it to others.

Also, over the last 5 weeks I have watched the quality of SoS posts go steadily downhill. When we first made it to Tier 1, we were cheerful and generally respectful, minus a few s*** talkers. Now, it feels like every 3rd post is a complaint or an excuse. Just stop it, we have nothing to prove to anyone as our record speaks for itself. Lets return to how we were back in October/November, when we were building a great server and a great community.

JQ: Every type of complaint SoS has made about JQ has already been made by JQ against SoS. While this is not an excuse for our behavior, it is in a sense karma sending everything back at you. Don't complain about self-congratulatory posts; as a vast majority of your posts were just that. While being called stacked is frustrating (we got called stacked for 12 weeks), you guys must accept you do have the superior coverage, and the scores show that. Own it, and as the Tier 1 leader, be the bigger person (server) and don't stoop to anyone trying to talk smack. When you think about talking down to other servers, remember what it felt like when you guys were the number 2 and felt like there was nothing you could do to beat SoS.

SoR: You just keep rocking out



Edit: Also, believe it or not, SoS is a super friendly server, it's just the forums don't always show it (I'm sure its the same for the other servers). Map chat is always helpful, people are friendly, PuGs are treated well and can generally join any of the guilds that are playing with no gear or skill requirements. We have got a bad rep for it for some reason, but my favourite thing about this server is how well all the WvW guilds communicate and organize with eachother. When you have the entire server on the same page things go a lot smoother.




Also, is everyone really making a big deal over us talking about our workshops? That's like making fun of a sports team for having practice. Is it better if everyone just hits the field having no idea what they are doing, and just having the commander dictate what everyone does? Do you think guilds like RG got to be as good as they are without a little theorycrafting? I mean, if they aren't your thing and you just wanna hop into WvW for a couple hours that's fine, but don't make fun of guilds for trying to go a step beyond that.

For those that want to know, workshops are where we get together with members of the same class and try to make our class the most effective as we can. It's fun, and it's where members get the most input as to how we operate. Trying to theorycraft counters to WM and RG tactics were probably the most fun I've had in this game.

Edited by GoGoGhosty, 07 February 2013 - 01:27 AM.

[Stei]

Q xoxo, on 07 February 2013 - 01:12 AM, said:

Weekends fight is skill - when all 3 server is full
Weekdays fight is coverage - when 1-2 server had outmanned buff

3WP @ SOR i could only imagine one thing = escorting dolly / spawn camping for hours
good job nonetheless

That would be FOO that's their goal every single night they play is to wp a side's garrison.

[Evank1]

The amount of chest thumping rhetoric and insults flying in this thread and on the official gw2 thread from JQ is disgusting.

We the WvW community learned nothing and should all accept blame for what is happening now.

T2 last week was ridiculous. The competitiveness of the T2 match was completely destroyed by the free transfer deadline with a 400K score that hasn't been seen since November 2012.

And now we're starting to see the same cracks forming in the T1 matchup. A point swing from Sunday to Monday that hasn't been seen since HoD reversed the lead SBI built up during their weekend clash. Grats to JQ for becoming HoD 2.0; hope all the guild leaders that made this possible are happy with themselves.

Now we're right back to square one and it's time for the rest of the servers to spend the next several months making T1 and T2 competitive again.

[Dark]

Evank1, on 07 February 2013 - 01:32 AM, said:

The amount of chest thumping rhetoric and insults flying in this thread and on the official gw2 thread from JQ is disgusting.

We the WvW community learned nothing and should all accept blame for what is happening now.

T2 last week was ridiculous. The competitiveness of the T2 match was completely destroyed by the free transfer deadline with a 400K score that hasn't been seen since November 2012.

And now we're starting to see the same cracks forming in the T1 matchup. A point swing from Sunday to Monday that hasn't been seen since HoD reversed the lead SBI built up during their weekend clash. Grats to JQ for becoming HoD 2.0; hope all the guild leaders that made this possible are happy with themselves.

Now we're right back to square one and it's time for the rest of the servers to spend the next several months making T1 and T2 competitive again.

Well since JQ is the next HoD you shouldn't expect them to last forever.

[Global_GW2]

I just don't understand all the bitching. This is the closest T1 score between all three servers through Wed night in recent memory. Only around 20k separates 1st and 3rd. Seriously guys. You all should be stoked! *shakes fist*

[Tarkus]

Paramex, on 06 February 2013 - 09:17 PM, said:

That is something that make me wonder as well, why we on SoS never have some kind of community teamspeak. I even post on SoS forum and suggesting that SoS need this thing, not only its usefull for map coordination its also important stuff for some guilds that were considering to transfers to SoS before the end of free transfers. Alas it seems nobody on SoS care about this

Its in the works and has been dicussed. The issue is with setting it up and then going from there, people do care and hell it would be useful.

Paramex, on 06 February 2013 - 09:17 PM, said:

Well said, most WwW guilds on SoS tends to treat pugs like garbage and put the blames on them if something goes wrong and then they wonder why they dont get reinforcement when they outnumbered by enemy zerg. Now if only some of WwW guilds on SoS knew how to better treat their pugs.

Ok? I haven't seen this at all, admittedly when certain commanders get stressed they blame themselves and the guys on the server but honestly I don't know where you're getting this attitude from.

Needless to say, a server is nothing without PuG's because while as a commander if you aren't helping the guys on the server, then why do you have a tag other than to lead your own guild around? Plus stating that a map doesn't have enough strong guilds and not enough PuGs is not a bash on PuGs, its more of a statement of a situation at hand.

How do you beat JQ? You obviously can't zerg harder because its hard to outzerg a map capacity on all three borderlands for all timezones (not qq, but an observation I understand you guys have coverage and skill so don't get a bee in your bonnet), but play better - something that a lot of our (SoS's) commanders are trying to facilitate.

Needless to say its fun to wipe JQ zergs in oceanic (<3 TKG), and we're trying to improve our guilds day by day while trying to facilitate better map relations, and educating new players to the server/game. Its awesome to see SoR doing so well in T1, I haven't seen a more persistant bunch of .... players (had to stop there to sub what I usually say lol); even if you wipe once you just get back-up there again and again. Its awesome to fight you guys and see some fresh faces. See you guys on the battlefield.

@ Evank, thats why I don't go on the official forums and don't post here as often as I used to because yeah, there's some pretty crazy bullkitten on the official site.

Edited by Tarkus, 07 February 2013 - 02:06 AM.

[DeadlyShield]

Actually we should all not whine already. The problem with WvW is actually with Anet. They should get stuff fix. No rewards, delay on updates, bugs and glitches.

Why do they have to make a big patch while the can make simple one which will only require 1 day changes. If they can remove a daily in a matter of hours, why not add one daily for WvW kills.

I wish certain changes are actually made.

1) Remove badges from jumping puzzle. SoS somehow has a commander in JP luring pugs there and reducing our numbers. With the badges remove no more need for jumping puzzle unless for siege.

2) Add WvW kills daily. Come on Anet. This will take 1 day to add and will not change any dynamic or meta game.

3) Better rewards and better drop rates. An NPC selling better gear and custom costume only available by earning badges.

These are the changes that need to be made. I love u guys WvWer. We are what this game should be about. Why fight each other everyday in and out and get not rewarded. I feel proud getting steam roll knowing that my badges will help a person get his legendary not by doing some stupid jumping puzzle. We all should actually united to provide feedback to Anet instead of fighting each other. At the end of the day, we are the ones getting push aside by anet not each other servers.

[Stinky Garbage]

Global_GW2, on 07 February 2013 - 01:42 AM, said:

I just don't understand all the bitching. This is the closest T1 score between all three servers through Wed night in recent memory. Only around 20k separates 1st and 3rd. Seriously guys. You all should be stoked! *shakes fist*

Agreed.  I honestly thought last week was dumb.  But whoever wins this week will get my genuine congrats because they will have won a well-fought week.

[Ahmrill]

I've been on JQ since BW1, through all the ups and downs.

I've been reading through this thread at some of the comments from people on my own server and I'm almost ashamed, all I can say is....

Hope I don't see you downed in WvW because I don't revive trolls.

[Jedbacca]

DeadlyShield, on 07 February 2013 - 12:27 AM, said:

Let me help you guys, EB there was AoS. there is DC, EMP, VaL was also in EB last night. I see mostly VaL and AoS. So yeah. These are the guilds you have.

SoS has only AFS in EB. And SoR had Choo. And you guys still haven't manage to take highest point tick during that time. Well i cant say that you NA guys don't have skill since i rarely play with you guys but as far as oceanic time goes, its not the coverage your lacking, its the skill. SoR is the ones lacking coverage for that time zone.

I am actually quite familiar with all tags mentioned for JQ.  I didn't think that those tags mentioned were non NA teams, I usually see those tags during my game time.  For the Oceanic coverage, from memory being on SBI, I would stay up late from time to time to see what servers had what type of coverage.  I was never really scared of JQ because of the lack of coverage.  We really don't have any true measure of skill for WvW because of all of the variables involved.  If I were to guage skill on anything, I would base it on how well balanced a team can perform.  Let's say defense, scouting, havoc/gank work, offense, offensive siege placement, tactical manuevering/positioning, response time, and defensive siege placement.  There's probably more categories to look at, but if someone is going to really guage someone on skill, to me...that's what is involved for WvW skill.

[Shiren]

Tarkus, on 07 February 2013 - 01:55 AM, said:

Ok? I haven't seen this at all, admittedly when certain commanders get stressed they blame themselves and the guys on the server but honestly I don't know where you're getting this attitude from.

Needless to say, a server is nothing without PuG's because while as a commander if you aren't helping the guys on the server, then why do you have a tag other than to lead your own guild around? Plus stating that a map doesn't have enough strong guilds and not enough PuGs is not a bash on PuGs, its more of a statement of a situation at hand.

I was hoping no-one but the same two or three JQ trolls more interested in a propoganda war rather than a forum discussion would legitimise that post with a response. The amount of times I have seen open invitations to TS/Mumble/Vent is more than the number of troll posts I've seen in this thread. Anyone who has been on the same servers as PRX knows that they do it all the time, and guess what? Very few people join it, not compared to the number of people on the map. It's all great and awesome having VOIP but most players don't give a crap. There are guilds with a VOIP requirement that have to actively enforce the rule in the guild. I know many of the commanders communicate with each other on voice chat, so for the people willing to put the effort in, the VOIP options are there.


The reason why Patone was so successful as a commander was because he communicated everything he did with the entire map. He would type out commands and reasons why (and quite often they weren't the smartest decision) but Patone made a very concerted effort to communicate what he was getting his zerg to do. He actually went as far as to try and pull off some of the most awkward portal bombs I've ever seen (he is a mesmer, trying to get a guild to stack on a portal successfully in the thick of battle can be hard, doing it with people over map chat who might not even know what a portal is, well lets just say he was often disappointed). There are other commanders who did the same thing, but very few of them played for 18 hours a day like Patone was known to do, so Patone built a reputation on that (and burnt out as fast as you'd expect him to, you can source drama or disrespect or W/E you want, but you could be treated like the guy who just saved kittens from a burning building the entire time, playing as much as he did is going to burn anyone out - which happened when the going got tough and everyone got sick of pulling late shifts in a game to hold the lead). Patone didn't have a guild when he started commanding, he didn't have the option of taking a guild to do what he did, so he did it with anyone who would listen.


The number of times I have heard glowing praise (not hyperbole, it was sickening to listen to) of the quality of the non-guilded people on SoS from commanders and members of big WvW guilds is great. The idea that it's commonly believed that attitudes are predominantly anything else is ludicrous. There are bad eggs, as I am sure there are on most servers, but commanders and guilds generally have a high opinion of anyone who helps out in WvW. Maybe it's hard for people to understand that commanding is very stressful. The decisions commanders make often determine whether you succeed or fail. If something doesn't go well, commanders often get the blame. It's not the backseat commanders in chat who take the responsibility, it's the guy with the blue tag, so while it sucks if a commander loses their cool, it's going to happen.


Most commanders have some degree of communication via map chat, but what are you honestly expecting to take place over VOIP that wouldn't be given to you via map awareness, map chat and wouldn't be most appropriate to simply join a guild with VOIP? Map chat doesn't discriminate against anyone, everyone has equal access to it and most players can see it. Even if there was a community VOIP, what would it do differently? Commanders and guilds already communicate with each other, many guilds will openly invite you to join a VOIP when they are on the map, an offer that isn't frequently taken up on and almost every guild is openly recruiting. You can be in four guilds, if you take WvW seriously enough to want to be in VOIP with someone, is it that unrealistic for you to join any guild at all?


Now I understand that a server VOIP can have value, but the number of options already available to anyone on SoS to better their WvW experience and inclusion into the community, that are in no way condescending, disrespectful or exclusionary, is quite large. That someone would come onto the forums solely to bash the server, bash the guilds and commanders on it and write a post like that one when they don't seem to have taken advantage of or participate in the myriad options available to them already, that post says more to me about the poster than it does about the server.

Every time I respond to the troll in these threads I seriously question how much I value my own time.

@Jedbacca you might now know this because you are a recent transfer to JQ (despite what your forum post claims on the official forums - a hillarious jab at all the loyalists claiming moral superiority?) but the JQ oceanic coverage began to change a lot in the weeks before the end of free transfers. After WM left and SBI began it's descent, JQ got a few oceanic transfers. When free transfers were ending they got even more.

As far as measuring skill in WvW goes, you may as well try and measure how much water is in the ocean. It's impossible given the number of fluctuating variables. WvW is not a blanced arena, it wasn't designed for balance and it doesn't care for balance, 99% of the time either you will outnumber your opponent in a fight, or your opponent will outnumber you. You might have voice vomes and all level 80s with BIS gear, your opponent might be padded with a bunch of WvW tourists hoping to get that last POI with the mighty power of their warrior's Strong Bow of Agony that 10 levels lower than they are. I don't think there is a single server with enough active players to fill WvW 24/7 (SoS doesn't even come close) and on weekend, when numbers are equal on some maps, who knows what guild got what members in to work together? If you want skill, glory and prestige based on playing better than your opponent, beating them in an even match up, go to sPvP. If you want to claim victory over the hordes of players going for map completion, stay in WvW.

Edited by Shiren, 07 February 2013 - 03:00 AM.

[Vanu4life]

Think that is the best post I've read here since closed beta.

[Stei]

Shiren, on 07 February 2013 - 02:49 AM, said:

I was hoping no-one but the same two or three JQ trolls more interested in a propoganda war rather than a forum discussion would legitimise that post with a response. The amount of times I have seen open invitations to TS/Mumble/Vent is more than the number of troll posts I've seen in this thread. Anyone who has been on the same servers as PRX knows that they do it all the time, and guess what? Very few people join it, not compared to the number of people on the map. It's all great and awesome having VOIP but most players don't give a crap. There are guilds with a VOIP requirement that have to actively enforce the rule in the guild. I know many of the commanders communicate with each other on voice chat, so for the people willing to put the effort in, the VOIP options are there.


The reason why Patone was so successful as a commander was because he communicated everything he did with the entire map. He would type out commands and reasons why (and quite often they weren't the smartest decision) but Patone made a very concerted effort to communicate what he was getting his zerg to do. He actually went as far as to try and pull off some of the most awkward portal bombs I've ever seen (he is a mesmer, trying to get a guild to stack on a portal successfully in the thick of battle can be hard, doing it with people over map chat who might not even know what a portal is, well lets just say he was often disappointed). There are other commanders who did the same thing, but very few of them played for 18 hours a day like Patone was known to do, so Patone built a reputation on that (and burnt out as fast as you'd expect him to, you can source drama or disrespect or W/E you want, but you could be treated like the guy who just saved kittens from a burning building the entire time, playing as much as he did is going to burn anyone out - which happened when the going got tough and everyone got sick of pulling late shifts in a game to hold the lead). Patone didn't have a guild when he started commanding, he didn't have the option of taking a guild to do what he did, so he did it with anyone who would listen.


The number of times I have heard glowing praise (not hyperbole, it was sickening to listen to) of the quality of the non-guilded people on SoS from commanders and members of big WvW guilds is great. The idea that it's commonly believed that attitudes are predominantly anything else is ludicrous. There are bad eggs, as I am sure there are on most servers, but commanders and guilds generally have a high opinion of anyone who helps out in WvW. Maybe it's hard for people to understand that commanding is very stressful. The decisions commanders make often determine whether you succeed or fail. If something doesn't go well, commanders often get the blame. It's not the backseat commanders in chat who take the responsibility, it's the guy with the blue tag, so while it sucks if a commander loses their cool, it's going to happen.


Most commanders have some degree of communication via map chat, but what are you honestly expecting to take place over VOIP that wouldn't be given to you via map awareness, map chat and wouldn't be most appropriate to simply join a guild with VOIP? Map chat doesn't discriminate against anyone, everyone has equal access to it and most players can see it. Even if there was a community VOIP, what would it do differently? Commanders and guilds already communicate with each other, many guilds will openly invite you to join a VOIP when they are on the map, an offer that isn't frequently taken up on and almost every guild is openly recruiting. You can be in four guilds, if you take WvW seriously enough to want to be in VOIP with someone, is it that unrealistic for you to join any guild at all?


Now I understand that a server VOIP can have value, but the number of options already available to anyone on SoS to better their WvW experience and inclusion into the community, that are in no way condescending, disrespectful or exclusionary, is quite large. That someone would come onto the forums solely to bash the server, bash the guilds and commanders on it and write a post like that one when they don't seem to have taken advantage of or participate in the myriad options available to them already, that post says more to me about the poster than it does about the server.

Every time I respond to the troll in these threads I seriously question how much I value my own time.

@Jedbacca you might now know this because you are a recent transfer to JQ (despite what your forum post claims on the official forums - a hillarious jab at all the loyalists claiming moral superiority?) but the JQ oceanic coverage began to change a lot in the weeks before the end of free transfers. After WM left and SBI began it's descent, JQ got a few oceanic transfers. When free transfers were ending they got even more.

As far as measuring skill in WvW goes, you may as well try and measure how much water is in the ocean. It's impossible given the number of fluctuating variables. WvW is not a blanced arena, it wasn't designed for balance and it doesn't care for balance, 99% of the time either you will outnumber your opponent in a fight, or your opponent will outnumber you. You might have voice vomes and all level 80s with BIS gear, your opponent might be padded with a bunch of WvW tourists hoping to get that last POI with the mighty power of their warrior's Strong Bow of Agony that 10 levels lower than they are. I don't think there is a single server with enough active players to fill WvW 24/7 (SoS doesn't even come close) and on weekend, when numbers are equal on some maps, who knows what guild got what members in to work together? If you want skill, glory and prestige based on playing better than your opponent, beating them in an even match up, go to sPvP. If you want to claim victory over the hordes of players going for map completion, stay in WvW.

Oceanic and SEA are two different things. We never got any oceanic transfers during the mad dash to the end of free transfers. We got SEA guilds which cover a timezone 3-4 hrs AFTER Aussie (Oceanic Prime)

[Mithrull]

Shiren, on 07 February 2013 - 02:49 AM, said:

The reason why Patone was so successful as a commander was because he communicated everything he did with the entire map. He would type out commands and reasons why (and quite often they weren't the smartest decision) but Patone made a very concerted effort to communicate what he was getting his zerg to do. He actually went as far as to try and pull off some of the most awkward portal bombs I've ever seen (he is a mesmer, trying to get a guild to stack on a portal successfully in the thick of battle can be hard, doing it with people over map chat who might not even know what a portal is, well lets just say he was often disappointed). There are other commanders who did the same thing, but very few of them played for 18 hours a day like Patone was known to do, so Patone built a reputation on that (and burnt out as fast as you'd expect him to, you can source drama or disrespect or W/E you want, but you could be treated like the guy who just saved kittens from a burning building the entire time, playing as much as he did is going to burn anyone out - which happened when the going got tough and everyone got sick of pulling late shifts in a game to hold the lead). Patone didn't have a guild when he started commanding, he didn't have the option of taking a guild to do what he did, so he did it with anyone who would listen.

Hopefully he'll come back. I loved what Patone did for SoS.

Edited by Mithrull, 07 February 2013 - 04:32 AM.