18 replies to this topic

[tfckmk988]

So in a couple different threads people have been saying that the classes in GW2 feel very similar to each other

I don't see this personally as I have a 80 engineer and like a lvl 15 guardian and the play feels very different between them.

Interested in hearing why people feel they are similar or is it more a melee feel one way and ranged/spell caster feels another (i haven't played a Ele or Necro so spell casters could feel different from melee or ranged)

[Gilles VI]

tfckmk988, on 06 March 2013 - 06:19 PM, said:

So in a couple different threads people have been saying that the classes in GW2 feel very similar to each other

I don't see this personally as I have a 80 engineer and like a lvl 15 guardian and the play feels very different between them.

Interested in hearing why people feel they are similar or is it more a melee feel one way and ranged/spell caster feels another (i haven't played a Ele or Necro so spell casters could feel different from melee or ranged)

In other MMO's professions would be able to do stuff other professions totally couldn't do, alot of conditions/boons would be specific to a certain profession.
While in GW2 pretty much every profession has acces to every boon/condition.
for example: mages are the only one with acces to teleport, or the warriors being the only one with "tanking" abilities,...

I agree with you the professions have a very distinctif feel, but I guess what I described above is the cause for people thinking that they're all the same.

[tfckmk988]

Gilles VI, on 06 March 2013 - 06:28 PM, said:

In other MMO's professions would be able to do stuff other professions totally couldn't do, alot of conditions/boons would be specific to a certain profession.
While in GW2 pretty much every profession has acces to every boon/condition.
for example: mages are the only one with acces to teleport, or the warriors being the only one with "tanking" abilities,...

I agree with you the professions have a very distinctif feel, but I guess what I described above is the cause for people thinking that they're all the same.

ok i get that the simplified boons and conditions could make it seem like every character can do similar things

thanks for the reply

[st_clouds]

No they're not similar at all. Those other ppl are complaining about how they're similar in terms of capabilities. Not play style.

Even so I still don't think this is true at all, more like there's a lot of overlap in terms of abilities with about 20-30% key distinction. However it's not an overwhelming distinction.

In RTS terms, look at it like classic WarCraft, where each units from opposiing sides are largely similar, except for their "specials". This is fine, works best for balance than if each unit were so different.

[astromarmot]

Conditions kinda remind me of the way they run slot machines down here in Florida...due to some archaic laws that allowed bingo, but not other forms of gambling, the slots all based on a digital form of bingo. The slot machine itself with the handle, and wheels and all the fancy bells, blips and graphics are meaningless to the win/payout, it's all about the digitized bingo card that's presented in a small nondescript screen on the machine.  

The mechanics and animations of applying are simply meaningless eye candy, all that really matters is that little badge that looks the same regardless of the character that applied it...

[tfckmk988]

astromarmot, on 06 March 2013 - 06:39 PM, said:

Conditions kinda remind me of the way they run slot machines down here in Florida...due to some archaic laws that allowed bingo, but not other forms of gambling, the slots all based on a digital form of bingo. The slot machine itself with the handle, and wheels and all the fancy bells, blips and graphics are meaningless to the win/payout, it's all about the digitized bingo card that's presented in a small nondescript screen on the machine.  

The mechanics and animations of applying are simply meaningless eye candy, all that really matters is that little badge that looks the same regardless of the character that applied it...

I think I get that but let me ask this why are you focusing so much on just the conditions do you really not feel like the classes do anything unique and are all just there to apply conditions or boons?

[astromarmot]

tfckmk988, on 06 March 2013 - 06:44 PM, said:

I think I get that but let me ask this why are you focusing so much on just the conditions do you really not feel like the classes do anything unique and are all just there to apply conditions or boons?

It's not black/white.  Some classes obviously feel more unique than others.  Thieves mechanics IMO behave quite differently than the rest given stealth.  Mesmers get illusions....rangers pets.  It's not that the classes don't do anything unique, just that the jack-of-all-trades traiting system with the universal accessibility of boons/conditions sorta blurs any differentiation of having a class system.  The more you begin to homogenize  the more it begs the question why not do away with classes altogether(I understand the real why) and just have one able to build from a common trait/skill pool drifting towards something like what TES does...

Edited by astromarmot, 06 March 2013 - 06:53 PM.

[st_clouds]

astromarmot, on 06 March 2013 - 06:53 PM, said:

It's not black/white.  Some classes obviously feel more unique than others.  Thieves mechanics IMO behave quite differently than the rest given stealth.  Mesmers get illusions....rangers pets.  It's not that the classes don't do anything unique, just that the jack-of-all-trades traiting system with the universal accessibility of boons/conditions sorta blurs any differentiation of having a class system.  The more you begin to homogenize  the more it begs the question why not do away with classes altogether(I understand the real why) and just have one able to build from a common trait/skill pool drifting towards something like what TES does...

This and I think it's for the best. Let your role evolve naturally as opposed to pigeon holed to a certain dos and donts.

What's TES? Sounds like a game to watch.

[astromarmot]

st_clouds, on 06 March 2013 - 07:00 PM, said:

This and I think it's for the best. Let your role evolve naturally as opposed to pigeon holed to a certain dos and donts.

What's TES? Sounds like a game to watch.

Elder scroll series, you have so much access to the various skills that you can basically customize your class so that class as a definition almost loses meaning...

I haven't been following the development of Elder Scrolls online, so I don't know how they're gonna handle that...

Edited by astromarmot, 06 March 2013 - 07:05 PM.

[Arich]

Ive been playinrg Ranger, Necromancer, Thief, Warrior and Mesmer.  All of those classes play differently for me.  To the point where it takes me some time to re-remember how to play the class if I havent been on it for a few days.

That being said, classes provide a wide range of playstyles.  You could make them play similarly if you tried.

[astromarmot]

Arich, on 06 March 2013 - 07:11 PM, said:

Ive been playinrg Ranger, Necromancer, Thief, Warrior and Mesmer.  All of those classes play differently for me.  To the point where it takes me some time to re-remember how to play the class if I havent been on it for a few days.

That being said, classes provide a wide range of playstyles.  You could make them play similarly if you tried.

And I think that's key...if you're playing a max/min pure stats/effects focus, they get really similar...if you're into playing it as a "class" they're quite different...

[Culture Shock]

I think that the classes were developed within a theme so that each style feels natural to the world, but there are also game mechanic restrictions that come to mind.  The game was "purposely" designed so that a certain class is not "needed" for a group to perform well, so if classes had a lot of "exclusive" skills then there would be a new holy trinity.  

Yes, guardians and warriors are more "tankey" than an elementalist, however a skilled group of casters can do an amazing job in a dungeon without them.  Also "extreme" diversity between classes means balancing will be a real chore as well especially for PvP and WvW.  And don't get me started on  how many people will cry and moan if one class has some ability that makes WvW too easy for them.  "Oh this game sucks because one class rules them all in WvW".

I think things are more or less as they should be.  "More Balanced".

Edited by Culture Shock, 06 March 2013 - 07:21 PM.

[tfckmk988]

Culture Shock, on 06 March 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

I think that the classes were developed within a theme so that each style feels natural to the world, but there are also game mechanic restrictions that come to mind.  The game was "purposely" designed so that a certain class is not "needed" for a group to perform well, so if classes had a lot of "exclusive" skills then there would be a new holy trinity.  

Yes, guardians and warriors are more "tankey" than an elementalist, however a skilled group of casters can do an amazing job in a dungeon without them.  Also "extreme" diversity between classes means balancing will be a real chore as well especially for PvP and WvW.  And don't get me started on  how many people will cry and moan if one class has some ability that makes WvW too easy for them.  "Oh this game sucks because one class rules them all in WvW".

I think things are more or less as they should be.

I agree with this when I played WoW there were constantly threads on the offical forums that oh a druid crushed me in a duel with blah blah blah it needs to be nerfed (for reference i haven't touched WoW in years so but i do remember druids getting nerfed lol although maybe not for pvp...)

doesn't seem to be the case for GW2

but to stay on my own topic (lol) despite conditions/boons being the same I feel like how and why they are applied is sufficiently different to nullify that point imo

[El Duderino]

st_clouds, on 06 March 2013 - 07:00 PM, said:

This and I think it's for the best. Let your role evolve naturally as opposed to pigeon holed to a certain dos and donts.

What's TES? Sounds like a game to watch.

I like this as well. You can have diverse skills. Utility skills. And let people be very flexible. Elder Scrolls has always done this well IMO.

Although, I am sure someone will cry "Balancing is too hard!" But, if we never did things because we anticipated its results would make something difficult, then I don't think we would even have computers and MMO's to play today. So its a BS argument.

tfckmk988, on 06 March 2013 - 07:24 PM, said:

I agree with this when I played WoW there were constantly threads on the offical forums that oh a druid crushed me in a duel with blah blah blah it needs to be nerfed (for reference i haven't touched WoW in years so but i do remember druids getting nerfed lol although maybe not for pvp...)

doesn't seem to be the case for GW2

If you haven't seen these threads, you haven't looked hard enough.

[tfckmk988]

El Duderino, on 06 March 2013 - 07:44 PM, said:

I like this as well. You can have diverse skills. Utility skills. And let people be very flexible. Elder Scrolls has always done this well IMO.

Although, I am sure someone will cry "Balancing is too hard!" But, if we never did things because we anticipated its results would make something difficult, then I don't think we would even have computers and MMO's to play today. So its a BS argument.



If you haven't seen these threads, you haven't looked hard enough.

part of this is probably that the WoW forums didn't divide the class forums into pve and pvp so even if all you cared about was pve u'd still end up seeing the pvp threads i think i have only opened the pvp forums here on guru once or twice on accident so that could be where they are hiding

as for the first part i think that each class needs (and as far as I can tell has) a unique playstyle but i'd also play each class differently based on their strengths and not just focus on damage (as i can guess that a lot of people would feel melee weapons all feel similar ) but if you focus on what the strength of the class is say guardian for example focusing on a more defensive role will get a toatally different feeling than a warrior who could be a more damage based class although with the possiblity of a more defensive roll

if you play all  your characters in the same roll (def, support , dps , healing etc) they are all going to feel similar so while yes you can play how you want remember that certain classes are still depsite not having set roles going to be a bit better at one than another

EDIT: inserted a comment into the quote on accident

Edited by tfckmk988, 06 March 2013 - 07:56 PM.

[chuckles79]

TL;DR
The game mechanics are the same for each class, but each class has a totally unique and visually diverse away of enacting them.

[tfckmk988]

chuckles79, on 06 March 2013 - 08:30 PM, said:

TL;DR
The game mechanics are the same for each class, but each class has a totally unique and visually diverse away of enacting them.

lol is that in response to my post? if it is it fits

[ShezuTsukai]

If you think even the game mechanics are the same then I challenge you to rotate through the classes and taste the difference between initiative, attunements, clones, pets, kits, etc.

This thread reeks of players who throw on the biggest weapon they can find and only use the number one skill.

[Feathermoore]

Please respond to other threads in those threads instead of making another thread.