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Feature Build Balance Preview - Jan 29

build balance preview anet

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#31 FoxBat

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 06:48 AM

View PostDatenshi92, on 10 February 2014 - 05:57 AM, said:

Its impossible to balance skill usage and power in PvE when all the base complaints you get come from people who probably got their rear end handed to them in PvP!

I haven't seen much evidence that "balancing" PvE is even a real concern. No-one seems to care anyway outside of dungeons, and the continued focus on open world zergfests shows just how relevant those are.

#32 sanctuaire

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 08:23 AM

a lot of us mainly-pve players do care, and the existing stigma against other classes on dungeon grouping
is reason enough... we don't see 'no warriors, no guardians' in the LFG notes ever... other classes are another story. and yes, it still happens to this day. getting constantly nerfed because of pvp only exacerbates the situation.

but yes anet doesn't care, as with the constant blind eye/ deaf ear approach with the calls for the pve/pvp split, as they were forced to do so in gw1.

Edited by sanctuaire, 10 February 2014 - 08:25 AM.


#33 Veji

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 10:49 AM

View PostDatenshi92, on 10 February 2014 - 05:57 AM, said:

General consensus seems to agree that Warrs are the running joke of this game on how easy they can steamroll over PvE vs other classes who dedicate the same amount of time and skill (and still feel inferior). Not that Warr requires that much player skills to win anyway but you know what I mean!

You know what's the source of all this? ANet not wanting to separate PvE from PvP. Its impossible to balance skill usage and power in PvE when all the base complaints you get come from people who probably got their rear end handed to them in PvP! It just sounds like a nice excuse for ANet to kick the ball from one side to another without actually fixing anything in the long run.

"We need an excuse to keep releasing patches, you know, to pretend we're doing something between each LS release... The topic is 'balance'. So tell me, what lucky profession are we going to kick down the pit and how are we going to do it?" *The dev says as he steeples his fingers with a devilish grin on his face*

I main a warrior.  I faceplant (not faceroll) PvE content and then die alot.  Yes, it takes skill, no matter what you are playing.  Think the balance changes are going o make dungeon runs ALOT harder, which makes me sad.  I like the sigil changes though.

I really wish they'd actually "balance" the game so that build diversity on armor sets and etc were viable.  Maybe the nerf to crit damage will do this?  One can only hope, but it doesn't seem likely.  If just feels like they're making it tougher for players to play the game.

#34 Datenshi92

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 11:45 AM

View PostVeji, on 10 February 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

I main a warrior.  I faceplant (not faceroll) PvE content and then die alot.  Yes, it takes skill, no matter what you are playing.  Think the balance changes are going o make dungeon runs ALOT harder, which makes me sad.  I like the sigil changes though.


I really wish they'd actually "balance" the game so that build diversity on armor sets and etc were viable.  Maybe the nerf to crit damage will do this?  One can only hope, but it doesn't seem likely.  If just feels like they're making it tougher for players to play the game.

Your main is a warrior and YOU faceplant, but just because your experience is different it doesn't mean it speaks for other's :P. You remind me of these people:
Dude 1 - "Hey guys, I have X problem in my PC and I don't know what to do. I think it may be my OS..."
Dude 2 - "I dunno what ur talking about, I'm just fine on my end!"
Dude 1- "Ok grats, but how does that solves MY problem?"

Almost everyone knows that this game needs more challenge yet when anything is mentioned about that, people start making funny faces of discontent. Its like we all want something but we're too lazy or afraid to adapt to the changes of thereof. "Good ol' sweet easy loot! But - ooohh maaan this game needs to be more challenging..."

I just have the feeling ANet doesn't know what they want to do with their game and what kind of community they are trying to cater to. In case of doubt, the middle ground tends to be the answer but it feels like they are trying to stretch their efforts into every street and the end result ends up a mess that is appreciated by little few. Once sides are picked there will be people who are going to be displeased but I think this was a position that should have been taken ages ago - having a freaking direction for their project!

Otherwise, I actually agree that their concept of "balance" should have been to make other stats and builds more viable. You know it, I know it and I'm pretty sure that deep inside they know it too. But what are they waiting for? Simple - their core mechanics need some serious revamp for that to happen. This all goes back to the zerker discussion and why its a favorite among the people and the fact that we have so many forms of passive defenses that the game AI ins't really able to be a match for it - so DPS will always be prefered vs defense.

Until ANet fixes that matter we won't be able to go anywhere and any "balance" fix is just a band-aid to a bigger problem that they're just avoiding to go shoulder-to-shoulder with.

Edited by Datenshi92, 10 February 2014 - 12:44 PM.


#35 Veji

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 01:08 PM

Quote

Your main is a warrior and YOU faceplant, but just because your experience is different it doesn't mean it speaks for other's :P. You remind me of these people:
Dude 1 - "Hey guys, I have X problem in my PC and I don't know what to do. I think it may be my OS..."
Dude 2 - "I dunno what ur talking about, I'm just fine on my end!"
Dude 1- "Ok grats, but how does that solves MY problem?"

Almost everyone knows that this game needs more challenge yet when anything is mentioned about that, people start making funny faces of discontent. Its like we all want something but we're too lazy or afraid to adapt to the changes of thereof. "Good ol' sweet easy loot! But - ooohh maaan this game needs to be more challenging..."

Yeah, no it doesn't.  The/ANY game needs to be accessible to new players.  Gosh, i know thats a tough pill to swallow, but if you don't bring in new players and if they give up at level 60 or whatever because the game is "challenging", well, you just lost profit.

They have challenging content:  Tequatal and that 3 headed worm thing.  You want a challenge, THAR SHE BLOWS!  Have fun with that.  The 5 man dungeon content is on par with any WoW raid, at a smaller level, if really good hardcore players can breeze through, thats great.  ANet needs to make content to keep them busy.

So instead of stating that "the game is to easy", lets look at this as "there isn't enough harder content to keep us busy", because thats what it amounts to.  Another thing here, is there isn't vertical progression, so the dream of challenging content at every tier isn't something that is going to happen.

I think ANet has struck a fine balance for the game, as far as challenges.

#36 Phadde

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 01:18 PM

View Postsanctuaire, on 10 February 2014 - 08:23 AM, said:

a lot of us mainly-pve players do care, and the existing stigma against other classes on dungeon grouping
is reason enough... we don't see 'no warriors, no guardians' in the LFG notes ever... other classes are another story. and yes, it still happens to this day. getting constantly nerfed because of pvp only exacerbates the situation.

but yes anet doesn't care, as with the constant blind eye/ deaf ear approach with the calls for the pve/pvp split, as they were forced to do so in gw1.

Exactly!

I can't bare to play a certain profession that I like, because it's so massively discouraging to think about how badly it performs in a structured PvE enviroment, which is what PvE is all about to me. I'm really not exaggerating this either, and neither are you when accusing ANet to passively ignore the obvious and big issues about PvE balance which are fairly easy to fix.

#37 Veji

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 01:27 PM

Well, another thought:  The more you run a dungeon, the better you are going to get at it.  Thats with any content.  Any MMORPG.  Same thing with classes.  If you play an Engineer all the time.  In every situation.  You are going to master that class.  Now, some classes are easier to pick up, such as warrior or guardian.  Theres always going to be classes like that, and thats cool.  I love me some warrior.  But if you want "challenege" try playing a class that isn't easy to pick up, then master it.

Thats my next goal, after i get all the goals i have for warrior done.  I want to pick a class that i'm utterly horrible at and just OWN it.  Since theres no vertical progression, i have time to do that with my RL schedule.  I mean, you have 'make your own fun" sometimes.  Make your own challenges.  Theres plenty of that here, you just have to open eyes!

EDIT:  Or just move on to Elder Scrolls Online, like all the other MMO bandwagoneers are doing. lol

Edited by Veji, 10 February 2014 - 01:31 PM.


#38 Phadde

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 01:47 PM

View PostVeji, on 10 February 2014 - 01:27 PM, said:

Well, another thought:  The more you run a dungeon, the better you are going to get at it.  Thats with any content.  Any MMORPG.  Same thing with classes.  If you play an Engineer all the time.  In every situation.  You are going to master that class.  Now, some classes are easier to pick up, such as warrior or guardian.  Theres always going to be classes like that, and thats cool.  I love me some warrior.  But if you want "challenege" try playing a class that isn't easy to pick up, then master i

......

Make your own challenges.  Theres plenty of that here, you just have to open eyes!



Well, I've been playing Elementalist & Engineer since release. That challenge has to a large extent disappeared, even in the most challenging builds. If you dislike open world events, the only challenge left is Fractals and the occasional Lupicus-fight.

#39 Veji

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Posted 10 February 2014 - 02:15 PM

View PostPhadde, on 10 February 2014 - 01:47 PM, said:

Well, I've been playing Elementalist & Engineer since release. That challenge has to a large extent disappeared, even in the most challenging builds. If you dislike open world events, the only challenge left is Fractals and the occasional Lupicus-fight.

Then play something else for a bit and come back.  I don't mean that in a trolling-fashion either.  I've played WoW since retail release.  I've taken many, many breaks, because the content just gets old.  And then they come out with an xpac, i do the xpac with like 5 level 90 toons, and i'm done.  I stop my sub and go play something else, like GW2 or Borderlands 2 or whatever your poison is.

Some people can play a game for YEARS and never grow tired of it.  Some people get bored, move on, and either come back or never come back.  Thats just how it is.  No one is telling you to give away all your stuff, delete your toons, and uninstall the game from your PC.

GW2, like all things, must be taken in moderation.  Otherwise, you burn out and/or get bored with it.  I play like a demon at the moment, because im just fresh out of the honeymoon phase with the game.  So, i'll be to that point soon enough and go on to the next big thing.  On that token, i don't get mad ANet doesn't provide enough challenging content and etc to keep enthralled for the rest of my life.

Yes, the cycle can suck, but the great thing about games, is you're not married to them, so you're free to flirt and play any other game out there! lol





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