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Member Since 26 Aug 2012
Offline Last Active Jan 21 2013 12:55 AM

#2143946 Cosmetic Reward is not the best carrot for an MMO

Posted shiggidyshwa on 16 January 2013 - 07:48 PM

This really. Content and social interaction in itself is the best reward, which in our commodity-driven mindsets may be somewhat alien but no less true. I challenge anyone who played Guild Wars 1 to list their best memories of the game. Popular recollections might be winning the Hall of Heroes, finishing UW with your guild in record time, or finally building your runner character and experiencing the thrill of running past a ton of ice wurms for the first time.

These took front and center over obtaining gear. At some point, however, even these social achievements lose their veneer and gear grind becomes the order of the day. It works out in much the same way in GW2. The thrill of obtaining vistas, capturing a WVW keep, or finishing a story dungeon happens ONCE per. This may seem obvious, as anyone who grinds the dragon fights can attest. These are long, drawn-out, repetitive events that feel more like mowing the lawn than playing a fun game. But how else should it play out in a scenario that pits hundreds of players against a single target?

I can propose a few ideas off the top of my head that could change things up a bit.


Open-world zones remain empty after you level your character through them, with the exception of end-level areas like the Cursed Shore and Southsun Cove. Even then, replaying these areas is simply done to grind for materials or the chance for rare drops. Outside of a guild setting, there is no excitement or feeling of group accomplishment. It's a very hollow feeling.

Solve this by expanding the dynamic, persistent event chains of each zone. Give each zone a cohesive story-driven event chain that spans the entire zone. Zone-wide notifications alert players to urgent quests that must be completed to advance the event chain. Rather than creating the events as token, optional, make sure there are concrete consequences for failing the zone's event chain.

I'll use Gendarran Fields as an example.

- - -

Zone Event - Prevent the Gendarran Pirates from Obtaining the Vizier's Staff

The Pirate crews have united to attack the Undead stronghold and obtain the Vizier's Staff. With this, they can control the Undead host and lay waste to the farms of Gendarran Fields. Band together and prevent their assault!

Benefits of Success:

- Increased appearance of gathering nodes
- 30% increased drop and gathering rate
- Players gain 15% to vitality

Consequences of Failure:

- Large bands of undead with large aggro range rove the countryside
- 30% reduced drop and gathering rate
- Players suffer from 15% reduced vitality

Event Chain One (North Sector) - Build Trebuchets on the Provern Shore and Sink Paz Gorga's Pirate Fleet

Main Quest - Man the trebuchets and sink the fleet (after Minor Quest completion)
Minor Quest (req'd) - Clear the Provern Shore of Basilisks and their Den Mother
Minor Quest (req'd) - Find and eliminate the Pirate assassin Vexx before he kills Priory Engineer Taluth
Minor Quest (req'd) - Use Peacemaker Malthus' weather modification device to produce favourable conditions for the upcoming battle
Minor Quest (bonus) - Rescue Peachy Pie the Quaggan soprano from the clutches of Skank the Pirate

Event Chain Two (East Sector) - ETC

Event Chain Three (South Sector) - ETC

Event Chain Four (West Sector) - ETC

- - -

You get my drift.

These four event chains would have to be completed within a few hours of each other, or else players would face the consequences until a "take-back" event chain occurred. This allows sufficient time for players to just go in and farm if they want without participating in the event. At the same time, the consequences make it unfavourable to simply go and farm, but not impossible (except maybe for bots who would suffer from the randomized mob movement patterns upon event failure).

If the time window for completion and the difficulty scaled with the current zone player population, could this be a positive step for dynamic event development? If bosses encountered during the Main and Minor Quests dropped unique loot that scaled to a player's level (not necessarily skins but stats), it would be an added incentive for players.

Needless to say, the quest and story execution would need to be above par. Nobody wants a boring zone-wide event chain that ultimately becomes a gathering quest. That's BS. These events must somehow strive to be on par with dungeons, while realizing that dungeons are top-tier (difficulty, drops) content that can't and shouldn't be experienced in any old zone.

As it stands, many open-world zones remain empty except for the obligatory story instances. These can remain unaffected by the persistent event chains so as not to handicap new players.

The game infrastructure for a development like this already exists. Heart quests and event chains are already scattered among every zone. They only need refinement and the injection of social and material incentives.


#2086393 Worth coming back, or is the game still bad?

Posted BnJ on 18 November 2012 - 10:04 PM

Yeah, you should definitely re-sub!

#2086200 Worth coming back, or is the game still bad?

Posted Nabuko Darayon on 18 November 2012 - 07:08 PM

I feel this topic pointless... You ain't paying any money to play it. Log in, try it, if you're bored - leave. Simple as that. 0.o or do you need society's approval to click on the Login button.
Some cheers maybe?
...like I said, pointless topic.

#2082462 Ranger Patch Notes.. What does it really equate to?

Posted Trei on 16 November 2012 - 03:18 AM

Anet probably believed they were doing us a favor buffing ranger underwater combat ahead of a major content patch involving islands and shores...

#2074383 Fractals of the Mists - New Dungeon 'Hub'

Posted Guest 34905 on 12 November 2012 - 05:08 PM

View PostKnuckledust13, on 12 November 2012 - 04:16 PM, said:

There is not enough information to speculate, just wait for the 15th and we will see it

But it is enough info for you to whine in the ascended armor QQ thread!
Talk about hypocrisy..

#2049390 Guild Wars 2 has a serious Bot problem, are they even doing anything about it?

Posted Midnight_Tea on 29 October 2012 - 01:09 AM

At the risk of sounding like a fanboy...

Really really good on Colin Johanson for his transparency and directness about the issue. Straight to the point, level, and not wrapped up in antiseptic PR speak.

#2049229 Guild Wars 2 has a serious Bot problem, are they even doing anything about it?

Posted Ethereal on 28 October 2012 - 11:24 PM

Yes. Colin Johanson recently posted an update on the bot issue on the official forums. Here was his reply.

Hey folks,

Since it has been a few weeks since we gave an update on this, just wanted to quickly update where we stand. We recently hired an entire new team of people with one mission in mind: operation bot destruction.

They’ve been getting everything in place to accomplish our goal of making botting, hacking, spamming, and malicious behavior as non-existent as possible in Gw2. In the last few weeks, over 10,000 bot accounts were banned from the game alone. Another area of massive improvement has been in account security, where our two-factor authentication as well as your password changes have led to account thefts dropping to a tiny rate. A vast majority of account thieves use those accounts to run bots and/or perform RMT transactions, so our serious beefing up of account security has led to fewer bots, and most importantly fewer stolen accounts. That being said, we have massive improvements on the way in the next couple of weeks that help us detect, verify, and remove botters.

What we don’t want to do is have someone report you as botting, we ban the account, the bot appeals, and we have no data to prove they were botting on file so we have to give them the account back. Ensuring we have 100% clear data on bots that’s incredibly easy for our GM team to quickly verify, and when an appeal is submitted verify within seconds if the person was truly botting is our most important goal. We don’t want to ban people who were not botting, and we want to keep the people who are permanently locked out.

Bottom line: We’re doing ok, but we know we can and need to do much better on this front and are putting massive resources behind ensuring we have a permanent solution to this issue. You’ll see a dramatic improvement in this area in the next few weeks as our remaining detection and bot destruction tools and staff come online.

We’ll continue to keep updating on this front as we go forward, but rest assured we are aware of issues folks are raising and take them incredibly seriously. From FOV to bots, account restoration to more awesome stuff to do at level 80 we have teams working like mad on all of these fronts.

Source: https://forum-en.gui...n-Gamespy/first

#2051976 November Update - Date Confirmed

Posted Valkaire on 30 October 2012 - 07:07 AM

View PostXSevSpreeX, on 30 October 2012 - 05:15 AM, said:

In such a short amount of time? This isn't something that they're going to start working on now and release on the 15th. I wouldn't be surprised if they were working on this at launch.

If it's being released in a little over two weeks I'm fairly sure that they had teams plotting it out before launch xD I think they pretty much had their minds set on the amount of content they were going to have by the BWEs so they could have spared a few teams to begin development of new content fairly early imo.

#2051554 November Update - Date Confirmed

Posted Saul Spotter on 30 October 2012 - 12:28 AM

Just having one of these things happen will be enough to keep me happy: (in no particular order)

-Guild Halls
-New Map
-Player Housing
-Polymock, Shooting Gallery, or other mini-game
-climate change to coincide with Winter

All I need is one of those to show that Anet is keeping up their post release support and I'll be thrilled.

#1996154 What do you NOT like about GW2?

Posted MyIGNisPrivate on 05 October 2012 - 08:23 PM

Your failure is only funny when you try... God I hate that guy.

#1966094 Post Your Mesmer!

Posted Toris on 25 September 2012 - 06:37 AM

Posted Image

#1966740 Think I'm Boned

Posted Desild on 25 September 2012 - 11:43 AM

In the advent of having multiple passwords for every other feature I use on the internet, I began using a Password Memory Card.

Basicaly it's a piece of cardboard with all my passwords (and spare autheticator codes) written on, which I chained to my screen base so it wouldn't get lost. I haven't forgot any password since.

You should try it someday, when you get your password back.

#1959148 so who got bored and stopped playing already?

Posted ak1287 on 22 September 2012 - 07:37 PM

This is the problem with threads like this.
The OP will make the thread; 3 out of every 5 people will disagree, and the OP will either argue with them or ignore them; then, when those last two people are like 'OMG TOTALLY AGREE GAME WILL FAIL LOL PANDA,' the OP comes right back with 'See, no one likes this game, it's going to fail.'

What everyone needs to realize is; you are independent people. I don't care that teh OP doesn't find the game interesting anymore, or that some dude named kanaxis doesn't like dungeons. I do, and my friends and guildmates do, and that's what matters. Forums should be for constructive criticisms only, not useless whining and back-patting (on both sides)

View PostShadowrose, on 22 September 2012 - 07:33 PM, said:

Everyone is supposed to be enjoying the newly released game.

It's the people who don't feel that way the ones that stand out. And that number is increased day by day.

Shouldn't you worry? I'm worried that maybe I spent 60$ on something that will just be one of those RPGs that only a small community plays. I'm having fun but I want my choice to be popular aswell...

Short answer, no.
Long answer, no because I'm an adult, for Christ's sake.

#1959101 "There is no content"

Posted XPhiler on 22 September 2012 - 07:21 PM

View PostTheHanzou, on 22 September 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:

I think what needs to be understood is that when we say endgame (PvE) content, we actually mean 'group content', as in dungeons/raids.

Because most people that play MMOs dont asociate solo content with endgame content. Solo content, as in achivment farming or map completion farming, is just a grind, it has no substance, its just artificial prolonging the gaming experience, might as well play offline singleplayer and you would not notice a difference. Most people refuse to aknowledge solo content as real endgame content in an MMO (Massive Multiplayer).

They said the 'whole game' is the endgame. But thats not true, the whole game 1-80 is solo content, thats true. But when you dont play MMOs for the solo content, what is there left in GW2? MMOs are not about solo content. Well, exept most new MMOs, which is why they fail and people go back to WoW all the time.


I think you're hitting the issues but just in the wrong way!
The issues you mention is exactly what Gw2 is designed from the ground up to address but because players are so used to the statues quo they just cant see it!

You mention that finishing off the zones, geting achievement and crafting legendaries is a grind. and Indeed grind is an issue with end games. But what is grind, Grind is repeating the same thing over and over and over again. Something which you do not enjoy! That fits perfectly the definition of end game raids imho. You get the same lets say 2 hour dungeon you have to repeat over and over again until lady luck smile on you. That to me and I am sure many others is Grind. GW2 cant do miricales it still has a finite amount of content and just like every other game it has to make you repeat it only instead of hgiving you 2 hours of content to repeat, it gives you a full 500 hours !

Teamplay... The whole game is designed from the ground up to provide team play. Everyone can support, everyone can res, everyone can CC. It puts the power in your hands. There is even a combo system where players can help each other out do more damage.  You decide!

You mention that Teamplay isnt fun because its too easy, but why is it too easy?

Simply because the game actually does way too much to have people play together and you just get these zergs. Are zergs a problem caused by the game or simply player's greed? I think its once again a player issue, there is no effort involved that if you see a group thats too large you simply walk away and look for another event / group. If played with a decent numbers event can be both challenging and fun! Well some of them at least.

As for the socializing aspect, isnt that entirely up to the player? what can a game do to have people talk to each other? Need healing, or thanks for the party or discussing how to tackle this next boss or shouting at players for not perfoming up to expectations isnt really socializing is it?

The only thing GW2 did by removing the trinity is opening up a ton of possiblities and combination. In trinity everyone has a speciifc role and everyone knows exactly what they need to do to synergize with their team mates. Here its a lot more complicated than that. Granted in most content its not really needed for the success of that content but you can still do it so that when you actually need to you'd be used to it + you finish content faster.

Of course all of this depends on the player. If what you enjoy are raids a fix for the grind they are is not somethign you're looking for anyway!

#1958528 "There is no content"

Posted Chip_H on 22 September 2012 - 02:53 PM

View PostTheHanzou, on 22 September 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:

In GW2, you don't have much interplay or support in defined roles. The norm is either not to group, or group in an anonymous uncommunicative way (i.e. DEs) with no roles and the concommitent interplay of strategy that brings to literally every fight. A team is merely the sum of its parts. Btw, Rift did a much smarter thing for roles and needing the "Holy Trinity": they let you vary your role to adapt and fit a need, not remove the need for roles. Because there are only shades of grey in the crayon box, the art of content is more limited to nice pencil sketches.
Two things:

First off, what makes you think there aren't plenty slap happy as heck to have destroyed the notion of necessary roles? Sure, there are obviously those who miss them, but I do not, at all, in any way. I hated it whenever any sort of conflict arose when playing with friends due to the unnecessary hard roles. You had to decide, do I tell my brother, no, you can't play your ranger in this mission because, really, you're a boat anchor, or even though you were happily playing your warrior, you needed to step down and come back with an elementalist because that's that the team needed for this mission. Yes, that style of gaming has a certain appeal to a certain audience, but if that's what you want, go play those games; there is no shortage of them on the market.

Second, guess what, when you are playing in a small group with voice chat, a great deal of these things you think are missing from the game somehow magically reappear. You ask who has a snare, who can daze, you swap weapons so that you reliably combo for extra damage with your friend. There are still plenty of roles, they're just softer around the edges, and that, for the right audience, is a good thing.

You've got to realize: for all the BS nostalgia for a game that only existed in the heads of those who played that way, GW1 was the largely the same. Most people tackled things solo or in small groups with H/H filling out the gaps. Only some people chose to approach the game as coordinated eight man teams with complimentary professions and builds. What ArenaNet did was they removed the artificial distraction to what was going on. In GW1, although you could play a carefully constructed and critical role in an eight man team, you were equally free to be just as "self sufficient" as in GW2. I was self sufficient because I used carefully built heroes to handle my healing and damage prevention when I was playing my warrior, or I used carefully built heroes to tank and protect me from direct assault when I was playing my elementalist. There wasn't any necessity to rely on another human for anything in most of the game, even in the imaginary golden age pre-Night Fall. GW2 merely strips away the pretense - instead of AI handling all the stuff your profession lacked, they just give it to you and it's up to you to come up with a combination of skills and traits and game play styles to make it work however you are choosing to approach the game.

Nothing much has changed, it's just that the solo/small group aspect is much more obvious in a open world and you can no longer hide behind the illusion of team dynamics when it was just you and 7 bots in reality.

TL,DR; What you call flaws were alive and well in GW1 from the beginning and only strengthened over time with improved mechanics to foster solo/small group play. It's in the DNA of GW2 and not going anywhere.