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Why I'm probably quitting the game after only a few weeks


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#1 adamjr4

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 04:45 AM

Just a quick background on myself. I consider myself the “casual” gamer that ArenaNet said would especially love this game (MMO Manifesto). I have a PS3. I’ve played popular games like Skyrim and Assassin’s Creed, but I also had a love for the original Guild Wars. Over the span of several years, I poured somewhere around 1100 hours into the game. I bought all expansions and had a tremendous time playing. I participated actively in Alliance Battle PVP, Jade Quarry and Fort Aspenwood PVP, I used to do runs back when that was popular, I rolled toons specifically for things like soosc, and I loved faction farming in Mount Qinkai and the Kurz equivalent. I had a fantastic time with my guild and the world that ArenaNet made.

Times changed though and when Guild Wars 2 was released it just wasn’t the right time for me to play. I’m in the summer between my senior year of high school and freshman year of college, and since I had some free time I thought it would be fun to see what awesome improvements ArenaNet had made upon an already fantastic platform.

Specifically, I was looking forward to several of their main bullets in the MMO Manifesto. In the video, one of the game designers said something that really stuck out to me - that quests would no longer be oriented around killing 10 of this or finding 15 of that. It was one of my biggest gripes with games like WoW and something I had no interest in participating in. Another profound statement that stood out to me was the the advent of dynamic event. The game designer talked about how you could save a town from centaurs that would stay saved, and that they would remember you upon return. Two seemingly insignificant points, but they’ll come back to important later.

Initial impressions of the game were good. I liked that you could pick from different races, and I enjoyed the reworked “tutorial,” noting that it might be good for replay value. The first 15 levels breezed by and I adapted quickly to the distinct flow the game had.

My happiness with the game changed shortly thereafter. I began to notice some subtle hypocrisy on the part of the game devs. While heart quests never explicitly stated you HAD to kill ten centaurs (MMO Manifesto), it was implicitly implied - as this was the fastest way to complete the heart and get the experience. After doing 16 of these heart quests per zone, and working through multiple zones per week, I began to feel this obnoxious drag. Here comes ANOTHER of these dumb heart quests. It doesn’t really matter if I’m killing centaurs, ascalonian ghosts, or ogres. The skins are the only things that change. The combat patterns aren’t different. The enemies are still roughly the same composition - warriors, archers, and the occasional magic wielder. Combat was still approached the same way. With my guardian: jump into combat, throw down a mark, and use the whirl attack. Woohoo! Rinse and repeat 500 times to gain two levels. Furthermore, and this is maybe just due to lack of insight, if there are say three level seven hearts in Queensdale (arbitrary - I don’t know), why am I not at least level seven when I finish completing all three? Leveling in this game seems like an impossible uphill climb. I tried out a few characters and did various starting zones, and without fail, every single time, I was always a level or two under the level zone stated for the area when I finished. This was even with completing several of the aforementioned “Dynamic Events.” Which leads me to my next point...

The Dynamic Events.

Alright. I’ll admit, I thought they were pretty cool at first. I enjoyed participating in them - especially in Queensdale - and they’re where I met my guild. However, the whole aspect of “cause and effect” seems to have been completely lost between conception and execution. In the Manifesto, they talked about an essence of permanence around these events. Oh really? How permanent can an event be when that troll I just killed is now back ten minutes later (paraphrased words from the female game dev in the manifesto - that just happen to directly apply to GW 2). Why is that general I just escorted to the weapons store going back to it nine and ten times in a 3 hour window? Why are these centaurs entering the Ascalon Settlement in the exact same pattern every time, with the exact same number of forces and the exact same battle plan? Even across zones - it doesn’t matter if Ogres or Centaurs have taken the keep and I need to take it back. It doesn’t matter if the small keep with three entrances and two trebuchets exists in The Fields of Ruin or Gendarran Fields. I’ve still taken this structure umpteen times only to have it retaken when I leave for five minutes.

The dynamic events also create a very lonely and sometimes impossible world, ironically. Operating off of pure conjecture, I’d guess that these events were meant to be tackled in conjunction with other players, and for the most part that is the complete opposite of what happens. As a level 35, it is completely unrealistic for me to infiltrate settlement overrun with centaurs, eliminate all of them, take back key points throughout the city, and then tackle a warbeast all on my own. Yet is near impossible to find other players readily willing and able to assist in tackling these events, so often times I go without doing them. One exception being Queensdale - though that zone is another story for another time as I don’t have the energy to articulate how I feel about it.

Combat System

It seems poorly thought out and very one dimensional. While we’re now technically allowed more skills than in Guild Wars, it certainly doesn’t feel that way. Having your main skills tied to your weapon choice severely limits options and build creativity. It also leads to a few distinct play styles per class and forces usually forces each player to become a DPS, when maybe I don’t want to play a DPS. The elimination of healer may have seemed like a good idea, but as an end result I’ve found myself dying more times in the first 10 hours of the game than I probably ever have in GW. The utility skills, for the most part, seem like useless and thoughtless additions to the classes, and honestly the trait system is so poorly explained by the game that I had no fricken clue what I was doing or what adding trait points to a trait did.  While GW only had 8 available skill slots, the sheer number skills available led to so much build diversity and specificity.

The “Personal” Story

For a story that is designed to be controlled by the player and reflect the player’s playing life, the personal story seems to fall flat on its face. The writing is horrid, the voice actors are bland, the storyline itself is stupid. (Really? I join the circus to stop a device that hypnotizes people called a grizwhirl?) And then, after I’ve completed this ridiculous grizwhirl misadventure, it’s immediately forgotten. Since shopping around the different Orders of Tyria and helping Demmi escape from pirates, I’ve seen nothing from my grizwhirl days. It’s like they never even happened. The instances themselves seem awkwardly limited and and sometimes unnecessarily challenging or way too easy.  The missions, when done based on what level you are, seem disjointed and very distanced. They cutscenes in my opinion are poorly put together and they’re incredibly impersonal. The name is not hero, initiate, representative, etc. Sir or Madam would be better fitting than the lackluster “titles” that I haven’t earned that they use. It’s a gross departure from the missions of Guild Wars and a poor one at that.

End Game

Admittedly, I haven’t made it there, but from what my guildies have told me and what I’ve read on this site it’s lacking. It seems to be focused on map completion (if I wanted to run around aimlessly I’d do it on Runescape which is free) WvW, PvP, etc. I don’t hear much about speed clearing, repeat dungeon exploration (is there even a hard-mode in which to do them on?) The competitive missions I loved doing seem to no longer exist, and I can’t faction farm like I used to like doing. So, my question is, why would I even strive to get to end game if it’s just the same as while I’m leveling? I hate what I’m doing while I’m leveling.

Final Thoughts

I really REALLY really want to like this game. It seems great on paper and in concept, but it falls flat on its face. Even reading some of my criticisms back to myself, I think “well that doesn’t sound so bad,” but in the end the devs just didn’t execute. I bought the game on the promises and premises laid out in the MMO Manifesto and honestly feel as though  I was misled. The game had so much potential, but I feel that the flaws that exist in it as of yet are fundamental. I don’t know that the game can be fixed without a major, major overhaul, and I doubt that is something ArenaNet is willing to do or that they have the financial wherewithal to pull off. There are numerous complaints about the game I know I didn’t touch on, most likely because I either didn’t notice them personally, haven’t gotten to them yet in the game, or it’s just an aspect of the game that I don’t care for regardless.

I know many of you will probably have thoughts on what I’ve posted, and feel free to share them. I’m open to maybe one day returning... but I just don’t see any reason as of yet to continue. Like I said... I really WANT to like this game, but I just can’t do it.

#2 The Axe Effect

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 05:29 AM

Don't quit before you meet Trahearne is my only advice. Otherwise, your post is pretty much spot on (meet the new anet).

#3 Inraged Twitch

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 05:39 AM

IMO You should split the combat system into two parts the combat in this game is very well thought out (dodge system freedom of movement not locked into combat like GW1 or NWO ect).  What WASN'T well thought out was the skill/trait system.

Edited by Inraged Twitch, 09 July 2013 - 05:43 AM.


#4 Saul Spotter

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 05:48 AM

Why post something like this?

I disliked my fair share of games but I didn't make a big deal of it.  When I decided WoW wasn't worth my time I just dropped out of it, and went on to other things.  I've yet to pick up Star Ocean: Til the End of Time since I bought it all those years ago.  The time and energy you put into writing this manifesto could've better been spent on a new PS3 game, like The Last of Us, that was a great game.

And then you chose to post it on Guild Wars 2 Guru, like you're Martin Luther or something.

What, seriously, do you hope to accomplish?  Validating your oppinion by finding other like minded individuals?  That fine, but again, you're chosing to do it on a fan forum.

Which means the only logical for your doing so is to try to poison the game for those of us who do enjoy it.  Which you can't really, but you do do kinda ruin Guild Wars 2 Guru.  Also, that's the technical definition of a troll so, you have to live with that.

In summary, sorry you didn't like the game, if you that dead set against it you really have no reason for posting here.

So can I politely ask you to leave and not come back?  Same goes for the other haters.

#5 NELiXERY

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 05:59 AM

View PostSaul Spotter, on 09 July 2013 - 05:48 AM, said:

So can I politely ask you to leave and not come back?  Same goes for the other haters.
That's harsh, bro.

OP, I agree with you about the graphics. When I was playing on my laptop, I didn't like the jagged squares and pixels, but then I bought a computer with a dedicated graphics card. It's like I'm playing a completely different game!

#6 leongrado

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:27 AM

View Postadamjr4, on 09 July 2013 - 04:45 AM, said:

snip

I'm not exactly sure what your intentions are for writing such a long post. If you didn't get the gist from the other threads, there's plenty of other people who are dissatisfied with the game and quitting. You're really not that special.

Why do you make such a big deal out of quitting? I stop playing different games all the time. Heard of single player games? If you're going to quit, just quit. I don't understand why you have to have a huge rant about it. If someone influential had a rant about something, I might actually listen. I have no idea who you are.

#7 lmaonade

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:29 AM

OP just opened a can of worms, stem the tide!

#8 assyrian dragon

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:37 AM

OP you are not alone in this.
anyone who came to GW2 looking for a great game like GW1 was disappointed.

Edited by assyrian dragon, 09 July 2013 - 06:37 AM.


#9 Cures

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:46 AM

gw1 traditionalists start getting on my nerves. There are as many (far more even) people that are happy gw2 is nothing like gw1.

#10 ben911993

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:47 AM

View PostSaul Spotter, on 09 July 2013 - 05:48 AM, said:

Why post something like this?

I disliked my fair share of games but I didn't make a big deal of it.  When I decided WoW wasn't worth my time I just dropped out of it, and went on to other things.  I've yet to pick up Star Ocean: Til the End of Time since I bought it all those years ago.  The time and energy you put into writing this manifesto could've better been spent on a new PS3 game, like The Last of Us, that was a great game.

And then you chose to post it on Guild Wars 2 Guru, like you're Martin Luther or something.

What, seriously, do you hope to accomplish?  Validating your oppinion by finding other like minded individuals?  That fine, but again, you're chosing to do it on a fan forum.

Which means the only logical for your doing so is to try to poison the game for those of us who do enjoy it.  Which you can't really, but you do do kinda ruin Guild Wars 2 Guru.  Also, that's the technical definition of a troll so, you have to live with that.

In summary, sorry you didn't like the game, if you that dead set against it you really have no reason for posting here.

So can I politely ask you to leave and not come back?  Same goes for the other haters.

View Postleongrado, on 09 July 2013 - 06:27 AM, said:

I'm not exactly sure what your intentions are for writing such a long post. If you didn't get the gist from the other threads, there's plenty of other people who are dissatisfied with the game and quitting. You're really not that special.

Why do you make such a big deal out of quitting? I stop playing different games all the time. Heard of single player games? If you're going to quit, just quit. I don't understand why you have to have a huge rant about it. If someone influential had a rant about something, I might actually listen. I have no idea who you are.

The thing is, you guys are implying that OP doesn't have much right to complain about being sorely disappointed by a game in a franchise that he was heavily invested in. His complaints are worthy of time and attention because perhaps other people of similar opinion will come across this, join him, and start speaking up against ANet. If we're putting our money into a game, our concerns deserve to be voiced.

I'm in a very similar, if not worse, boat as OP. I played GW1 for some 3500 hours and put, I would estimate, around $350 into my account, getting all of the games, numerous character slots, and every upgrade and costume I could buy--sometimes just for the sake of giving money to my (formerly) favorite game developer. I was incredibly pleased with GW1, and even 8 years after starting playing that game, it still remains my #1 favorite game.

A lot of promises were made and expectations raised about GW2 by ANet. Most of those expectations they either failed to meet, or promises they didn't hold true to either at or shortly after launch. I, along with many veteran players from GW1, feel incredibly disappointed by--and in some respects, outright lied to about--GW2.

As someone who was so heavily invested in the Guild Wars franchise, I think it's rude of you to say or imply that we shouldn't speak up as to our concerns or grievances about a game that we care so much for. Although I will admit, a fan site really isn't the best place to do that. But it's not like we have a lot of options, is it? Posting something of this nature on the GW2 official forums is begging to get flamed by fanboys, and possibly censored or banned if someone at ANet deems it worthy.

Edited by ben911993, 09 July 2013 - 06:49 AM.


#11 XRay

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:52 AM

what gw1 fangirls need to realize is that gw2 isn't an expansion of gw1 and stop treating it as such...

also - if you eat a mushroom pizza for 8 years, and then someone suddenly gives you a bacon instead, it doesn't necessarily suck, you just need to embrace the new flavour.

#12 otterix

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:54 AM

I am not sure the point of the post? Perhaps to be persuaded to keep playing? As ur title says "probably" stop playing.
But if u have so many dislikes and think the game is not for u, just quit (as some have said)

Admittedly I didn't read ur full post. I just glimpsed parts of it and the combat section and I disagree.

Combat in gw2 requires the player to be proactive and block and dodge at the right times. Not tank and spank, especially if you are dying lots.
I like weapons where they have their purpose/specialty and you have to choose which skills (up to 5) to use depending on ur build from a pool of skills and utilities.
And because of these skill choices I have to make, there are lots of build diversity to suit different play styles.



#13 Trei

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 07:04 AM

Ah... It's that word again.
"Promise"

I do not take manifestos of any kind, in any field, to be promises.
They are nothing more than declarations of intentions.

Do you know of any manifestos in the literate history of mankind that has been followed to the letter? I don't.

Anet may not have succeeded fully in crafting the world exactly as you or me may have interpreted, but I don't feel they have deviated from their stated aims, let alone intentionally.



#14 Eon Lilu

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 07:05 AM

Really well thought out post OP, you pretty much hit the nail on the head on all of the things I noticed that sucked in the game except obviously the huge focus on gem store and gambling, limited items etc

Ignore the people calling you a gw1 fan girl, even if you never played gw1 they would find something else to call you or criticise your honesty about how you personally feel about gw2. Your not alone. I agree with you it's been almost 12 months and they still have not added certain things they mis led players with what was made out to be at launch or delivered on a lot of what they mis led players with.

I am in the same boat and will probably stop playing after the next month or so.

I have seen so many topics and posts giving almost identical feedback as yours since beta and launch, if they were going to deliver or take the feedback on board that would of done so by now.

Edited by Eon Lilu, 09 July 2013 - 07:08 AM.


#15 Saul Spotter

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 07:10 AM

View PostNELiXERY, on 09 July 2013 - 05:59 AM, said:

That's harsh, bro.

I said 'politely'.  And its not like he even asked for help to better enjoy the game.

View Postben911993, on 09 July 2013 - 06:47 AM, said:

snip

Since you put so much time into guild wars, I'd think the obvious answer would be, guildwarsguru.com, just a thought.  Alternatively, you could start a guildwars2hater.com.

And as far as your money going into the game, you're buying a product not investing in one.  That means you don't have a say in the prodution.  If you don't like it, don't buy it anymore.

You and others like you have nothing positive to add to this board. That means you're only posting on here for negative reasons.  Again the defenition of a troll.

If your displeasure with this game is so great that you can't let it go, hold it in, or channel it elsewhere, and that the only thing that can give you any sense of relief is to go to a community of relatively happy individuals, pleasently sharing they're enjoyment of an activity, and then vomit all that vitriol and hate you're suffering from onto them, well I think have to take a good hard look at what is wrong with your life.

Edited by Saul Spotter, 09 July 2013 - 07:17 AM.


#16 konsta_hoptrop

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 07:27 AM

1. Combat system is really good for an MMO. The only problem is the lack of skill choice but still the combat is dynamic and free and compared to gw1 combat,GW2 combat is levels above.
2. Graphics are beautiful if you play on a powerful PC that can run the game on max settings and full hd. Again levels above gw1 and one of the best looking mmos atm.
3. You didnt complete the storyline? Are you even lvl 80? I cant believe that your are gw player and u even didnt complete gw2
4.I am 2700 hours GW1 player for 7 years and i dont get all the moans that gw1 is different and better and bla bla. WHen gw1 was actual and modern game everyone cryied about races and more lvls bigger open world better combat , now you have that and moan for gw1 features. I have GW1 installed and when i log in it looks so boring and slow that i cant stand it more then 10 mins and log out. Ye gw was my first mmo and i have many precious moments in that game , my first newbie steps in exploring big maps and so on . But gw2 is better, same world with bigger map , much better graphics , much more alive , better sound, better gameplay, better quest system.  Yes atm i am bored from GW2 and i didnt log in for 1 month but today i ll log in for the new update. Both gw games are not like WoW or Lineage that force the player to play non-stop. In gw u can rest and wait for the new stuff without falling behind. Yes u could miss some new skins but your stats wont fall behind and you can still run every dungeon or wvw without  problems.
The only bigger problem with gw 2 in my opinion is the grind. I am bored to grind dungeons , zones , events . Its exhausting and boring after some time. But still you can have full set max stats armor and weapons without grinding at all. Grind is for shinies.
In my opinion its better for Anet to come with an expansion that winter , that living story updates are really short and unstatisfying. They keep me interested for about 2-4 hours ... 1 month wait for 4 hours. Better make expansion that complete the all regions on the current map with 1 new race and many new events and armors and weapons. about 10 -15 new zones for lvl 80s with some new duongeons that have potential for good farming . That kind of expansion can keep people interest for at least 1 more year. They need to complete ascended gear too with weps and armor and add legendary armor .
Sry for my terrible language

#17 Whiteone

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 07:33 AM

View PostSaul Spotter, on 09 July 2013 - 07:10 AM, said:

a community of relatively happy individuals, pleasently sharing they're enjoyment of an activity

What is this magical place you are talking of?


And to OP, I agree with

View PostThe Axe Effect, on 09 July 2013 - 05:29 AM, said:

Don't quit before you meet Trahearne is my only advice. Otherwise, your post is pretty much spot on (meet the new anet).

meet Trahearne and then go on. This will make leaving GW2 much easier.

#18 Dusty Friday

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 07:48 AM

OP has made valid points, I don't see any reason to flame him or tell him to get the hell out. That's no way to treat someone who's gone through the effort of laying out his structured arguments properly. Sadly, the arguments might be valid but they are also very old and have been discussed to oblivion. Not much has been done to fix these flaws. Maybe some has seen improvement, but nothing radical.

Me and all of my GW1 guild mates had immense hopes for this game (virtually NONE of us play the game anymore). There were ferocious discussions in our own forum before the game came out, and there were a few guys that just knew what's going to happen after spending 10 minutes in the first BWE. Actually, our brightest player who also took a major part in creating guild builds, decided he won't waste his time, while others (like me) defended the game to the end. But what OP wrote is very true. The combat has been dumbed down a lot. Build variety has been reduced to ashes, from what used to be a franchise that relied on the opportunity for creative thinking. Some people feel like the mesmer can do so much now, but maybe not all of them know about how the mesmer used to be able to handle hundreds of builds in Gw1. The mesmer could essentially be anything.

People noticed these things very early, including the dynamic events which are really fun initially, but later on become tedious and completely expected. The idea behind them is good, the execution on the other hand is not the best and I admit that it would be very hard to actually make it as good as it sounds.

I don't even want to talk about the Personal Story that much, as for me it's a complete failure. I was taken completely off-guard with this, as the stories of GW1 (prophecies especially) were not bad at all and I actually wanted to see what happens next and how it ends. I didn't feel any of this during my first GW2 playthrough. Trahearne is a terrible NPC, something which is beyond me. He is utterly useless in any mission. You will see random NPCs resurrecting other NPCs during events, but you will NEVER see Trahearne resurrect you, the 'main hero'. Because in your 'personal' story he is the hero, not you. I would have at least enjoyed having someone to boost me up with some health while being down during these boring and often bugged/annoying missions, but you don't even get that luxury. Trahearne is too busy not doing anything useful to be slowed down by such matters as your very plausible death. So yes, for me the personal story, and storyline is general, is utter crap.

And finally, the end game. What got me to quit the game in the first place. There is no end game. There is just... more 'game'. There is nothing that reminds of the GvG or HoH endgame we used to have in GW1, two modes that kept players hooked for years. I was very saddened to hear that the best of GW1 had been trashed away. A design decision that offended us, because it was not logical in any way, except one - to make the game easier, and thus easier to like by casual players and very young kids. An audience that I hardly have any care for whatsoever. An audience that is not serious, yet the gaming industry seems to be very serious about it in return. A sad combination with the idea of making extra $$.
There isn't anything truly different you can do at max level. The dungeons are more or less similarly scaled in terms of difficulty at all levels. All the PvP is open since level 2, excluding maybe WvW for which you need decent gear and traits, but for me, personally, WvW is not a serious pvp mode.

The only reason I still play the game occasionally is to level up random toons and just mess around with them, casually, because that's all the game has for me. Casual content. It's a beautiful game with a hell of a lot of potential, though all of it is wasted on catering for the masses, which doomed the game to mediocrity.

Edited by Dusty Friday, 09 July 2013 - 07:52 AM.


#19 ben911993

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:03 AM

View PostSaul Spotter, on 09 July 2013 - 07:10 AM, said:

Since you put so much time into guild wars, I'd think the obvious answer would be, guildwarsguru.com, just a thought.  Alternatively, you could start a guildwars2hater.com.

And as far as your money going into the game, you're buying a product not investing in one.  That means you don't have a say in the prodution.  If you don't like it, don't buy it anymore.

You and others like you have nothing positive to add to this board. That means you're only posting on here for negative reasons.  Again the defenition of a troll.

If your displeasure with this game is so great that you can't let it go, hold it in, or channel it elsewhere, and that the only thing that can give you any sense of relief is to go to a community of relatively happy individuals, pleasently sharing they're enjoyment of an activity, and then vomit all that vitriol and hate you're suffering from onto them, well I think have to take a good hard look at what is wrong with your life.

guildwarsguru.com is great and all, but not much in the way of a thriving community anymore. I don't hate GW2; in fact, there are facets of it that I greatly enjoy. The dodge/block/"action"-based combat has me hooked, and the combination of gear and traits satisfies the number crunching min/maxer in me. But there are a lot of areas that I think could be improved.

As to the distinction between buying a product and investing in it, my apologies, I can see how that choice of words would be confusing. What I meant is that I poured a huge amount of time (nearly half a year out of my life) and a pretty sizable chunk of money into GW1, and now GW2.

I don't look at myself as being a troll. Trolling is posting negative things for the specific purpose of angering others or ruining their enjoyment of something. I'm not trying to anger anyone or kill the fun, I'm just talking about my disappointments with this game. But you and a few posters above are right, a fan site is no place for that.

So I apologize for dragging things down and souring what is otherwise a good experience for you. I guess it never occurred to me that a great deal of players actually do enjoy GW2. Perhaps it's just me, and perhaps GW2 just isn't the game for me.

#20 Baron von Scrufflebutt

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:06 AM

View PostSaul Spotter, on 09 July 2013 - 05:48 AM, said:

Why post something like this?

I disliked my fair share of games but I didn't make a big deal of it.  When I decided WoW wasn't worth my time I just dropped out of it, and went on to other things.  I've yet to pick up Star Ocean: Til the End of Time since I bought it all those years ago.  The time and energy you put into writing this manifesto could've better been spent on a new PS3 game, like The Last of Us, that was a great game.

And then you chose to post it on Guild Wars 2 Guru, like you're Martin Luther or something.

What, seriously, do you hope to accomplish?  Validating your oppinion by finding other like minded individuals?  That fine, but again, you're chosing to do it on a fan forum.

Which means the only logical for your doing so is to try to poison the game for those of us who do enjoy it.  Which you can't really, but you do do kinda ruin Guild Wars 2 Guru.  Also, that's the technical definition of a troll so, you have to live with that.

In summary, sorry you didn't like the game, if you that dead set against it you really have no reason for posting here.

So can I politely ask you to leave and not come back?  Same goes for the other haters.


You are aware that you managed to post ALL of that without addressing a SINGLE issue in the OP?
As far as I can see, it's actually your post that would be against the forum rules: you are discussing the poster instead of his views.

Let's see what the mods say about this.

#21 Subdue

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:17 AM

Whenever I read a post like this I have to wonder, are we even playing the same game?

1.  Reaching the level cap in GW2 is faster and easier than it is in just about any MMORPG I can think of.

2.  There are MANY ways to level, including:  killing enemies, completing hearts, completing dynamic events, completing your personal story, completing achievements, gathering items, crafting items, PVPing in WvWvW, dungeons, completing guild events, and even just wandering around!

3.  While yes, some dynamic events have fast respawn times, others, especially the very large group events, have very long respawn times.  I mean honestly, what is the alternative here?  Low impact dynamic events have very long cooldowns, and if you happen to miss it you're out of luck and will be at a massive disadvantage compared to someone who didn't?  

Yes, there's a fair bit of monster killing in GW2.  Guess what, it's an MMORPG.

#22 dondarrion

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:21 AM

View PostRitualist, on 09 July 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

You are aware that you managed to post ALL of that without addressing a SINGLE issue in the OP?
As far as I can see, it's actually your post that would be against the forum rules: you are discussing the poster instead of his views.

Let's see what the mods say about this.

Well, I for one hope that his (not the OP) post stands. It's one of the few that - like on the official GW2 forums - is dubbed an 'I quit' post and they don't allow them and close them quickly, so why should guildwars2guru deign to allow negative threads like this popping up. What sort of community do we want, one full of negative quitters?
Yes, there might be some reasonable criticism in OPs post, but ultimately it's just another goodbye thread.

#23 iLag

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:29 AM

I do agree with OP leveling is definitely the worst part and its a very tedious grind it gets much better after that It still feels like such a pain to level a alt....

Edited by Corsair, 14 July 2013 - 11:22 PM.
removed OT


#24 Saul Spotter

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:36 AM

View PostWhiteone, on 09 July 2013 - 07:33 AM, said:

What is this magical place you are talking of?

Its called Tyria, I'm there every day for an hour or so, enjoying the jumping puzzles, talking with guildmates, doing dailies, and WvW'ing til I realize I got to go make dinner.

I'm sorry you're unable to enjoy it there.  Some people think cucumbers taste better pickled.

View Postben911993, on 09 July 2013 - 08:03 AM, said:

guildwarsguru.com is great and all, but not much in the way of a thriving community anymore. I don't hate GW2; in fact, there are facets of it that I greatly enjoy. The dodge/block/"action"-based combat has me hooked, and the combination of gear and traits satisfies the number crunching min/maxer in me. But there are a lot of areas that I think could be improved.

As to the distinction between buying a product and investing in it, my apologies, I can see how that choice of words would be confusing. What I meant is that I poured a huge amount of time (nearly half a year out of my life) and a pretty sizable chunk of money into GW1, and now GW2.

I don't look at myself as being a troll. Trolling is posting negative things for the specific purpose of angering others or ruining their enjoyment of something. I'm not trying to anger anyone or kill the fun, I'm just talking about my disappointments with this game. But you and a few posters above are right, a fan site is no place for that.

So I apologize for dragging things down and souring what is otherwise a good experience for you. I guess it never occurred to me that a great deal of players actually do enjoy GW2. Perhaps it's just me, and perhaps GW2 just isn't the game for me.

If all you have for GW2 is negative feelings, like the OP, then move on.  Your time with GW was special, and its great you tried to make it work with GW2, but there's no reason to hang around if you don't have any love left for it.  Maybe come back at the end of the year see if you feel any different.  There's no logical reason for making a big spectical out of it.

View PostRitualist, on 09 July 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

You are aware that you managed to post ALL of that without addressing a SINGLE issue in the OP?
As far as I can see, it's actually your post that would be against the forum rules: you are discussing the poster instead of his views.

Let's see what the mods say about this.

His single issue, or thesis, was that he disliked the game, everything else he wrote was padding.  I adressed this, and what I consider a reasonable manner.

#25 Jedibless

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:51 AM

View PostDusty Friday, on 09 July 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

OP has made valid points, I don't see any reason to flame him or tell him to get the hell out. That's no way to treat someone who's gone through the effort of laying out his structured arguments properly. Sadly, the arguments might be valid but they are also very old and have been discussed to oblivion. Not much has been done to fix these flaws. Maybe some has seen improvement, but nothing radical.

Me and all of my GW1 guild mates had immense hopes for this game (virtually NONE of us play the game anymore). There were ferocious discussions in our own forum before the game came out, and there were a few guys that just knew what's going to happen after spending 10 minutes in the first BWE. Actually, our brightest player who also took a major part in creating guild builds, decided he won't waste his time, while others (like me) defended the game to the end. But what OP wrote is very true. The combat has been dumbed down a lot. Build variety has been reduced to ashes, from what used to be a franchise that relied on the opportunity for creative thinking. Some people feel like the mesmer can do so much now, but maybe not all of them know about how the mesmer used to be able to handle hundreds of builds in Gw1. The mesmer could essentially be anything.

People noticed these things very early, including the dynamic events which are really fun initially, but later on become tedious and completely expected. The idea behind them is good, the execution on the other hand is not the best and I admit that it would be very hard to actually make it as good as it sounds.

I don't even want to talk about the Personal Story that much, as for me it's a complete failure. I was taken completely off-guard with this, as the stories of GW1 (prophecies especially) were not bad at all and I actually wanted to see what happens next and how it ends. I didn't feel any of this during my first GW2 playthrough. Trahearne is a terrible NPC, something which is beyond me. He is utterly useless in any mission. You will see random NPCs resurrecting other NPCs during events, but you will NEVER see Trahearne resurrect you, the 'main hero'. Because in your 'personal' story he is the hero, not you. I would have at least enjoyed having someone to boost me up with some health while being down during these boring and often bugged/annoying missions, but you don't even get that luxury. Trahearne is too busy not doing anything useful to be slowed down by such matters as your very plausible death. So yes, for me the personal story, and storyline is general, is utter crap.

And finally, the end game. What got me to quit the game in the first place. There is no end game. There is just... more 'game'. There is nothing that reminds of the GvG or HoH endgame we used to have in GW1, two modes that kept players hooked for years. I was very saddened to hear that the best of GW1 had been trashed away. A design decision that offended us, because it was not logical in any way, except one - to make the game easier, and thus easier to like by casual players and very young kids. An audience that I hardly have any care for whatsoever. An audience that is not serious, yet the gaming industry seems to be very serious about it in return. A sad combination with the idea of making extra $$.
There isn't anything truly different you can do at max level. The dungeons are more or less similarly scaled in terms of difficulty at all levels. All the PvP is open since level 2, excluding maybe WvW for which you need decent gear and traits, but for me, personally, WvW is not a serious pvp mode.

The only reason I still play the game occasionally is to level up random toons and just mess around with them, casually, because that's all the game has for me. Casual content. It's a beautiful game with a hell of a lot of potential, though all of it is wasted on catering for the masses, which doomed the game to mediocrity.



You see, the thing you do is to compare this with guild wars 1. Its two different games with the same names. Yes! Guild Wars 2 has its flaws but these are things that can be fixed. When? I dont know. Look at combat, combat in this game is unlike anything else that you see mmo on the market, its so smooth. Just think of the opportunities with actually good boss mechanics, not just dodge that kill that.

When it comes to build variety, this game got many, but not as many in guild wars 1; "but how balanced was that?" in for example pvp. At least gw2 is doing a better job than guild wars 1 when it comes to balance, and guild wars 2's balance is also shit - so that speaks for itself.

Endgame: It confirmed that they are working on a endgame experience with more than 5 players, GVG is also coming.

Like you say, this game has alot of potential. But please stop comparing gw2 with other games.

- A wise man once told me; dont like the game? dont play it.

Edited by Jedibless, 09 July 2013 - 08:52 AM.


#26 Cube

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:52 AM

I think it's absolutely great to disagree with ANet and their choices. To not like them. Without people not liking things, other things can't improve.

Even thought I agree fully, I barely play if at all either any more. Mostly because I don't agree with the take on living story, because so far it's been so bad it's not enjoyable. I don't like rushed materials and a ton of items in the gemstore to make you buy it before it disappears cause it's all temporary and limited.

Even thought yes, the hearts kinda have what they said nobody likes, the killing of x and y, z amount of times. I have to say hearts where great compared to normal quests found in WoW or TERA as an example. I wish the quests where more like in Guild Wars(i.e there's a little story behind it. I also never remember having to kill x amount of things in GW).

If you look at this game and thought it was going to be a new Guild Wars, it is not. It shouldn't be named Guild Wars 2. If it wasn't named Guild Wars 2 that would spare a lot of peoples disappointment.

You can enjoy the game if you look at it as something else. Just name it something else in your head.  I mean it's nothing like Guild Wars and the lore is pretty funny compared so renaming it in your head and playing it as something completely different is possible.

#27 Dusty Friday

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 08:53 AM

View PostJedibless, on 09 July 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

You see, the thing you do is to compare this with guild wars 1. Its two different games with the same names. Yes! Guild Wars 2 has its flaws but these are things that can be fixed. When? I dont know. Look at combat, combat in this game is unlike anything else that you see mmo on the market, its so smooth. Just think of the opportunities with actually good boss mechanics, not just dodge that kill that.

When it comes to build variety, this game got many, but not as many in guild wars 1; "but how balanced was that?" in for example pvp. At least gw2 is doing a better job than guild wars 1 when it comes to balance, and guild wars 2's balance is also shit - so that speaks for itself.

Endgame: It confirmed that they are working on a endgame experience with more than 5 players, GVG is also coming.

Like you say, this game has alot of potential. But please stop comparing gw2 with other games.

- A wise man once told me; dont like the game? dont play it.

Your first paragraph - these are the exact things we discussed in our community forums before the game's release. I actually used some of your own arguments to defend the game. This was before release and you can see for yourself how much of the flaws have been removed.

Now let's look at the rest:

- The problem is that I compare it with GW1? Excuse me, we were promised GW2, not 'Completely New Game 2 that has nothing to do with GW1 gameplay 2'. Judge me if you want to, as a hardcore Gw1 player I had my right to expect GW2 to be similar in mechanics, because you know - GW1's mechanics were QUITE GOOD and quite different than all other mmos of that time.

- Of course the game is easier to balance. When you have 2-3 builds per class, YES, the game becomes easy to balance. In PvP. Because if you talk about PvE balance, I have one word for you, one word that encompasses ALL of the balance - warriors and mesmers (ok, 3 words). All you will EVER need. Also, balance in GW1 was not bad in any case. It was bad for noobs, but not for people who understood the game. This why balanced builds were the ones that mostly dominated PvP ladders. The best guilds ever always used precisely balanced builds with mixture of all classes. There was also space for 'pure' builds, with mostly one class and a couple more for support. Stuff like ranger spike, necro spike, IWAY, spirit spam, etc. All of these were possible to beat with a balanced build. I know it because I've experienced it and I am not talking about it out of what I've heard or read somewhere.

- Fluid combat is indeed one of the stronger parts of gW2, but it has been fully handicapped/extremely limited by the skill system, which is tightly bound to weapon sets.

- Endgame. Yeah, it would be nice to have some endgame properly introduced one or two years after the game's launch. There isn't even GvG yet.


And I don't see why you have to write comments like 'why bother to come and talk about it?', or 'we won't miss you'. It's not just OK to write about it, it's also encouraged! There needs to be criticism, because maybe one day we'll have GW3, and at that point I would really hope that Anet have taken some notes and made some proper conclusions.

Edited by Corsair, 14 July 2013 - 11:30 PM.


#28 Perm Shadow Form

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 09:02 AM

Then why come and talk about it, why not just quit?

After thousands of hours invested in GW1, I guess I'm just too attached to the original game and want the sequel to be as successful and good as the first one.
No, I'm not asking for reskined GW1, personally for me, GW2 is missing core features that made GW1 so unique and great.
If that makes sense, I'm tired.

Edited by Perm Shadow Form, 09 July 2013 - 09:02 AM.


#29 Kany

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 09:08 AM

what do you expect, to mourn you? you won't be missed. hope you'll envy - I'm having lot's of fun ingame....

Edited by Kany, 09 July 2013 - 09:09 AM.


#30 Baron von Scrufflebutt

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 09:16 AM

View PostSaul Spotter, on 09 July 2013 - 08:36 AM, said:

His single issue, or thesis, was that he disliked the game, everything else he wrote was padding.  I adressed this, and what I consider a reasonable manner.

He points out that he has issues with the game because of:
- how DEs work
- the PS
- shallow combat
- hearts


Your post in no way contradicts those issues: it doesn't even address them. Can we assume that you agree with the OP?


Your post can be summarized with "Don't like it, don't do it!" in a thread that you "don't like", but feel obligated to "do". (By "do", I mean post in it.)
Take your freaking advice and don't bother posting if you can't post about the issues that the OP is discussing. And if you feel that the thread violates the forum rules, report it. I think the OP singles out some of the core issues with the game, but we did have a bunch of these threads already, so I can see why it would be closed down. And the fact that we are now bitching about the bitching instead of discussing the issues certainly isn't helping. Which is why I hope, if the thread stays alive, that pretty much everything I posted here will be removed, along with the shit you posted.
It makes for a shitty forum if we discuss discussions rather than the issues said discussions tackle.

Edited by Ritualist, 09 July 2013 - 09:46 AM.





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