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B3aT

Member Since 12 Apr 2012
Offline Last Active Dec 24 2013 02:42 PM

#2127640 Yo, how are thieves not crazy OP?

Posted Falfyrel on 25 December 2012 - 12:16 AM

View PostArcherHenchman, on 24 December 2012 - 05:42 PM, said:

The switch to utilities isn't the entire problem, but its certainly another piece of evidence towards the idea that anet has no idea what they're doing with respect to pvp.

And to a certain extent, their strategy is pretty clear, they're going to add pvp content over time, then introduce real rewards in order to draw people over from the robust pve playerbase they've built. From there, they're hoping to get decent stream involvement and word of mouth which will pull back the previous drop-outs. The sad part is: Its a pretty *ing good strategy. Get raw numbers by developing pve content, then segue into esports when the development is done. The only people who get *ed over are the people who bought the game for pvp from the start.

As for the diversion argument, you might be entirely correct, but given the long cooldown of the chain, the easy method of stopping it, and its inability to drop people who aren't specced for full glass, it seems that pointing out the plentiful and easy-to-use defensive options is a valid retort. Guardian hammer 4, for instance, is incredibly powerful for decapping and capping points in guardian v point holder shitfests. You save dodges specifically for that skill because of how strong the knockback is. That said, the ability to dodge it is central to how those fights play out. Pretending that the skill should be nerfed because it attracts dodges rather than, say, the guardian's auto chain, is absurd. Same applies to this.
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First off, the thief combo you're talking about requires the thief to be unstealthed and within 900 range of you. You can see it coming if you bother to look around. Thieves rarely hit a steal at exactly 900 range, either, because the penalty to an out of range whiff is a full cooldown.

Second, your math is wrong, demonstrably so. A big chunk of thief damage comes from their critical strikes grandmaster talent. Steal and CnD in tpvp deal around 4k each on crits. Lets be nice and pretend that steal applies rage before the mug damage calculation, which means that there's a 49% chance that both hits crit with a full crit build. If either of those miss, you're down to 2k for the hit. Now here's where stuff gets fun.

If you crit on both against a full glass individual, you've dropped them by 8k. If their total hp is under 15k, you're now dealing extra on the backstab. Great.  If they didn't both crit, no build in the game, including glassy ones, will activate the additional 20% damage. Against glass, you typically backstab for 6k. When they're under 50% hp, that goes up to mid 7k figures. Note the difference between 4k+4k+7.5k and 4k+2k+6k.

Oh, and wait, those backstabs are crits. Another 30% chance that doesn't work.
The first gibs a full glass build at 15k hp, which is where glass thieves and elementalists run. The second does 12k damage, which does not kill a single class in the game.

In tpvp, you don't have food that increases your precision and power or crit rate and crit dmg %. You also don't get the same gear options. Again, if you want to compare numbers, go beat on some golems. I'm not rolling a warrior or mesmer and leveling to 80, getting a set of full exotics, then making a youtube video for you because you're too lazy to get actual tpvp numbers to compare against. Are thieves broken in wvwvw? I don't *ing know. Nor do I really care.  All I know is that whining from that area of the game has been used to inform balance changes which have substantially *ed with tpvp, especially when wvwvw's massive blobs of bullshit make playing a thief reliant on culling errors anyways.

Still, I'm really sorry that your ping makes you rage at things that require reactions. Maybe we should balance counterstrike with 250ms in mind and make headshots not do any extra damage, because that would be unfair to the people who are forced to mash buttons and spray.

Proof, please. It's very easy to make up numbers on the Internets, and your entire posts hinges on what you admit yourself are made-up, theoretical numbers.

That being said? Your theorycrafting is extremely light on actual information, disregards stuff like Assassin's Signet/sigils, and relies far too much on "what skills usually hit for." So is your theorycrafting backed up by actual ingame footage of sPvP and the basic art of addition?



Just to help you a little bit and provide video evidence for your "claims,"  here's a video which completely corroborates your unfounded statements!


Except... no, it doesn't.
1:03. There goes that Thief with that super-weak 15k-max burst on a Warrior! Except... wait... 3.4k and stun, 1.4k, 1.4k, 4.2k, and then 10k. Again, on a Warrior. Hmm! That looks a bit like 20k to me!

Since you're doubtless going to cherrypick the video for why the Warrior was a terrible player, here's another segment of the same video: 2:24. 2.4k and cripple, 3.8k and stun, 3.4k, and then 7.2k. 16.8k burst on a Guardian,and the Thief wasn't even finished before the Guardian was downed.

(EDIT: for one last counterpoint brought to you by the crummy built-in Microsoft calculator itself, check 5:31. 3.4k + immobilize (so no stunbreak), 4k, 7.4k, 6.7k, down, 21k damage total, burst still not finished. Is three good enough for you?)

This video is chock-full of footage of the Thief putting out burst that far outpaces your theoretical numbers. If you don't like the footage in this video for whatever contrived reason of people making mistakes in video games and thus being shit-tier players, I can always find more footage. If you don't like his build too bad: we argue about the potential of Thief burst, we use a burst build, not some shitty pseudo-burst build which uses no sigils or Assassin's Signet.

There you go. Actual sPvP footage of Thief bursts that far outpaces your hashed-together burst ceiling, that doesn't rely entirely on made-up data.


#2133316 Guru - State of the Game sPvP Discussion! Jan. 4th!

Posted Rubajz on 02 January 2013 - 06:31 AM

View PostAodan, on 01 January 2013 - 07:24 PM, said:

That is absolutely not true. Reason why is pvp in this game so dead is absence of motivation to play and issues with matchmaking. When you are newbie and you are trying free tournaments for first few times, you get facerolled by teams playing them for some time and it not get better, because when losing 100 to 500, you are not learning anything. Why these team plays free and dont go to paids? Because they get facerolled there by few teams playing them repeatedly on a daily basis. Again, if you get destroyed with score under 300, you are not learning anything.

Reason why cs is fine without any ranking system is same as you argued for wow. Huge fanbase and really active scene.
You cant get this in almost dead game. Rating system is only thing that can pour new players into pvp and shield them from veteran teams.

Custom arenas dont solve anything, because there are not enough people to use them at their max potential at this time and, in my opinion, you dont get to increase your skill level by playing with teams in custom arenas. You can only play with your friends, which they are usually at similiar skill level, and then maybe few matches with unknown team to you, which destroy you easily until it stops entertaining them or the other way around. Anyway, planning matches is much more difficult and time consuming when compared to automated tournament system. Also it will not bring new players into game.

As I see it, only thing that can save this game is matchmaking/rating system, spectator mode and only then, after all this is implemented, custom arenas.


#2064614 Mesmer's and thief's, too powerful?

Posted Chorazin on 06 November 2012 - 11:15 AM




#2128703 Yo, how are thieves not crazy OP?

Posted Caffynated on 26 December 2012 - 08:55 PM

I'm not going to bother going round and round with you again on the same crap.

Here, your precious golem damage tests:

Posted Image

I forgot about the CnD nerf only affecting structured, and not WvW. Sometimes I forget how retarded ANet is. My bad there.

Compare that to what my math says it should be:
Steal 6,861 WvW
Steal 5,301 sPvP

CnD 6,862 WvW
CND 3,552 sPvP

Backstab 13,246 WvW
Backstab 10,235 sPvP

Otherwise, the math worked out almost exactly, with the slight exception that backstab was actually higher than expected.

*edit - the 3rd backstab is lower because I swapped out Executioner (20% damage to targets under 50%) for Hidden Killer (100% crit chance in stealth).

*edit - more golem tests with some different trait choices:

Posted Image

Heavy golems for reference:

Posted Image

I couldn't get the light golem to stay alive long enough for a full CnMugD -> backstab, so backmugstab had to do.

Posted Image


#1909558 WvW Article Series: New players, start here!

Posted Relidar on 10 September 2012 - 06:25 AM

I see many new players asking questions on forums and in game about what exactly to do in WvW, and how they can affect the bigger picture. For this purpose i thought it would be good to make more people aware of what their options are and how what they do helps their team or hurts their enemies.

1. Communication and chat.

This is the most important part about WvW. If your server cannot communicate then your success rate will diminish. Let people know what is happening around you. On most servers /team is focused mainly on tactics and information on the borderland that you're on and /map is for general chat.
  • Are you and 4 friends attacking an objective? Let everyone know about this, be specific too, where are you attacking and how many are you, do you need help, where are you going next.
  • Is one of your objectives being attacked by an enemy? Same here, where, how many and what's the status. (Gate/wall %)
  • Is your guild claiming a tower, keep or castle? Are you upgrading a castle? (See more about upgrades below)
2. Contribution and progress.

No matter how many you are, even if you are alone, you can always contribute and help your team.
  • If you're alone, go help working on relationships with the neutral mob factions in the borderlands. Not many people are aware of these and what they can do, but they can help change the battle for your team or the enemies. All neutral mobs, when allied, will contribute in one way or another. Some will send out forces to defend your supply camps and some will even attack and take over supply camps or towers.
  • Small man groups, 3-10, your biggest advantage is your speed and quick execution. Stay away from the big crowds and focus on supply camps. Supply camps are the most important part about taking and keeping objectives. Without supplies your, or the enemy team, will eventually run dry and not be able to defend their towers, keeps or castles.
  • Cut off roads from and to big hubs where your enemies are headed to defend. Placing small groups of 5-10 players on vital choke points around the map will help your team or devastate your enemy.
3. Siege weapons, positioning and costs.

The most important part about siege weapons is that you are aware of how they work and how much they cost to build.
  • ALWAYS make sure that you have people around you with supplies to finish the build, otherwise it's a waste of a siege weapon. (info on how much supplies a siege weapon costs is on the tooltip of the weapon that you buy, it also shows the range!)
  • Positioning is your next priority. Don't just build trebuchets or arrow carts anywhere. Remember, arrow carts have no line of sight requirements, so if you play smart you can hide them behind objects or inside of houses/ruins on the map!
  • If you are building a siege weapon anywhere, make sure your team knows about it. Use /say or /team to make people aware of your plan.
  • Always carry supplies on you wherever you go! When you take a supply camp, make sure you stock up on supplies before moving on to the next objective.
  • If you see someone else building a siege weapon, help them out!
4. What's important and how will i know where to go?

Leadership is good and will always help, but not necessary if your server can communicate.
  • If you don't know where to go, always check the map FIRST! There will be swords indicating  if anyone is attacking an objective. Silver swords means a smaller attack (5 or less) and bronze/orange swords means a bigger attack (5 or more).
  • If you are still unsure, don't be afraid to ask for direction in /map or /team.
  • Your main priority should always be your own borderlands. Each borderlands has an Orb that gives a bonus 5% health and 50 points in all stats to your realm. Make sure that your homelands is secured and defended first and foremost.
  • Hitting the enemy in their own borderland can distract them and help your own team in the Eternal Battlegrounds.
  • During a siege, if everything around you is cooling down you should always run to the nearest supply camp and restock on supplies, you never know when you might need it next!
5. Tips and tricks!
  • See yourself in the middle of nowhere surrounded by enemies? Remember, it's free to port back to your borderland keep and you can do it instantly out of combat!
  • Always carry salvage kits and gathering tools, you never know when you're gonna run into that rich gold vein!
  • Don't be afraid to team up with new players, it makes WvW even more fun and you get to know new players!
  • Stay off the roads if you want to remain hidden. If you want to get to an objective on the map, you'll be safer following the edge of the map.
  • Keep an eye on chat and the map. You never know when your team might need you exactly where you are at that time!
  • If you die in a zone with the Outmanned buff, make sure you zone out of that map and back in again to regain it.
  • Tower, keep and castle defenses will reward more exp, karma and money as the battles tend to last longer there.
  • All objectives can be upgraded by ANYONE. You don't need to claim it to be able to contribute.
  • Ressing people awards exp and contribution if you are close to an objective. As does repairing doors, gates and walls!
  • Don't take supplies from Stonemist Castle! This is important because this castle will use a lot of supplies to upgrade and repair it's walls and gates. It's also very helpful to have a stock of supplies for when there's an attack! * linkstatic
  • Don't waste time auto-attacking doors, bring siege weapons! * Talamare

Link to part 2: Click!
Link to part 3: Click!

Link to our stream: http://www.own3d.tv/CruelGaming


#2106177 Guardian Screenshots Thread!

Posted sploosh on 03 December 2012 - 07:58 PM

Posted ImagePosted Image


#1991787 Guardian Screenshots Thread!

Posted Keidel on 04 October 2012 - 10:21 AM

My Guardian, only level 60 but i think i will use this set for level 80, i really don't like the exotic stuff, and everyone is pretty much in the same gear.

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#1980710 Guardian Screenshots Thread!

Posted metamorphosee on 30 September 2012 - 02:23 AM

My asura baby

Posted Image

Dyes were used to imitate the effect of Mystic Claymore.


#2120286 WvW: Original Culling Behavior Has Been Restored

Posted Calebrus on 16 December 2012 - 09:25 PM

Rule #1:
If your computer is that old you should not be allowed to complain about one single issue regarding graphics or processing.
2005?  Really?  Your computer is older than some of the people that play this game.


#2047120 Why are people qqing because they are ignorant? (Thief)

Posted CepaCepa on 27 October 2012 - 11:02 PM

Yes, you can counter thieves. Or mesmers. With particular builds.

But if you need to build yourself and using certain utilities JUST for one particular profession in the game, it's enough of a hint to start looking at that profession's balance. They don't necessarily need a nerf, but you bet it should be something always on the table for discussion.

I know how to counter a thief, hell if all I ever do in PvP or WvW is fight against thieves, I can build myself in certain ways that I can almost always win against at least 2-3 of the most popular thief builds in 1v1. But I've only got 3 utility slots and 1 amulet slot and thieves aren't exactly the profession that you can spot 10 miles away and switch all your utilities before he approaches. And I run the risk of being very vulnerable to some other professions if I build particularly to counter a thief, not to mention I would not want to be next to useless for my team whenever the situation is not 1v1. So now I'm building myself such that I won't die to a thief easily, and may have a chance to win --- Yeah, they aren't particularly a problem anymore, but the very fact that I have to balance my build/gear choices upon the "potential encounter of this one profession" means that thief is definitely in the spot light.

Now, it could be intended, in many mmos the thief/rogue/assasin type of class forces many other classes to build certain ways and they're supposed to do so. In other words, maybe thieves are "supposed to be" overpowered in certain areas, for example they're "supposed to" stop certain glass cannon builds in other professions. I don't know if that's the case, but either way it's silly to say that "you can always deal with thieves once you have one" --- Again, you only have 3 utility slots, and building yourself just so you can deal with thieves and making yourself utterly useless against some specs of other professions is just sad and in some ways degrading (yet, that seems to work best given how many thieves there are nowadays in comparison to others).

I'm not going to cry for a nerf to thieves, because I recognize that they're not invincible and there are situations that other professions shines a lot more than thieves. I'll just say that they're definitely something annoying and have a rather big impact on the overall structure of PvP. For this very same reason you see guardians getting QQs as well, they also influence the overall structure of PvP so they're in the spot light --- But at least they're not killing others none-stop, they're just hard to kill, so less people dislike Guardians and more people dislike thieves, it's all natural. Now you may say that a shatter mesmer is just as powerful as a thief for burst, that is true. However, the frequency of you encountering a mesmer capable of bursting you down in seconds is much less than the frequency of encountering a thief that can do the same thing --- Maybe it's just easier to play a standard zerg thief and hence everyone is playing one, or maybe the mesmer player base really haven't found out about their own burst yet, I'm not one to make a statement here. But this phenomenon, no matter the cause, is going to result in a cry on thieves over mesmers and guardians even though all three can be potentially very powerful in certain situations.

For a thief to cry about "other people crying" is therefore none-sense. Here's the logic: the only way for thieves to avoid the nerf bat is if "griefing" is what a thief is SUPPOSED to do in the meta-game to keep the balance of other professions. And if griefing is what you're supposed to do, there WILL be cries and hate and dislikes from others, it's part of the package. If you can't deal with that, then you can either ask for a nerf yourself and suddenly have more people liking you, OR just switch to another profession. For example, an engineer, ranger, or necro. No one will hate on you then.

Like you said, sometimes you've gotta just deal with it. This goes for yourself as well.


#2108811 Please help me understand control in dungeons

Posted GuanglaiKangyi on 05 December 2012 - 10:24 PM

View PostDahk, on 05 December 2012 - 08:27 PM, said:

Dude, what is your issue?  No, it's not technically a fact, because yes, it is technically possible that there is some widespread bug that conveniently only applied to ranged mobs and conveniently prevents exploitation.  But realistically?  That'd be one hell of a lucky mistake to make.

And can you back off the who arguing over technicalities?  Just because there isn't some quote to cite somewhere doesn't mean that I'm suddenly throwing out baseless statements in order to assort my authority or something.  I made an educated assessment of the situation based on logic, experience, and weighing of probabilities.  Most people are able to comprehend this, but for some reason you seem to need me to preface anything I say with some sort of disclaimer or else you think I'm somehow trying to brainwash the community for who knows what reason.

Coglin is notorious for being the local idiot.  It's safe to ignore him.

On topic, there are mobs that can't be moved but who are still vulnerable to control effects.  If you try to push or pull one, they'll be knocked down but won't move from where they are.  That's just a design decision on Anet's part, probably since they're usually "guarding" chokepoints.  It prevents us from pushing them away or pulling them out when we're supposed to fight them all at once.

As for unstoppable, some mobs are just straight-up immune to control effects.  The Risen Abominations are the most obvious example of this.  I think the game just lists unstoppable as a descriptor when it's not otherwise obvious that they'd be CC-immune.


#2107914 Commander - Is it good for WvW? At what cost?

Posted Shiren on 05 December 2012 - 07:50 AM

Do you guys think the commander function is good for WvW design? I'm not asking if you think it's good to have someone to focus your forces on or to rally the pugs/zerg, I'm specifially talking about the decision to make the only identifiable person on a map ro*ed by a 100g purchase. Incredibly significant parts of WvW rely on functions which are reserved for rich people and not people who have proven they should have that responsibility or who have the potential behind them to make use of it.

To a certain extent, WvW is made better by the presence of a commander. Guilds use them to focus their members on siege points and they are almost mandatory for co-ordinated large scale sieges. Pugs use them to find a zerg to rally around and become a cohesive part of the group. Without them, these kinds of things would be more difficult.

And then there is the downside. Many commanders are a just players who were good at playing the TP and not at playing WvW (some of the most skilled and knowledgeable commanders will make very little money from WvW - it's often not about capping and moving on, sometimes defending is very important - and someone has to pay for upgrades). Some commanders are just outright bad and will direct zergs to chaotic and pointless locations while key locations are lost. Some commanders devalue the presence of other commanders, they all look equal and there is no way for pugs to tell who is a knowledgable commander and who is a bad commander.

The biggest issue I see with commander is that it comes at the opportunity cost for WvW to have a better system put in place by guilds or friends who have chosen someone to follow around. Say a WvW guild has three commanders, but one is on holidays, one has just finished a long shift and needs a break and the other is just burnt out for a while. There are still many people in that guild who want to WvW but they use a commander to wrangle up some pugs, or even just to keep track of each other. There is no way for them to appoint a leader of the guild group on the map and see their location to rally on. They have to deal with voice chat and often will lose members or have difficult rallying together.

Wouldn't it be better to have a system where guilds/groups/friends can form raids and appoint a raid leader? They have their own raid chat to comminicate with the entire raid (similair to squad, only this time it doesn't cost 100g and it's not specific to one person) and they should be able to see each other on the map (similair to a party). Being able to see how much supply your group has without having to type 1 in chat would also be helpful (I know commanders can currently do this). It would also be good if they could all have a follow option for a certain person, giving them an icon similair to a commander one, but an icon you only see if you follow them, and not before that.

Using the primary rally mechanic of WvW as a gold sink is harmful to competitive play. It puts too much pressure on current commanders to be on for better coverage and it makes it very difficult to assign new commanders, especially when there is a very high risk of a guild sponsored commander burning out in the first week or two due to the pressures of having to be on and perform so much. It would be better to have a system where people could organise themselves and rally on a person they choose to. This way, if a commander goes offline the guild can continue operations on their own chosen person. Smaller groups of players can work together and have enhanced communication and co-ordination without having to have a specific character drop 100g on what should have been a free feature for organised guilds and groups to use.

The current design (a lack of a free alternative) is putting a gold sink and e-peen ahead of organised, skilled and competitive play. It would be easier to group smaller guild WvW communities if the functions which are currently exclusive to the commander tag were redesigned to be available through other systems. It's still possible to have the e-peen commander and the raid leader/guild/group chosen and limited leader.


#1897586 Tier 3 Cultural Armor too much?

Posted Awbie on 07 September 2012 - 02:13 PM

I really can't stand this "I'm gonna be a unique snowflake one day, because I live in my mom's basement and have the time to spend 5 months doing nothing but farm armor in an online game" kind of attitude.

GW2 is supposed a game where everything you do is fun, there is no grind, you keep playing the game because it's actually *FUN*, you don't keep playing the game because they're holding a little carrot in front of your eyes.


#2106891 L2P is the dumbest argument ever

Posted RandolfRa on 04 December 2012 - 01:11 PM

View PostLeeto, on 04 December 2012 - 06:36 AM, said:

Oh dont worry about me l2ping, anet is just gonna nerf vapor form, but instead of whining when it happens just L2P.
Ya, cuz they gotta please these l2p noobs lol who'd really just need to l2p instead of qq in forums cuz they suck lol

Seriously though, my point was that L2P is a non-argument that destroys any actual discussion about inbalanced skills. This is what OP was also trying to say in his opening post.

Quote

There is a considerable difference between learning to play and wanting to get rid of a mechanic that rewards play that does not require skill.
Like getting rid of the whole thief profession?


#2105779 L2P is the dumbest argument ever

Posted raspberry jam on 03 December 2012 - 01:50 PM

There is a considerable difference between learning to play and wanting to get rid of a mechanic that rewards play that does not require skill.