The discussion involves engineer condition dmg vs nec condition dmg
In summary, I'm of the belief that nec condition damage is more powerful largely because of epidemic.
Mastif believes engineer condition damage is more powerful because engineers can apply more bleeds.
This discussion is, of course, not limited to just myself and Mastif, and I encourage all others to give their input, and I have started this without consulting Mastif first, so he may or may not even post here.
Furthermore, if you believe a profession other than nec or engineer can out-do either one of them, say so.
And lastly, this is not a thread about how useless or worthless you believe condition damage to be. This is just about who does it better.
epidemic is quite nice, I admitted to that. Necro does not hold up to engineer for condition damage. I can max bleed and vuln, add in fire and perma poison with my nades and pistol, necro can't even apply fire without a guardian or ranger in the party (sun spirit), and fire is the 2nd best damaging condition. Necro takes a lot more work to max bleed and then can't even apply vuln well, or you can apply vuln well with axe and not get good bleeds cause you aren't using scepter.
Are we talking about soloing things with condition damage or working as a team with condition damage? Epidemic's strength partly comes from the fact that the other professions in the team will apply conditions as a secondary effect to an otherwise power-driven build.
Plus, if vuln is a sincere concern, we can bring spectral wall. Running over it once is pretty much a guarantee for every enemy(aside from stationary enemies, ofc), if placement is correct. Running over it twice is common. 10 stacks of vuln per time an enemy crosses it, and it also gives protection to allies.
And your burning- if you're using traits to get it on grenade kit -is negligible, as it'll only be on one enemy, for 4 seconds out of every 10 seconds. Without epidemic, you might as well not even bring it for fighting groups.
Condition damage nec also purges the team of conditions and (with mark of blood) applies perma-regeneration to any allies who are on the frontline. And let's not even get started on the weakness spam.
Oh yeah, all my bleeds are aoe too. Not as good as epidemic's radius, but then again I can apply bleeds to 15 enemies instead of 5 because I have 3 separate grenades instead of 1 skill.
Grenade radius is trash compared to that of Enfeebling Blood(Dagger 5), Grasping Dead(Scepter 2), and big marks.
Grenades normally have 120 and 150 radius for each individual grenade, while Enfeebling Blood, Grasping Dead, and big marks all have a radius of 240. The area each individual grenade covers is 45,239 units of area for 120 grenades, and 70,686 units of area for each 150 grenade. By comparison, nec counterparts cover 180,956 units of area, much more than double the larger grenades. Unless you've packed all of your targets into one tight corner, nec skills are going to blow you away.
And no, you cannot ever apply more bleeds than an epidemic nec. You cannot. Don't even try. You have 3 separate sources of aoe bleeding, that's nice, so do condition damage necs(Well, actually 4 if you want to count dark path, but let's not), but ours are larger radius to begin with and we have epidemic to double it all.
(I also need to point out that the tooltips for several nec skills are still incorrect. Grasping dead, with no traits, applies 3 stacks of bleed, while scepter auto-attack applies bleeding that lasts longer than what it states(wiki says 5 sec, what I've seen says 8 sec))
Plus epidemic is a waste of a skill against bosses that don't have spawns because it does nothing in that situation.
That's why you swap it out before the boss fight for something like BiP(Which gives 10 stacks of might and retardculous bleeding duration), or whatever situational utility would be best suited.
Also, it's a lot harder to hit moving enemies with grenades than it is to hit them with nec skills. Big marks are a guaranteed hit unless the target goes invuln.