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#1 MrSibby

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:01 PM

I just created a Thief for the first time and i was wondering if someone could point me to a good All around Build? (PvE, PvP, Dungeons, ect.)I tend to do alot of Soloing and Dungeoning, and occasionally PvP/WvW. I've been tring to find one tho its been kinda hard. :(

Thanks in advance~ c:

#2 TGIFrisbie

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:02 PM

Shouldn't step 2 be levelling to 80?

#3 MrSibby

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:08 PM

View PostTGIFrisbie, on 05 February 2013 - 11:02 PM, said:

Shouldn't step 2 be levelling to 80?
I normally Have a build on hand so I know where to atlease put my traits. I like working towards a goal.

#4 brokerib

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:33 PM

There's a number of good/viable builds, it just depends on your playstyle.  Some are reliant on stealth and positioning, some on conditions and survivability, and some on mobility and sustained dps.

Here's a starter link for consideration, but your best bet is to work out which weapon set/playstyle you prefer and look for a build based around that.  And use a shortbow as your secondary ;)

http://www.guildwars...-a-basic-guide/

#5 MrSibby

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 12:41 AM

View Postbrokerib, on 05 February 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

There's a number of good/viable builds, it just depends on your playstyle.  Some are reliant on stealth and positioning, some on conditions and survivability, and some on mobility and sustained dps.

Here's a starter link for consideration, but your best bet is to work out which weapon set/playstyle you prefer and look for a build based around that.  And use a shortbow as your secondary ;)

http://www.guildwars...-a-basic-guide/
Thanks for that! I think i managed too create a simple build with that! And I will always have a Short-bow on me! :D

#6 Running4Cover

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 01:01 AM

Thief was my first 80, and still I think my favorite.  I personally try to stay away from building "towards" what you want to be at 80 for a couple of reasons; the first is that you miss out on a lot of fun strategies you'd never think of at end game.  Additionally, you will eventually get bored with your build, and it sucks to hate your character immediately after you've finished getting top tier equipment.  Finally, since you are forced to retrait at 40 and 60 anyway, you fully regear every 5-ish levels (if you're like me), and there are plenty of skill points to go around, there's really no harm in switching it up.

That spiel aside, I'll try to ACTUALLY acknowledge your original question now :P

While you can make a lot of really creative builds work in solo and WvW/sPvP, your dungeon options are SOMEWHAT limited, in that you will almost always be too squishy to focus melee on the heavy-hitting mobs you'll be finding in there (let alone bosses).  For instance, a d/d condition build is extremely entertaining for levelling, and not even terrible for farming, but will get you killed very quickly in dungeons.  Shortbow is a good start, then, for any purpose (a lot of people swear by it, and I personally think it has the best utility available to a Thief), but I would strongly encourage you to actually flip through your trait trees and see what you think synergizes with it.  I very much enjoyed my time using a venoms build with a shortbow, and in fact spec'd my second exotic set for that (eventually your venons last longer, heal you, and spread to your entire party.  The elite venom alone is ridiculously entertaining).  Alternatively the stealth builds are extremely entertaing, allowing you to crit high, and manage damage through perks.  Even more entertaining in sPvP are builds heavily utilizing shadow steps (sword 2, Steal, pistol+dagger 3, dagger+pistol 3 iirc, etc) to evade and kite.  You have a lot of options, and really my best advice is to ignore advice, and try it all.  It will certainly keep you more entertained until you hit 80, and there's no real harm.

Sorry, not the best of answers I realize.  If you're really just looking for a link to a good build, check out Minion's "Invincible Thief" build, hidden somewhere on this forum; it's entertaining and useful, albeit high-risk.

Good luck, and happy hunting!

#7 MrSibby

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 01:36 AM

View PostRunning4Cover, on 06 February 2013 - 01:01 AM, said:

Thief was my first 80, and still I think my favorite.  I personally try to stay away from building "towards" what you want to be at 80 for a couple of reasons; the first is that you miss out on a lot of fun strategies you'd never think of at end game.  Additionally, you will eventually get bored with your build, and it sucks to hate your character immediately after you've finished getting top tier equipment.  Finally, since you are forced to retrait at 40 and 60 anyway, you fully regear every 5-ish levels (if you're like me), and there are plenty of skill points to go around, there's really no harm in switching it up.

That spiel aside, I'll try to ACTUALLY acknowledge your original question now :P

While you can make a lot of really creative builds work in solo and WvW/sPvP, your dungeon options are SOMEWHAT limited, in that you will almost always be too squishy to focus melee on the heavy-hitting mobs you'll be finding in there (let alone bosses).  For instance, a d/d condition build is extremely entertaining for levelling, and not even terrible for farming, but will get you killed very quickly in dungeons.  Shortbow is a good start, then, for any purpose (a lot of people swear by it, and I personally think it has the best utility available to a Thief), but I would strongly encourage you to actually flip through your trait trees and see what you think synergizes with it.  I very much enjoyed my time using a venoms build with a shortbow, and in fact spec'd my second exotic set for that (eventually your venons last longer, heal you, and spread to your entire party.  The elite venom alone is ridiculously entertaining).  Alternatively the stealth builds are extremely entertaing, allowing you to crit high, and manage damage through perks.  Even more entertaining in sPvP are builds heavily utilizing shadow steps (sword 2, Steal, pistol+dagger 3, dagger+pistol 3 iirc, etc) to evade and kite.  You have a lot of options, and really my best advice is to ignore advice, and try it all.  It will certainly keep you more entertained until you hit 80, and there's no real harm.

Sorry, not the best of answers I realize.  If you're really just looking for a link to a good build, check out Minion's "Invincible Thief" build, hidden somewhere on this forum; it's entertaining and useful, albeit high-risk.

Good luck, and happy hunting!
I plan to switch around builds at 80, Its just I need some form of structure on starting. xD;
Thanks for the advice tho! :D
Personally, I dont think Ill use daggers much, Since I'm loving Pistols and SB. XD; I also try to stay away from bosses in Dungeons since I've always been squishy when going up against them. ._.
I'm also tring to stay away from condition builds and Carrion armor, lmfao. I went through that with my mesmer. XD:

#8 TGIFrisbie

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 03:20 AM

View PostMrSibby, on 05 February 2013 - 11:08 PM, said:

I normally Have a build on hand so I know where to atlease put my traits. I like working towards a goal.

It just doesn't work out this way.  If you have an 80 you know this already.

Simple way to level a thief:

DPS - prec, crit, etc.

Any actual build won't come until you have a lot of trait points.  You can fake it, or fake yourself, up to you.

#9 Loperdos

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 09:47 PM

View PostTGIFrisbie, on 06 February 2013 - 03:20 AM, said:

It just doesn't work out this way.  If you have an 80 you know this already.

Simple way to level a thief:

DPS - prec, crit, etc.

Any actual build won't come until you have a lot of trait points.  You can fake it, or fake yourself, up to you.

While I respect your opinion and agree that one of the easiest ways to level up a thief is a prec/crit focus, presenting your own experience and opinion as fact doesn't make it right. :)

I have a couple level 80s, two of them are thieves and on both of them I sat down and figured out, in general, what kind of build I wanted to run, and played that style all the way up to the point that I wanted to switch it up a bit.  Does that mean that I kept the exact same build that I figured out when I started the thief? No, but it did stay generally the same over time, while I was still working towards that particular build.  But even after I hit lvl 80 I continued to (and still continue) to tweak my thief builds as I find different ways of playing that work for my own playstyle better than what I originally thought.  You can make yourself a build using a site like gw2skills.net or something like that and work your way towards that build if you want as you level, there's nothing wrong with that.  As I look back at the builds when I put them together and compare them to the builds I am currently using, there are only a few differences here and there (mostly trait selection within the trait-lines, not major changes like shifting points from DA to SA or from Acr to Trick or whatever combination you prefer).

Since the OP is new to thief, I would agree with Running4Cover, but also throw in a little of my own experience.  Start with a weapon setup and combat style that you think is going to be enjoyable for you to play.  Because let's face it, if your play feels like work and that you are just trudging your way up to lvl 80, any focus, build or anything else is a moot point if you don't ever feel like you want to play because you aren't having fun playing the way your thief is setup.  If you do end up running into that, switch it up!  I ran a prec/crit/stealth focused playstyle for the first 60~ish levels on my first thief, but then decided I wanted to change it up to a different style (condition damage acrobatic dancer, so I sat down and drew up a new build compared to my other backstab/crit/stealth build) and I've been having a blast on that playstyle now for a while.  My second thief I started up because I don't have the time to re-equip my first thief for a D/P utility backstab build focused around hopping in and out of combat with lots of blinds and other fun things thrown about.  That and I really enjoy seeing an Asura shadowstepping in and out of combat constantly, it makes me chuckle. :D  (first thief was a human)

TL;DR, if you want to make a build beforehand and work towards it, go for it, but if you find yourself dreading playing on your thief because you find it repetitive, boring or whatever else, don't lock yourself into that particular build and combat style and change it up!

Edited by Loperdos, 06 February 2013 - 09:48 PM.


#10 Phenn

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 05:24 AM

Loperdos <-- Listen to the man. He knows his stuff.

#11 MrSibby

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 03:33 PM

View PostLoperdos, on 06 February 2013 - 09:47 PM, said:

While I respect your opinion and agree that one of the easiest ways to level up a thief is a prec/crit focus, presenting your own experience and opinion as fact doesn't make it right. :)

I have a couple level 80s, two of them are thieves and on both of them I sat down and figured out, in general, what kind of build I wanted to run, and played that style all the way up to the point that I wanted to switch it up a bit.  Does that mean that I kept the exact same build that I figured out when I started the thief? No, but it did stay generally the same over time, while I was still working towards that particular build.  But even after I hit lvl 80 I continued to (and still continue) to tweak my thief builds as I find different ways of playing that work for my own playstyle better than what I originally thought.  You can make yourself a build using a site like gw2skills.net or something like that and work your way towards that build if you want as you level, there's nothing wrong with that.  As I look back at the builds when I put them together and compare them to the builds I am currently using, there are only a few differences here and there (mostly trait selection within the trait-lines, not major changes like shifting points from DA to SA or from Acr to Trick or whatever combination you prefer).

Since the OP is new to thief, I would agree with Running4Cover, but also throw in a little of my own experience.  Start with a weapon setup and combat style that you think is going to be enjoyable for you to play.  Because let's face it, if your play feels like work and that you are just trudging your way up to lvl 80, any focus, build or anything else is a moot point if you don't ever feel like you want to play because you aren't having fun playing the way your thief is setup.  If you do end up running into that, switch it up!  I ran a prec/crit/stealth focused playstyle for the first 60~ish levels on my first thief, but then decided I wanted to change it up to a different style (condition damage acrobatic dancer, so I sat down and drew up a new build compared to my other backstab/crit/stealth build) and I've been having a blast on that playstyle now for a while.  My second thief I started up because I don't have the time to re-equip my first thief for a D/P utility backstab build focused around hopping in and out of combat with lots of blinds and other fun things thrown about.  That and I really enjoy seeing an Asura shadowstepping in and out of combat constantly, it makes me chuckle. :D  (first thief was a human)

TL;DR, if you want to make a build beforehand and work towards it, go for it, but if you find yourself dreading playing on your thief because you find it repetitive, boring or whatever else, don't lock yourself into that particular build and combat style and change it up!
I actually just threw the build i made out the window and started winging it with my traits, I'm really loving thief, DD and PP is really fun!
With any Ranger, Mesmer, necro ect. I would just use signets in my 7-9 utilities but with thief I've been using Blinding Powder, Caltrops and Signet of shadows. Really fun. c:

View PostPhenn, on 07 February 2013 - 05:24 AM, said:

Loperdos <-- Listen to the man. He knows his stuff.
Haha, I am I am. XD

#12 The Shadow

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 05:08 PM

No such thing as the perfect build. 30 Critical Strikes and 15 Acrobatics are essential in any build IMO. The rest is down to context/ preference. I change my build multiple times a day and change my trait/ utilities mid run if I need to. It's easy enough to do, so why not?

Condition builds on Thieves don't really have a place in PvE. Even when doing easy content like dynamic events and world bosses you present issues that can be entirely avoided by going down a far more versatile route.

People seem to have this misconception that Crit build equates Stabby-stabby-back-stabby. That's almost entirely false. Crit build is far more than that. You can use literally any combination of weapons and achieve the purpose for which that weapon combo was created for. With Condition builds you are limited to P/D, D/D and SB.

Versatility is king. As for fun/ enjoyment. If you don't like every single weapon combination available then I'm gunna go ahead and say Thief probably isn't for you lol :P

Edited by The Shadow, 07 February 2013 - 05:11 PM.


#13 Minion

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 08:16 AM

View PostThe Shadow, on 07 February 2013 - 05:08 PM, said:



VersatilityBACKSTABS is king.

fix'd

#14 MrSibby

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 04:37 PM

View PostThe Shadow, on 07 February 2013 - 05:08 PM, said:

Versatility is king. As for fun/ enjoyment. If you don't like every single weapon combination available then I'm gunna go ahead and say Thief probably isn't for you lol :P
Just the opposite actually. I actually have trouble finding a good one, since I like each of them. xD

#15 The Shadow

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:15 PM

View PostMrSibby, on 08 February 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

Just the opposite actually. I actually have trouble finding a good one, since I like each of them. xD

Then just run the usual crit build as it facilitates every weapon combination and play style except for spamming LDB. You don't have to limit yourself to just one weapon set :P

Edited by The Shadow, 08 February 2013 - 05:15 PM.


#16 MrSibby

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 06:32 PM

View PostThe Shadow, on 08 February 2013 - 05:15 PM, said:

Then just run the usual crit build as it facilitates every weapon combination and play style except for spamming LDB. You don't have to limit yourself to just one weapon set :P
The 30 crit and 15 acro right? I may end up doing that since the rest of the points as you said are up to preference, what armor would you recommend going for then? Berserker's? c; I'm also not limiting myself, Current i've been using DD/SB an occasnally switching out DD with PP, or PD, DP ect.

#17 Loperdos

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 08:59 PM

View PostMrSibby, on 08 February 2013 - 06:32 PM, said:

The 30 crit and 15 acro right? I may end up doing that since the rest of the points as you said are up to preference, what armor would you recommend going for then? Berserker's? c; I'm also not limiting myself, Current i've been using DD/SB an occasnally switching out DD with PP, or PD, DP ect.

30 crit and 15 acro is a good place to start for a crit build, especially one for D/D (though like Shadow stated, its really pretty good for any of the weapon-sets).  It gives good, solid damage that you can sustain without a whole lot of difficulty.

I would definitely agree that the other points are largely up to you and what you see fits your particular build the best (best being most fun, most effective, whichever you prefer).  Some say put the points into Deadly Arts up to 25 for Exposed Weakness, others say put it into Trickery (though maybe not the best choice for a crit build, this line is generally more suited to a condition damage bleeder build) and some say stick up to 25 into Acr so you can pick up Fluid Strikes, since having less than 100% endurance is a normal thing on a thief, unless you are running SB or P/P at the time where you don't have to dodge quite as much.  Shadow Arts (though not really my cup of tea :) ) isn't a bad line to look at either, especially if you have 15 points to spend because then your stealth skills last 1s longer, which on paper doesn't seem like that much of a difference, but when you actually use it, a lot of times it feels like you are in stealth forever with that extra 1s, which is nice.

As for gear, if you have trouble with survivability, a mix of Beserker's and Valkryie's is a pretty decent bet, especially since you don't lose out on your crit damage.  Another way to do it if you are having issues with survivability is to do a mix of Beserker's and Knights, that way you don't lose out on quite as much prec compared to if you run with Valk's instead of Knights, but then you do lose out on the crit damage boost.  Its all a trade-off.  If you don't have any issues with survivability at all like some people *cough* Minion *cough* :D  then full Beserker's is perfectly fine.

#18 MrSibby

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 09:47 PM

View PostLoperdos, on 08 February 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

30 crit and 15 acro is a good place to start for a crit build, especially one for D/D (though like Shadow stated, its really pretty good for any of the weapon-sets).  It gives good, solid damage that you can sustain without a whole lot of difficulty.

I would definitely agree that the other points are largely up to you and what you see fits your particular build the best (best being most fun, most effective, whichever you prefer).  Some say put the points into Deadly Arts up to 25 for Exposed Weakness, others say put it into Trickery (though maybe not the best choice for a crit build, this line is generally more suited to a condition damage bleeder build) and some say stick up to 25 into Acr so you can pick up Fluid Strikes, since having less than 100% endurance is a normal thing on a thief, unless you are running SB or P/P at the time where you don't have to dodge quite as much.  Shadow Arts (though not really my cup of tea :) ) isn't a bad line to look at either, especially if you have 15 points to spend because then your stealth skills last 1s longer, which on paper doesn't seem like that much of a difference, but when you actually use it, a lot of times it feels like you are in stealth forever with that extra 1s, which is nice.

As for gear, if you have trouble with survivability, a mix of Beserker's and Valkryie's is a pretty decent bet, especially since you don't lose out on your crit damage.  Another way to do it if you are having issues with survivability is to do a mix of Beserker's and Knights, that way you don't lose out on quite as much prec compared to if you run with Valk's instead of Knights, but then you do lose out on the crit damage boost.  Its all a trade-off.  If you don't have any issues with survivability at all like some people *cough* Minion *cough* :D  then full Beserker's is perfectly fine.
So berserker's and knights. Awesome! Thanks for the info~ :)

Till i get the GM book I'll be messing with my build on its on, after that ill do crit. So far I've been able to have 2-3 mobs that are 4-6levels higher than me. My traits atm are 10/2(idkwhythatsthere)/0/20/0 And Been surviving pretty good too! ;D

#19 The Shadow

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 04:28 PM

Full Zerker is fine until you get to medium level Fractals. When you get to that point I suggest using Zerker jewelry with Soldier and Zerker armor mix and match (i.e. 4 pieces Soldier 2 pieces Zerker) with Runes of the Eagle to compensate for the Precision lost.

I'm not a massive fan of Knight's as Vitality scales better on Thief than Toughness does. Valkyrie is a good suggestion too. It all depends on how much survival you think you need though.

Edited by The Shadow, 09 February 2013 - 04:32 PM.


#20 Vysander

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 05:00 PM

View PostThe Shadow, on 09 February 2013 - 04:28 PM, said:

Full Zerker is fine until you get to medium level Fractals. When you get to that point I suggest using Zerker jewelry with Soldier and Zerker armor mix and match (i.e. 4 pieces Soldier 2 pieces Zerker) with Runes of the Eagle to compensate for the Precision lost.

I'm not a massive fan of Knight's as Vitality scales better on Thief than Toughness does. Valkyrie is a good suggestion too. It all depends on how much survival you think you need though.

Full zerkers *armor can do fine up through the 30's of fractals. Of course, you have to supplement with other forms of survival. im currently running this http://gw2skills.net...qxWjrGZNLLGjMhA with full zerkers armor (i do have a few peices of knights i throw on, but have lately stuck to full zerk armor). Running with divinity runes, "bunch of stat" rings, neck and karka earing with the other being a zerk gives a good bit of survive-ability while retaining a 100% crit dmg and 50%+ crit chance. This setup gives me 1.2k armor and ~18k hp.

I know its not the most... economical build, but it really is lovely.

To the OP, try everything... not the most useful advice, but you wont know what playstyle you really like and works for you without trying them out (after hitting 80, so you can see how the traits really shine with certain builds).

Edited by Vysander, 15 February 2013 - 05:03 PM.





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